ISRAEL IS AT WAR !

[placeholder]

Just now, Morch said:

So what is your point? That they have no choice? No options where to place their facilities, bunkers, launchers, depots and and so on?

 

They obviously do. They don't like the tradeoff. They put them right smack in the middle of residential areas.

Where did I say they had no options? They could certainly choose to make themselves a lot more vulnerable. Morally speaking, they should. But tactically speaking, it's a terrible idea.

[Morch]

Just now, placeholder said:

Where did I say they had no options? They could certainly choose to make themselves a lot more vulnerable. Morally speaking, they should. But tactically speaking, it's a terrible idea.

Yawn. That was point. Good job.

[Morch]

EU freezes development aid to Palestinians after Hamas attack

https://www.reuters.com/world/germany-austria-suspend-bilateral-aid-palestinians-after-hamas-attack-2023-10-09/

 

As I understand, this applies to the West Bank as well. Good show, Hamas - although no doubt the anger would be directed at EU representatives, and even the projects halted/funded.

[Danderman123]

Now the Israeli response is coming. Lots of Gazans are going to die. It's not going to be very nice.

 

Muslim sentiment is going to change from "Great, a bunch of Jews have been killed" to "the Jews are massacring our people". 

 

One thing about sentiments in these situations - losers are abandoned. Sadam, Bin Laden, and ISIS are now mostly forgotten by the masses, not because their ideology has been rejected, but because they lost. If Hamas is perceived as losing this confrontation, then they may join the list of irrelevant losers. That might pave the way for someone else to represent the Gazans.

 

But, before that happens, there will come death and destruction.

[Jingthing]

38 minutes ago, Danderman123 said:

Now the Israeli response is coming. Lots of Gazans are going to die. It's not going to be very nice.

 

Muslim sentiment is going to change from "Great, a bunch of Jews have been killed" to "the Jews are massacring our people". 

 

One thing about sentiments in these situations - losers are abandoned. Sadam, Bin Laden, and ISIS are now mostly forgotten by the masses, not because their ideology has been rejected, but because they lost. If Hamas is perceived as losing this confrontation, then they may join the list of irrelevant losers. That might pave the way for someone else to represent the Gazans.

 

But, before that happens, there will come death and destruction.

And so it goes.

[Danderman123]

So it goes

[Danderman123]

Hamas has launched 1000s of rockets at Israel, pointlessly.

 

What if the money used for those rockets had been used instead to better the lives of Gazans?

[Harsh Jones]

There will be more civilian casualties in the Israel Palestine war by the end of this week than there has been in the 1.5 year long Russia Ukraine war.

[Paul Catton]

6 hours ago, Morch said:

History shows that violence and terrorism from both sides (against each other and vs. the Brits) started well before the 'inception of the state of Israel'.

Correct, no dispute from me. Abhorrent atrocities since Biblical times have been committed by all who seem to settle in and around the region.

However in context to the OP the focus is around "Israel at War"  

[MrMojoRisin]

6 hours ago, Morch said:

There are more Israelis that support Palestinians' right to exist, and to a country of their own, then there are Palestinian feeling the same toward Israel. Palestinians often display mass gathering of support and celebration when there are Israeli casualties of Palestinian terrorist attacks (the recent one had the same effect). Sure, there are Israelis doing the same, but that's nowhere a mainstream thing.

You are right to condemn the abhorrent actions of Hamas.

You are wrong to excuse the abhorrent actions of the Israeli government.

 

The moral and ethical deficiencies of both sides are precisely equal - one must be either dishonest or ignorant to assert otherwise.

[thaibeachlovers]

13 hours ago, novacova said:

The way that Israel has treated them, really? The way Israel is treating them is containment, containing an enemy that will accept nothing less than complete extermination of the Jewish people. If I was surrounded by hateful neighbors I’d do anything to maintain preservation. Pelt my house with rocks, I’ll drop a bolder on theirs, retaliate me with 9mm’s, I’ll pull out the Scar17-s and clean house. Israel, in my opinion has shown great restraint, now they’re fed up with the tit for tat routine and it’s time to drop the hammer for their own survival and civilization. Anyway, you and others here come off as rooting for the Hamas terror thugs…with antisemitism tones.

