Penang Consulate - More Bad News

[Falcon]

HI,

Thought i would write and say what is happening right now in Penang as of today - 6 feb 2008.

I arrived in to penang this morning and met with my visa agent who is now a friend (as he and his Brother are to many here now) who took the copies of my ltd. company, passport, application and the 220 ringit fees and was told that it would be ready on Monday as usual at 2:30pm.

I then walked by their offices a couple hours later and they called to me and said that the application had been rejected due to no work permit being shown. Its a new company and there wasnt time to apply as where i live it can take up to 2 months to get the wp. So therefore, even people with a company in their own name are being refused the non-b. The agents said that not only my application for non-b was rejected but he had 4 others this morning in the same batch, 3 of these were for simple tourist visa's!

This new consul has, over the past 3 months he has been here, caused people countless problems, some of them being as follows: applying for non-o for retirement purposes and showing thai bank book with funds in excess of 1 million baht, refused! reason given? not enough money shown to support the application. Applications for Non-B together with WP3 (receipt from labor office) refused! reason given? Need actual work permit! Refused Non-B application whilst showing work permit, refused! Reason given? Need further evidence of being able to support themselves in thailand.

Its really now getting past a joke.

The consulate told my agent that either i could go to KL to be issued the non-b or i could accept a transit visa (validity 30 days). Now, ordinarily I would have ot on the first bus out of penang and gone to kl in order to have it issued but the problem right now is that the places are closing down today for chinese new year and although the penang office is only closed for 2 days (reopens on Monday - usual weekends off) past experience has shown me that kl has up to 14 days of holidays for the same Chinese New Year. I can't afford to sit and wait for it to open so i will opt for the transit visa and get my passport back on Monday with the visa in and sort out my WP during the validity of the transit visa. I will then go directly to KL as while this guy is head of the consulate in Penang things are just going to get worse for people.

Hope this helps a little to know whats going on over here right now.

Obviously some people with their "rose tinted glasses" about anything to do with thailand and visa's are going to say "so what"? but for the rest of the people living in the real world, it really is just a heads up as to what is going on and what you need to expect and be ready for if coming over here to penang.

Falcon

[bottlenose]

...Thought i would write and say what is happening right now in Penang as of today - 6 feb 2008...

On the 21st of Jan this year I got my 4th non-B in 12 mnths from Penang with no problems. I didn't have a WP and still don't. My agent is in the process of trying to get me my teachers licence which I suspect will be a pain in the arse as no-one seems to be sure if we're to take some Thai culture exam or how much it's going to cost. TIT.

[moe666]

What is the real world, some places give you the visa some do not. I think it has to do more with individuals rather than the whole country. If you get your visa in KL I guess the real world has changed again.

[cnmltd]

I too got back from Penang yesterday.

I applied for and recieved a multi entry, 1 year non imm O visa based on

marriage to a Thai. I only had to show a marriage certificate and my wifes ID card. Nothing else.

6 others in my group applied for and received tourist visas with no problems.

So its not all bad news.

[lopburi3]

The non immigrant O visa issue is good news but to know what was provided by the tourist visa applicants would make the post more useful for many. Did they have and show tickets out/hotel reservations?

[tropo]

...Thought i would write and say what is happening right now in Penang as of today - 6 feb 2008...

On the 21st of Jan this year I got my 4th non-B in 12 mnths from Penang with no problems. I didn't have a WP and still don't. My agent is in the process of trying to get me my teachers licence which I suspect will be a pain in the arse as no-one seems to be sure if we're to take some Thai culture exam or how much it's going to cost. TIT.

Penang has toughened up in all areas as of February 1. Forget about your past successes.

[DavidS]

HI,

Thought i would write and say what is happening right now in Penang as of today - 6 feb 2008.

Now, ordinarily I would have ot on the first bus out of penang and gone to kl in order to have it issued but the problem right now is that the places are closing down today for chinese new year and although the penang office is only closed for 2 days (reopens on Monday - usual weekends off) past experience has shown me that kl has up to 14 days of holidays for the same Chinese New Year. I can't afford to sit and wait for it to open so i will opt for the transit visa and get my passport back on Monday with the visa in and sort out my WP during the validity of the transit visa.

