Destination Thailand Visa Sparks Interest, Faces Future Hurdles

[webfact]

 

The DTV program has had a promising start, according to Thai Foreign Minister Maris Sangiampongsa. Although no official numbers have been released, social media bloggers estimate that between 1,500 and 2,500 visas have been issued in the first 10 weeks.

 

The main question now is what happens to DTV holders after their initial six-month stay, assuming they wish to remain in Thailand.

 

A contributor to a popular Facebook group summed up the uncertainty: “How about we wait until December or January when the first DTV holders share their experiences and requirements for extensions?” By then, DTV holders will face two options: leave Thailand and reapply or seek an extension at local immigration for another 180 days.

 

However, both options come with challenges. While the visa is valid for five years with multiple entries, the lack of clarity from immigration authorities has raised concerns about future extensions.

 

Although the Tourism Authority of Thailand initially indicated that no additional documentation would be required for re-entry or extension, immigration officers may still request further paperwork at their discretion.

The immigration bureau’s silence has led to speculation about potential abuses in the DTV application process. Some digital nomads, for instance, may be working for Thai clients without the necessary work permits.

There are also questions about how far soft power has been extended, with activities like attending concerts or dental appointments potentially qualifying for long-term visa status.

 

Thai embassies worldwide are issuing DTVs, but the requirements vary widely. Some embassies ask for a bank account with at least three months of activity, while others require a Thai guarantor or evidence of past work-related activities.

 

Discrepancies in documentation, such as differing requirements for cookery classes or Thai boxing academy registrations, add to the confusion.

 

For now, little is expected to change. If immigration officers start asking for more paperwork at airports and border posts, it could lead to daily delays.

 

Meanwhile, the government is working to merge immigration databases, a process expected to take most of next year. A review of the non-immigrant visa categories is also underway, which could affect the DTV.

 

"There is no doubt DTV will be reformed, and likely restricted, in the light of experience. But perhaps not in 2025," writes Barry Kenyon for Pattaya Mail.

 

-- 2024-09-30

 

 

[ChasingTheSun]

And how will those who stay longer than 183 days in a calendar year be taxed in Thailand on their worldwide income?

[ryandb]

sounds like the usual they have no idea but lets speculate based on a social media thread I read last week

[RICHARD H SCHILTZ]

But like when and where you apply for extension, the requirements are not the same.  Let the Immigration offices make up their own rules and how thick the brown envelope carries the faster and  longer approvals.  

[Snackbar]

All part of the game

[Presnock]

1 hour ago, ChasingTheSun said:

And how will those who stay longer than 183 days in a calendar year be taxed in Thailand on their worldwide income?

by definition of the Thai Revenu Department, if they stay 180 days or more in a calendar year, they are tax-residents and I have seen nothing about them being exempt as in the LTR.  Therefore, I would think that the RD will want their taxes but TIT so who really knows anything about anything here.

[hotchilli]

4 hours ago, webfact said:

However, both options come with challenges. While the visa is valid for five years with multiple entries, the lack of clarity from immigration authorities has raised concerns about future extensions.

As with any other type of extension... you are always a guest and never more.

[Ironmike]

The paperwork will be up to the immigration officials, I'm assuming that paperwork will be just how many 1000baht notes you will need to give the corrupt officers. 

[Kerryd]

Sounds more like those "bloggers" are pulling numbers from their nether regions.

As there is literally NO way they would have ANY actual idea of how many DTVs have been applied for/issued. Pretty sure Immigration doesn't stop what they are doing to do a database search and total the numbers from around the country every time some so-called "blogger" drops in looking for information they have no right to know in the first place.

Which is why the estimate is "1,500-2,500". Because they've talked to, or seen posts on forums, suggesting "15-25" people may have applied or been granted a DTV and then just added 2 zeros to the number to make it appear more "news worthy".

And Immigration has to know what a schmozzle this is going to be. It has the inklings of a "big boss" coming up with a grand scheme without thinking it through and then when the (khee) hits the fan, let the minions sort out the problems.

Remember the hassles of people trying to get "confirmation letters" from their Embassys to verify that they were getting (x amount) of "pension" income to meet the 65k/month requirement.

