What is different between Drug Dealers and Farmer's burning their crops?

[Gobbler]

Thailand executes drug dealers. Why? Is it because of the damage they do to society? Why are the farmers different?  Both are profit-driven, and both are killing innocent people in Thailand.  I say yes, hang the farmers from a tree after adjudication, and all appeals are exhausted.  Can someone logically convince me otherwise?

[atpeace]

6 minutes ago, Gobbler said:

Thailand executes drug dealers. Why? Is it because of the damage they do to society? Why are the farmers different?  Both are profit-driven, and both are killing innocent people in Thailand.  I say yes, hang the farmers from a tree after adjudication, and all appeals are exhausted.  Can someone logically convince me otherwise?

 

Thais in general  are ready for the burning to stop.  Not the politicians that are just talking but  the majority of Thai citizens  would support extreme penalties but death is too extreme.   

[Gobbler]

1 minute ago, atpeace said:

 

Thais in general  are ready for the burning to stop.  Not the politicians that are just talking but  the majority of Thai citizens  would support extreme penalties but death is too extreme.   

 

They kill drug dealers here.  What is the difference? Convince me.

[KannikaP]

1 minute ago, Gobbler said:

 

They kill drug dealers here.  What is the difference? Convince me.

When was the last one please?

[KhunLA]

Geez, I though I was an Ahole (no need to agree) on OTT punishments.

 

Drug dealers ... depends what type of drugs, with ganga still being illegal in many places, even unlicensed sales here/TH, that's a bit of overkill.  I would actually say alcohol sales is a more serious issue.  And that's mostly legal.

 

Death for burning ... maybe heavy fine, loss of land, but we all know, nothing will change.   Been spewing the same hot air about smog season for over 24 years since I've been here, and I think it's only gotten worse, or I just noticed how horrendous it is in some areas.

[Gobbler]

10 minutes ago, KannikaP said:

When was the last one please?

Are they rotting in prison, waiting for death? This is acceptable. 

[Gobbler]

15 minutes ago, atpeace said:

 

Thais in general  are ready for the burning to stop.  Not the politicians that are just talking but  the majority of Thai citizens  would support extreme penalties but death is too extreme.   

 

How many people does one farmer affect?

[Gobbler]

8 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

Geez, I though I was an Ahole (no need to agree) on OTT punishments.

 

Drug dealers ... depends what type of drugs, with ganga still being illegal in many places, even unlicensed sales here/TH, that's a bit of overkill.  I would actually say alcohol sales is a more serious issue.  And that's mostly legal.

 

Death for burning ... maybe heavy fine, loss of land, but we all know, nothing will change.   Been spewing the same hot air about smog season for over 24 years since I've been here, and I think it's only gotten worse, or I just noticed how horrendous it is in some areas.

Nothing will change because Thais are gutless most of the time and do nothing to rock the boat. 

People are dying in the boat.

[TheAppletons]

What is the difference between a drug dealer and a farmer burning his crops?

 

One is lighting up a joint while the other is lighting up the joint.

 

(Thank you ladies and gentlemen, I'll be here all week.  Please remember to tip your servers and bartenders.)

[newbee2022]

A little bit funny post for the weekend. Thanks for entertaining us.🤗

[newbee2022]

19 hours ago, KannikaP said:

When was the last one please?

Here on AN?🤗

[Presnock]

19 hours ago, KhunLA said:

Geez, I though I was an Ahole (no need to agree) on OTT punishments.

 

Drug dealers ... depends what type of drugs, with ganga still being illegal in many places, even unlicensed sales here/TH, that's a bit of overkill.  I would actually say alcohol sales is a more serious issue.  And that's mostly legal.

 

Death for burning ... maybe heavy fine, loss of land, but we all know, nothing will change.   Been spewing the same hot air about smog season for over 24 years since I've been here, and I think it's only gotten worse, or I just noticed how horrendous it is in some areas.

agree with you and I have watched it since the early 1950's.  It most likely has been done just about forever but since the invention of tractors of all kinds, the burning creating pollution MUST be stopped

[wombat]

i find your comparison between polar opposites to be confusing

[newbee2022]

19 hours ago, KannikaP said:

When was the last one please?

Oh, I think it was some days ago in the North. And it was mentioned on AN 

[KannikaP]

3 minutes ago, newbee2022 said:

Oh, I think it was some days ago in the North. And it was mentioned on AN 

The last person executed in Thailand was on 18th June 2018 (Gemini AI)

[frank83628]

20 hours ago, Gobbler said:

Thailand executes drug dealers. Why? Is it because of the damage they do to society? Why are the farmers different?  Both are profit-driven, and both are killing innocent people in Thailand.  I say yes, hang the farmers from a tree after adjudication, and all appeals are exhausted.  Can someone logically convince me otherwise?

I think you're a bit out of date, When was the last execution for drugs?

Farmers have been burning long before you arrived... you know the answer is at the airport.

[newbee2022]

2 minutes ago, KannikaP said:

The last person executed in Thailand was on 18th June 2018 (Gemini AI)

No, you're mistaken me. The police shot them. Another way for execution though.

[carlyai]

20 hours ago, Gobbler said:

Thailand executes drug dealers. Why? Is it because of the damage they do to society? Why are the farmers different?  Both are profit-driven, and both are killing innocent people in Thailand.  I say yes, hang the farmers from a tree after adjudication, and all appeals are exhausted.  Can someone logically convince me otherwise?

Farmers are not 'profit' driven but 'survival' driven.

