Destination Thailand Visa (DTV) Success Faces an Uncertain Future

[webfact]

File photo

 

Since its launch last July, Thailand’s Destination Thailand Visa (DTV) has been wildly popular, designed to attract more visitors and encourage longer stays, boosting state coffers in the process.

 

Although precise figures haven't been released, estimates suggest between 10,000 and 40,000 visas have been granted. Social media estimates lean towards the higher end. Despite some initial hiccups—such as inconsistencies in documentation requirements across Thai embassies—feedback on the popular DTV Facebook group shows a satisfaction rate of over 90%, writes Barry Kenyon for Pattaya Mail.

 

The success largely stems from a flexible approach. The DTV was initially intended for applications from home countries. But now, quick visas can even be obtained via a brief stay abroad, with the Thai embassy in Taipei providing the fastest service. It allows walk-ins and processes applications within 24 hours/.

 

The visa's potential hasn't gone unnoticed by Thai visa agents, who now offer visa runs, typically to Laos or Cambodia, managing travel and paperwork for a fee between 100,000 and 150,000 baht (around £2,200 to £3,300).

 

The DTV grants a 180-day stay per entry, and according to the Ministry of Foreign Affairs, multiple re-entries are allowed, making it an attractive option. However, a possible 180-day extension at local Thai immigration offices remains murky, as the Ministry of the Interior has yet to comment.

 

Concerns linger, particularly for freelancers and digital nomads. Misunderstandings about working legally are widespread, as any work interaction with the Thai economy is prohibited. Currently, DTV extensions are being granted, but future policies remain speculative, with some suggesting online applications or stricter controls.

 

Whatever the outcome, the Thai Revenue Department is poised to tax income from people staying over 180 days annually, sparking little controversy thus far. As it stands, no final decision has been made, leaving visa holders and hopefuls in limbo.

 

-- 2024-11-04

 

 

[ChasingTheSun]

Are these guys gonna report their worldwide income in Thailand and then pay Thailand taxes on it if they stay longer than 6months in a calendar year?

[NemoH]

4 minutes ago, ChasingTheSun said:

Are these guys gonna report their worldwide income in Thailand and then pay Thailand taxes on it if they stay longer than 6months in a calendar year?

Yep .. they are forming the new tax group which Thai income tax department hopes to tax on… other than the work permit holders… whilst it is harder to tax the residents on other visa type unless these residents make a self declaration. 

[hotchilli]

3 hours ago, webfact said:

Since its launch last July, Thailand’s Destination Thailand Visa (DTV) has been wildly popular, designed to attract more visitors and encourage longer stays, boosting state coffers in the process.

[sikishrory]

"faces an uncertain future" seems to be based on no evidence but speculation and seems misleading.

From memory I beleive the extensions was touched on and confirmed in the podcast with the minister of foriegn affairs a couple of months ago.

As for the tax. Most people hate tax but I imagine certain "residents of nowhere" such as people that work at sea with complex tax situations will be happy to pay some tax and have piece of mind that one day if they return to their home country they are not going to be penalised.

[kuzmabruk]

2 hours ago, NemoH said:

Yep .. they are forming the new tax group which Thai income tax department hopes to tax on… other than the work permit holders… whilst it is harder to tax the residents on other visa type unless these residents make a self declaration. 

Your statement makes no sense.  Residents (1-year visa holders) could be asked to provide their Thai tax return on visa renewal.  Easy as pie.  Same for 180-day renewals of DTV holders.   If the days in Thailand during Jan1-Dec31 is less than 180 days, then you are exempt.  Additionally, a lot of us are already taxed at higher rates in our home country - if we still claim tax residency or are American.  Otherwise the tax rate here is a pretty fair 35%.  Compared with 52% that I paid in Canada.  

[Presnock]

2 hours ago, ChasingTheSun said:

Are these guys gonna report their worldwide income in Thailand and then pay Thailand taxes on it if they stay longer than 6months in a calendar year?

that is the purpose of the OCED agreement, CRS, and FACTA agreements on exchange of financial information.  Immigration will know when you pass 180 days and probably have set up some kind of computer exchange with the Thai Revenue Dept  We have yet to see any final information on tax schemes affecting tax residents or those earning income within Thailand.  We still wait...

