Conspiracy?

It seems a lot of people are saying it!

Interesting read!

Kerry Won - Here Are The Facts

http://rense.com/general59/kery.htm

More Evidence The Vote Was Rigged

http://rense.com/general59/rig.htm

How They Could Steal the Election This Time by Ronnie Dugger

http://www.ejfi.org/Voting/Voting-20.htm

How A Private Company Counted Our Votes

http://rense.com/general59/howaprivatecompany.htm

An Election Ordained in ######

http://batr.org/wrack/110804.html

Overthrow Of The American Republic - Part 64 - Buying And Selling The US Presidency.

http://rense.com/general59/eovt.htm

E-Voting Machine Error In Ohio Gives Bush Thousands Of Extra Votes

http://nuclearfree.lynx.co.nz/ohio.htm

Who runs ES&S - company that handles US elections

http://www.libertyforum.org/showflat.php?C...umber=293079971

Global Monitors Find Faults

http://www.pissedoffamerican.blogspot.com/

BLACK BOX VOTING DECLARES THE 2004 ELECTION TO BE A FRAUD

http://blackboxvoting.org/

Voting Machine Error Gives Bush Extra Ohio Votes

http://www.nbc4i.com/politics/3894867/detail.html

Vote Fraud 2004 Round Up

http://www.libertyforum.org/showflat.php?C...umber=293078189

Stolen Election?

http://66.39.111.188/cgi-bin/UltraBoard/Ul...ID=8500&SID=338

Palm Beach County Logs 88,000 More Votes Than Voters

http://www.washingtondispatch.com/spectrum...ves/000715.html

Voting Group Finds Irregularities In Southern States

http://www.theneworleanschannel.com/politi...899/detail.html

NOBODY ALLOWED TO WITNESS OHIO VOTE TALLY

http://www.enquirer.com/editions/2004/11/0...rrenvote05.html

CBS Shows Tie In TEXAS...Bush wins by 31 points???

http://www.ultimatetaxi.com/board/messages/389.html

Outrage in Ohio: Angry residents storm State House in response to massive voter suppression and corruption

http://michiganimc.org/feature/display/7644/index.php

Broward machines count backward

http://www.palmbeachpost.com/politics/cont...WVOTE_1105.html

Computer Loses More Than 4,000 Early Votes

http://www.wsoctv.com/news/3892151/detail.html

Software flaw found in Florida vote machines

http://www.palmbeachpost.com/news/content/.../05flavote.html

A Full Investigation is Required

http://www.zmag.org/content/showarticle.cf...=90&ItemID=6573

Should America Trust the Results of the Election?

http://www.washingtondispatch.com/article_10500.shtml

In one precinct, Bush’s tally was supersized by a computer glitch

http://www.dispatch.com/election/election-...1105-A6-01.html

The Ultimate Felony Against Democracy The Ultimate Felony Against

http://www.truthout.org/docs_04/110604Z.shtml

Maryland e-voting controversy continues in presidential race

http://www.wtonline.com/news/1_1/daily_news/24878-1.html

They are stealing Minnesota

http://electionresults.sos.state.mn.us/200...p?M=S&R=ALL&P=A

Glitches Mar San Francisco Balloting

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/11/05/national/05sanfran.html

AN ELECTION MOST FOUL

http://takethemattheirwords.blogspot.com/2...958908753400114

The stolen election of 2004: welcome back to ######

http://onlinejournal.com/evoting/110504Chin/110504chin.html

Too many voting ’irregularities’ to be coincidence

http://bellaciao.org/en/article.php3?id_article=4175

complaints in several states

http://www.usatoday.com/tech/news/techpoli...0-reports_x.htm

Important Notice to Readers of the SenderBerl Website

http://www.senderberl.com/

A STOLEN NATION

http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/stolennation.html

America is screwed: Election stolen again

http://newswire.indymedia.org/en/newswire/...11/813413.shtml

election analysis, numbers suggest vote fraud

http://www-personal.engin.umd.umich.edu/~asatanov/fraud/

When they put you in the ground after a full life - your tombstone will read: Here Lies A Man Who Believed Every Whacko Conspiracy Theory Imaginable"!