Falcon

KL does not have 14 days of holidays for Chinese New Year, just 2. All Embassies, Banks and Offices incl Govt Offices close Thu 7 and Fri 8 plus Sat and Sun of course. All re-open Mon. Fourteen day holidays may be taken by some Chinese Businesses, but the embassy will be open Mon 11, unless it is a holiday here in Thailand.

Edited February 7, 2008 by DavidS

[atwr]

I too got back from Penang yesterday.

I applied for and recieved a multi entry, 1 year non imm O visa based on

marriage to a Thai. I only had to show a marriage certificate and my wifes ID card. Nothing else.

6 others in my group applied for and received tourist visas with no problems.

So its not all bad news.

By group did you use a service to apply? Anyone have any other successful O stories from Penang like this? I was set for going to Laos to apply for a double tourist but this really has me scratching my head, and it's not those small biting ants this time.

I didn't have a bank account to show but I had proof I was spending over 50,000 baht per month to support my family over the past year. The guy at the councilor in Penang seemed really annoyed that I was even asking for a multi entry O last Nov. Told me to apply in Bangkok and handed back my family photos and almost all of my paperwork showing moneys I've spent over the year. Last time I checked my wife had a great job, I was bringing in money from home and spending it here, and trying to raise my son as a Thai despite having to hear him called farang at least 10 times a day. I've never tried to get vat refunds, I don't fight or drink. I even apologized to the taxi driver who tried to run over my pregnant wife and break my kneecaps with his cab because he was having a bad day.

Hey, did that farang standing at chit lom for half a year begging for ticket money finally get arrested? I picture him walking into an airasia stall, cardboard sign still strapped around his neck, and buying a ticket with doubled big C bags filled with 100,000 B worth of sthang coins. I wonder if he had a TV, 90 day, or 1 year, and whether it really mattered in the end what kind of visa they issued him.

[cnmltd]

The non immigrant O visa issue is good news but to know what was provided by the tourist visa applicants would make the post more useful for many. Did they have and show tickets out/hotel reservations?

I spoke with 2 of the tourist visa applicants and both showed tickets out but as far as I know did not need hotel reservations.

By group did you use a service to apply?

We all used different agencys. I personally used the Thai Visa service and it all ran quite smoothly. I was picked up at the airport in Penang and driven to the agencys office. We filled out the application form provided and gave up copies of the documents asked for. We were then driven to our hotel at 12:00 pm and were free to do as we wanted until we were picked up at 15:00 pm, given our passports complete with visa and driven back to the airport the following day.

[Falcon]

applying for the non-0 for reasons of being married to a Thai national has no bearing whatsoever on my original post. People have and are being turned away from the thai consulate, penang for non sensical reasons as i explained earlier. I am married to a Thai and also have a Son but have always had a company and been on a Non-B instead of non-o and paid my tax and social security for the past 14 years. I had always been on the one year extension through having the company and work permit but i was away from thailand for the past 9 months on other business so needed to get everything concerning my visa re-issued and the one year extension issued again, thus the reasons fo me being in Penang to obtain my non-b.

I feel that I should also offer a word of warning to those speaking on the other thread about giving the Air ticket out of thailand to your home country for the tourist visa here in penang, I have seen many people saying that they would "create" the e-ticket and show the consul this as their way of getting over the requirement of needing to see air tickets from thailand to the home country. There were 32 people refused visa's on tuesday who had given the copies of e-tickets to the consulate together with the hotel vouchers, the consulate then phoned the airline/agencies and asked them if the person named on the ticket was actualy traveling. in most cases it was a simple case of the airline/agency saying "no, sorry, we dont have record of that person traveling"! Therefore, i would suggest that if you are going to penang for the tourist visa then do have a verifiable ticket from thailand available. Same for the hotel accomodation vouchers, the consul also checked these if the airline verified the travel arrangements.