You obviously have not spent any time in a small village in Isaan near the Lao boarder.

[Gobbler]

5 minutes ago, carlyai said:

Farmers are not 'profit' driven but 'survival' driven.

You obviously have not spent any time in a small village in Isaan near the Lao boarder.

Murder is murder. 

 

You have no clue, it appears. 

[fredwiggy]

Collateral damage from burning takes quite a while before it kills, just like legal cigarettes. And it isn't easy to prove the respiratory damage was done specifically by the burning. They can stop burning immediately here if the penalties came immediately and took cash from those who burn things. Losing money, especially if you're not well off, is a good teacher, especially if the second offense means more cash lost. The same goes for traffic offenses regarding not wearing helmets or letting the under aged drive.If this was Singapore, more would stay away from drugs but seeing it's a place where cash talks and gets many off the hook, this will continue indefinitely.

 

The first thing that has to happen to make changes is complaining about the problem. if enough people are "allowed" to complain, and they are heard, and the official in charge could lose their job if they ignore the people, then things might change. Also if it personally affects them,as in seeing a relative die from respiratory ailment brought on by burning. Looking at how little care is put towards drivers , students and women who are assaulted, things won't change anytime soon.

[spidermike007]

Death is probably a fairly extreme, but I do think massive penalties and enormous fines and perhaps even the forfeiture of land after the third offense. The real problem in this scenario is the unwillingness of the provincial authorities to get involved and to actually police the area and do real work. It appears they would rather sit at a desk and collect their salary and large bribes. 

 

I posted something similar elsewhere. But this is such a massive problem it bears repeating.

 

There is a very simple solution to this problem. If the authorities were interested in solutions. The burning has to stop. There are alternatives, to this 19th century technique of burning after the sugar cane harvest. Either the government starts to encourage farmers to switch to more environmentally friendly crops, or they start to penalize farmers for burning. This heinous burning, is leading to a tremendous degree of environmental degradation, and alot of lung disease. So here is what I propose-

 

1. Fine the farmers 5,000 baht for a first offense, and give them a stern warning, that burning is now prohibited, and the second fine will be very harsh.

2. For a second offense, fine the farmer 100,000 baht, and warn them that if the burning continues, their land will be confiscated.

3. On the 3rd offense, confiscate their land. Period. No questions. No legal proceeding or appeals on the part of the farmers. Allow others to come in and purchase the land at a fair price, with the caveat that sugar is prohibited as a crop to be grown on that land.

The news would travel faster than the toxic smoke, and farmers would change their ways overnight, and move into the 21st century.

 

Progressive reform on burning - green harvesting

https://youtu.be/thXstqQcdQ4?si=yExPfXaED66a4vyP

 

This is an absolute travesty, and fall squarely on the tiny shoulders of the do nothing PM. They're absolute unwillingness to do anything about this situation is an abomination and the list of things that could be done to address this problem are countless.

 

They could start by pulling over diesel vehicles spewing out enormous clouds of black smoke, but that would require the highway patrol to actually do some work, which they utterly refuse to do.

 

If the government cared one iota which they don't they would start convincing Farmers to switch crops and start moving away from 16th century crops like rice and sugar, moving toward more progressive crops which are potentially more profitable. If they felt the need to stick with rice and sugar they could educate the public on how those crops can be processed without burning, and subsidize the purchase of the required equipment. 

 

Then they can move on to tackle the sale of diesel vehicles, and the government's enthusiastic support of such. It is inane in this day and age. Most nations are moving away from diesel for good reasons. When they are not well maintained, they foul the air, with large, nasty particles. And who properly maintains their vehicle here?

[novacova]

21 hours ago, Gobbler said:

What is different between Drug Dealers and Farmer's burning their crops?

Is this supposed to be some sort of trick question? Drug dealers sell illicit drugs to burn brain cells. Farmers burn residual biomass to grow your food.

[carlyai]

'Fine the farmers 5,000 baht'. Typical farmers out our way have unregistered motorbike and some unregistered trucks and make B300 per day.

Many smoke roll-your-own, have a small bottle of 40 degree or two, have a second wife sometimes, take yaa-haa and support kids and dogs.

Live in a very basic house with 1 light and mozzie nets.

So you want to fine these people B5000 for a first offence?

The authorities and police are not as stupid as you think.

What is a practical solution you would recommend? How would you get rid of the leftovers from harvests without penalising the farmers?

[mikebike]

2 hours ago, newbee2022 said:

No, you're mistaken me. The police shot them. Another way for execution though.

AHH, a Duterte fan 😎

[newbee2022]

1 hour ago, mikebike said:

AHH, a Duterte fan 😎

No, but a no-drugs and no-dealers fan.

[newbee2022]

3 hours ago, carlyai said:

Farmers are not 'profit' driven but 'survival' driven.

You obviously have not spent any time in a small village in Isaan near the Lao boarder.

That's laughable. Go to the mountain people at the border and check who got the latest model of Pickups. Without bank loans.

[KannikaP]

7 hours ago, newbee2022 said:

No, you're mistaken me. The police shot them. Another way for execution though.

Good, the easy way.

[KannikaP]

6 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

There are alternatives, to this 19th century technique of burning after the sugar cane harvest.

Do they not burn the crop BEFORE harvesting to make it easier to cut. And is that why the Government have threatened to fine any sugar factories which buy 'burned' sugar cane.

Rice fields are set alight AFTER harvesting, the only reason I can see is to provide some nutrients for the next crop, as they do not burn everything.