And the never ending "800k" rules. First it was have 800k in the bank when you applied for an Extension and your bank book had to show deposits and withdrawals (to show you were actually using that money to live on while in Thailand). 
And it had to be in a "savings account".

Then it was just have that much in any account. Then it was have it there for 3 months before you applied. Then it was 2 months before and 3 months after. Then it was 800k in the account 2 months before and 3 months after and then you could withdraw half of it - but it had to be topped up 2 months before your next application.

Next it will be "have 800k locked into an inaccessible term account for 365 days before and after you apply for and Extension and show that you have another 800k in a Thai bank to live on for the next 365 days but half of that has to be locked in for the full year so you will need another account with an additional 400k and half of that will be locked in for the full year so you will need another account with 200k (and so on and son on)".

Meanwhile, anyone with a faked "letter of employment" from Bill's pizza shop and Laundry Mart can get a DTV visa for 10k and just has to show the equivalent of having 500k in ANY bank - in ANY country - as "proof" of having enough funds ?

Or go to "Omm's Bar and Short-time hotel - now with "Cooking School" and sign up for a course on making fried rice and that's good enough ?

And remember when people could do unlimited border runs to get 30 day stamps so Immigration cracked down and said you could only have three 30 day stamps in a calendar year ?

And now they have 60 day stamps with no (apparent) limit to how many times you can do border runs ?

And 180 day DVT visas that only require one border run a year and you can keep doing that for 5 years at a time ?

Yeah, I can see a whole bunch of "amendments" coming in the near future and none of them will be beneficial to most of us.

[john donson]

dtv for cooking, but here you cannot work as a cook

 

dtv for thai boxing, but another job reserved for thai only

 

etc...

[mikeymike100]

1 hour ago, Ironmike said:

The paperwork will be up to the immigration officials, I'm assuming that paperwork will be just how many 1000baht notes you will need to give the corrupt officers. 

So just like it is at the present moment?

[Searat7]

They really opened the barn door with the low requirements to apply for DTV. Really ridiculous that one could apply for an 5 yr visa after making a dentist appointment.  I think changes will be coming by early next year if not sooner. 

[818Pilot]

The best is DTV for “attending a concert”. I think these people will be in for a shock after the first of the year and things are in immigrations hands for extensions or re-entry.

 

While I’m not shocked anymore, this in itself just shows how dysfunction things are here. The left doesn’t speak to the right and no one thinks about long term consequences, as they are a short sighted bunch that only thinks about now

[Sandboxer]

 I predict they'll choke down DTV issuance/eligibility harder than David Carradine in his hotel BKK room.

[Thomas72]

I have a DTV. It was pretty easy to get via the Los Angeles consulate in America. It just took a while. Total processing time was about 5 weeks.

 

I landed in Thailand last week at BKK. 11am on a Tuesday. No immigration queue. I was through in under 5 minutes.

 

My immigration official was very cheery... "Oh, DTV visa!" He stamped me in for 6 months with zero questions.

 

Zero stress or drama.

 

Regarding what will happen in 6 months - others have already exited and reentered Thailand and received a new 6 month stamp. I personally don't plan on doing extensions. I travel enough it will likely be all border runs for me.

 

I also opened a new Bangkok Bank account in Pattaya on my first try with the DTV. No fees, save the annual debit card fee. They set up online banking on my phone. I already had a sim registered in my name with AIS.

 

Taxes? That has to nothing to do with the DTV but with how long you stay. Everyone's personal situation will be different.

 

All in all I am very happy. There has been zero stress or fuss. If things change in the future I'll just roll with it. I'm not going to worry about what "might happen" - TIT. Anything can happen.

 

 

[Rolo89]

More nonsense.

 

It's for 5 years. There's no reapply if you leave and come back, you just get another 6 month passport stamp. Hardly anyone is going to bother to extend it and deal with that mess when they can just do a run.

[alw22]

11 minutes ago, Thomas72 said:

I also opened a new Bangkok Bank account in Pattaya on my first try with the DTV.

 

 

 

 

Nice! So they didn't require any additional documents?  What kind of address did you give them?

 

[Bobydog]

7 hours ago, webfact said:

 

The DTV program has had a promising start, according to Thai Foreign Minister Maris Sangiampongsa. Although no official numbers have been released, social media bloggers estimate that between 1,500 and 2,500 visas have been issued in the first 10 weeks.

