Clear from day 1

[TedG]

On 8/6/2024 at 10:40 PM, thaibeachlovers said:

Your comment would be more relevant had Russia wanted to "roll over Ukraine" ie all of Ukraine.

There is not and IMO never was a need to occupy all of Ukraine to achieve the objective.

Russia’s advance to Kiev was repulsed.   The goal was to replace the Ukraine government with a puppet.  

[TedG]

On 8/6/2024 at 8:41 PM, Gweiloman said:

You seem rather ignorant of the facts.

 

You are free to bring your “facts” to the table, then I’ll be happy to debunk your facts. 

[transam]

On 8/7/2024 at 9:42 AM, thaibeachlovers said:

Perhaps it's relevant to note that despite billions of $ of western military equipment, Ukraine is losing ground, not gaining it.

 

How are those Leopards that were going to win the war doing? Haven't heard much about them for a while, and now it's all about how 10 planes are going to turn the tide, LOL.

Oh, the Red bloke is back.........🙄

 

Plus, you may not have noticed that after 2.5 years, your leader has not overrun Ukraine, after his initial show of force heading to the Capital...

 

How much are you being paid, comrade....😂

[sirineou]

On 8/5/2024 at 5:37 PM, TedG said:

Russia is a paper tiger.  

Yet the west is afraid Russia will invade Europe. 

[Cameroni]

4 minutes ago, TedG said:

Russia lost the war in Ukraine.  Putin is stuck in a quagmire with no way out, and the Russian economy is slowing degrading.  But, at least he has people like you to spread his propaganda. 

 

Errrrr, no. Russia, if it wanted to, can drop a nuclear bomb in Ukraine. The US in turn could not respond because it would then risk nuclear annihilation.

 

Therfore, Russia will be the undoubted winner of this conflict. It can not be any other way.

[TedG]

On 8/5/2024 at 3:54 AM, FritsSikkink said:

Don't think that is their intention, they just want a buffer between their border and NATO troops.

Look at Map.   

[TedG]

1 minute ago, Cameroni said:

 

Errrrr, no. Russia, if it wanted to, can drop a nuclear bomb in Ukraine. The US in turn could not respond because it would then risk nuclear annihilation.

 

Therfore, Russia will be the undoubted winner of this conflict. It can not be any other way.

If Putin drops a nuke on Ukraine the US will destroy the Russian military.  

[TedG]

3 minutes ago, sirineou said:

Yet the west is afraid Russia will invade Europe. 

If they allow Putin to win in Ukraine he will try something stupid again.  Anyway, NATO has the means to destroy Russia. 

[jas007]

1 minute ago, TedG said:

If they allow Putin to win in Ukraine he will try something stupid again.  Anyway, NATO has the means to destroy Russia. 

And Russia has the means to destroy NATO and America, with thousands of nukes left over.  
 

Too many of you guys seem to have ingested too much Western warmonger propaganda.  It’s hard to believe, really.  

[transam]

3 minutes ago, jas007 said:

And Russia has the means to destroy NATO and America, with thousands of nukes left over.  
 

Too many of you guys seem to have ingested too much Western warmonger propaganda.  It’s hard to believe, really.  

Funny, you're full of laughs.....

 

The west has had a very long time to prepaid for any eventuality. You should point your advice to those who are making a complete cock-up of their land grab campaign...

[Cameroni]

24 minutes ago, TedG said:

If Putin drops a nuke on Ukraine the US will destroy the Russian military.  

 

See, no, that's where you're wrong. Because Americans are not idiots and they would not risk nuclear war with Russia because they would then themselves be in a nuclear conflict with Russia. Does this make any sense to you?

[Cameroni]

32 minutes ago, TedG said:

  Anyway, NATO has the means to destroy Russia. 

 

Well, yes. But you see Russia has the means to destroy every single NATO country many times over. The whole planet in fact.

 

Which is why the US is so hyper careful not to attack Russia herself with troops in this war, and why America would not reply if Russia drops a nuclear bomb on Ukraine. Because then America would be in a nuclear conflict with Russa. And Americans want to live.

