Health Insurance renewal

[jensmann]

On 5/7/2024 at 2:57 PM, brewsterbudgen said:

 

Do  you have a link to the small print for these WRLife's exclusions?  I can't see anything about 41 'old age illnesses' that are excluded.

ask for a quite from WrLife. One of their attachments are the exclusions. They not hiding it...

[ChipButty]

Take a look at this company online

 

Health Insurance for Digital Nomads

Every country. Any doctor or hospital. We've got you covered.,

We're here when you need us

Scooter crash in Thailand

Dengue fever in Bali

Ear infection in Vietnam

Surfing accident in South Africa

Broken foot in Spain

COVID-19 in Colombia

Click the Link
https://bit.ly/4abThKo

[rumak]

On 5/7/2024 at 1:29 AM, mania said:

Of course there are those that can set aside millions for future health care problems but few who can replenish that at a moment notice or over & over again if complications quickly drain so called self insurance

 

even worse can be the shock and horror of NOT setting aside whatever you can each year ,   so that you will be prepared for the draining of all your expectations when the insurance company denies your coverage after putting you through all kinds of stress.

 

over and over again ?    for large amounts ?   Insurance companies ?   I don't think so...

[brewsterbudgen]

1 hour ago, jensmann said:

ask for a quite from WrLife. One of their attachments are the exclusions. They not hiding it...

I've been insured with them for two years.  Maybe I'm not old enough to have those conditions attached!

[Sheryl]

2 hours ago, rumak said:

 

even worse can be the shock and horror of NOT setting aside whatever you can each year ,   so that you will be prepared for the draining of all your expectations when the insurance company denies your coverage after putting you through all kinds of stress.

 

 

Simply does not happen with reputable international (non-Thai based) insurers unless you lied or omitted relevant information at intake.

 

I've had health insurance ally my life, and for >30 years in Thailand. Multiple claims over the years. Never a problem of any type. But I do not use Thai insurers.

[newbee2022]

On 5/7/2024 at 2:57 PM, brewsterbudgen said:

 

Do  you have a link to the small print for these WRLife's exclusions?  I can't see anything about 41 'old age illnesses' that are excluded.

Me too. Please show us the small prints👏

[newbee2022]

18 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

 

Simply does not happen with reputable international (non-Thai based) insurers unless you lied or omitted relevant information at intake.

 

I've had health insurance ally my life, and for >30 years in Thailand. Multiple claims over the years. Never a problem of any type. But I do not use Thai insurers.

Thai insurer are similar reliable. 

[OJAS]

On 5/7/2024 at 8:51 AM, jensmann said:

Pacific Cross just increased my policy by 35% because I'm entering the next age bracket (76-80). I was aware of that .

Checked out WrLife. Sounds good, reasonable, fair, ethical....but when I got to the small print ....

They exclude most of the sicknesses old men get for the first 5 years. After that still 41 typically old age illnesses are excluded...

In other words insured but not insured. 

Yes, Pacific Cross is more expensive, but doesn't have all this exclusion.

I'll stay.

Ethical advertised doesn't always mean Ethical.

.

 

Complete reversal of my experiences with this pair. Pacific Cross saddled me with a whole raft of exclusions, including one relating to my prostate, for which I had had no previous medical history. So I dumped them last September in favour of WR Life who only imposed a couple of exclusions, both based on previous medical history. And like @brewsterbudgen I was not presented with any list of standard exclusions before taking out my policy with them, despite the fact that I am the ripe old age of 74!

[rumak]

41 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

 

Simply does not happen with reputable international (non-Thai based) insurers unless you lied or omitted relevant information at intake.

 

I've had health insurance ally my life, and for >30 years in Thailand. Multiple claims over the years. Never a problem of any type. But I do not use Thai insurers.

