Midair Collision Near Reagan National Sends Plane into Potomac River

[sqwakvfr]

17 minutes ago, lordgrinz said:

 

According to the video above, the military helicopter took over responsibility for "visual" separation at night, that's just bonkers! A busy airport with multiple planes landing on that runway, and the ATC hands over safety to a helicopter trying to cross the runway path?!

An aviation expert on the DC Fox station claimed the Blackhawk was on a check ride?  I thought no way because why would an examiner take a check ride flight through a busy commercial airport at night.  The other claim that i believe is untrue is that the Blackhawk crew were on NVG's (Night Vision Goggles).  NVG's are worn for actual mission or mission training not while operating inside of Class B or D airspace and at night.  

[lordgrinz]

1 minute ago, sqwakvfr said:

An aviation expert on the DC Fox station claimed the Blackhawk was on a check ride?  I thought no way because why would an examiner take a check ride flight through a busy commercial airport at night.  The other claim that i believe is untrue is that the Blackhawk crew were on NVG's (Night Vision Goggles).  NVG's are worn for actual mission or mission training not while operating inside of Class B or D airspace and at night.  

 

I read an article a few minutes ago, where they state the helicopter was not at a proper height or the correct flight path for military helicopters travelling though that area.

[sqwakvfr]

3 minutes ago, lordgrinz said:

 

I read an article a few minutes ago, where they state the helicopter was not at a proper height or the correct flight path for military helicopters travelling though that area.

I saw another expert who said  rotor wing aircraft have to be at or below 200 MSL.  

[lordgrinz]

Just now, sqwakvfr said:

I saw another expert who said  rotor wing aircraft have to be at or below 200 MSL.  

 

Yup, the article said he should have been at no higher than 200 ft and near the east bank of the river, and he was half a mile off the approved route.

[spidermike007]

7 hours ago, lordgrinz said:

 

I know, but obviously flying helicopters through flight paths and landing zones for airliners at a busy airport isn't working out to well. The military helicopters should for now on ask for clearance before entering, and hold until given the OK to proceed.

There was no reason whatsoever for them to have been in the flight path to begin with, especially with an approaching commercial jet full of passengers. That makes absolutely no sense and it had to have been pilot error on the part of the fool who was flying this chopper, or a serious breach on the part of air traffic control. 

[soi3eddie]

There is talk online that the helicopter pilot was Jo Ellis a transgender person.  

https://www.smerconish.com/exclusive-content/living-to-serve-living-as-myself-a-transgender-service-members-perspective/

 

Just looking at the BBC who list plane and helicopter occupants, but only name two of the three people on the helicopter. Jo Ellis not mentioned. Neither was it stated who was pilot flying. 

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cwyjpwxx22ko

 

Not seen any official notice of the pilot flying the helicopter but why would Trump go off on DEI like he did in his speech?

 

Is this pure speculation or is there really truth in this?

 

[soi3eddie]

9 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

There was no reason whatsoever for them to have been in the flight path to begin with, especially with an approaching commercial jet full of passengers. That makes absolutely no sense and it had to have been pilot error on the part of the fool who was flying this chopper, or a serious breach on the part of air traffic control. 

 

Totally agree that it makes no sense. Helicopter was well off the air corrider for helicopters and way higher than it should have been. 350ft instead of 200ft maximum. 

[Social Media]

Update:

 

Washington DC plane crash live: US army helicopter ‘was off course’

Black Hawk aircraft was allegedly at least 100 feet higher than permitted and was half-a-mile off its agreed flight path when the collision happened over the Potomac. The US army helicopter reportedly deviated from its approved flight path, it has emerged.

 

The Black Hawk pilot asked air traffic control for permission to use a specific, predetermined route that lets helicopters fly no higher than 200 feet. This route — referred to as Route 4 at Reagan international airport — hugs the east bank of the Potomac, which would have meant it avoided the American Airlines plane.

