The Children of Gaza = More than 7000 Killed.

[ezzra]

What i find disturbing is that there are at least half a dozen of trouble spots around the world where war is raging and

millions are displaced, hungry and diseased with tens of thousands of dead, (including many children) but nothing of that

is of concern to those who howl and stand on hind legs vilify and accuse Israel of genocide, holocaust and war crimes

in Gaza, all because the above trouble places there are no Jews to blame, the world's favourite scapegoat...

[Hawaiian]

19 minutes ago, ezzra said:

What i find disturbing is that there are at least half a dozen of trouble spots around the world where war is raging and

millions are displaced, hungry and diseased with tens of thousands of dead, (including many children) but nothing of that

is of concern to those who howl and stand on hind legs vilify and accuse Israel of genocide, holocaust and war crimes

in Gaza, all because the above trouble places there are no Jews to blame, the world's favourite scapegoat...

How true.  Shine the spotlight on Israel to keep the terrorist campfires going.

[Hawaiian]

1 hour ago, Jingthing said:

Of course.

 

 

Only after watching this video for a few minutes did I realize it was from MSNBC.

As I continued viewing this interview I was totally surprised that this young man was allowed to tell of his story without any interruption or interjection.

His description of the horror he witnessed is a grim reminder of what will occur again if Hamas is not destroyed.  The sooner the better.

 

 

[spidermike007]

1 hour ago, Jingthing said:

Of course.

 

 

 

There are alot of Israelis that are opposed to this genocide, and the killing of thousands of women and children. Many would prefer a more targeted approach, that differs from the leveling of Syria, or the Russian campaign in Ukraine. Putin is a genocidal, maniacal serial killer. Most of us knew that already. We did not know Netanyahu was also a mass murderer, and the US support has to stop.

[spidermike007]

3 hours ago, Jingthing said:

There is that Jew hating trope again suggesting an equivalence between  the state of Israel and Nazis.

"And all of this from a nation that was founded after the genocide committed against Jews by the Nazis. One would think Israel would at least make an attempt to hold itself to a higher standard. That does not appear to be the case, these days. Netanyahu is a genocidal freak".

 

There was no such suggestion. Read my post again, before making up your own ridiculous tropes. In fact, I am an American Jew. And I love my Jewish friends and family, many of whom do not support this insane campaign of destruction and murder. I have long had a hard time with Israeli policy, and often been criticized for it, by other Jews. It does not mean anything to me.

Edited December 22, 2023 by spidermike007

[Hawaiian]

34 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

 

There are alot of Israelis that are opposed to this genocide, and the killing of thousands of women and children. Many would prefer a more targeted approach, that differs from the leveling of Syria, or the Russian campaign in Ukraine. Putin is a genocidal, maniacal serial killer. Most of us knew that already. We did not know Netanyahu was also a mass murderer, and the US support has to stop.

Would you ever consider living in Israel, facing the danger that some day you or your family will be a victim of Hamas?  And just who is this "alot of Israeli's"?  Please describe in detail what a more "targeted approach" would be.  If you watched the entire video you would understand the challenges the IDF confronts every day.  Easy to be an armchair general, when you are not on the front line, face to face with a ruthless enemy. Talk is cheap, even for an American Jew.

As an independent voter, I fully support American aid to Israel in order to carry out their mission against Hamas. 

I also question your use of the word genocide.

 

Edited December 22, 2023 by Hawaiian
Correction

[Morch]

1 hour ago, spidermike007 said:

 

There are alot of Israelis that are opposed to this genocide, and the killing of thousands of women and children. Many would prefer a more targeted approach, that differs from the leveling of Syria, or the Russian campaign in Ukraine. Putin is a genocidal, maniacal serial killer. Most of us knew that already. We did not know Netanyahu was also a mass murderer, and the US support has to stop.

 

That's just you tossing words about, as usual.

 

A lot? OK...how many are 'a lot'? How do the figures measure vs. those supporting the campaign?

 

Genocide? What genocide? Are you suggesting the the Palestinian people will not exist after this campaign? If it was about genocide, there's be far more casualties in a way shorter time.

 

How would a 'more targeted approach' would be carried out, given the situation?

 

Mass murderer? Do you consider all them POTUS who held office during war to be mass murderers? Even if you affirm that, by the way, I'd venture yours is a minority take.