Seems the israeli army is carrying out your wishes with the murder of hundreds of Palestinians by artillery and bombing of residential areas, including many children. How many dead children will satisfy your desire to kill Palestinians?

 

Yes netanyahu, the world is watching as you call up 300,000 reservists. One wonders just what so many are needed for, as Gaza has no heavy weapons, and is defenseless against bombing and artillery.

 

As seen on Al Jazeera, the israelis have cut off water to over 2 million people. Just how many Gazans need to die to satisfy netanyahu and his ultra right cronies? The israeli defense minister referred to Gazans as "animals".

 

Meanwhile, the freedom loving Americans are sending more munitions to israel in case they don't have enough to kill all the Gazans.

 

Yes, the world is indeed watching.

 

BTW, it has been reported that for every attack on residential areas without warning, a hostage will die, so seems that the israelis are not even going to try to rescue them, as they are not negotiating.

[Harsh Jones]

26 minutes ago, MrMojoRisin said:

You are right to condemn the abhorrent actions of Hamas.

You are wrong to excuse the abhorrent actions of the Israeli government.

 

The moral and ethical deficiencies of both sides are precisely equal - one must be either dishonest or ignorant to assert otherwise.

The imperial sponsors of both sides do not want to solve the conflict. 

[thaibeachlovers]

36 minutes ago, Paul Catton said:

Correct, no dispute from me. Abhorrent atrocities since Biblical times have been committed by all who seem to settle in and around the region.

However in context to the OP the focus is around "Israel at War"  

Indeed. Seems a misnomer to describe it as the "Holy Land", given the amount of blood that has been shed in that unfortunate region.

 

I don't think it can be called a "war" any longer, given it is now just an attack on a captive population by air and artillery.

[Harsh Jones]

5 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Seems the israeli army is carrying out your wishes with the murder of hundreds of Palestinians by artillery and bombing of residential areas, including many children. How many dead children will satisfy your desire to kill Palestinians?

 

Yes netanyahu, the world is watching as you call up 300,000 reservists. One wonders just what so many are needed for, as Gaza has no heavy weapons, and is defenseless against bombing and artillery.

 

As seen on Al Jazeera, the israelis have cut off water to over 2 million people. Just how many Gazans need to die to satisfy netanyahu and his ultra right cronies? The israeli defense minister referred to Gazans as "animals".

 

Meanwhile, the freedom loving Americans are sending more munitions to israel in case they don't have enough to kill all the Gazans.

 

Yes, the world is indeed watching.

 

BTW, it has been reported that for every attack on residential areas without warning, a hostage will die, so seems that the israelis are not even going to try to rescue them, as they are not negotiating.

So you are 100% on the Palestine side? Why did they start this 2 days ago ?

[thaibeachlovers]

1 minute ago, Harsh Jones said:

The imperial sponsors of both sides do not want to solve the conflict. 

I can agree with that. The only thing I don't understand is why Americans support israel to the extent they do.

[thaibeachlovers]

1 minute ago, Harsh Jones said:

So you are 100% on the Palestine side? Why did they start this 2 days ago ?

I'm on the side of Palestinians that are NOT in Hamas or any other armed group that are suffering because israel does not discriminate between fighters and innocent civilians with their bombs on residential areas.

Cutting off water to the entirety of Gaza affects everyone, whether Hamas or not.

[thaibeachlovers]

6 hours ago, Eloquent pilgrim said:

Whatever grievances the Palestinian people have, the barbaric acts that the terrorist organisation, Hamas, has carried out in their name, will prove to be one of the most erroneous judgements of modern history.

 

Slaughtering 250+ kids dancing at a music festival is something they will never, ever, come back from.

 

Israel now has the weight of every civilised human being on the planet behind them, and Hamas has just mandated them to wade into Gaza unrestricted by any moral obligations ….

So how many of the 2 million+ innocent Gazans have to die to make up for the 250+ kids that were dancing? Plenty of dead children already, so how many Gaza children will have to die to pay the debt?

 

Revenge killing will only create more recruits for Hamas, and let's not forget that the Palestinians on the West Bank are also watching, and waiting to take revenge of their own.

