Vaccine-Associated Measles: The Overlooked Variable in Outbreak Statistics

Documented cases of VAM and viral shedding raise questions about what we're actually counting during measles resurgences

Source: https://sayerji.substack.com/p/wild-type-or-vaccine-strain-investigating

= = = 

Story at a glance

• Media Narrative vs. Reality:
  Public health officials and media typically attribute measles outbreaks to “vaccine hesitancy.” Yet an overlooked question remains: how precisely do we verify that every positive test reflects wild-type measles rather than vaccine-associated measles (VAM)? Only genetic sequencing can confirm this distinction, and surveillance rarely includes it.

• Documented Vaccine-Strain Cases:
  Vaccine-associated measles (VAM) is rare but documented in the literature. Healthy children have occasionally developed measles-like illness from the MMR’s live virus, confirmed as vaccine strain rather than wild measles². A 2017 case in a 13-month-old showed the same full-body rash as wild measles, underscoring the need for molecular testing³.

• Shedding and Transmission Questions:
  Live vaccines can shed virus, and measles vaccine RNA has been detected in bodily fluids after vaccination⁴. A 2024 study found RNA in one-third of children up to four weeks post-MMR⁵. While transmission hasn’t been documented⁶, surveillance for it is limited, leaving the question scientifically open.

• The Genotyping Gap:
  Outbreak investigations often omit strain typing, meaning recently vaccinated cases with fever and rash may be logged as wild measles⁷. The CDC itself notes that vaccine reactions “may be misclassified as measles cases” and that only genotyping can distinguish the two (CDC, Manual for Surveillance of Vaccine-Preventable Diseases, 2024).

 

You can read the full article here > https://sayerji.substack.com/p/wild-type-or-vaccine-strain-investigating

Hey,  predictably, it's Sayer Ji again, one of the most prolific health misinformation spreaders dubiously recognized as one of the "Disinformation Dozen" in 2021 for spreading the most health misinformation in the U.S. during the first year of COVID pandemic. Good source!

 

Sayer Ji's Disinformation Dozen profile from the Center for Countering Digital Hate (starting on page 28 of the report):

 

https://252f2edd-1c8b-49f5-9bb2-cb57bb47e4ba.filesusr.com/ugd/f4d9b9_b7cedc0553604720b7137f8663366ee5.pdf

 

https://counterhate.com/research/the-disinformation-dozen/

 

 

But it doesn't stop there for this prolific anti-vaxer whackjob:

 

When you want bad and unsubstantiated info about measles, where else better to turn than someone who has absolutely no medical or scientific credentials to be commenting on the topic:

 

"Sayer Ji is author of the international best-selling book REGENERATE, chairman of the www.GlobalWellnessForum.org, founder of www.Greenmedinfo.com, and co-founder of www.StandForHealthFreedom.com"  [see more info on these below]

 

https://substack.com/@sayerji

 

OK, so what's Sayer Ji all about?

 

 

"Douglas Sayer Ji (born October 10, 1972) is the founder of alternative medicine portal GreenMedInfo, a website known for promoting  various pseudoscientific publications. He was identified in 2020 as one of the largest promoters of COVID-19 misinformation on social media. [emphasis added][

...

The son of a biochemist, Ji obtained a BA in philosophy from Rutgers University in 1995.^[1] He went on to manage an organic food market in Bonita Springs, Florida, after working with camps and facilities for troubled youths. He developed an interest for Zen Buddhism during that period, but stopped short of joining the movement. [emphasis added]

...

Ji denies being an anti-vaccination activist, but consistently shares false or misleading messages about vaccine safety and efficacy.^"

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sayer_Ji

 

And re the websites / businesses he's behind:

Overall, we rate GreenMedInfo a quackery-level pseudoscience website based on claims not supported by science.

 

https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/greenmedinfo/

 

Overall, we rate Stand for Health Freedom (SHF) as right-biased due to its focus on individual liberties and opposition to government health mandates. We also rate it as questionable due to its use of selective data, omission of mainstream scientific perspectives, and lack of transparency, which contribute to a mixed rating for factual accuracy. [emphasis added]

...

Stand for Health Freedom often downplays or ignores research from mainstream medical authorities. This selective presentation can result in a skewed portrayal, especially regarding vaccines and COVID-19. While raising legitimate concerns about informed consent, its selective use of facts compromises its credibility. Readers should verify claims with credible scientific sources." [emphasis added]

 

https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/stand-for-health-freedom-bias-and-credibility/

 

But hey, he did manage an organic food market. So he does have some kind of expertise... in something!   

 

 

I don't agree with the general take on measles, but I do respect the OP's right to post the truth. And Sayer Ji is researching and showing new insights; so is worth a read.

 

What it the point of continually shooting down the messengers?

 

Who is fact-checking the fact checkers?

Quote

Who is fact-checking the fact checkers?

 

Not you, certainly.... 

 

"the truth"?   

This is the OTBT subforum, where people are allowed to post misinformation and non-credible information and sources, and they do...