The consul has been here for almost 4 months and nothing has got any easier, in fact certain things have become harder as we can all see from the posts about Penang. He has stopped any possibility of the "express" service where you pay a little extra and get your passport back the same day around 5pm and has even moved his desk to be near the door so that he can see everything that is going on with the visa issuing and passport control. He is a young guy, 33 years old.

He is talking about changing things a little in the next 2/3 months if he is still there for such things as issuing every visa application made before 11am the same day by 5pm.

Khota Bharu office is still open and operating and giving visa's without the need for work permit/wp3 for Non-B, without the need for tickets and hotel bookings for tourist visa's, etc. and gives the passport and visa the same day so no need to stay overnight. I think that this will get very popular again as it was a few years back as thte service there is a lot friendlier than it is in Penang.

Falcon

[tijnebijn]

Is Kota Bahru giving out Non O multiples based

on marriage with a Thai ?

I have been in that area before and it has got much

pretty surroundings ,very nice idea actually going back to some nice memories.

Even more if they give out the visa the same day and do an island hub after , has

been ages ago for this fellow .......

[astral]

I wonder how the Penang consulate will feel in a few months time

when they look at the drop in Visa revenue and are asked to account for the shortfall?

[ovenman]

I wonder how the Penang consulate will feel in a few months time

when they look at the drop in Visa revenue and are asked to account for the shortfall?

That's an interesting point. I guess it becomes a question of whether the lost revenues generated by visa fees (which presumably would have been substantial at the Thai consulate in Penang) are more important than allowing the consul-general the leeway to set his own ever-changing visa issuance policies.

[Falcon]

Yes, Khota Bharu are giving the multi Non-O for marriage to thai and giving it very easily and the same day. Only the marriage certificate and spouses ID card needed.

People are correct in asking how the heads of mission will feel if everyone goes somewhere else, but, right now, the consul is actualy saying that he doesnt want people going there and would much prefer it to be like the quieter consulates so that he has less people to deal with. Its a crazy situation as they are one of the busiest and highest revenue taking businesses in penang with and average of 150 to 200 applications per day.

All we can do is sit and watch how things go, Penang without the visa runners is pretty much like Pattaya without the bars so I hope that they do something about the current consul befor everyone does start to go away from the place.

Falcon

[LivinLOS]

Khota Bharu office is still open and operating and giving visa's without the need for work permit/wp3 for Non-B, without the need for tickets and hotel bookings for tourist visa's, etc. and gives the passport and visa the same day so no need to stay overnight. I think that this will get very popular again as it was a few years back as thte service there is a lot friendlier than it is in Penang.

Do you mean they are giving 1 year multiple non B's ??

My buddy has to get another and has a legit company and WP but not 4 thai employees to extend.

[MeaMaximaCulpa]

Thai immigration is an enforcement agency, not a service center nor a profit center.

Is there anyone that seriously think the Thai Government care about the P&L of a consulate?

Is there anyone who still think that their spending of a small pension in Thailand is of any consequence to this country.

Is there still anyone in doubt that a foreigner is not really wanted in Thailand? Tolerated, but not wanted.

It is amazing the importance some people put to their existance here. We are only guests, and will NEVER have any certainty here (barring PR and suchlike, but even that...)

[tijnebijn]

Thanks falcon for the very useful information ,I appreciate this info

from you very much , did not know this , better then going to KL .

Now me staying in Chiangmai , guess have to fly to Kl take a train to KB

right ? From there I could go back the same route or cross over to Hat Yai .

Thinking now how to travel wisely , has been a long time ago , and the situation

at the border might not be a wise decision right now ......

I need the new visa in the end of august , so still got plenty of time ,

next year I will try the extension , now I choose to do another multiple first , at KB

or Bali (which will be more expensive) , want to skip Penang and KL .

[Falcon]

Khota Bharu office is still open and operating and giving visa's without the need for work permit/wp3 for Non-B, without the need for tickets and hotel bookings for tourist visa's, etc. and gives the passport and visa the same day so no need to stay overnight. I think that this will get very popular again as it was a few years back as thte service there is a lot friendlier than it is in Penang.

Do you mean they are giving 1 year multiple non B's ??