 

The main question now is what happens to DTV holders after their initial six-month stay, assuming they wish to remain in Thailand.

 

A contributor to a popular Facebook group summed up the uncertainty: “How about we wait until December or January when the first DTV holders share their experiences and requirements for extensions?” By then, DTV holders will face two options: leave Thailand and reapply or seek an extension at local immigration for another 180 days.

 

However, both options come with challenges. While the visa is valid for five years with multiple entries, the lack of clarity from immigration authorities has raised concerns about future extensions.

 

Although the Tourism Authority of Thailand initially indicated that no additional documentation would be required for re-entry or extension, immigration officers may still request further paperwork at their discretion.

 

The immigration bureau’s silence has led to speculation about potential abuses in the DTV application process. Some digital nomads, for instance, may be working for Thai clients without the necessary work permits.

There are also questions about how far soft power has been extended, with activities like attending concerts or dental appointments potentially qualifying for long-term visa status.

 

Thai embassies worldwide are issuing DTVs, but the requirements vary widely. Some embassies ask for a bank account with at least three months of activity, while others require a Thai guarantor or evidence of past work-related activities.

 

Discrepancies in documentation, such as differing requirements for cookery classes or Thai boxing academy registrations, add to the confusion.

 

For now, little is expected to change. If immigration officers start asking for more paperwork at airports and border posts, it could lead to daily delays.

 

Meanwhile, the government is working to merge immigration databases, a process expected to take most of next year. A review of the non-immigrant visa categories is also underway, which could affect the DTV.

 

"There is no doubt DTV will be reformed, and likely restricted, in the light of experience. But perhaps not in 2025," writes Barry Kenyon for Pattaya Mail.

 

-- 2024-09-30

 

 

Better option is to find another destination that will deal openly and honestly with you without all the BS and subterfuge.

[Cabradelmar]

If it's too good to be true, it won't last. One thing is certain, visa rules change in Thailand like the wind.

[Thomas72]

52 minutes ago, alw22 said:

 

Nice! So they didn't require any additional documents?  What kind of address did you give them?

 

 

I'm American, so I needed to fill out a W4. The only other paperwork was a residence certificate, passport, and my  American driver license. They didn't want my Thai license - they required a valid foreign license.

 

Then for all the paperwork I filled out by hand they wanted my American address.

[black tabby12345]

The main question now is what happens to DTV holders after their initial six-month stay, assuming they wish to remain in Thailand...

 

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

They probably will If another half year extension is OK.

I presume most of those people are from the 1st world where they often suffer 

steep  inflation(rising cost of sustaining basic life) in recent years.

Compared to that, Thai inflation is at moderate level(2.3% in August).

And with or without current price hikes in the west, overall living cost here is

a lot lower(always has been) than back home.

So WHY NOT?

Unless they experience something horrible during first months of their stay here.

 

 

Edited September 30 by black tabby12345

[harryviking]

6 hours ago, ChasingTheSun said:

And how will those who stay longer than 183 days in a calendar year be taxed in Thailand on their worldwide income?

There is still NO such tax!

[Gottfrid]

Sounds like they know exactly what they are doing, as always. 

[bkknirvana]

In terms of tax, just make sure you only bring limited amount of money in, preferably cash. Limit the money you spend here that's traceable. Limit ATM withdrawals too.

 

In short, do everything you can to avoid paying these corrupt feckers one dime!

[motdaeng]

12 minutes ago, bkknirvana said:

In terms of tax, just make sure you only bring limited amount of money in, preferably cash. Limit the money you spend here that's traceable. Limit ATM withdrawals too.

 

In short, do everything you can to avoid paying these corrupt feckers one dime!

 

that would be difficult, if not impossible, for someone officially working in thailand on a dtv visa (and staying more than 180 days in los) to avoid paying taxes ...

[black tabby12345]

"There is no doubt DTV will be reformed, and likely restricted...

...the government is working to merge immigration databases, a process expected to take most of next year. A review of the non-immigrant visa categories is also underway, which could affect the DTV.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ 

 

Again from the Empty Pride of Thai Bureaucrats?y 

Some of them feel unhappy If  it is too easy for foreigners to come and stay here longer.