 

Do you not understand this works both ways?

[TedG]

1 hour ago, jas007 said:

And Russia has the means to destroy NATO and America, with thousands of nukes left over.  
 

Too many of you guys seem to have ingested too much Western warmonger propaganda.  It’s hard to believe, really.  

Russia exposed itself as a paper tiger.  Their military is lame. 

[TedG]

42 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

 

Well, yes. But you see Russia has the means to destroy every single NATO country many times over. The whole planet in fact.

 

Which is why the US is so hyper careful not to attack Russia herself with troops in this war, and why America would not reply if Russia drops a nuclear bomb on Ukraine. Because then America would be in a nuclear conflict with Russa. And Americans want to live.

 

Do you not understand this works both ways?

 

If Russia drops a nuke on Ukraine, Russia is done. 

[TedG]

These Russian apologists are delusional.  The invasion of Ukraine exposed the ineptness of Russia to the world.

[Cameroni]

4 minutes ago, TedG said:

 

If Russia drops a nuke on Ukraine, Russia is done. 

 

Why? More sanctions? Lol.

[swissie]

I remain:
- Who has a larger militay/industrial complex = Russia.
- Who has more manpower (soldiers) at their disposal = Russia.

Without massive "western help" the Ukrainian Armed Forces would not have been able to conduct this war, based on their own limited resources from the very beginning.

- The last "express financial injection" of 3 billion $ from the US does not go to the Ukrainian military, but to pay the state employees salary, so that the Ukraine as a state will not implode !!!

Does that tell us something?

[still kicking]

6 hours ago, transam said:

Oh, the Red bloke is back.........🙄

 

Plus, you may not have noticed that after 2.5 years, your leader has not overrun Ukraine, after his initial show of force heading to the Capital...

 

How much are you being paid, comrade....😂

He is too busy counting his sheep

[swissie]

On 8/5/2024 at 1:03 AM, jas007 said:

The Russians have no intention of expanding the conflict.  They didn’t even want the current conflict, but they saw the expansion of NATO as an existential threat.  Putin has been saying as much for years, but the Western warmongers didn’t listen.  And so we have the narrative that Putin wants to reassemble the old Soviet Union.  That’s silly.  It’s a recipe for bankruptcy.  

Upon the fall of the Berlin wall, ex chancellor Helmut Kohl assuered Putin that there would be no "eastward expansion" of NATO.  But that's exactly what happened. Looking at the map, as a Russian, I would also feel "encerceld". The eastward expansion of NATO was absolutely uncalled for.

[swissie]

5 hours ago, TedG said:

Russia exposed itself as a paper tiger.  Their military is lame. 

If there ever was a "Paper Tiger" it can only be NATO. Exept for the US the "west" has cut military expenses to the bone. Now, not enough armaments, not enough ammo, not enough military personnel. The will to die for the "fatherland" non existant for the current generation.

Example: The "Deutsche Bundeswehr" consists of merely 100'000 soldiers. Infanterists having ammo for 2 weeks.

WHO IS THE PAPER TIGER"?

[Khyron]

31 minutes ago, swissie said:

Upon the fall of the Berlin wall, ex chancellor Helmut Kohl assured Putin that there would be no "eastward expansion" of NATO.  But that's exactly what happened. Looking at the map, as a Russian, I would also feel "encircled". The eastward expansion of NATO was absolutely uncalled for.

As much as I despise the Russian government for their illegal occupation of Ukraine and Georgia,(not the Russian people)

there is alot of truth to these statements.

Ever since the Crimean war, WW1 and WW2, Russia has been at odds with western Europe over expansion. 

Neither side was 100% right or wrong.

Crimea was England and France stopping Russia from taking over the Ottoman empire, both World wars were from treaties falling apart or ignored.

This would fuel some kind of paranoia of Nato expansion, but unfortunately the powers that be in Russia took it to another level, feeding that fear for an excuse for a land grab.

Nato has never "expanded", member states want to join. If I am not mistaken, Russia asked to join Nato and/or the EU in the 90's, but the European leaders and others shut it down as a drag on the economy as Russia was not doing well in that department. That was probably a mistake, as the world may have been a more peaceful place now.