Don't you EVER give up?

Boon,

The difference between you and the majority of the rest of us is that we keep an open mind, we are willing to look at all the evidence and make up our own minds about it.

We do not believe the propaganda machine of our natally lobotomised preznid unless we can see genuine evidence that his pronouncements are correct. Furthermore, we have great difficulty believing anything put out by a born again Krizchun politician, knowing that being "Born Again" is regarded by most reputable psychiatrists around the world as being symptomatic of a deep and severe psychosis.

Prior to the US Excretion, we had an extended debate regarding the fairness of such pending vote. Having just re-read the thread, I see you did not rebut any of the points raised against your point of view with fact.

Perhaps you could now follow all the links above. Read the articles concerned, make notes and show us using facts and logic, why the theorise proposed are incorrect.

I greatly look forward to a long and deeply considered reply.

The real question is: Did Kerry really want (intend) to win? I don't think he did. This is really what scares me about the current state of US government and the blind acceptance on the behalf of the people.

When they put you in the ground after a full life - your tombstone will read:  Here Lies A Man Who Believed Every Whacko Conspiracy Theory Imaginable"!

Don't you EVER  give up?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I never stated that I believed it.

After reading all the links, I do know that the election process is flawed.

How many links did you read?

When they put you in the ground after a full life - your tombstone will read: My name is Boon Mee, Tornado tried to point out a few truths and I failed to listen. I listened to Georgie Porgie and now Im dead.

, have a read of a few of them mate

What is your thoughts on this one Boon Mee (and others). It seems like the world was lied and cheated too once again.

Evidence Mounts That

The Vote Was Hacked

By Thom Hartmann

Common Dreams.org

11-7-4

When I spoke with Jeff Fisher this morning (Saturday, November 06, 2004), the Democratic candidate for the U.S. House of Representatives from Florida's 16th District said he was waiting for the FBI to show up. Fisher has evidence, he says, not only that the Florida election was hacked, but of who hacked it and how. And not just this year, he said, but that these same people had previously hacked the Democratic primary race in 2002 so that Jeb Bush would not have to run against Janet Reno, who presented a real threat to Jeb, but instead against Bill McBride, who Jeb beat.

"It was practice for a national effort," Fisher told me.

And evidence is accumulating that the national effort happened on November 2, 2004.

The State of Florida, for example, publishes a county-by-county record of votes cast and people registered to vote by party affiliation. Net denizen Kathy Dopp compiled the official state information into a table, available at

http://ustogether.org/Florida_Election.htm, and noticed something startling.

Also See:

Florida Secretary of State Presidential Results by County 11/02/2004 (.pdf)

Florida Secretary of State County Registration by Party 2/9/2004 (.pdf)

While the heavily scrutinized touch-screen voting machines seemed to produce results in which the registered Democrat/Republican ratios matched the Kerry/Bush vote, and so did the optically-scanned paper ballots in the larger counties, in Florida's smaller counties the results from the optically scanned paper ballots - fed into a central tabulator PC and thus vulnerable to hacking - seem to have been reversed.

In Baker County, for example, with 12,887 registered voters, 69.3% of them Democrats and 24.3% of them Republicans, the vote was only 2,180 for Kerry and 7,738 for Bush, the opposite of what is seen everywhere else in the country where registered Democrats largely voted for Kerry.

In Dixie County, with 4,988 registered voters, 77.5% of them Democrats and a mere 15% registered as Republicans, only 1,959 people voted for Kerry, but 4,433 voted for Bush.

The pattern repeats over and over again - but only in the smaller counties where, it was probably assumed, the small voter numbers wouldn't be much noticed. Franklin County, 77.3% registered Democrats, went 58.5% for Bush. Holmes County, 72.7% registered Democrats, went 77.25% for Bush.

Yet in the larger counties, where such anomalies would be more obvious to the news media, high percentages of registered Democrats equaled high percentages of votes for Kerry.

