The Children of Gaza = More than 7000 Killed.

[Hawaiian]

1 hour ago, ezzra said:

Unfortunately, there aren't many of them as on the 7th of October, many of the looters, rapists and murderers were ordinary Palestinians folks who joined the terrorist in their deeds, and what future do you wanna build for you and your future if you don't stand up and be counted and let them here you objection, and if enough of them will do that, all those terrorists will be gone...

Must be in their blood.  Agree.  Almost impossible to change that mindset. You've convinced me, but it is the rest of the world that will never agree.  Every move that the Israelis make is scrutinized, looking to shift the blame from Hamas to Israel.  As the old saying goes, "You gotta do what you gotta do."  And it sure looks like Israel is going to do it.

[ezzra]

7 minutes ago, Hawaiian said:

Must be in their blood.  Agree.  Almost impossible to change that mindset. You've convinced me, but it is the rest of the world that will never agree.  Every move that the Israelis make is scrutinized, looking to shift the blame from Hamas to Israel.  As the old saying goes, "You gotta do what you gotta do."  And it sure looks like Israel is going to do it.

The rest of the the world, from times in memorial, didn't needed much to hate/blame/vilify Jews, most of those who go out on marches and protests would know where Gaza is on a map or what the history of the Palestinian people and their history being a wild card to play with by the bigger and richer and more powerful nations who has an agenda to see the Palestinians people where they are, so you see, it is not only Israel/Jews Vs. Palestinians, it is much more complicated than that...

[thaibeachlovers]

2 hours ago, ezzra said:

When you aid and abide, harbour by allowing your schools, mosques, hospitals and homes to become a potential Hamas hiding places and battlefield, employed by the Hamas (50,000 Palestinians) digging tunnels to be used in guerrilla war, when you rejoice and dance, give away sweets in the streets of Gaza seeing dead, butchered and kidnapped Israelis, you're no better than the terrorists, you become the enemy and thus a fair target, and maybe if enough of the Palestinians babies will die the penny finally will drop...

I think your hatred of Palestinians has warped your mind, by what you so openly say.

I pity you.

[ezzra]

26 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I think your hatred of Palestinians has warped your mind, by what you so openly say.

I pity you.

How would you feel if a group of  marauding barbarians comes in to your home on a sleepy Sabbath morning, burn, loot, rape, murder 1,200 of your people and kidnap old and sick people many of whom are children ?

would you have a whole lot of love for them? and mind you, those people, many of whom works and earn a living in Israel,

enjoy social care and aid courtesy of the Israeli government and it's people... Hate them? not really, they should hate themselves and the way of life they chose and the people who they allowed to bring this catastrophe on themselves...

 

[harada]

Putin will be laughing, the Jews are making him look like Florence Nightingale. 🥲

[Jingthing]

1 hour ago, harada said:

Putin will be laughing, the Jews are making him look like Florence Nightingale. 🥲

Not really but that monster is definitely happy that attention has been diverted away from his war of choice against Ukraine.

[ozimoron]

3 hours ago, Hawaiian said:

Must be in their blood.  Agree.  Almost impossible to change that mindset. You've convinced me, but it is the rest of the world that will never agree.  Every move that the Israelis make is scrutinized, looking to shift the blame from Hamas to Israel.  As the old saying goes, "You gotta do what you gotta do."  And it sure looks like Israel is going to do it.

 

Here we go with the racist garbage. It must be in their blood argument". A very reminiscent argument made in times past and used often by racists.

[ozimoron]

18 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Not really but that monster is definitely happy that attention has been diverted away from his war of choice against Ukraine.

 

He and his buddy Netanyahu have been supporting Hamas for years.

[ezzra]

Everyday the IDF discover more and more tunnels and subterranean passage as deep as 40-50 meters laid out with full infrastructures and wide enough o drive a car trough running hundreds of km that Hamas dug investing many billions of Iranian and Qatari monies instead to spend this money to better the lives of the Palestinian people who lives in squalid, poor conditions of a sub-third world country and all that under the guise of defending the Palestinian people...