[Presnock]

2 minutes ago, kuzmabruk said:

Your statement makes no sense.  Residents (1-year visa holders) could be asked to provide their Thai tax return on visa renewal.  Easy as pie.  Same for 180-day renewals of DTV holders.   If the days in Thailand during Jan1-Dec31 is less than 180 days, then you are exempt.  Additionally, a lot of us are already taxed at higher rates in our home country - if we still claim tax residency or are American.  Otherwise the tax rate here is a pretty fair 35%.  Compared with 52% that I paid in Canada.  

However, if one earns any income within Thailand they too must get a Thai Tax ID and file whether they stay even less than 180 days in a calendar year.

[ChasingTheSun]

15 minutes ago, kuzmabruk said:

Your statement makes no sense.  Residents (1-year visa holders) could be asked to provide their Thai tax return on visa renewal.  Easy as pie.  Same for 180-day renewals of DTV holders.   If the days in Thailand during Jan1-Dec31 is less than 180 days, then you are exempt.  Additionally, a lot of us are already taxed at higher rates in our home country - if we still claim tax residency or are American.  Otherwise the tax rate here is a pretty fair 35%.  Compared with 52% that I paid in Canada.  

35% is “fair”?

 

what do you get for your 35% donation to Thailands coffers?

[mfd101]

The fog of war ... woops. The murky life of Thailand.

[Dakhar]

3 hours ago, ChasingTheSun said:

Are these guys gonna report their worldwide income in Thailand and then pay Thailand taxes on it if they stay longer than 6months in a calendar year?

 

Why report world wide income & not report the $ brought into Thailand, as far as I know the law/policy is...

 

Tax is assessed on the amount of $ remitted to Thailand?

 

World wide income has nothing to do with remitted money.

[redwood1]

17 minutes ago, ChasingTheSun said:

35% is “fair”?

 

what do you get for your 35% donation to Thailands coffers?

 

What do you get for paying Taxes in Thailand?

 

You get to pay 10X as much as Thais at National parks....

 

You get to pay 3-4X as much as Thais for medical care...

 

You get to do 90 day reports...

 

You get no easy way of permanent residency..

 

And many other benefits such as these...

 

 

So paying Thai taxes is a heck of a deal....lol 

[tai4de2]

The taxation situation in Thailand seems poised to cross the line to "not worth it" for many, I suspect.

 

In that vein if Thailand tries taxing DTV holders, and there's actual enforcement, I suspect DTV will start to become a lot less successful, quickly.

 

I'm definitely re-evaluating my own future plans because of all the recent taxation machinations.

[Kerryd]

 

3 hours ago, webfact said:

Currently, DTV extensions are being granted

So even though it only started in "July" (4 months ago) they know that "extensions" are being granted, even though anyone wanting an extension would have at least 2 more months to go on their initial 180 day Visa ?

Sounds more like "it looks like 10 or so people have applied, but lets quadruple that - and then add 3 zeros to it and then make up a lot of stuff".

Seriously. It's the same as another previous article a couple months ago where a "writer" claimed huge numbers of people had applied for DTVs - with NO reference or link to the source of the information of course.

Because it's NOT likely that ANY journalist, let alone a foreign one, has access to Immigration's database or data from Thai Embassies around the world.

So where are they getting these numbers from ? 

Wild guesses, exaggerated estimations and the nether regions of a Beach Road freelancer at 3:30 in the morning ?


And seriously, 100,000-150,000 baht for a "visa run" to Laos or Cambodia ?

MOST of the (caucasian "Westerner") expats that would go for a DTV are the ones who CAN'T afford to live here under the current financial requirements and use agents to loophole/scam their way into getting an Extension.

Digital nomads, "begpackers", Ed Visa" holders pretending to be studying Thai, retirees constantly wiring money back and forth each month to make it look like they are getting 65,000 a month.

Every time there's a thread about Non-O visas/Extensions, there's a smug bunch of people bragging about how they never worry about the requirements because they just use an agent.

And "someone" thinks those people are going to jump up and splash out "100-150,000 baht" for a DTV ? Plus whatever that "agent" would charge to get an Extension on it 6 months later. And then whatever the agent would charge to do the "border run" 180 days after getting the Extension.

Not likely.
 

[tai4de2]

1 minute ago, redwood1 said:

What do you get for paying Taxes in Thailand?

 

[...]

 

I agree that all those things are not exactly wonderful.