 

And other people such as myself are entitled to document just where and from whom that content is coming, and how it's regarded by experts in misinformation, such as with the content source here:

 

 

 

 

 

4 minutes ago, Stiddle Mump said:

Sayer Ji is researching

 

Do we know how many researchers he employs and the the extent of his research facilities?

 

Don't bother.....it seems he has a a laptop.

 

 

Ji is not a credentialed biomedical researcher he has a degree in philosophy

 

•  His work is largely challenging mainstream medical consensus.

 

•  He has been listed in the “Disinformation Dozen” report by the Center for Countering Digital Hate, which flagged him as a major source of vaccine misinformation.

 

Oh dear.

How long is one allowed to distribute this crap?

24 minutes ago, Stiddle Mump said:

I don't agree with the general take on measles, but I do respect the OP's right to post the truth. And Sayer Ji is researching and showing new insights; so is worth reading.

 

What it the point of continually shooting down the messengers?

Who is fact-checking the fact checkers?

 

@Stiddle Mump > I appreciate your comment.  And you are of course fully right on both accounts:

 

1 - Posting an article/study/opinion piece does not necessarily mean that the poster fully agrees with what the author stated.  In this case I have a different opinion on measles (which by the way is much more aligned with your view than Sayer Ji's).  But I thought it useful to post this article by Sayer Ji, as TGJiBKK in other posts on this sub-forum is stoking up the fear for a mumps outbreak to push the 'need' for getting the MMR-vaccine.  And of course he is blaming the 'unvaccinated' for the outbreaks, while 

a) there is very little insight in vaccination status of those that currently are getting measles, and

b) the article highlights the often overlooked variable that it could well be MMR vaccine-induced measles instead of the 'wild' variant (a fact that is even confirmed by the CDC).

 

2. The continual shooting down of the messenger and posting of negative 'fact-check' profiles on EVERY thread that has a different view than the 'accepted narrative' is completely besides the point, as this is the Off-the-Beaten-Track forum, which by definition brings up such topics to be discussed.  And these Fact-Check 'hit job' pieces are anything but discussing the topic, and are only meant to derail the thread. 

        

11 minutes ago, FritsSikkink said:

How long is one allowed to distribute this crap?

Don't bother, we are well aware of your intolerant view on other opinions and your pleas to shut this FreeSpeech corner of the Forum down.

11 hours ago, Stiddle Mump said:

What it the point of continually shooting down the messengers?

 

What is the point of continually obsessing over vaccines and nothing else?

 

If you go look at the author's site quoted in the OP, GreenMedInfo, there are thousands of articles about different health topics.

 

Health is holistic, meaning a thousand different factors will determine if you remain healthy or not. 

 

So that means your health is not dependent on a vaccine as much as OP would like to claim. The vaccine alone won't make or break you, yet this is what the OP is suggesting. 

 

It's completely nuts to focus on vaccines alone as OP does, to the exclusion of everything else.

 

Particularly since perhaps the available studies on vaccines are lacking and you are just mostly groping in the dark and guessing. 

 

Why not focus on health issues that are more easily provable whether they assist your health or harm it? 

 

 

19 minutes ago, save the frogs said:

What is the point of continually obsessing over vaccines and nothing else?

...

It's completely nuts to focus on vaccines alone as OP does, to the exclusion of everything else.

Particularly since perhaps the available studies on vaccines are lacking and you are just mostly groping in the dark and guessing. 

 

Why not focus on health issues that are more easily provable whether they assist your health or harm it? 

 

The point being that this is the Covid and other Vaccine Studies sub-forum of the Off-the-Beaten-Track forum.  

It is evident and quite normal that occasionally the discussions here go broader than vaccines, but we try to stay 'on topic' as there is not yet a Natural Health sub-forum on OtBT. 

And it is not allowed to address such alternative points of view in the ' Health and Wellness'  section of the 'regular' Forum.  

But it would actually be a good idea to also have a Natural Health sub-forum here, as both @Stiddle Mump, myself and several other AN members, have quite a lot to contribute on that subject too.  

46 minutes ago, save the frogs said:

 

What is the point of continually obsessing over vaccines and nothing else?

 

 

Why not focus on health issues that are more easily provable whether they assist your health or harm it? 

 

To a human body, vaxxes are seen as insults, and poisonous. Which of course they are. Just have to add with that; vaxxes vary from the proper ones, to inert ones.

 

www.howbadismybatch.com

 

Good health is a simple thing. Keep the body in balance, bio-chemically, bio-electrically and emotionally; and all will be fine. So! What upsets this balance? The first thing is diet. Virtually everything in the earth is in our bodies. After all we are nature. All the elements, minerals, vitamins etc that help to keep us in balance are available (at the moment). Balance is achieved when the dead tissue and cells are easily removed and are easily replaced. And in the case of the young, completely (99%) renew the body a few times before maturity. That's a big factor in how, and why, a babe grows into an adult.

 

We will, through general living, encounter stuff that the body does not want. Dust, smoke, dirty water, unclean food, chemicals in processed food and undesirables due to local environmental exposures. To this must be added medicine. Vaccines; especially. 

