Its Happening - Law to Tax Overseas Income Now in Progress

[Presnock]

1 hour ago, chiang mai said:

Why would it be necessary to show TRD your US tax return. TRD will either accept as fact, what you have written in your Thai tax return or they will query something and ask you for proof or further information. I don't think a tax return from another country constitutes proof, only statements or similar of the item being queried meet that requirement.

Actually for the LTR visa he BOI wanted the 1040 for PROOF of my income - I had given them the 1099R but they wanted the 1040 so gave a redacted copy of course and within 12 weeks had the visa.  They mentioned when I called to chat with them about he 1099R, as that is the "official" US document on salary and taxes so..,.go figure!  anyway best of luck.

[JimTripper]

2 hours ago, chiang mai said:

Why would it be necessary to show TRD your US tax return. TRD will either accept as fact, what you have written in your Thai tax return or they will query something and ask you for proof or further information. I don't think a tax return from another country constitutes proof, only statements or similar of the item being queried meet that requirement.

Umm...they do like paperwork in Thailand, not just a verbal. Have you ever dealt with immigration? You need a paper or documentation for every little thing, sometimes that's not even good enough or understandable. Would be much worse with the tax dept.

[chiang mai]

2 minutes ago, JimTripper said:

Umm...they do like paperwork in Thailand, not just a verbal. Have you ever dealt with immigration? You need a paper or documentation for every little thing, sometimes that's not even good enough or understandable. Would be much worse with the tax dept.

I've dealt with Immigration for over 20 years and watched that paper oile grow each year.

 

But TRD seems to be the opposite, they have moved the majority in recent years, from paper based to online hence they are reducing the amount of paper. If they require additional documents from you, they will instruct you to upload them, rather than give them paper.

 

 

[JimTripper]

14 minutes ago, chiang mai said:

I've dealt with Immigration for over 20 years and watched that paper oile grow each year.

 

But TRD seems to be the opposite, they have moved the majority in recent years, from paper based to online hence they are reducing the amount of paper. If they require additional documents from you, they will instruct you to upload them, rather than give them paper.

I hope you're joking...😆

 

There's not much difference between pulp paper and an online document. The point being that Thai's need every little thing documented. It's not a physical piece of paper issue. I won't go into the reasons why here.

[chiang mai]

13 minutes ago, JimTripper said:

I hope you're joking...😆

 

There's not much difference between pulp paper and an online document. The point being that Thai's need every little thing documented. It's not a physical piece of paper issue. I won't go into the reasons why here.

Actually I wasn't. I can do everything I need to for filing my return, from my PC at home, In fairness, my tax affairs here are not complicated but nevertheless, they don't get one piece of paper from me.

[Presnock]

2 hours ago, Presnock said:

Actually for the LTR visa he BOI wanted the 1040 for PROOF of my income - I had given them the 1099R but they wanted the 1040 so gave a redacted copy of course and within 12 weeks had the visa.  They mentioned when I called to chat with them about he 1099R, as that is the "official" US document on salary and taxes so..,.go figure!  anyway best of luck.

That is with in 2 (two) weeks very quick and easy to get documentation from my own computer only!

[JimGant]

2 hours ago, Presnock said:

Actually for the LTR visa he BOI wanted the 1040 for PROOF of my income - I had given them the 1099R but they wanted the 1040

BOI also wanted my 1040 -- but since it was joint, it made no sense without 1099 delineation. Thus, my 1099s, with an explanation sheet, breezed right thru.

[Gknrd]

Give ma all ya money or get out of Thailand... They have been chipping away at this for years. 

[Rolo89]

2 hours ago, Gknrd said:

Give ma all ya money or get out of Thailand...

Well they'll go from getting a fair bit of tax from me to 0.

 

Thailand isn't a paradise that people are desperate to live in for 365 days a year. 

 

UK citizens can easily be a tax resident of nowhere so I have little to gain to keep being a thai tax payer, other than a messy return

[chiang mai]

38 minutes ago, Rolo89 said:

Well they'll go from getting a fair bit of tax from me to 0.

 

Thailand isn't a paradise that people are desperate to live in for 365 days a year. 

