Thailand to tax residents’ foreign income irrespective of remittance

[chiang mai]

Just now, Neeranam said:

I wonder if other countries have tax information in foreign languages. 

I know the US doesn't tax Mexican expats on remittance.

I know the UK government has other languages but that is for British nationals of other ethnicities. 

Also, there, Thais can remit funds as they are considered a gift, much like Brits remitting to Thailand. 

The Revenue Code doesn't distinguish between different nationalities, any rule applies to everyone.

 

We are told via previous discussion about this that many countries offer information in different languages hence it is not unusual

[Neeranam]

58 minutes ago, chiang mai said:

The Revenue Code doesn't distinguish between different nationalities, any rule applies to everyone.

I see, thanks for the info. 

[kiwikeith]

On 6/6/2024 at 2:24 AM, Foxx said:

 

Well, apart from the 7% they pay on every purchase they make.

My Thai family are mostly market traders, they have never paid tax in their lives

[Neeranam]

4 hours ago, motdaeng said:

as far as i know, the written TRD regulation makes it clear who needs to apply for a TIN and who needs to file taxes.

reading this thread, it seems otherwise

[Rolo89]

5 hours ago, Neeranam said:

Unless you are specifically told to get a Thai tax ID, by immigration for example, don't. 

I was thinking about getting one as could180+ days next year in Thailand.

 

I've given up my UK residency and when I let banks know this they'll want a tax ID of somewhere else close the account. 

 

I could just transfer enough to live for the year before Jan 25 into my Thai bank account meaning no tax is due, if I tell them this like @oldcpu then they may not even let me have a tax ID so I couldn't pay tax even if I wanted

[Sheist]

On 10/21/2024 at 10:19 AM, Neeranam said:

 

Thailand will not impose taxes on foreign remittances for foreigners because doing so would inadvertently grant foreigners tax rights that the government wants to avoid.

By taxing remittances, the Thai government could create a precedent that allows people to claim certain privileges, such as the ability to purchase property and access public services. This could lead to concerns about foreign ownership and influence within the local economy.

 

 

So is this tax voluntary, or mandatory as of this date?  (I am not asking about if I am a resident, 120k, 150k+, etc)

 

Your statement suggests they "cannot" (or are you suggesting only your opinion here?) tax our remittances legally as of this date?

[chiang mai]

20 minutes ago, Sheist said:

 

So is this tax voluntary, or mandatory as of this date?  (I am not asking about if I am a resident, 120k, 150k+, etc)

 

Your statement suggests they "cannot" (or are you suggesting only your opinion here?) tax our remittances legally as of this date?

Filing a tax return for those people who are tax resident and who exceed the assessable income threshold is mandatory for foreigners, just as it is for Thai's. Filing that tax return doesn't infer any rights whatsoever.

[kiwikeith]

On 10/23/2024 at 1:51 AM, chiang mai said:

Filing a tax return for those people who are tax resident and who exceed the assessable income threshold is mandatory for foreigners, just as it is for Thai's. Filing that tax return doesn't infer any rights whatsoever.

 

On 10/23/2024 at 1:51 AM, chiang mai said:

Filing a tax return for those people who are tax resident and who exceed the assessable income threshold is mandatory for foreigners, just as it is for Thai's. Filing that tax return doesn't infer any rights whatsoever.

As far as I know my mother in law who is 78 and her daughters and sons have never paid tax in their lives. And some how they still manage to get loans for vehicles

[lordgrinz]

1 minute ago, kiwikeith said:

 

As far as I know my mother in law who is 78 and her daughters and sons have never paid tax in their lives. And some how they still manage to get loans for vehicles

 

I would guess most Thai's would laugh at the idea of filing a Tax return, no matter how much they made.

[connda]

On 6/5/2024 at 9:24 PM, Foxx said:

 

Well, apart from the 7% they pay on every purchase they make.

Yeah, I always love it when someone chimes in - "Farangs don't pay tax.  If you live her you need to pay your fair share."

I do.  7% of my income on all purchases I make.  And then I receive none of the benefits that a Thai citizen receives.