 

But my main concern is the overall sense that Thailand could decide on a moment's notice to cut off access to my life here. At the very least, there is no guarantee whatsoever of continued unfettered access. So why pay all those taxes, make investments here, etc. with that risk?

 

We need look no further than Thailand's covid response to see this negative possibility in action.

[Presnock]

39 minutes ago, ChasingTheSun said:

35% is “fair”?

 

what do you get for your 35% donation to Thailands coffers?

I agree, 35% is a lot more than my US tax on my pension and that pension is guaranteed for life - all that I have paid for here, could be gone like previously mentioned - stroke of a pen on a new interpretation of a law or maybe after they join BRICS too and turn away from the west totally.  My opinion anyway.

[Sydebolle]

This country is drowning in its bureaucracy to keep all those ignorant pencil pushers in jobs and, wonder over wonder, it also applies to the DTV programme. Maybe it is high time to boot out 80% of all those goons, simplify procedures to the essential necessities; more money in the state's coffers at far less (human resource and customer frustration) costs! 

 

The only consistent thing in this country, for decades, are the  inconsistencies in documentation requirements across Thai government agencies leaving hopefuls in limbo. 

A "full-of-tax-extensions" Bangkok-registered car book can only be renewed in Bangkok (which is 700kms away). Going back to the same office a few hours later trying with another officials - no issue and five minutes later I had the new book.
A re-entry for a PR could not be issued in (very unfriendly) Korat but no issue in Sisaket. 
A driving license extension in Banglamung takes a gooseneck trailer of documents, a rude shake-down by the grouch behind the counter and "see you tomorrow tomorrow" (in two days); in Chayaphum I could wait for it with a copy of my passport only. 

The bottle neck is usually on top of the bottle 😉 

[fvw53]

6 hours ago, webfact said:

File photo

 

Since its launch last July, Thailand’s Destination Thailand Visa (DTV) has been wildly popular, designed to attract more visitors and encourage longer stays, boosting state coffers in the process.

 

Although precise figures haven't been released, estimates suggest between 10,000 and 40,000 visas have been granted. Social media estimates lean towards the higher end. Despite some initial hiccups—such as inconsistencies in documentation requirements across Thai embassies—feedback on the popular DTV Facebook group shows a satisfaction rate of over 90%, writes Barry Kenyon for Pattaya Mail.

 

The success largely stems from a flexible approach. The DTV was initially intended for applications from home countries. But now, quick visas can even be obtained via a brief stay abroad, with the Thai embassy in Taipei providing the fastest service. It allows walk-ins and processes applications within 24 hours/.

 

The visa's potential hasn't gone unnoticed by Thai visa agents, who now offer visa runs, typically to Laos or Cambodia, managing travel and paperwork for a fee between 100,000 and 150,000 baht (around £2,200 to £3,300).

 

The DTV grants a 180-day stay per entry, and according to the Ministry of Foreign Affairs, multiple re-entries are allowed, making it an attractive option. However, a possible 180-day extension at local Thai immigration offices remains murky, as the Ministry of the Interior has yet to comment.

 

Concerns linger, particularly for freelancers and digital nomads. Misunderstandings about working legally are widespread, as any work interaction with the Thai economy is prohibited. Currently, DTV extensions are being granted, but future policies remain speculative, with some suggesting online applications or stricter controls.

 

Whatever the outcome, the Thai Revenue Department is poised to tax income from people staying over 180 days annually, sparking little controversy thus far. As it stands, no final decision has been made, leaving visa holders and hopefuls in limbo.

 

-- 2024-11-04

 

 

 

Does Thailand have an Embassy in Taipei ? It would mean there are diplomatic relations between Thailand and Taiwan which is unthinkable....

[Upnotover]

5 minutes ago, fvw53 said:

 

Does Thailand have an Embassy in Taipei ? It would mean there are diplomatic relations between Thailand and Taiwan which is unthinkable....

Not an Embassy but they offer services from the Thailand Trade and Economic Office (Taipei).

[topt]

1 hour ago, Kerryd said:

Not likely.

Was my thought when first reading the article.

The original article on what it states it is based on is a little bit more nuanced -

https://www.pattayamail.com/latestnews/news/thailands-dtv-game-changer-let-sleeping-dogs-lie-for-now-478512

 

PS -

just Ignore the 10 fold $ increase exchange "typo" for the agent fees  

[john donson]

launch a new visa, lure people ,  then change the rules... legend

[harryviking]

2 hours ago, ChasingTheSun said:

35% is “fair”?