I am pretty sure that this link is an "approved source" .    I believe that you and many others have had good experiences .   But "never a problem "  seems to be very far from the standard in the US . https://www.pbs.org/newshour/health/analysis-health-insurance-claim-denials-are-on-the-rise-to-the-detriment-of-patients  

 

As i am someone in the "self insure"  group .... my experience is that I have never had a problem .   Never even had to fight anyone to pay the bill .  Since stress is known to be a major factor in causing health problems.... i attribute not having to deal with insurance battles as being very positive .  

 

The irony is :  if one has health issues that might turn serious , then it would seem prudent to buy health insurance.  The catch 22 is that you won't be covered for those issues !

 

"A recent KFF study of ACA plans found that even when patients received care from in-network physicians — doctors and hospitals approved by these same insurers — the companies in 2021 nonetheless denied, on average, 17% of claims. One insurer denied 49% of claims in 2021; another’s turndowns hit an astonishing 80% in 2020. Despite the potentially dire impact that denials have on patients’ health or finances, data shows that people appeal only once in every 500 cases."

 

ouch

[RemyDog]

On 5/7/2024 at 9:00 AM, CharlieH said:

WR Life: No crazy price increases: maximum of 3% renewal increase. No claim = no increase

 

Individual circumstances are very different there is no one size fits all.

Getting a broker to do the leg work makes sense.

 

Sometimes, something is better than nothing.

WR Life for 3m cover @ 4000thb a month age 65 (example)

I agree. My WR Life cover is for hospital inpatient only and was taken out when I was 75 years of age. I pay GBP 4.400 per year and if no claims then no fee increase. Covers me with no deductibles, for good grade hospitals in most countries (15 days max for USA and Canada) plus medevac to the location of suitable specialist services (ICU etc).

So far so good.

[Sheryl]

1 hour ago, newbee2022 said:

Thai insurer are similar reliable. 

I have to strongly disagree on that.

 

The regulatory framework for health insurance differs markedly from that in western countries and all8ws things other vounyries would not.

 

Insurance company practices differ accordingly. Most do little or no screening at time of application and wait until a claim is made to decide if it is allowable. The basis for deciding, after the fact,  that a confition was pre-existing is sometimes ludicrous/makes no medical sense. 

 

Innumerable reports of this over the years on this forum.

 

In addition coverage levels tend to be low and premium costs comparatively high especially at older ages.

 

The health insurance market in Thailand is very small since all Thai citizens already have  free cover. This may explain why it is so weakly regulated. 

 

 

[verticalift]

Have a look at the CIGNA “Close Care Policy”. 
 

I am also 65yrs and this is the policy I maintain.

[rumak]

56 minutes ago, RemyDog said:

I agree. My WR Life cover is for hospital inpatient only and was taken out when I was 75 years of age. I pay GBP 4.400 per year and if no claims then no fee increase. Covers me with no deductibles, for good grade hospitals in most countries (15 days max for USA and Canada) plus medevac to the location of suitable specialist services (ICU etc).

So far so good.

any exclusions for "pre-existing conditions"  ?

 

i would think that most 70 yr olds would have some... if not many

[newbee2022]

9 hours ago, Sheryl said:

I have to strongly disagree on that.

 

The regulatory framework for health insurance differs markedly from that in western countries and all8ws things other vounyries would not.

 

Insurance company practices differ accordingly. Most do little or no screening at time of application and wait until a claim is made to decide if it is allowable. The basis for deciding, after the fact,  that a confition was pre-existing is sometimes ludicrous/makes no medical sense. 

 

Innumerable reports of this over the years on this forum.

 

In addition coverage levels tend to be low and premium costs comparatively high especially at older ages.

 

The health insurance market in Thailand is very small since all Thai citizens already have  free cover. This may explain why it is so weakly regulated. 

 

 

My research and experience does show different. Also there a lot of Thais who got a private insurance. Quite different from your opinion actually. Or do you think honestly Thaksin (as an example) would go for this 30-Baht scheme? 