[ozimoron]

3 minutes ago, ezzra said:

Everyday the IDF discover more and more tunnels and subterranean passage as deep as 40-50 meters laid out with full infrastructures and wide enough o drive a car trough running hundreds of km that Hamas dug investing many billions of Iranian and Qatari monies instead to spend this money to better the lives of the Palestinian people who lives in squalid, poor conditions of a sub-third world country and all that under the guise of defending the Palestinian people...

 

How exactly was any foreign money spent digging these tunnels? Did they buy earthmoving equipment? Employ thousands of workers? I'm curious as to how this works. 

[ezzra]

11 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

 

Here we go with the racist garbage. It must be in their blood argument". A very reminiscent argument made in times past and used often by racists.

If you ever lived among Arab and Muslims, (which i'm sure you didn't) you'd know that they solves feuds with revenge and blood letting, eye for an eye, blood for blood, and honour killing, and YES, this IS the Arab/Muslim's mindset and mentality from day one, and to brand someone a racist just because he knows better than you, portrays you a dolt and a dimwit...  

[ozimoron]

1 minute ago, ezzra said:

If you ever lived among Arab and Muslims, (which i'm sure you didn't) you'd know that they solves feuds with revenge and blood letting, eye for an eye, blood for blood, and honour killing, and YES, this IS the Arab/Muslim's mindset and mentality from day one, and to brand someone a racist just because he knows better than you, portrays you a dolt and a dimwit...  

 

Your racism is showing and you have no idea about me. You simply resort to insulting others because you don't have the courage to criticise the actions fo your own country.

[ezzra]

6 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

 

How exactly was any foreign money spent digging these tunnels? Did they buy earthmoving equipment? Employ thousands of workers? I'm curious as to how this works. 

Yes, to the shame of Israel, the IDF and inelegance services Israel was so proud of, turned out PM Netanyahu knew very well and in advance of the billions Qatari money flowing to Gaza and turned a blind eye thinking it will be put for a good use and for the better of everyone, little he knew that it will come to bite him in the ass some years later and in a BIG way,

and yes, it was reported that up to 50,000 Palestinians were employed in digging those state of the art tunnels and subways, and again yes, Palestinians were free to buy earth moving equipment in Israel and used in Gaza, presumably with good intentions, but know we all know the truth... 

[ozimoron]

3 minutes ago, ezzra said:

Yes, to the shame of Israel, the IDF and inelegance services Israel was so proud of, turned out PM Netanyahu knew very well and in advance of the billions Qatari money flowing to Gaza and turned a blind eye thinking it will be put for a good use and for the better of everyone, little he knew that it will come to bite him in the ass some years later and in a BIG way,

and yes, it was reported that up to 50,000 Palestinians were employed in digging those state of the art tunnels and subways, and again yes, Palestinians were free to buy earth moving equipment in Israel and used in Gaza, presumably with good intentions, but know we all know the truth... 

 

Rubbish. Netanyahu knew very well he was strengthening Hamas to ruin the prospects of the PA to gain controlling power over Gaza. He active aided and abetted Hamas when he could have destroyed them economically and politically. That's what bit him on the ass, not his feigned ignorance of their activities.

[CharlieH]

Post and response removed.

 

Members please desist from making personal remarks./name calling.

 

 

[Hawaiian]

52 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

 

Here we go with the racist garbage. It must be in their blood argument". A very reminiscent argument made in times past and used often by racists.

Racist?  If you say so.  I believe if you begin indoctrinating children with the ideology of hating a particular ethnic group, in this case people of Jewish descent, one generation after another it eventually becomes  ingrained into the culture. Are they then considered racist if they habitually practice this ideology?