 

The helicopter pilot confirmed visual sight of the plane and the air traffic controller instructed the helicopter pilot to follow the route and go behind the plane. But he did not follow the intended route, the New York Times reported, citing four people briefed on the matter said. Rather, the helicopter was above 300 feet, not below 200 feet, and was at least half-a-mile off the approved route when it collided with the jet.

 

Source

https://www.thetimes.com/us/news-today/article/dc-plane-crash-trump-dei-victims-pilot-latest-news-9hprgjlgw

 

If you wish to discuss Trump please do so in a separate topic here:

https://aseannow.com/topic/1350364-trump-keen-to-blame-diversity-and-inclusion-for-washington-dc-crash/

 

[Rimmer]

Multiple off topic posts have been removed, topic is about a tragic air crash, stay on topic please.

[MicroB]

10 hours ago, Yagoda said:

Prayers for the Families of these DEI victims.

 

Disgusting comment given the facts that are arising, and your lack of insight what went on in the control tower. You are literally an apologist, which is different from a defender of Trumpf. Defenders will at least attempt to rationalise the President's words. Apologists react with a Knee Jerk. And like you, blame disabled people for the deaths of dozens of people.

 

Technically Trumpf is a DEI hire; he's both elderly and disabled. That ticks a few boxes. He got a sympathy vote as well for a scabby ear. Some, like my old departed dad, reckon he has a screw loose someplace as well.

 

 

The FAA employs 45,000 people, of which 500, at most, are air traffic controllers. Like any big organisation, they will have toilets that need cleaning, cafeterias that need scrubbing down, and bins that need taking out.

 

About 30% of ATCs are veterans. If you are a disabled ATC, ie in a wheelchair, there is a good chance you lost a leg, hand, nose, through serving your country, and that you are highly proficient in your trade. We've heard the logs from the ATC. Enunciation was clear. All ATCs must be cleared by the Flight Surgeon before working. Epilepsy is a disqualifying health condition, as is poor eyesight, hearing. Their seated BP must not exceed 155/95.

 

But I see already the anti-DEI lot are out to blame the military pilot for being a woman. He might say the name of the helicopter type is also "Woke".

[Patong2021]

12 hours ago, TedG said:

 

The helo in question exists to fly VIPs around DC.  

 And you know that because? Who are the VIPS who are transported by US Army utility  UH 60  rotary aircraft?

There were no VIPs on this helicopter so the  continued claims and references of the aircraft  being used as a passenger aircraft is nonsense and injects your political bias. The Sikorsky UH-60 was an army helicopter on a training flight.

 

 

[Patong2021]

13 hours ago, TedG said:

It’s all about the VIP.  

 

Which VIP. Since you know so much, who was the VIP?

 

Jonathan Koziol, a retired Army chief warrant officer with more than 30 years of flight experience who now serves as Headquarters Department of the Army Aviation Directorate chief of staff, told reporters in a briefing Thursday afternoon that the Black Hawk crew was on a nighttime qualification flight with an instructor pilot evaluating an experienced pilot on the flight routes that their unit routinely flies day and night around the Potomac River.  Koziol confirmed that the instructor pilot had more than 1,000 flight hours in a Black Hawk and that the pilot being evaluated had more than 500 hours in the aircraft. The evaluated pilot was in command of the flight but if an emergency were to occur the instructor would have taken control of the helicopter, Koziol said.   The maximum altitude for the route the Black Hawk was flying is 200 feet, Koziol said.

"Very serious crew, even the crew chief in the back has been in the unit for a very long time, very familiar with the area, very familiar with the routing structure," Koziol said. "So we don't see that at all as being any impact on what happened today or last night. And both pilots had flown this specific route before at night. This wasn't something new to either one of them."

Koziol added, “These are our top pilots doing this mission in the National Capital Region."