 

This being said, the "Special military action" has saved the country of Taiwan and South Korea from anything for a while. 

Reason being, this has showed China and DPRK that the current Soviet style military isn't relevant in modern warfare, they will go back to the drawing board for a while and figure something out.

 

This is my opinion only, And I respect everyone's differing views.

 

[swissie]

30 minutes ago, Khyron said:

As much as I despise the Russian government for their illegal occupation of Ukraine and Georgia,(not the Russian people)

there is alot of truth to these statements.

Ever since the Crimean war, WW1 and WW2, Russia has been at odds with western Europe over expansion. 

Neither side was 100% right or wrong.

Crimea was England and France stopping Russia from taking over the Ottoman empire, both World wars were from treaties falling apart or ignored.

This would fuel some kind of paranoia of Nato expansion, but unfortunately the powers that be in Russia took it to another level, feeding that fear for an excuse for a land grab.

Nato has never "expanded", member states want to join. If I am not mistaken, Russia asked to join Nato and/or the EU in the 90's, but the European leaders and others shut it down as a drag on the economy as Russia was not doing well in that department. That was probably a mistake, as the world may have been a more peaceful place now.

 

This being said, the "Special military action" has saved the country of Taiwan and South Korea from anything for a while. 

Reason being, this has showed China and DPRK that the current Soviet style military isn't relevant in modern warfare, they will go back to the drawing board for a while and figure something out.

 

This is my opinion only, And I respect everyone's differing views.

 

Well researched and well written. I stand corrected, as you said, former "eastern block" countries WANTED to join NATO. Unfortunately.

But let's look ahead: Soon there will be "peace negotiations". The Ukraine will lose the Donbass to the Russians (a natural occurrence as those people speak Russian an think Russian).

A "demarcation-line" will seperate those 2 countries, Like North and South Korea. A no mans land, observed by UN troups.

Well understood, this would be "the best of cases".

[thaibeachlovers]

9 hours ago, TedG said:

Russia lost the war in Ukraine.  Putin is stuck in a quagmire with no way out, and the Russian economy is slowing degrading.  But, at least he has people like you to spread his propaganda. 

Certainly seems that someone believes western propaganda.

[thaibeachlovers]

9 hours ago, sirineou said:

Yet the west is afraid Russia will invade Europe. 

That's what the west's leaders want the sheeple to believe, then they can carry on throwing taxpayer money into a losing cause.

[swissie]

12 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Certainly seems that someone believes western propaganda.

I read major european newspapers daily. Reporting of "major Russian losses" constantly. Never read anything about "major Ukrainian losses". Never.

While the Russians advance slowly but surely.

[TedG]

3 hours ago, swissie said:

I remain:
- Who has a larger militay/industrial complex = Russia.
- Who has more manpower (soldiers) at their disposal = Russia.

Without massive "western help" the Ukrainian Armed Forces would not have been able to conduct this war, based on their own limited resources from the very beginning.

- The last "express financial injection" of 3 billion $ from the US does not go to the Ukrainian military, but to pay the state employees salary, so that the Ukraine as a state will not implode !!!

Does that tell us something?

GDP of Russia 2.24 trillion

GDP of USA + EU 48.13 trillion

[TedG]

1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said:

That's what the west's leaders want the sheeple to believe, then they can carry on throwing taxpayer money into a losing cause.

Russia has lost the war in Ukraine. 

[thaibeachlovers]

33 minutes ago, TedG said:

Russia has lost the war in Ukraine. 

You keep saying that without any proof. According to the forum rules you must prove any statement of fact. I bet you can't prove it.

[thaibeachlovers]

35 minutes ago, TedG said:

GDP of Russia 2.24 trillion

GDP of USA + EU 48.13 trillion

GDP has no bearing on the number of troops available.

 

Irrelevant.

[swissie]

10 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

GDP has no bearing on the number of troops available.

 

Irrelevant.

Yep. European "growth" around 0%. In spite of "sanctions" the Russian economy grew by 3.5 % last year.