[ozimoron]

4 minutes ago, Hawaiian said:

Racist?  If you say so.  I believe if you begin indoctrinating children with the ideology of hating a particular ethnic group, in this case people of Jewish descent, one generation after another it eventually becomes  ingrained into the culture. Are they then considered racist if they habitually practice this ideology?

 

Now your conflation education with genetics. You'r etrying to duck out from yoiur "It's in their blood" claim with an irrelevant defection. The suggestion that any race is different in a way that affects their social behaviour is racist.

[Bkk Brian]

1 hour ago, ozimoron said:

 

How exactly was any foreign money spent digging these tunnels? Did they buy earthmoving equipment? Employ thousands of workers? I'm curious as to how this works. 

You don't think Hamas uses money siphoned off from its foreign donors? How quaint.

 

Not even Iran?

[ezzra]

Sadly, some posters here, will not be happy unless they'll see the Jews in Israel surrender and capitulate by putting their arms down and letting every terrorist overrun the country burning, looting, raping and murdering their ways they know how to do so well, while the rest of the antisemitic world cheer and rejoice that finally, the Jews has got what they deserves...

[Hawaiian]

1 hour ago, ozimoron said:

 

Now your conflation education with genetics. You'r etrying to duck out from yoiur "It's in their blood" claim with an irrelevant defection. The suggestion that any race is different in a way that affects their social behaviour is racist.

Didn't I say you call it anything you want. If you're looking to pick a bone, go find a dog.  A dingo will suffice.  You won't find them on

this forum, but guarantee you'll find some racists.

 

[Hawaiian]

2 hours ago, ezzra said:

Sadly, some posters here, will not be happy unless they'll see the Jews in Israel surrender and capitulate by putting their arms down and letting every terrorist overrun the country burning, looting, raping and murdering their ways they know how to do so well, while the rest of the antisemitic world cheer and rejoice that finally, the Jews has got what they deserves...

Hamas is not only a threat to Israel, but anywhere in the world where Jews live along with any of their supporters.  The recent apprehension of four Hamas operatives in Denmark and Germany who were plotting to attack Jewish institutions in Europe is all the more reason for Israel to wipe them out.  And I will be called a racist again for saying, "It's in their blood."  The truth of the matter is Hamas is a racist organization and anyone who supports them is a racist.

[Morch]

On 12/16/2023 at 2:44 PM, simple1 said:

For me it's a matter of opinion: I do not hold the viewpoint that the alleged killing of currently nearly 19,000 civilians in Gaza is 'justified'. Recently it's speculated the IDF assault on Gaza will take approx another two months to destroy Hamas killing machine so G_d knows how many more civilians will be killed and for what purpose as currently no-one has articulated the end game.

 

Matter of opinion how? Regarding what or which part? Not sure what you meant. You've asked why they do/don't do this/that. I provided what I think is the answer.

 

As for 'justified' - I'm not sure how these things are decided, or how posters imagine they are decided. There is a lot of such comments about, but again, less in the way of realistic, viable alternatives offered. I also see very little acknowledgment from those opposing Israel that Hamas bears in responsibility on three related counts - (a) that the war is on, (b) that the war drags on, and (c) the civilian death toll. Making the moral argument something that is solely to do with Israel is not something I agree with.

 

No idea how long Israel will be 'allowed' to go on (or on the other hand, if it will be stopped), but IDF comments I read talk about much longer than a couple of months. This goes back to something I commented on early on - that given ample time, it is possible to root out Hamas and make it a minor threat. Whether this is realistic (in terms of political pressure) is another thing.

 

I do agree that there is an issue with the end-game not being clearly defined. Not even with regard to the 'destroy Hamas' thing (several comments on that, with variations), the future of the Gaza Strip after the war, and Israel's relations with the Palestinians. This seems mostly down to domestic politics in Israel, and Netanyahu already hedging in preparation for an election campaign. Truth is nobody got good answers to any of these things.

[Morch]

On 12/16/2023 at 8:18 PM, ozimoron said:

 

Anecdotes by extremists are not proof of anything.

 

Are you for real?