When they start to complicate things, matters   often go out of their control...

Edited September 30 by black tabby12345

[Dan O]

4 hours ago, Kerryd said:

Sounds more like those "bloggers" are pulling numbers from their nether regions.

As there is literally NO way they would have ANY actual idea of how many DTVs have been applied for/issued. Pretty sure Immigration doesn't stop what they are doing to do a database search and total the numbers from around the country every time some so-called "blogger" drops in looking for information they have no right to know in the first place.

Which is why the estimate is "1,500-2,500". Because they've talked to, or seen posts on forums, suggesting "15-25" people may have applied or been granted a DTV and then just added 2 zeros to the number to make it appear more "news worthy".

And Immigration has to know what a schmozzle this is going to be. It has the inklings of a "big boss" coming up with a grand scheme without thinking it through and then when the (khee) hits the fan, let the minions sort out the problems.

Remember the hassles of people trying to get "confirmation letters" from their Embassys to verify that they were getting (x amount) of "pension" income to meet the 65k/month requirement.

And the never ending "800k" rules. First it was have 800k in the bank when you applied for an Extension and your bank book had to show deposits and withdrawals (to show you were actually using that money to live on while in Thailand). 
And it had to be in a "savings account".

Then it was just have that much in any account. Then it was have it there for 3 months before you applied. Then it was 2 months before and 3 months after. Then it was 800k in the account 2 months before and 3 months after and then you could withdraw half of it - but it had to be topped up 2 months before your next application.

Next it will be "have 800k locked into an inaccessible term account for 365 days before and after you apply for and Extension and show that you have another 800k in a Thai bank to live on for the next 365 days but half of that has to be locked in for the full year so you will need another account with an additional 400k and half of that will be locked in for the full year so you will need another account with 200k (and so on and son on)".

Meanwhile, anyone with a faked "letter of employment" from Bill's pizza shop and Laundry Mart can get a DTV visa for 10k and just has to show the equivalent of having 500k in ANY bank - in ANY country - as "proof" of having enough funds ?

Or go to "Omm's Bar and Short-time hotel - now with "Cooking School" and sign up for a course on making fried rice and that's good enough ?

And remember when people could do unlimited border runs to get 30 day stamps so Immigration cracked down and said you could only have three 30 day stamps in a calendar year ?

And now they have 60 day stamps with no (apparent) limit to how many times you can do border runs ?

And 180 day DVT visas that only require one border run a year and you can keep doing that for 5 years at a time ?

Yeah, I can see a whole bunch of "amendments" coming in the near future and none of them will be beneficial to most of us.

They do know exactly how many have been issued for DTV and each other category  so not sure why you think they wouldnt know. They choose not to release the numbers as of yet for some reason only they know. Your making lots of inaccurate statements in your post 

[bkknirvana]

1 hour ago, motdaeng said:

 

that would be difficult, if not impossible, for someone officially working in thailand on a dtv visa (and staying more than 180 days in los) to avoid paying taxes ...

 

Go to Malaysia, Cambo or Laos, withdraw up to the limit you can take into Thailand undeclared. Rinse and repeat.

[Rolo89]

1 hour ago, motdaeng said:

 

that would be difficult, if not impossible, for someone officially working in thailand on a dtv visa (and staying more than 180 days in los) to avoid paying taxes ...

Well you can't work in Thailand on a DTV other than abroad remote work, so any money earned doesn't need to be paid into a thai bank account.

 

I can just take a short flight to another country, withdraw up to $20'000 USD from my Guernsey bank account where my company dividends are paid and Thailand can't trace or tax it.

 

If I decide to pay tax in Thailand then I won't pay the 35% tax rate while the services received don't justify it. 

[motdaeng]

21 minutes ago, bkknirvana said:

Go to Malaysia, Cambo or Laos, withdraw up to the limit you can take into Thailand undeclared. Rinse and repeat.

 

... it might work, but if you do exchange money in thailand, you'll need to present your passport = bingo!

... if you exchange thai baht in a neighboring country, you'll likely need a passport as well, and you'll get a poor exchange rate = bingo!

 

to safely and successfully trick the system, it requires a bit more than just some ideas ... good luck what ever you do