[msbkk]

51 minutes ago, newbee2022 said:

My research and experience does show different. Also there a lot of Thais who got a private insurance. Quite different from your opinion actually. Or do you think honestly Thaksin (as an example) would go for this 30-Baht scheme? 

Thaksin is certainly not a good example. Billionaires do not need any insurance, they can self pay. 

[simon43]

I'm also with WR Life, (after a bad experience with April International Insurance - see previous threads).  I pay 5,700 baht/month (age 65) for my medical cover plus emergency evacuation (I live in Laos) and a $10,000 death policy to pay for a party at my funeral etc.  The only exclusion is prostate BPH, UTIs etc, but I'm fully covered for prostate cancer.

 

Never omit any pre-existing condition or medical event when you apply for medical insurance.  That's what I did (purely by accident) and it cost me with April Insurance). WR Life has a 2-page list of every single accident/illness since my birth (eg childhood mumps, falling off my bicycle etc etc - they maybe think I was crazy to provide those details, but it also means that they can never claim that I withheld details from them in case I have to make a claim).

[rumak]

2 hours ago, simon43 said:

but it also means that they can never claim that I withheld details from them in case I have to make a claim).

 

i am absolutely sure that insurance "companies"  have more tricks and deceipt at their disposal than any average person can imagine.    what they can do and have done to make life miserable for those who have in good faith handed over money... year after year.... is very well documented .

If you had posted your past experience( or links) with April here on this thread.... for all to see.. it would give a very clear idea of just how bad the claim procedure can be . 

Sheryl's comment (regarding thai insurers):"The basis for deciding, after the fact,  that a confition was pre-existing is sometimes ludicrous/makes no medical sense".  is right on,  and I for one am sure that the same treatment is almost universal .  

Just one link , of many on this subject,  i posted in another comment on this thread.

[newbee2022]

4 hours ago, msbkk said:

Thaksin is certainly not a good example. Billionaires do not need any insurance, they can self pay. 

There a lot middle class people with a private Thai insurance. 

(I doubt actually that the billionaires don't have an insurance)

[Scouse123]

20 hours ago, ChipButty said:

Take a look at this company online

 

Health Insurance for Digital Nomads

Every country. Any doctor or hospital. We've got you covered.,

We're here when you need us

Scooter crash in Thailand

Dengue fever in Bali

Ear infection in Vietnam

Surfing accident in South Africa

Broken foot in Spain

COVID-19 in Colombia

Click the Link
https://bit.ly/4abThKo

 

 

Just done it at 62 years old and living in Thailand, meaning I would be out of home country for best part of a year.

 

660 Euros a month, No, thanks!

[shackleton]

When I asked for quotes aged 70 plus it was going to be 40000 baht plus a month excluding pre existing conditions 

Cheaper for me to pay cash when in 🏥 

Plus have money put aside in case of emergency hopefully nothing major 

[PETERTHEEATER]

On 5/6/2024 at 1:32 PM, scubascuba3 said:

None fit that description 

Judging from the Ads which blanket my screen when scrolling through the forum daily, a certain company are offering '40% off Expat Health Insurance'....😀

[nglodnig]

4 hours ago, Scouse123 said:

660 Euros a month, No, thanks!

That's a ridiculous figure. As a Swiss resident I pay half that and it covers me for being abroad six months a year.

[Sheryl]

5 hours ago, shackleton said:

When I asked for quotes aged 70 plus it was going to be 40000 baht plus a month excluding pre existing conditions 

Cheaper for me to pay cash when in 🏥 

Plus have money put aside in case of emergency hopefully nothing major 

Likely that was either a Thai company or it was including outpatient cover or both.

 

70 plus can get a good international expat policy covering hospitalization (including day surgeries) and outpatient cancer treatment and dialysis for half that. 

[CANSIAM]

On 5/7/2024 at 8:32 AM, JimHuaHin said:

I am 68 years young, just renewed my policy with Pacific Cross.  No new medical questions this year - just sign a coverage form and fill out a payment form.  Emailed Pacific Cross with a request to renew day 1, received a reply and forms day 2, returned signed forms day 4, received acceptance email day 4.  Package to be sent out to mailing address within 10 days.