 

As reported by CNN

 

[Patong2021]

1 hour ago, MicroB said:

 

Disgusting comment given the facts that are arising, and your lack of insight what went on in the control tower. You are literally an apologist, which is different from a defender of Trumpf. Defenders will at least attempt to rationalise the President's words. Apologists react with a Knee Jerk. And like you, blame disabled people for the deaths of dozens of people.

 

Technically Trumpf is a DEI hire; he's both elderly and disabled. That ticks a few boxes. He got a sympathy vote as well for a scabby ear. Some, like my old departed dad, reckon he has a screw loose someplace as well.

 

 

The FAA employs 45,000 people, of which 500, at most, are air traffic controllers. Like any big organisation, they will have toilets that need cleaning, cafeterias that need scrubbing down, and bins that need taking out.

 

About 30% of ATCs are veterans. If you are a disabled ATC, ie in a wheelchair, there is a good chance you lost a leg, hand, nose, through serving your country, and that you are highly proficient in your trade. We've heard the logs from the ATC. Enunciation was clear. All ATCs must be cleared by the Flight Surgeon before working. Epilepsy is a disqualifying health condition, as is poor eyesight, hearing. Their seated BP must not exceed 155/95.

 

But I see already the anti-DEI lot are out to blame the military pilot for being a woman. He might say the name of the helicopter type is also "Woke".

 

Yes you are correct and although some disabled people may be hired to work  as ATC,  to clarify, the hiring of disabled or disabled people is not necessarily for ATC positions. It can be for support positions. Many firms have hiring practices that intentionally hire people that would otherwise be excluded from the workplace. My previous employer specifically hired people with  intellectual disabilities to work in the mail room. It was a simple job for workers who were punctual and who showed up every day.

Considering the large number of mentally and physically challenged individuals in the USA, if they were excluded from the workplace, there would be a workers shortage and millions of Americans would be at home collecting Social Security instead of contributing as tax payers.

 

[Harsh Jones]

The controller had a conflict alert warning on his screen and all he did was ask the heli to miss the jet. Instead of vectoring one or the other as soon as the warning came up. Which is the protocol. And yes , the heli was 100 feet high. But it should never have been in a position to miss a plane by 100 feet anyway 

 

 

[Harsh Jones]

7 hours ago, soi3eddie said:

 

Totally agree that it makes no sense. Helicopter was well off the air corrider for helicopters and way higher than it should have been. 350ft instead of 200ft maximum. 

100 feet is a problem but not the main cause. There was still a traffic conflict alert after the controller vectored the airplane into the path (route 4) of the helicopter. And instead of correcting it instantly , he just radioed the helicopter to get a visual (at night)

 

80% controllers fault , 20% helicopters fault.

 

 

[Yagoda]

5 hours ago, MicroB said:

 

Disgusting comment given the facts that are arising, and your lack of insight what went on in the control tower. You are literally an apologist, which is different from a defender of Trumpf. Defenders will at least attempt to rationalise the President's words. Apologists react with a Knee Jerk. And like you, blame disabled people for the deaths of dozens of people.

 

Technically Trumpf is a DEI hire; he's both elderly and disabled. That ticks a few boxes. He got a sympathy vote as well for a scabby ear. Some, like my old departed dad, reckon he has a screw loose someplace as well.

 

 

The FAA employs 45,000 people, of which 500, at most, are air traffic controllers. Like any big organisation, they will have toilets that need cleaning, cafeterias that need scrubbing down, and bins that need taking out.

 

About 30% of ATCs are veterans. If you are a disabled ATC, ie in a wheelchair, there is a good chance you lost a leg, hand, nose, through serving your country, and that you are highly proficient in your trade. We've heard the logs from the ATC. Enunciation was clear. All ATCs must be cleared by the Flight Surgeon before working. Epilepsy is a disqualifying health condition, as is poor eyesight, hearing. Their seated BP must not exceed 155/95.

 

But I see already the anti-DEI lot are out to blame the military pilot for being a woman. He might say the name of the helicopter type is also "Woke".