[ozimoron]

11 hours ago, Bkk Brian said:

Al Jazeera as you know. State funded. The same state that was funding Hamas. Maybe still is?

 

With complicity from Netanyahu. maybe ask him, he'd know.

[Bkk Brian]

2 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

 

With complicity from Netanyahu. maybe ask him, he'd know.

Yes we know he helped in the delivery etc, however even if he hadn't do you think Qatar would not have found their own routes to get it to Hamas, after all Hamas leaders do they not live in Qatar?

[ozimoron]

2 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

Yes we know he helped in the delivery etc, however even if he hadn't do you think Qatar would not have found their own routes to get it to Hamas, after all Hamas leaders do they not live in Qatar?

 

No, Hamas would have faded away had Israel negotiated in good faith with the PA. Netanyahu was instrumental in facilitating financing Hamas by Qatar

Edited December 22, 2023 by ozimoron

[Bkk Brian]

1 minute ago, ozimoron said:

 

No, Hamas would have faded away had Israel negotiated in good faith with the PA. Netanyahu was instrumental in facilitating financing Hamas by Qatar

I'm not so sure they would have faded away, never shown any signs of that in their long history. 

 

The Order of Battle of Hamas’ Izz al Din al Qassem Brigades, Part 1: North and Central Gaza

Hamas sees itself in a multi-generational fight against Israel and some other Palestinian groups that will consist of multiple distinct phases.[viii] Hamas sought to undermine secular Palestinian groups in the 1980s and 1990s to Islamicize the Palestinian people as part of the Hamas effort to form an Islamic state.[ix] Hamas then opposed the Oslo Peace Process to prevent Israel, the Palestinian Authority, and the international community from blocking the hypothetical pathway to an Islamic Palestinian state covering the entirety of historic Palestine.[x] Hamas sees control of “some parts” of Palestine as an interim goal prior to the establishment of an Islamic Palestinian state.[xi] The al Qassem Brigades state that they will “tolerate” only a temporary truce and that a permanent truce or recognition of the Israeli state is forbidden.[xii]

Hamas launched the October 7 attacks in this larger context to derail Arab-Israeli normalization efforts, to destabilize Israel, and eventually to destroy it.

https://www.criticalthreats.org/analysis/the-order-of-battle-of-hamas-izz-al-din-al-qassem-brigades-part-1-north-and-central-gaza

[ozimoron]

28 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

I'm not so sure they would have faded away, never shown any signs of that in their long history. 

 

The Order of Battle of Hamas’ Izz al Din al Qassem Brigades, Part 1: North and Central Gaza

Hamas sees itself in a multi-generational fight against Israel and some other Palestinian groups that will consist of multiple distinct phases.[viii] Hamas sought to undermine secular Palestinian groups in the 1980s and 1990s to Islamicize the Palestinian people as part of the Hamas effort to form an Islamic state.[ix] Hamas then opposed the Oslo Peace Process to prevent Israel, the Palestinian Authority, and the international community from blocking the hypothetical pathway to an Islamic Palestinian state covering the entirety of historic Palestine.[x] Hamas sees control of “some parts” of Palestine as an interim goal prior to the establishment of an Islamic Palestinian state.[xi] The al Qassem Brigades state that they will “tolerate” only a temporary truce and that a permanent truce or recognition of the Israeli state is forbidden.[xii]

Hamas launched the October 7 attacks in this larger context to derail Arab-Israeli normalization efforts, to destabilize Israel, and eventually to destroy it.

https://www.criticalthreats.org/analysis/the-order-of-battle-of-hamas-izz-al-din-al-qassem-brigades-part-1-north-and-central-gaza

 

You're describing a time and circumstances where they were a domestic nationalist, religious and political organization. Hamas has really only become powerful since Netanyahu appeared on the scene, It should also be noted that Iran and Hezbollah are not exactly close to Hamas since Hamas is Sunni. Hamas really relied on the funding and support from Qatar and Israel.

Edited December 22, 2023 by ozimoron

[Bkk Brian]

4 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

 

You're describing a time and circumstances where they were a domestic religious and political organization. Hamas has really only become powerful since Netanyahu appeared on the scene, It should also be noted that Iran and Hezbollah are not exactly close to Hamas since Hamas is Sunni. Hamas really relied on the funding and support from Qatar and Israel.