[chiang mai]

8 minutes ago, kiwikeith said:

 

As far as I know my mother in law who is 78 and her daughters and sons have never paid tax in their lives. And some how they still manage to get loans for vehicles

That's not only very possible, it's probably typical.

 

Native Thai's are able to earn substantial sums, without paying tax. Many are able to take advantage of TEDA and don't have any need to file.

 

A self employed Thai can turn over a million in sales each year, net over 600k per year in salary and legally escape all tax, because of the generous deductions in the self employed sector. My wife runs a business this way and clears over 50k per month without any tax being due.

 

The average Thai wage nationally is 15 k per month, that means a husband and wife with one child can each earn that amount and not pay tax.

[chiang mai]

2 minutes ago, connda said:

Yeah, I always love it when someone chimes in - "Farangs don't pay tax.  If you live her you need to pay your fair share."

I do.  7% of my income on all purchases I make.  And then I receive none of the benefits that a Thai citizen receives.

Ridiculous! VAT is an indirect tax, everyone pays, even illegals and tourists.

 

The only time you get benefits is if you pay into the social security system, just ;like in most countries.

[lordgrinz]

1 minute ago, connda said:

Yeah, I always love it when someone chimes in - "Farangs don't pay tax.  If you live her you need to pay your fair share."

I do.  7% of my income on all purchases I make.  And then I receive none of the benefits that a Thai citizen receives.

 

Yup, and you pay for yearly extensions, re-entry permits, a 1000% increased fee to enter National Parks or other attractions, higher farang only medical costs, etc....etc....etc. 

[Foxx]

1 minute ago, chiang mai said:

The only time you get benefits is if you pay into the social security system, just ;like in most countries.

 

No.  Universal health coverage does require one to pay into the social security system, nor does state old age pension.  Those two are off the top of my head.  There may be others.

[chiang mai]

1 minute ago, Foxx said:

 

No.  Universal health coverage does require one to pay into the social security system, nor does state old age pension.  Those two are off the top of my head.  There may be others.

Old age pension is paid from the social security fund and requires membership and fees having been paid whilst working

 

Universal health care is Thai nationals only

 

 

[chiang mai]

You all knew these things before you moved here yet you still came, despite not receiving those "benefits"...it was your decision, your choice.

[Danderman123]

On 10/21/2024 at 1:19 PM, Neeranam said:

There is no new rule making foreigners even get a tax ID. All hogwash. 

Per 1000s of posts here, foreigners who are tax residents will have to file a tax return next year. Impossible to file a tax return without a tax ID.

[TheAppletons]

18 minutes ago, Danderman123 said:

Per 1000s of posts here, foreigners who are tax residents will have to file a tax return next year.

 

  False.  No assessable income, no need to file a tax return.

[Foxx]

1 hour ago, chiang mai said:

Old age pension is paid from the social security fund and requires membership and fees having been paid whilst working

 

Universal health care is Thai nationals only

 

You previously wrote "The only time you get benefits is if you pay into the social security system, just ;like in most countries" which is what I was responding to.

The pension is not paid from the SSF and does not require membership and fees.  To quote the ILO
 

Quote

Thailand has made considerable progress in recent years to build a near-universal pension system.
This success rests heavily on the rapid expansion of the near-universal tax-financed OAA scheme since 2008,
which covers about four in five older people. The coverage gap consists of retirees from the civil service (who
are not eligible) and a small portion of the older population who receive no allowance at all.

https://www.ilo.org/sites/default/files/wcmsp5/groups/public/@asia/@ro-bangkok/documents/publication/wcms_836733.pdf

 

UHC may be only for Thai nationals, but it is clearly a case of getting benefits without paying into the social security system.

In short, your previous assertion is wrong, and your facts about the state pension in Thailand are also wrong.

[Rolo89]

2 hours ago, chiang mai said:

The only time you get benefits is if you pay into the social security system, just ;like in most countries.

Not true for the UK. I still pay tax there but I'm not entitled to any benefits or healthcare. 

 

But people that arrive in the UK and haven't paid a penny into social security are entitled to a lot. 