More visual analysis of the results can be seen at

http://ustogether.org/election04/FloridaDataStats.htm and http://www.rubberbug.com/temp/Florida2004chart.htm

And, although elections officials didn't notice these anomalies, in aggregate they were enough to swing Florida from Kerry to Bush. If you simply go through the analysis of these counties and reverse the "anomalous" numbers in those counties that appear to have been hacked, suddenly the Florida election results resemble the Florida exit poll results: Kerry won, and won big.

Those exit poll results have been a problem for reporters ever since Election Day.

Election night, I'd been doing live election coverage for WDEV, one of the radio stations that carries my syndicated show, and, just after midnight, during the 12:20 a.m. Associated Press Radio News feed, I was startled to hear the reporter detail how Karen Hughes had earlier sat George W. Bush down to inform him that he'd lost the election. The exit polls were clear: Kerry was winning in a landslide. "Bush took the news stoically," noted the AP report.

But then the computers reported something different. In several pivotal states.

Conservatives see a conspiracy here: They think the exit polls were rigged.

Dick Morris, the infamous political consultant to the first Clinton campaign who became a Republican consultant and Fox News regular, wrote an article for The Hill, the publication read by every political junkie in Washington, DC, in which he made a couple of brilliant points.

"Exit Polls are almost never wrong," Morris wrote. "They eliminate the two major potential fallacies in survey research by correctly separating actual voters from those who pretend they will cast ballots but never do and by substituting actual observation for guesswork in judging the relative turnout of different parts of the state."

He added: "So, according to ABC-TVs exit polls, for example, Kerry was slated to carry Florida, Ohio, New Mexico, Colorado, Nevada, and Iowa, all of which Bush carried. The only swing state the network had going to Bush was West Virginia, which the president won by 10 points."

Yet a few hours after the exit polls were showing a clear Kerry sweep, as the computerized vote numbers began to come in from the various states the election was called for Bush.

How could this happen?

On the CNBC TV show "Topic A With Tina Brown," several months ago, Howard Dean had filled in for Tina Brown as guest host. His guest was Bev Harris, the Seattle grandmother who started www.blackboxvoting.org from her living room. Bev pointed out that regardless of how votes were tabulated (other than hand counts, only done in odd places like small towns in Vermont), the real "counting" is done by computers. Be they Diebold Opti-Scan machines, which read paper ballots filled in by pencil or ink in the voter's hand, or the scanners that read punch cards, or the machines that simply record a touch of the screen, in all cases the final tally is sent to a "central tabulator" machine.

That central tabulator computer is a Windows-based PC.

"In a voting system," Harris explained to Dean on national television, "you have all the different voting machines at all the different polling places, sometimes, as in a county like mine, there's a thousand polling places in a single county. All those machines feed into the one machine so it can add up all the votes. So, of course, if you were going to do something you shouldn't to a voting machine, would it be more convenient to do it to each of the 4000 machines, or just come in here and deal with all of them at once?"

Dean nodded in rhetorical agreement, and Harris continued. "What surprises people is that the central tabulator is just a PC, like what you and I use. It's just a regular computer."

"So," Dean said, "anybody who can hack into a PC can hack into a central tabulator?"

Harris nodded affirmation, and pointed out how Diebold uses a program called GEMS, which fills the screen of the PC and effectively turns it into the central tabulator system. "This is the official program that the County Supervisor sees," she said, pointing to a PC that was sitting between them loaded with Diebold's software.

Bev then had Dean open the GEMS program to see the results of a test election. They went to the screen titled "Election Summary Report" and waited a moment while the PC "adds up all the votes from all the various precincts," and then saw that in this faux election Howard Dean had 1000 votes, Lex Luthor had 500, and Tiger Woods had none. Dean was winning.

"Of course, you can't tamper with this software," Harris noted. Diebold wrote a pretty good program.

But, it's running on a Windows PC.

So Harris had Dean close the Diebold GEMS software, go back to the normal Windows PC desktop, click on the "My Computer" icon, choose "Local Disk C:," open the folder titled GEMS, and open the sub-folder "LocalDB" which, Harris noted, "stands for local database, that's where they keep the votes." Harris then had Dean double-click on a file in that folder titled "Central Tabulator Votes," which caused the PC to open the vote count in a database program like Excel.