 

UK citizens can easily be a tax resident of nowhere so I have little to gain to keep being a thai tax payer, other than a messy return

You can't be tax resident nowhere, you have to be tax resident somewhere, unless you don't have any income at all. You can live in a country for less than 180 days and then move on, or you can live in a low tax country. But at some point you will need to be paid income and invoke a tax treaty, which means having a country of tax residency.

[Rolo89]

11 minutes ago, chiang mai said:

You can't be tax resident nowhere, you have to be tax resident somewhere, unless you don't have any income at all. You can live in a country for less than 180 days and then move on, or you can live in a low tax country. But at some point you will need to be paid income and invoke a tax treaty, which means having a country of tax residency.

You don't have to be a tax resident of somewhere.

 

It mainly causes issues with banking so it's a good idea to get tax residency somewhere. I get paid dividends from my UAE company into my Jersey personal bank account. Can't see why I'd need to get tax residency, neither of those countries cared about my thai tax status.

[ukrules]

17 minutes ago, chiang mai said:

You can't be tax resident nowhere, you have to be tax resident somewhere, unless you don't have any income at all. You can live in a country for less than 180 days and then move on, or you can live in a low tax country. But at some point you will need to be paid income and invoke a tax treaty, which means having a country of tax residency.

 

This is not correct with regards to people who originate from the UK, not just the UK either.
 

The playing field is not level out there in the wider world, it all depends on where you come from and how long you've been living out of the country and of course where the income comes from.

[chiang mai]

Just now, Rolo89 said:

You don't have to be a tax resident of somewhere.

 

It mainly causes issues with banking so it's a good idea to get tax residency somewhere. I get paid dividends from my UAE company into my Jersey personal bank account. Can't see why I'd need to get tax residency, neither of those countries cared about my thai tax status.

Yes it causes problems with banking but also with companies making payment I imagine. Jersey and UAE are part of CRS, they both want to know your tax residency, has this not been an issue for you yet?

[chiang mai]

5 minutes ago, ukrules said:

 

This is not correct with regards to people who originate from the UK, not just the UK either.
 

Can a British subject open a bank account and receive payment without tax residency somewhere? I'm a Brit and not UK UK resident for tax purposes but they wont let me keep my UK bank account, unless I give them a a TIN from somewhere.

[ukrules]

1 minute ago, chiang mai said:

Can a British subject open a bank account and receive payment without tax residency somewhere?

 

Oh for sure, we all do it and have been for decades

 

If you're non resident the CRS information is worthless.

[Rolo89]

4 minutes ago, ukrules said:

 

This is not correct with regards to people who originate from the UK, not just the UK either.
 

Exactly, for some countries you have to prove residency elsewhere in order to not be pulled into the tax of your citizenship. But the UK doesn't do this.

[chiang mai]

3 minutes ago, ukrules said:

 

Oh for sure, we all do it and have been for decades

 

If you're non resident the CRS information is worthless.

 

1 minute ago, Rolo89 said:

Exactly, for some countries you have to prove residency elsewhere in order to not be pulled into the tax of your citizenship. But the UK doesn't do this.

 I'm a Brit and not UK  resident for tax purposes but HSBC UK wont let me keep my UK bank account, unless I give them a TIN from somewhere.

[ukrules]

2 minutes ago, Rolo89 said:

Exactly, for some countries you have to prove residency elsewhere in order to not be pulled into the tax of your citizenship. But the UK doesn't do this.

 

Correct, it's always been this way and long may it last.

[Rolo89]

4 minutes ago, chiang mai said:

Yes it causes problems with banking but also with companies making payment I imagine. Jersey and UAE are part of CRS, they both want to know your tax residency, has this not been an issue for you yet?

No issues with payments. CRS is about stopping tax evasion. 

 

If you don't qualify for tax residency anywhere then you don't qualify, that's avoiding tax rather than evading. 

 

Seemed unfair for my last tax return that it all went to thailand despite me spending 7 months there and 5 months in Japan. They should work on a way of making it fairer. 

[chiang mai]

1 minute ago, Rolo89 said:

No issues with payments. CRS is about stopping tax evasion. 