I just renewed as well with PC and a 8% premium increase do to medical costs etc they say. Did yours increase this renewal ?

[Scouse123]

On 5/6/2024 at 6:33 PM, Mark17AA said:

It's a old topic I know, but I'm a 65  more than average fit, and just got my renewal quote which is now doubled. Please any suggestions for a company that's not going to phone me 10 times a day chasing, but has sensible pricing and good quality policies to review.  So basically who would you recommend.

 

Thanks 

 

 

I always give the wrong phone number by one digit, this forces them to email me, as I too get sick of 10/15 phone calls a day for people touting insurance, or your personal information has been sold online, and the vultures are trying to contact you for selling other services.

 

There is nothing that can't be said in an email than can be said in a phone call.

 

The only thing you avoid is pressure sales.

[4MyEgo]

On 5/6/2024 at 9:33 PM, Mark17AA said:

It's a old topic I know, but I'm a 65  more than average fit, and just got my renewal quote which is now doubled.

 

It's an unfortunate realisation as we get older, our policies increase exponentially, been there done that.

 

I was insured for 4 years here, with a pre-existing condition, I went through AA Insurance Brokers after not being able to find an insurer to cover my pre-existing condition for the 1st two years that I was here.

 

AA Insurance Brokers found me an insurer who gave me an option to pay extra for the pre-existing condition and every year my insurance went up, including entering into another age bracket (59-64), back then 3 years ago when I was still insured, now I self insure.

 

My policy started off at around 70k baht per year, then hit 150k baht per year after 4 years, the last increase was two fold, i.e. entering the new age bracket and of course the insurer changed underwriters, just my luck.

 

I am similar in age to you and consider myself to be more than average in health, regardless of my pre-existing condition which hasn't given me any issues since it came to light in 2008.

 

As mentioned above, I self insure now, and feel comfortable that while I continue to exercise, eat a healthy diet and drink in moderation, things should be fine, that and I do add 250,000 baht to my self insure account annually and I do have enough to back me up in an emergency.

 

It's up to each individual to sort out which way they are comfortable, i.e. Insure or self insure, for me, I saw no reason to continue in this one size fits all health insurance industry rip off in my opinion, e.g. continuous increase, especially when no claims have been made, just because of age, hmmm, never heard of a 90 year old + guy remaining healthy, so everyone pay through the nose.

 

If you are not in a situation to self insure and are looking for a broker, AA Insurance Brokers I would highly recommend as they can find a suitable insurer for you, but from what I have heard Thai insurers are the worst.

 

Good Luck  

 

[newbee2022]

15 hours ago, Sheryl said:

Likely that was either a Thai company or it was including outpatient cover or both.

 

70 plus can get a good international expat policy covering hospitalization (including day surgeries) and outpatient cancer treatment and dialysis for half that. 

Examples please!

[Sheryl]

15 hours ago, Scouse123 said:

 

 

I always give the wrong phone number by one digit, this forces them to email me, as I too get sick of 10/15 phone calls a day for people touting insurance, or your personal information has been sold online, and the vultures are trying to contact you for selling other services.

 

There is nothing that can't be said in an email than can be said in a phone call.

 

The only thing you avoid is pressure sales.

Me too except that to spare someone else getting the calls I put a nonsense phone number like a string of 9's. 

[Sheryl]

12 hours ago, 4MyEgo said:

 

 

If you are not in a situation to self insure and are looking for a broker, AA Insurance Brokers I would highly recommend as they can find a suitable insurer for you, but from what I have heard Thai insurers are the worst.

 

Good Luck  

 

AA no longer handles/advises on internationally issued policies.

[Sheryl]

12 hours ago, newbee2022 said:

Examples please!

Off the top of my head, Cigna Gloval (UK based). 

 

There are others.

 

Should get through a broker.