You use anecdotes from Israeli extremists to make your points.

[Morch]

On 12/16/2023 at 8:28 PM, ozimoron said:

 

Not their not, they're incisive and loaded accusations designed to prevent any countering of the false propositions that each one represents. We have the "I'm not racist because my friend is black" argument as a start. But the real clanger is this incisive proposition.

 

"If they label things genocide that aren't genocide just to inflame, then they are stupid. "

 

The take away is that anybody who accuses Israel of genocide is motivated only by a desire to inflame and the accusation itself must not be debated. What about the possibility that many people will make that accusation because they believe it's true. Are they not entitled to make that argument? Are they stupid if they do? The whole list is the same loaded propaganda.

 

 

Reading comprehension issues.

Plus yeah, it's a stupid argument.

[Morch]

On 12/16/2023 at 8:38 PM, ozimoron said:

 

I'm sorry, a video of a dozen Palestinian kids getting military training with an unproven allegation that they are being taught to be terrorists as opposed to fighters of any other description doesn't move the needle for me. We still had air ride sirens on my school which were tested every Tuesday when I was doing my sea cadet training. I think our perceived enemies were Indonesian at the time. This is just peripheral noise and manufactured outrage to deflect from the mass killings of Palestinian civilians by indiscriminant bombing.

 

The only 'fighting' force is the Gaza Strip is Hamas.

For good reasons, they are designated as 'a terrorist organization' by a host of countries (mostly Western).

So when you say kids are trained as 'fighters' - no. They are trained by terrorists.

There is no Gazan army to enlist to when they are of age.

There's only Hamas.

Well, and the Palestinian Islamic Jihad.

 

Nobody cares about your sea cadet stories.

They are irrelevant.

 

[Morch]

On 12/16/2023 at 8:42 PM, ozimoron said:

 

Yes. So is killing over 5,000 children. Which of these war crimes is more heinous?

 

What you reference is not necessarily a 'war crime', though.

The equivalency is assumed, not proven or real.

[Morch]

On 12/16/2023 at 9:00 PM, ozimoron said:

 

Does the article prove that those 3 videos were training kids to be terrorists? Or is your definition of a terrorist a muslim kid with a rock? Or a gun?

 

Unless you wish to deny Hamas is a terrorist organization, then yes - camps held by a terrorist organization and include such training are about training future terrorists.

[Morch]

On 12/16/2023 at 8:57 PM, Nick Carter icp said:

 

   Things that happen regularly are not newsworthy stories 

 

Plus, his claims is bogus - this is discussed, referenced, reported on etc. everyday. Including this OP and this 'discussion'.

He's just trolling, scoring point off deaths.

[Morch]

On 12/17/2023 at 6:24 AM, thaibeachlovers said:

You have nothing to apologise for. IMO it's just another invented reason to justify killing Palestinian children, for which there is not, and never will be, justification.

 

@thaibeachlovers

 

But you did your best to minimize the Hamas attack....which featured this as well.

[Morch]

On 12/17/2023 at 6:34 AM, thaibeachlovers said:

For starters one doesn't drop dirty great bombs that destroy an entire building to kill one Hamas fighter, and one does NOT carry out collective punishment which is probably illegal and a crime under every law or statute ever written dealing with it.

 

The best way to deal with such is to prevent it happening in the first place, for which one would need to go back to 1967 and do things differently. As that is impossible, IMO all israelis have to look forward to for the very long future is fear of the enemy that is just waiting for any opportunity to kill them in revenge for what they have done in the past 30 or so years, what they are doing now, and what they will do in the future.

 

They should always remember that no matter how many Palestinians they kill now, millions live outside Palestine where israel can't touch them, and for every Palestinian child they kill, a dozen more want to take revenge for them.

Never forget, never forgive.

 

@thaibeachlovers

 

Given that you are to busy with your anti-Israeli posting, and got little time to develop a time-machine, what would you (realistically, if you can) suggest?