In the "Sum of the Candidates" row of numbers, she found that in one precinct Dean had received 800 votes and Lex Luthor had gotten 400.

"Let's just flip those," Harris said, as Dean cut and pasted the numbers from one cell into the other. "And," she added magnanimously, "let's give 100 votes to Tiger."

They closed the database, went back into the official GEMS software "the legitimate way, you're the county supervisor and you're checking on the progress of your election."

As the screen displayed the official voter tabulation, Harris said, "And you can see now that Howard Dean has only 500 votes, Lex Luthor has 900, and Tiger Woods has 100." Dean, the winner, was now the loser.

Harris sat up a bit straighter, smiled, and said, "We just edited an election, and it took us 90 seconds."

On live national television. (You can see the clip on www.votergate.tv.)

Which brings us back to Morris and those pesky exit polls that had Karen Hughes telling George W. Bush that he'd lost the election in a landslide.

Morris's conspiracy theory is that the exit polls "were sabotage" to cause people in the western states to not bother voting for Bush, since the networks would call the election based on the exit polls for Kerry. But the networks didn't do that, and had never intended to. It makes far more sense that the exit polls were right - they weren't done on Diebold PCs - and that the vote itself was hacked.

And not only for the presidential candidate - Jeff Fisher thinks this hit him and pretty much every other Democratic candidate for national office in the most-hacked swing states.

So far, the only national "mainstream" media to come close to this story was Keith Olbermann on his show Friday night, November 5th, when he noted that it was curious that all the voting machine irregularities so far uncovered seem to favor Bush. In the meantime, the Washington Post and other media are now going through single-bullet-theory-like contortions to explain how the exit polls had failed.

But I agree with Fox's Dick Morris on this one, at least in large part. Wrapping up his story for The Hill, Morris wrote in his final paragraph, "This was no mere mistake. Exit polls cannot be as wrong across the board as they were on election night. I suspect foul play."

Thom Hartmann (thom at thomhartmann.com) is a Project Censored Award-winning best-selling author and host of a nationally syndicated daily progressive talk show. www.thomhartmann .com His most recent books are "The Last Hours of Ancient Sunlight," "Unequal Protection: The Rise of Corporate Dominance and the Theft of Human Rights," "We The People: A Call To Take Back America," and "What Would Jefferson Do?: A Return To Democracy."

http://www.commondreams.org/headlines04/1106-30.htm

hi'

is it possible to go to a point to recount the votes?

what do they need to recount the votes?

what would happen if they recount the votes and the result comes out different?

could someone explain this if knows about?

thanks

francois

Boon,

The difference between you and the majority of the rest of us is that we keep an open mind, we are willing to look at all the evidence and make up our own minds about it.

We do not believe the propaganda machine of our natally lobotomised preznid unless we can see genuine evidence that his pronouncements are correct. Furthermore, we have great difficulty believing anything put out by a born again Krizchun politician, knowing that being "Born Again" is regarded by most reputable psychiatrists around the world as being symptomatic of a deep and severe psychosis.

Prior to the US Excretion, we had an extended debate regarding the fairness of such pending vote. Having just re-read the thread, I see you did not rebut any of the points raised against your point of view with fact.

Perhaps you could now follow all the links above. Read the articles concerned, make notes and show us using facts and logic, why the theorise proposed are incorrect.

I greatly look forward to a long and deeply considered reply.

p1p~

I, too, have kept an open mind and use objective thinking when it comes to the recent election it's just that some of y'all are so overwhelmingly biased against Bush it has clouded your anaylsis.

The final count is now in and Iowa and Arizona went for Bush as well. I'll get back to you with figures etc but looking at the popular vote county by county, the states decided an east coast Liberal like Kerry was not the option we need in these times.

I'm still at a loss to understand your opinion that there exists or existed an "unfairness" w/respect to the election?

Yours,

บุญมี

p.s. When the words "excretion"and "krichun" are used in a debate, it slightly distorts the message. Objective are we.....???

p1p~

Perhaps to throw a little more light on the varied perceptions between you & I, here's how our election was viewed by Germany’s Der Spiegel.