[thaibeachlovers]

6 hours ago, Eloquent pilgrim said:

Israel now has the weight of every civilised human being on the planet behind them,

I guess you consider a large part of the world's populations uncivilised then.

Many people and some countries do not support israel.

[thaibeachlovers]

9 hours ago, MrMojoRisin said:

The imbalance between the two sides has only grows greater day by day. 

 

You are again wrong.

I'd be interested to know what "heavy weapons" that poster thinks the Palestinians posses. If they have them, why have they not used them?

Of course he gave no links to prove his erroneous claim.

[thaibeachlovers]

9 hours ago, novacova said:

Good frik’n grief, quoting Noam Chomsky of all people. Now it’s clear of who follows who.

Is Chomsky right though? I think he is.

[Danderman123]

26 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

So how many of the 2 million+ innocent Gazans have to die to make up for the 250+ kids that were dancing? Plenty of dead children already, so how many Gaza children will have to die to pay the debt?

 

Revenge killing will only create more recruits for Hamas, and let's not forget that the Palestinians on the West Bank are also watching, and waiting to take revenge of their own.

So, what should the Israelis do, in your opinion?

[thaibeachlovers]

8 hours ago, rabas said:

This an altered mis-quote from Chomsky (in fact only part is from him)  and not even about Gaza.

 

https://ceasefiremagazine.co.uk/it-misquoting-noam-chomsky-gaza/

 

Worse, the mis-quote is from 2012. 

What the quote says was as true in 2012 as it is today, or are you going to claim that Israel wasn't attacking refugee camps back then?

 

https://reliefweb.int/report/israel/israeli-forces-commit-massacre-jenin-refugee-camp

Israeli forces commit massacre in Jenin refugee camp

Format

News and Press Release

Source

LAW

Posted

8 Apr 2002

Originally published

8 Apr 2002

Israeli forces, comprising of more than 150 tanks, armored personnel carriers and artillery, backed by F-16 fighter jets, continue to attack Jenin refugee camp, home to 15,000 Palestinian refugees, living on one square kilometer.

[thaibeachlovers]

1 minute ago, Danderman123 said:

So, what should the Israelis do, in your opinion?

They should defeat the fighters in israel and then solve the root cause of the problem by withdrawing from the illegally occupied Palestinian land and making a real peace based on the two state solution.

If they do not, this will only happen again and again in the future.

The Palestinians are not going away- live with them in peace or keep fighting for generations.

Does israel want to be occupying Palestinian land and forcing all it's people to become soldiers for ever? Do they have no dreams of living a normal life?

[thaibeachlovers]

10 hours ago, Trippy said:

Ask hamas, or any other radical islamic organization, they kill kids quite often. Death to the infidels doesn't discriminate by age.

I thought israel claimed to be a civilised country. Do civilised people think it's OK to kill children because the enemy does?

[thaibeachlovers]

10 hours ago, MrMojoRisin said:

 

The Nazi's dehumanised the Jews before the holocaust, much of the commentary made by Israel apologists these last few days is dehumanising the Palestinians.

 

Hmmm.

I watched Al Jazeera as the israeli defense minister called Gazans "animals".

[Harsh Jones]

Why did they choose Israel. They were offered a part of Russia at one point to make a homeland. That would have been better than this. 

[thaibeachlovers]

4 minutes ago, Harsh Jones said:

Why did they choose Israel. They were offered a part of Russia at one point to make a homeland. That would have been better than this. 

Look to the zionist movement to answer that.

[Danderman123]

13 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

They should defeat the fighters in israel and then solve the root cause of the problem by withdrawing from the illegally occupied Palestinian land and making a real peace based on the two state solution.

If they do not, this will only happen again and again in the future.

The Palestinians are not going away- live with them in peace or keep fighting for generations.

Does israel want to be occupying Palestinian land and forcing all it's people to become soldiers for ever? Do they have no dreams of living a normal life?

What part of the Negev desert is illegally occupied Palestinian land?

[thaibeachlovers]

Just now, Danderman123 said:

What part of the Negev desert is illegally occupied Palestinian land?

Deflection.

How about responding to what I said about making peace without irrelevant quips?

[Harsh Jones]

Concrete structures are being pancaked worse than almost anything seen in the Ukraine war. Most of the damage in Mariupol was cosmetic in comparison.