[tomkenet]

Please keep to topic, the recently proposed change :

 Thailand to tax residents’ foreign income irrespective of remittance

[NoDisplayName]

On 10/22/2024 at 10:36 AM, oldcpu said:

My wife asked some questions of the Phuket RD official, one question being she noted my Thai pink ID number was rejected as a tax-ID by the online tax forms. Why was that?  The Phuket RD official noted the Thai pink ID could only be used as a tax-ID in an on-line form AFTER it was activated.  Mine was not activated.  (and again he noted he saw no reason to activate mine).

 

You have a pink ID, which serves as your tax number.

The number must be activated, yes.

You must request it, yes.

Must be done through the main provincial office.

 

The tax office lackey was correct.  You have no Thai income, you bring no foreign income into Thailand.  At this time, you have no assessable income.  You don't need to file, you don't need a tax number, and you gave no reason to get one.

 

If you really, really, truly want one now, tell them you intend to file returns to have withheld tax refunded.  Need established.

[chiang mai]

56 minutes ago, Foxx said:

 

You previously wrote "The only time you get benefits is if you pay into the social security system, just ;like in most countries" which is what I was responding to.

The pension is not paid from the SSF and does not require membership and fees.  To quote the ILO
 

 

UHC may be only for Thai nationals, but it is clearly a case of getting benefits without paying into the social security system.

In short, your previous assertion is wrong, and your facts about the state pension in Thailand are also wrong.

The bottom line is that the Thai system of benefits is for people who paid into the Thai system historically. For foreign expats, who earn at least four or five times the average Thai monthly wage of 15k Baht per month, to suggest that they ought to receive those same benefits, is almost galling and insulting.

 

Foreigners are not necessarily being asked to pay Thai tax, they are being required to participate in more or less global scheme that ensures they pay tax somewhere.....demanding something in return for that is also galling, especially given that many moved here thinking they could escape tax entirely in the first place.

[Yumthai]

6 minutes ago, chiang mai said:

Foreigners are not necessarily being asked to pay Thai tax, they are being required to participate in more or less global scheme that ensures they pay tax somewhere.....demanding something in return for that is also galling, especially given that many moved here thinking they could escape tax entirely in the first place.

It seems indeed to be the global trend: "shut up, obey, and pay". I don't think most of us will be happy anywhere in the future world that is being drawn, hopefully people will wake up before it's too late.

[chiang mai]

13 minutes ago, Yumthai said:

It seems indeed to be the global trend: "shut up, obey, and pay". I don't think most of us will be happy anywhere in the future world that is being drawn, hopefully people will wake up before it's too late.

Transitioning from a world full of tax loopholes where some people pay nothing and others pay a lot, will take time and will make some people unhappy. I personally think a system whereby everyone contributes to the running of society, is fair and reasonable.

[stat]

4 hours ago, chiang mai said:

Ridiculous! VAT is an indirect tax, everyone pays, even illegals and tourists.

 

The only time you get benefits is if you pay into the social security system, just ;like in most countries.

Two sentence and two times wrong.

 

1. It is even in the word Value added tax so it is a tax and hence foreigners are already paying tax.

 

2. You get benefits the moment you come into Britain or Germany or the US or the all other members of the EU... if you are an asylum seeker.

 

 

[Yumthai]

1 hour ago, chiang mai said:

I personally think a system whereby everyone contributes to the running of society, is fair and reasonable.

Ideally, but it's never the case and any attempt to change this throughout history has failed. The few people in charge make the rules in order to control the many others, keep their privileges (certainly not contributing fairly to the system) and transfer it to the next generation.

[chiang mai]

Just now, Yumthai said:

Ideally, but it's never the case and any attempt to change this throughout history has failed. The few people in charge make the rules in order to control the many others, keep their privileges (certainly not contributing fairly to the system) and transfer it to the next generation.

Sorry but I don't go along with these conspiracy theories but I'm happy that others do if they wish.

[Yumthai]

2 minutes ago, chiang mai said:

Sorry but I don't go along with these conspiracy theories but I'm happy that others do if they wish.

Conspiracy? We definitely don't live in the same world.

[chiang mai]

Just now, Yumthai said:

Conspiracy? We definitely don't live in the same world.

"The few people in charge make the rules in order to control the many others", 

 

If you believe that and that it's some sort of evil plan, you've got a vote, use it. Out