A bit simplistic, no? Americans are tired of the Liberal line advocating Gay marriage, legalized Pot and the Michael Moore's and Barbara Striesand's defending the criminal vs. the injured.

It's coming full circle and it's impossible for y'all living in LOS to empathize with the backlash the so-called "patrician elites" have engendered.

Pick up a copy of that old movie "Red Dawn" for a glimpse of the general attitude outside of the small pockets of extreme liberalism on the coasts.

And here is the reality...you know there are not that many "Born Again Christians" on the entire planet!

Final electoral vote count: Bush 286, Kerry 252

WASHINGTON (AFP) - President George W. Bush won re-election with 286 electoral votes while Democratic challenger John Kerry amassed 252 electoral votes, according to a final tally compiled after the midwestern state of Iowa fell into the Bush column.

Results from a tight presidential race in Iowa had been delayed since Tuesday’s vote while the ballots were counted. Bush won the state by 14,000 votes according to results obtained Friday from the Iowa secretary of state’s office.

Iowa’s seven electoral votes boosted Bush’s final tally in the 538-member Electoral College to 286. A total of 270 was needed for election and Bush crossed the barrier on Wednesday when Kerry conceded the state of Ohio and its 20 electoral votes.

Bush won 31 states in Tuesday’s election while Kerry won 19 states and the nation’s capital, Washington, DC

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=stor...p/us_vote_final

From the NY Times - that most “liberal” of newspapers, a good analysis…

Every election year, we in the commentariat come up with a story line to explain the result, and the story line has to have two features. First, it has to be completely wrong. Second, it has to reassure liberals that they are morally superior to the people who just defeated them. (ain't that the truth)

In past years, the story line has involved Angry White Males, or Willie Horton-bashing racists. This year, the official story is that throngs of homophobic, Red America values-voters surged to the polls to put George Bush over the top.

This theory certainly flatters liberals, and it is certainly wrong.

Here are the facts. As Andrew Kohut of the Pew Research Center points out, there was no disproportionate surge in the evangelical vote this year. Evangelicals made up the same share of the electorate this year as they did in 2000. There wasno increase in the percentage of voters who are pro-life. Sixteen percent of voters said abortions should be illegal in all circumstances. There was no increase in the percentage of voters who say they pray daily.

It's true that Bush did get a few more evangelicals to vote Republican, but Kohut, whose final poll nailed the election result dead-on, reminds us that public opinion on gay issues over all has been moving leftward over the years. Majorities oppose gay marriage, but in the exit polls Tuesday, 25 percent of the voters supported gay marriage and 35 percent of voters supported civil unions. There is a big middle on gay rights issues, as there is on most social issues.

The reality is that this was a broad victory for the president. Bush did better this year than he did in 2000 in 45 out of the 50 states. He did better in New York, Connecticut and, amazingly, Massachusetts. That's hardly the Bible Belt. Bush, on the other hand, did not gain significantly in the 11 states with gay marriage referendums.

italics/emphasis mine

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/11/06/opinion/...ner=rssuserland

If Kerry Won Ohio and New Mexico why didn't he just wait until the votes were counted and not concede?? It's his own ###### fault

Tornando why are you bringing this up?? It's a little late Too Late Actually I'm glad that four month war hero didn't make it to be president.

If Kerry Won Ohio and New Mexico   why didn't he just wait until the votes were counted and not concede??    It's his own ###### fault  

Tornando  why are you bringing this up??    It's a little late   Too Late   Actually I'm glad that four month war hero didn't make it  to be president.  

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

yada yada yada - who is responsible for letting you have access to here anyway?

If Kerry Won Ohio and New Mexico   why didn't he just wait until the votes were counted and not concede??    It's his own ###### fault  

Tornando  why are you bringing this up??    It's a little late   Too Late   Actually I'm glad that four month war hero didn't make it  to be president.  

yada yada yada - who is responsible for letting you have access to here anyway?

Georgie Porgie!

Bush, Kerry. Kerry, Bush. They're both useless tools in my book. However, the shining beacon of American democracy will never falter, as it blinds the rest of the world with it's purity and conviction.....even if the people have to choose between two retards.

God bless ignorance. God bless America.