Seems like the facts that are arising are pointing more and more to dysfunctional Dei hiring in the faa. They're being sued for discrimination, did you know that?. By the way because you seem to have some spelling problems, president Trump's name is spelled t r u m p. Could be just a foreigner mistake.

 

 I submit that people who are enamored with Dei are racists. Our Constitution prohibits that.

[newnative]

On 1/30/2025 at 9:21 PM, rabas said:

 

Because that's where these guys have to fly. This UH-60 Blackhawk's squadron, based near by, is responsible for flying officials and VIPS around Washington including to the airport.  That doesn't make it a wise thing to do, but apparently Washington DC is a challenging air space. Some have suggested a problem waiting to happen. 

Maybe some rethinking on training:

Army Secretary nominee Daniel Driscoll said during a Senate hearing on Thursday that the crash may prompt the military to reconsider conducting training operations near the busy Washington, D.C., airspace.

"This seems to be preventable," Driscoll said. "I think we might need to look at where is an appropriate time to take training risk, and it may not be near an airport like Reagan."

[WorriedNoodle]

5 hours ago, Yagoda said:

I submit that people who are enamored with Dei are racists.

A case of pot calling the kettle I see.

In general, DEI initiatives were put in place in response to persistent discrimination and exclusion in the workplace, where individuals from marginalized groups were being overlooked for positions and denied promotions due to prejudice and bias.

[Yagoda]

1 minute ago, WorriedNoodle said:

A case of pot calling the kettle I see.

In general, DEI initiatives were put in place in response to persistent discrimination and exclusion in the workplace, where individuals from marginalized groups were being overlooked for positions and denied promotions due to prejudice and bias.

Nice talking point but a lie.

 

Whats a marginalized group btw?

[scottiejohn]

6 hours ago, Yagoda said:

president Trump's name is spelled t r u m p. Could be just a foreigner mistake.

Actually his name is spelt "Trump"! Could just be a Yankee mistake!

[Yagoda]

2 minutes ago, scottiejohn said:

Actually his name is spelt "Trump"! Could just be a Yankee mistake!

Your stalking posts get dumber and dumber. I have my own little Scotty stalker.

[scottiejohn]

8 minutes ago, Yagoda said:

Your stalking posts get dumber and dumber. I have my own little Scotty stalker.

You actually think that you are that important that someone would stalk you.

What is actually happening is that you have a tendency to make ridiculous posts which you do not like me commenting on!

[Yagoda]

27 minutes ago, scottiejohn said:

You actually think that you are that important that someone would stalk you.

What is actually happening is that you have a tendency to make ridiculous posts which you do not like me commenting on!

Naw, you just like following me around, its as close as you will get to boxing with God

[KhunLA]

6 hours ago, Yagoda said:

Seems like the facts that are arising are pointing more and more to dysfunctional Dei hiring in the faa. They're being sued for discrimination, did you know that?. By the way because you seem to have some spelling problems, president Trump's name is spelled t r u m p. Could be just a foreigner mistake.

 

 I submit that people who are enamored with Dei are racists. Our Constitution prohibits that.

As much as I'm against DEI, it is a trainer, and surely there was a qualified trainer on board.  

 

After watching another vid, much clearer of the approaching chopper to the plane, I really don't understand how they could not have seen it, and avoided the collision.  Everyone on board must not have been paying attention.

[PomPolo]

On 1/30/2025 at 8:30 PM, PomPolo said:

Couldn't agree more with this.  I think sometimes military aircraft get carte-blanche as to where they want to fly however that close to an airport they should have been on the approach tower frequency and been aware of any close traffic.  A total tragedy at the same time and probably not worth speculating on anything just yet even though it may seem obvious.

Very very sad

Looks like I was sort of correct, looks like the plane is in the clear, the ATC's are in the clear and the helicopter was in the wrong place at the wrong time and had deviated it's flight plan to a disallowed altitude despite saying they had visually cleared themselves.  This pilot guy who got all the ATC audio explains it much better than me.  RIP and condolences to all the families very sad.