 

what do you get for your 35% donation to Thailands coffers?

NOTHING!!!

[Cabradelmar]

All part of the master plan to grow the tax base then spring worldwide income tax rules on the base. Tick tock, tick tock... 

[Patong2021]

3 hours ago, kuzmabruk said:

Your statement makes no sense.  Residents (1-year visa holders) could be asked to provide their Thai tax return on visa renewal.  Easy as pie.  Same for 180-day renewals of DTV holders.   If the days in Thailand during Jan1-Dec31 is less than 180 days, then you are exempt.  Additionally, a lot of us are already taxed at higher rates in our home country - if we still claim tax residency or are American.  Otherwise the tax rate here is a pretty fair 35%.  Compared with 52% that I paid in Canada.  

 

For reference sake, the tax rate in Thailand is not 35%. The 35% only applies on income that is in excess of 5 million baht. Thailand like Canada has a progressive tax rate.

 National income tax rates

1 to 150,000 B    -0%

150,001 to 300,000B -  5%

300,001 to 500,000B - 10%

500,001 to 750,000B - 15%

750,001 to 1,000,000 B - 20%

1,000,001 to 2,000,000 B - 25%

2,000,001 to 5,000,000B  - 30%

5,000,001+B - 35%

 

Canada uses a progressive tax rate that has higher tax rates apply only on income segments. For example, in Ontario the 52% would have applied only on income in excess of  $246,000. A lower tax rate applies to Canadian  Capital Gains

Taxable Income ($)			Marginal Tax Rates (%)
			Interest and Regular Income	Capital        Gains
-	to	$15,705	-	-
$15,706	to	$18,062	15	7.5
$18,063	to	$23,726	25.1	12.55
$23,727	to	$51,446	20.05	10.02
$51,447	to	$55,867	24.15	12.08
$55,868	to	$90,595	29.65	14.83
$90,596	to	$102,894	31.48	15.74
$102,895	to	$106,735	33.89	16.95
$106,736	to	$111,733	37.91	18.96
$111,734	to	$150,000	43.41	21.71
$150,001	to	$173,205	44.97	22.49
$173,206	to	$220,000	48.29	24.15
$220,001	to	$246,752	49.85	24.93
$246,753	and	over	53.53	26.77

 

 

[Rolo89]

Thailand is only worth it for digital nomads without worldwide taxation.

 

I'm undecided if I'll stay over 180 days and pay tax on money moved into Thailand.

 

It might be worth paying tax on 800'000 THB remitted for peace of mind as it's 75'000 tax and feels a fair amount to contribute.

 

But the moment world wide taxation comes in they won't get a penny from me as most of my income would be taxed at 35%. It's just about worth it with the current system but these new arrivals will very easily leave, and leave more of a glut of empty properties. 

[nglodnig]

4 hours ago, kuzmabruk said:

Residents (1-year visa holders) could be asked to provide their Thai tax return on visa renewal.  Easy as pie

This is has not occurred - and no indication that it will - it's November now, less than two months before the end of the year and no sign of this happening

[Toby1947]

All this hassle, who in their right mind would want to live in Thailand permanently, 

[hioctane]

4 hours ago, kuzmabruk said:

Your statement makes no sense.  Residents (1-year visa holders) could be asked to provide their Thai tax return on visa renewal.  Easy as pie.  Same for 180-day renewals of DTV holders.   If the days in Thailand during Jan1-Dec31 is less than 180 days, then you are exempt.  Additionally, a lot of us are already taxed at higher rates in our home country - if we still claim tax residency or are American.  Otherwise the tax rate here is a pretty fair 35%.  Compared with 52% that I paid in Canada.  

What 1 year resident visas are you referring to? The only one that allows working is the DN visa which very few have.

 

I don't think they have announced what the tax rates are for DTV visas are yet.

[Rolo89]

44 minutes ago, Toby1947 said:

All this hassle, who in their right mind would want to live in Thailand permanently, 

Well most couldn't live in Thailand permanently even if they wanted.

 

I think it's more who would want to contribute to a country where you'll only ever be a visitor and at the constant mercy of changes.

[cjinchiangrai]

The biggest issue is that it undermines other visas. They really need to rationalize the entire program.