Rubbish. They 

 

8 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

 

You're describing a time and circumstances where they were a domestic religious and political organization. Hamas has really only become powerful since Netanyahu appeared on the scene, It should also be noted that Iran and Hezbollah are not exactly close to Hamas since Hamas is Sunni. Hamas really relied on the funding and support from Qatar and Israel.

Now I just know you didn't read all that lengthy article otherwise you would not be saying that.

 

As for funding from Iran

 Check again. It was huge amounts and probably still is.

 

For a shorter article. The one explains things. Hamas came to power in Gaza before Netanyahu via dodgy elections. You may want to look a Bush's role in this.

 

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2023/10/was-hamas-elected-to-govern-gaza-george-w-bush-2006-palestinian-election.html

[ozimoron]

 

2 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

Rubbish. They 

 

Now I just know you didn't read all that lengthy article otherwise you would not be saying that.

 

As for funding from Iran

 Check again. It was huge amounts and probably still is.

 

For a shorter article. The one explains things. Hamas came to power in Gaza before Netanyahu via dodgy elections. You may want to look a Bush's role in this.

 

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2023/10/was-hamas-elected-to-govern-gaza-george-w-bush-2006-palestinian-election.html

 

Attaining political power and becoming militarily powerful are not the same thing.

[ozimoron]

Two senior European Union officials said Friday that they are “deeply shocked” at an assessment that the entire population of Gaza is at risk of acute food insecurity because of the Israeli offensive there.

 

“This is a grave development and should be a wake-up call for the whole world to act now to prevent a deadly human catastrophe,” EU foreign policy chief Josep Borrell and Crisis Management Commissioner Janez Lenarcic said in a statement.

 

“We urgently need continued, rapid, safe and unhindered humanitarian access to avoid a further worsening of an already catastrophic situation,” they said.

 

https://apnews.com/article/israel-palestinians-live-updates-c83889b311f05fc76184b0ab95da7b60

[Bkk Brian]

1 minute ago, ozimoron said:

 

 

Attaining political power and becoming militarily powerful are not the same thing.

Confirmed you didn't even read it. Pointless

[ozimoron]

4 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

Rubbish. They 

 

Now I just know you didn't read all that lengthy article otherwise you would not be saying that.

 

As for funding from Iran

 Check again. It was huge amounts and probably still is.

 

For a shorter article. The one explains things. Hamas came to power in Gaza before Netanyahu via dodgy elections. You may want to look a Bush's role in this.

 

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2023/10/was-hamas-elected-to-govern-gaza-george-w-bush-2006-palestinian-election.html

 

How Benjamin Netanyahu empowered Hamas ... and broke Israel

 

Polling shows majority blame the PM not just for military failures but for ‘propping up’ the terrorist group in the first place

 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2023/10/16/how-benjamin-netanyahu-empowered-hamas/

[Bkk Brian]

8 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

 

How Benjamin Netanyahu empowered Hamas ... and broke Israel

 

Polling shows majority blame the PM not just for military failures but for ‘propping up’ the terrorist group in the first place

 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2023/10/16/how-benjamin-netanyahu-empowered-hamas/

Yes I read it and that was discussed weeks ago. He has his share of blame. Does nothing for all the other factors involved that you know nothing about. Having not read it.

Edited December 22, 2023 by Bkk Brian

[ozimoron]

Netanyahu’s policy, however, was in direct opposition to most of the Israeli defense and security establishment, which viewed cooperation with the PA to be in Israel’s security interest.

 

Since returning to power in 2009, Netanyahu made no secret of his desire to keep Hamas and the PA apart for his own political purposes.

 

With Hamas in power in Gaza, coupled with a deliberately emaciated PA in the West Bank, Netanyahu could claim there was no Palestinian partner for negotiation, and he could continue to crisscross the West Bank with settlements.

 

https://thehill.com/opinion/international/4268794-the-symbiotic-relationship-between-netanyahu-and-hamas/

[ozimoron]

Israeli intelligence officers were the ones who escorted Qatari officials to Gaza.

 

He believed that having two strong rivals would “lessen the pressure on him to negotiate toward a Palestinian state”.