 

If you don't qualify for tax residency anywhere then you don't qualify, that's avoiding tax rather than evading. 

 

Seemed unfair for my last tax return that it all went to thailand despite me spending 7 months there and 5 months in Japan. They should work on a way of making it fairer. 

Did you work in Thailand? Because you were tax resident in Japan, why didn't you change it?.

 

And....bump re UK bank account at HSBC.

[ukrules]

Just now, chiang mai said:

bump re UK bank account at HSBC

 

Some banks are perhaps more strict with their 'policies' than others, there's no law against it - it's just the bank policy.

But they do know that many have gone 'full nomad' which simply means spreading your time between 2 or 3 countries over a year.

HSBC always been a bit of a stickler since they got fined many billions of dollars for industrial scale money laundering

[Rolo89]

6 minutes ago, chiang mai said:

 

 I'm a Brit and not UK  resident for tax purposes but HSBC UK wont let me keep my UK bank account, unless I give them a TIN from somewhere.

Well I wouldn't bank with hong kong and shanghai banking corp, but yes banks want a tax id but you can pay tax in a country without being a resident. 

[chiang mai]

1 minute ago, ukrules said:

 

Some banks are perhaps more strict with their 'policies' than others, there's no law against it - it's just the bank policy.

But they do know that many have gone 'full nomad' which simply means spreading your time between 2 or 3 countries over a year.

HSBC always been a bit of a stickler since they got fined many billions of dollars for industrial scale money laundering

I find it hard to imagine that UK banks apply UK HMRC policy differently.

[Rolo89]

Just now, ukrules said:

HSBC always been a bit of a stickler since they got fined many billions of dollars for industrial scale money laundering

This. All their fines for laundering drug cartel money have made them pretty strict. 

 

They only really care about not being fined. I can't recall any cases of banks being fined for providing services to people that live across several different countries.

[chiang mai]

1 minute ago, Rolo89 said:

Well I wouldn't bank with hong kong and shanghai banking corp, but yes banks want a tax id but you can pay tax in a country without being a resident. 

You said you lived in Japan for 7 months but paid tax in Thailand where you weren't tax resident. Can I ask again where you worked, presumably it was financially beneficial to pay tax here rather than Japan where the flat rate would have been what, 20% for a foreigner?

[ukrules]

1 minute ago, chiang mai said:

I find it hard to imagine that UK banks apply UK HMRC policy differently.

 

We're not talking about UK banks here, your bank accounts would generally be in other countries.

[Rolo89]

1 minute ago, chiang mai said:

You said you lived in Japan for 7 months but paid tax in Thailand where you weren't tax resident. Can I ask again where you worked, presumably it was financially beneficial to pay tax here rather than Japan where the flat rate would have been what, 20% for a foreigner?

You've misread.

[chiang mai]

1 minute ago, ukrules said:

 

We're not talking about UK banks here, your bank accounts would generally be in other countries.

Sorry but I'm trying to understand this rather than challenge anything. I said, HSBC wont let me have a bank account unless I declare my tax residency and show them a PIN, that seems contrary to what you and Rolo have said about the UK's liberal approach to this and that some banks might ignore tax residency.

[ukrules]

2 minutes ago, chiang mai said:

Sorry but I'm trying to understand this rather than challenge anything. I said, HSBC wont let me have a bank account unless I declare my tax residency and show them a PIN, that seems contrary to what you and Rolo have said about the UK's liberal approach to this and that some banks might ignore tax residency.

 

From the UK, open an account in Thailand, open an account in Cambodia, perhaps more than one.

Get paid from say the US into your Thai account and stay less than 180 days. Not being a US tax resident or on a payroll and perhaps receiving payments as a contractor or trading Bitcoin, etc on a US exchange - zero ties to US - wire money wherever you want but you're not doing this with HSBC or any UK sourced income.

Job done.

[chiang mai]

1 minute ago, Rolo89 said:

You've misread.

Ah sorry, yes I did. So you were tax resident in Thailand and you paid tax here, that seems about right. Where does you Jersey bank think you are tax resident?