My buddy has to get another and has a legit company and WP but not 4 thai employees to extend.

Your friend "should be able to" get the Multi B in Penang with the work permit, there is no need for him to show that he has 4 employees there at all. As long as his company papers are up to date and he has his current WP he should still be able to get it, it really depends on what kind of mood the consul is in on that given day.

Falcon

[Falcon]

Thanks falcon for the very useful information ,I appreciate this info

from you very much , did not know this , better then going to KL .

Now me staying in Chiangmai , guess have to fly to Kl take a train to KB

right ? From there I could go back the same route or cross over to Hat Yai .

Thinking now how to travel wisely , has been a long time ago , and the situation

at the border might not be a wise decision right now ......

I need the new visa in the end of august , so still got plenty of time ,

next year I will try the extension , now I choose to do another multiple first , at KB

or Bali (which will be more expensive) , want to skip Penang and KL .

tijnebijn, I would say it would be far easier for you to fly from Chiang Mai to KL and then fly internaly with Airasia straight to KB, its only an extra 600 baht or so from kl to KB so not going to break the bank and if you can arrange to get there before 11am you can leave the same day together with your new visa. To get there before 11am you would need to get the 0745am plane from KL and arrive at 0840. This would give you ample time to get everything done in the one day.

Hope this helps,

Falcon

[LivinLOS]

Khota Bharu office is still open and operating and giving visa's without the need for work permit/wp3 for Non-B, without the need for tickets and hotel bookings for tourist visa's, etc. and gives the passport and visa the same day so no need to stay overnight. I think that this will get very popular again as it was a few years back as thte service there is a lot friendlier than it is in Penang.

Do you mean they are giving 1 year multiple non B's ??

My buddy has to get another and has a legit company and WP but not 4 thai employees to extend.

Your friend "should be able to" get the Multi B in Penang with the work permit, there is no need for him to show that he has 4 employees there at all. As long as his company papers are up to date and he has his current WP he should still be able to get it, it really depends on what kind of mood the consul is in on that given day.

Falcon

No he got a single entry 90 day.. I dont know what company papers he took only that its his own company, he does pay tax, but that he doesnt satisfy enough of the rules for the annual extansion. He has always had 1 year multiples issued and just got turned down and given a single.

Hes pissed as hes here paying tax and trying to be legal while all his competition isnt. And yet hes getting the run around. I dont think his job is one where thai staff would be possible / helpful.

[koheesti]

Thai immigration is an enforcement agency, not a service center nor a profit center.

Is there anyone that seriously think the Thai Government care about the P&L of a consulate?

Someone high up the food chain stands to lose a lot of money from what the consulate brings in so don't expect the new consulate to last long - one way or another.

[sayitaintso]

Thai immigration is an enforcement agency, not a service center nor a profit center.

Is there anyone that seriously think the Thai Government care about the P&L of a consulate?

Someone high up the food chain stands to lose a lot of money from what the consulate brings in so don't expect the new consulate to last long - one way or another.

i read somewhere here that the penang consulate was processing 200+ visa apps per day. that's a lot of coin for the local guys.

[Maestro]

...that's a lot of coin for the local guys.

Sayitaintso, I’m saying it ain’t so.

You have to know the difference between a government-staffed consulate and an honorary consulate.

Government-staffed consulate: the consul and all consular officials are government employees. The consulate is allowed a fixed maximum number of staff. Their salary is the same whether they issue 2 visas or 200 visas per day. Their work consists of a lot more than just issuing visas. All fees collected for visas and other services go into the government coffers.

Honorary consulate: privately staffed. Income principally from fees for visas, certifications of documents and signatures. The consul can increase and decrease the number of staff at liberty.

Now, put yourself in the position of the Thai consul in Penang. Everything was running smoothly until suddenly Royal Thai Police Order No. 608/2549 was issued, limiting visa-exempt stay to a maximum of 90 days within six months effective 1 October 2006. The number of applications for tourist visa at your consulate increases 300% or more. You are not allowed to employ additional staff to cope with the extra workload, nor to spend money for overtime. What will you do?

--

Maestro