 

According to Israeli intelligence officials, the Qatari money played a role in the success of the terror attacks.

 

https://www.firstpost.com/explainers/qatar-sent-millions-to-hamas-for-years-and-netanyahu-encouraged-it-heres-why-13495242.html

[Neeranam]

11 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

"And all of this from a nation that was founded after the genocide committed against Jews by the Nazis. One would think Israel would at least make an attempt to hold itself to a higher standard. That does not appear to be the case, these days. Netanyahu is a genocidal freak".

 

There was no such suggestion. Read my post again, before making up your own ridiculous tropes. In fact, I am an American Jew. And I love my Jewish friends and family, many of whom do not support this insane campaign of destruction and murder. I have long had a hard time with Israeli policy, and often been criticized for it, by other Jews. It does not mean anything to me.

You have integrity, unlike others. Respect. 

[Neeranam]

1 hour ago, ozimoron said:

 

No, Hamas would have faded away had Israel negotiated in good faith with the PA. Netanyahu was instrumental in facilitating financing Hamas by Qatar

Wow, it's coming out now. 

 

[Hawaiian]

3 hours ago, Neeranam said:

Wow, it's coming out now. 

 

What's coming out now?  Evidently, you missed the article provided by Bkk Brian

from criticalthreats.org.  Or maybe you did and its too long and involved for you and your friend to understand.

[Hawaiian]

3 hours ago, Neeranam said:

You have integrity, unlike others. Respect. 

People with integrity don't throw around and casually misuse words like genocide.

As far as respect goes, you evidently think just like him.

[Jingthing]

57 minutes ago, Hawaiian said:

People with integrity don't throw around and casually misuse words like genocide.

As far as respect goes, you evidently think just like him.

Yeah, save the word genocide for actual genocide. Genocide inflation. Yeah, there are reasons to criticize some of the Israeli tactics in this war against Hamas, but it is not genocide. 

[Hawaiian]

6 hours ago, ozimoron said:

 

No, Hamas would have faded away had Israel negotiated in good faith with the PA. Netanyahu was instrumental in facilitating financing Hamas by Qatar

Hamas could have used the money to better the lives of the Palestinians living in Gaza.  Instead much of it was spent to construct an expensive, complex system of tunnels to conduct their clandestine operations. 

Could Netanyahu have restricted the funds to non-military use?  I don't know and perhaps,as others have said, he had ulterior motives. 

[Hawaiian]

5 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Yeah, save the word genocide for actual genocide. Genocide inflation. Yeah, there are reasons to criticize some of the Israeli tactics in this war against Hamas, but it is not genocide. 

Exactly.  The definition of genocide does not apply to movements and organizations like Hamas.

[thaibeachlovers]

21 hours ago, Neeranam said:

Absolutely 

Who thinks they are moral? 

They do.

After the way they have been behaving and posting vdos themselves of their vile behaviour, no one else does.

https://www.jns.org/the-idf-is-the-most-moral-army-in-history/

The IDF is the most moral army in history 

[Hawaiian]

5 hours ago, ozimoron said:

Israeli intelligence officers were the ones who escorted Qatari officials to Gaza.

 

He believed that having two strong rivals would “lessen the pressure on him to negotiate toward a Palestinian state”.

 

According to Israeli intelligence officials, the Qatari money played a role in the success of the terror attacks.

 

https://www.firstpost.com/explainers/qatar-sent-millions-to-hamas-for-years-and-netanyahu-encouraged-it-heres-why-13495242.html

Was the money designated specifically for military use and not for humanitarian purposes? 

Maybe Hamas thought like Jack from  Beanstalk fame, they would get rid of the mean old giant, Israel, and collect their treasure, magnificent rulers of the new Palestinian state.

[thaibeachlovers]

6 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

In response to questions about the bomb’s use in south Gaza, an Israeli military spokesman said in a statement to The Times that Israel’s priority was destroying Hamas and “questions of this kind will be looked into at a later stage.” The spokesman also said that the I.D.F. “takes feasible precautions to mitigate civilian harm.”

Does the spokesman keep a straight face when saying that?

They never say what the feasible precautions to mitigate civilian harm are, presumably because they don't.

Sounds just like every American official apologist for israeli bad behaviour.