 

There is also the bio-electrical within. So exposure to prolonged EMFs is obviously gonna upset our system.

 

Also the emotional.

 

Also accidents.

 

IMO, a big rethink on what makes us sick, and what we should do to keep healthy, is long over due. Although some on AN are on that track.

 

As Dr Andrew Kaufman has said; 'We know more about the moon that the human body, and we don't know much about the moon.'

 

Until the theory about germs causing us harm is ditched, we will be continually battling against the dollar/euro/pound/etc. Which is what keeps the 'germ theory' afloat.

 

12 minutes ago, Red Phoenix said:

 

The point being that this is the Covid and other Vaccine Studies sub-forum of the Off-the-Beaten-Track forum.  

It is evident and quite normal that occasionally the discussions here go broader than vaccines, but we try to stay 'on topic' as there is not yet a Natural Health sub-forum on OtBT. 

And it is not allowed to address such alternative points of view in the ' Health and Wellness'  section of the 'regular' Forum.  

But it would actually be a good idea to also have a Natural Health sub-forum here, as both @Stiddle Mump, myself and several other AN members, have quite a lot to contribute on that subject too.  

https://aseannow.com/forum/473-natural-health/   created for you 😀

Alternative health through alterative facts. 

7 minutes ago, CharlieH said:

https://aseannow.com/forum/473-natural-health/   created for you 😀

 

Much appreciated!  😃

13 minutes ago, cjinchiangrai said:

Alternative health through alterative facts. 

Truth, and nature, will see us reach our true destiny.

11 hours ago, Stiddle Mump said:

To a human body, vaxxes are seen as insults, and poisonous.

 

The air you breathe is seen as "an insult" to the body. 

 

Just now, Stiddle Mump said:

Truth, and nature, will see us reach our true destiny.

 

 

The grave or the incinerator......that's it.

2 hours ago, Red Phoenix said:

Associated

 

That word does a misinformationally bigly yuuuuge amount of heavy lifting.

 

Are you aware that every child that exhibits symptoms of "measles", which of course doesn't exist, as viruses aren't real, arrived at the hospital or clinic in a motor vehicle?

 

And every motor vehicle has a windshield.

 

Every.

Single.

One.

 

100% association!

 

We must band together to fight "Big Silica"!

 

 

 

 

26 minutes ago, save the frogs said:

 

The air you breathe is seen as "an insult" to the body. 

 

Really? Don't agree with you on that sir.

 

Why do we actually breathe? A couple of reasons. One to take in air; essentially oxygen. To take in electricity. To regulate the heart beat. To remove the waste products of metabolism.

25 minutes ago, NoDisplayName said:

Are you aware that every child that exhibits symptoms of "measles", which of course doesn't exist, as viruses aren't real, arrived at the hospital or clinic in a motor vehicle?

Yea!! A new disciple. Thank you Sir. You are enlightened for sure. Want to join my team? Cut off point is 1 million. And if you hurry you would be member #69.

 

However! In the third world, and indeed, a century or so ago in the west, sick people would be transported by cart. Some powered by mules or horses. Or piggy-back even.

1 hour ago, Stiddle Mump said:

Truth, and nature, will see us reach our true destiny.

Just like the Black Plague where only the infirm died. 55555

13 hours ago, Stiddle Mump said:

Really? Don't agree with you on that sir.

 

Why do we actually breathe? A couple of reasons. One to take in air; essentially oxygen. To take in electricity. To regulate the heart beat. To remove the waste products of metabolism.

 

But air is full of toxins, depending where you live. 

There's cars everywhere with their exhaust fumes. You're not living in "nature". 

 

On 10/8/2025 at 11:39 AM, Stiddle Mump said:

One to take in air; essentially oxygen.

A common misconception. The actual composition is not "essentially oxygen". Breathing 100 percent oxygen at normal pressure can cause acute oxygen poisoning.

 

Nitrogen (N₂): Approximately 78.1% of the atmosphere is nitrogen. Nitrogen is essential for the nitrogen cycle, which is vital for plant growth. 
Oxygen (O₂): Making up about 20.9% of the atmosphere, 
Argon (Ar): This noble gas constitutes about 0.93% of the atmosphere. 
Carbon Dioxide (CO₂): Makes up only about 0.04% of the atmosphere.

30 minutes ago, Purdey said:

A common misconception. The actual composition is not "essentially oxygen". Breathing 100 percent oxygen at normal pressure can cause acute oxygen poisoning.

 

Nitrogen (N₂): Approximately 78.1% of the atmosphere is nitrogen. Nitrogen is essential for the nitrogen cycle, which is vital for plant growth. 
Oxygen (O₂): Making up about 20.9% of the atmosphere, 
Argon (Ar): This noble gas constitutes about 0.93% of the atmosphere. 
Carbon Dioxide (CO₂): Makes up only about 0.04% of the atmosphere.

Indeed!

 

Try breathing in air, when there is no oxygen present. Not a great feeling I reckon.

48 minutes ago, Stiddle Mump said:

Indeed!

 

Try breathing in air, when there is no oxygen present. Not a great feeling I reckon.

You first.