naturelover Posted January 16, 2009 Author Share Posted January 16, 2009 Interesting!We suddenly have 2 Newbies - "carlmichael" and "naturelover" giving ringing endorsements of the Elite Card or claiming it has not failed. Patrick EDIT: Patrick - i don't know if you happened to notice that I am the one that has created this thread... I suggest you read it from the start. Naturelover. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crushdepth Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 (edited) If all the money is in Singapore why should the program be reinstated? Face basically. Eventually even the new government will realise that are torching their credibility with foreigners if they don't honour the programme. It's not like it costs them anything. I'm not commenting on what happens to the money in Singapore, I have no idea although the imagination does tend to wander Edited January 16, 2009 by Crushdepth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jingthing Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 (edited) If the government wants to cancel the program, and make no mistake, it is a Thaksin failure, they could also save face by granting a partial refund to all card holders. They did enjoy some use of the card and in the long run that may be cheaper than carrying on with funding a failed company, so a partial rather than full refund could be justified. That is, if they really care about saving face with these foreigners. Edited January 16, 2009 by Jingthing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soutpeel Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 I still find it shocking that anybody with the smallest knowledge of this country would hand over a million baht to a Singapore account (if that's true) and expect the Thais to honour it; they honour nothing other than their own personal wallet. The Singapore account bit is very true, I researched the Thai Elite card for future reference, although I am currently working in Thailand was looking at future options once the job finally finished, I did think at the time the Singapore account thing appeared a bit strange. I am certainly no fan of Toxic, but schemes like this have a lot of merits, I am not talking about limo services, free golf or other BS benefits like that, but the fact you can live somewhere long term without visa hassles etc, if you are prepared to pay the price and dont qualify for things like retirement visa's ie under 50 and financially secure. If a Thai Elite scheme part deux comes into being would like to see some other tangible benefits other than the visa benefits such as a card holder would be able to purchase a maximum of 1 rai of land in their own name on a 99 year lease to build a house. If a benefit such as this was offered, I would have no hesitation in paying THB 1.0 - 1.5 million for a card. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
p_brownstone Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 (edited) Dont agree with you Patrick. Most of the benefits I receive ie Golf, Spa etc etc is at no cost to Thailand Elite. The golf clubs, restaurants, Spa's that have agreements with the scheme are hoping guys like myself bring along business compatriots, friends etc you get the picture, who have to pay. You surely cannot be serious!? Go to your local Noodle Shop, ask them for free food and promise you will try to bring in other Customers at some point in the future who will eat and pay. Some business' may offer Freebies when the Cost is not immediately a material loss - for example a Golf Course has little actual Cost if they allow you free Greenfees (apart from repairing any Divots you leave behind etc.) but a Spa giving you a free treatment still has to pay the Masseuse, the cost of water and Oils etc. etc.. The "free" Airport pickups have a Cost - the investment in the vehicle, fuel and the drivers salary. The Card Company has no income apart from the Subscriptions from new Members - that is quite simply a Ponzi Scam. Patrick Edited January 16, 2009 by p_brownstone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sriracha john Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 Hmm..... Now: Sorajak Kasemsuvan Chairman of the Board of Directors Thailand Privilege Card Co., Ltd. Before: Sorajak Kasemsuvan Deputy Foreign Affairs Minister in Thaksin's Cabinet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naturelover Posted January 16, 2009 Author Share Posted January 16, 2009 Dont agree with you Patrick. Most of the benefits I receive ie Golf, Spa etc etc is at no cost to Thailand Elite. The golf clubs, restaurants, Spa's that have agreements with the scheme are hoping guys like myself bring along business compatriots, friends etc you get the picture, who have to pay. You surely cannot be serious!? Go to your local Noodle Shop, ask them for free food and promise you will try to bring in other Customers at some point in the future who will eat and pay. Some business' may offer Freebies when the Cost is not immediately a material loss - for example a Golf Course has little actual Cost if they allow you free Greenfees (apart from repairing any Divots you leave behind etc.) but a Spa giving you a free traetment still has to pay the Masseuse, the cost of water and Oils etc. etc.. The "free" Airport pickups have a Cost - the investment in the vehicle, fuel and the drivers salary. The Card Company has no income apart from the Subscriptions from new Members - that is quite simply a Ponzi Scam. Patrick I totally agree with this! I am sure that Thailand elite company today is funding its activities by utilizing members future financial reserves that should have been allocated for future services. This indeed sounds like a Ponzi Scam. I am sure that over time some terms and services will be readjusted – and limited for the members. I am also sure that no member will get extremely mad if in the next 5 years some privileges will be readjusted and somewhat limited. The visa is one of the more significant benefits of this program if not the most significant one and it has theoretically zero cost for the company. IF this benefits changes then its totally disrespectful for the members and insulting. For most of us it will not be becasue the money that was lost but the humiliation around this situation. When Thailand elite company says – " we need to cut down golf costs" its understandable and somewhat acceptable – but when the government rejects your visa it simply means you are not welcomed any more! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimmyTheMook Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 Can they rename the card "How to Steal from the Rich and Gullible and Get Away With It" ??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OlRedEyes Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 There has been a lot of negative comments in the past towards this program coming mainly from expats that live in Thailand and are not members of this program. Apparently those fears about the government not continuing to respect this program are coming to be true! Wow. That must be a surprise to some. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DMasut Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 Based on 2500 members paying 1,000,000 THB each = 2,500,000,000 THB $73,529,411.00 USD 49,545,563.75 GBP 6,636,003,340.80 JPY Alot of money in Thailand to do alot of things. Is T.A.T.'s Annual budget more than that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DMasut Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 THAILAND HAS PONZI SCHEMES?!?! I THOUGHT THEY WERE "INVESTMENT CLUBS"!?! :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasreeve17 Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 (edited) I still find it shocking that anybody with the smallest knowledge of this country would hand over a million baht to a Singapore account (if that's true) and expect the Thais to honour it; they honour nothing other than their own personal wallet. The Singapore account bit is very true, I researched the Thai Elite card for future reference, although I am currently working in Thailand was looking at future options once the job finally finished, I did think at the time the Singapore account thing appeared a bit strange. I am certainly no fan of Toxic, but schemes like this have a lot of merits, I am not talking about limo services, free golf or other BS benefits like that, but the fact you can live somewhere long term without visa hassles etc, if you are prepared to pay the price and dont qualify for things like retirement visa's ie under 50 and financially secure. If a Thai Elite scheme part deux comes into being would like to see some other tangible benefits other than the visa benefits such as a card holder would be able to purchase a maximum of 1 rai of land in their own name on a 99 year lease to build a house. If a benefit such as this was offered, I would have no hesitation in paying THB 1.0 - 1.5 million for a card. Okay, I take your point and have realigned a bit because some people, including yourself, have made decent posts in favour of the elite card. The problem I have, and the likes of Samuiman can rant at me all they like, but I just don't trust monied Thais, so I could never trust the people behind this scheme, or any Thais that have enough power to set up a sheme like this. Monied Thais want more money, period. They don't want Thai development, they don't want foreign investment (they only think in terms of short term money gain; one time partners to rape), they don't care how people perceive the country or themselves, they want more money. Hence, I'd never invest in this sheme because I consider it another in a huge line of scams. These moneyed Thais think that Foreigners are stupid, and to be fair to them we prove them right time after time... Edited January 16, 2009 by jasreeve17 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tpkhk Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 (edited) By the way, to the question as to why an account in Singapore - the Thailand Elite program is marketed through in country, or territorial resellers (who get a commission) - and who have exclusivity over certain territories. The resellers are usually, existing businesses (real estate, event marketeers etc) who add this on as an additional item. I've seen at least one real estate agency in Phuket sign up as a reseller. Anyway, for those who bought into the program, via the Singapore contact - transfer funds via Singapore. Ditto for HKG, Korea etc. Edited January 16, 2009 by tpkhk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jingthing Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 (edited) Jingthing, the new lot are making rather a habit of rehashing MrT's ideas (education, wellfare, economic stimulation package...) maybe they'll be a new Abhisit inspired card, coming soon, as Southpeel reckoned. Sorry. Somchai on the street, in the fields, cares about rice policies or medical care, not a few thousand "rich" farangs. What would Abhisit have to gain POLITICALLY by rehashing a failed program that is of no interest to Thais? I reckon it costs money to keep this failed program going. These are hard times. Another thing they could do to save face is simply grandfather the visa program for life for the current holders. That wouldn't cost anything. Edited January 16, 2009 by Jingthing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sabaijai Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 Three or four years ago I met with an elite card company officer who was seeking sales reps for the program. At the meeting there was another foreigner, an American, who was already representing sales in Phuket. The commissions they offered on memberships were decent. The Thai officer from the company gave me a press kit and explained how the company worked. I asked him why the accounting was done in Singapore but I don't recall what the explanation was. One thing I remember well was the man's confidence that the program would be successful because it had the prime minister's full support. Thaksin became an elite-card cheerleader relatively late in the game, ie, the concept and company were in place before Thaksin became a public supporter. The officer admitted that sales had been slow but that since Thaksin (or a relative? I'm hazy on which) had a private share in the company, he thought it would be making a comeback. I declined to get involved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MeetJohnDoe Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 Here in Phnom Penh I paid the guy at the airport $300 cash and had a 13-month working visa delivered to my door next day. No work permit is needed (or even exists). No need to leave the country to renew: you can stay here forever if you want. That's all fine and dandy if one wants to live in PP/Cambo, however, most people don't. I would venture a guess that most people are aware of this option and have likely spent time in PP but for various reasons, have ruled it out as a retirement or work destination. As for the Thai visa situation, it's really no hassle for folks who have their sh1t together...either a legit job or a decent pension or savings amount. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MeetJohnDoe Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 Anyway, for those who bought into the program, via the Singapore contact - transfer funds via Singapore. Ditto for HKG, Korea etc. If the re-seller was a Singaporean company selling the program in Singapore to people there, that would make sense. However, when I was considering the program (I never joined) and received an official membership application and supporting documentation from a Bangkok based agent (who is also a major sponsor on this forum), the TPCC membership application stated the membership fee was to be paid to their bank account in Singapore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasreeve17 Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 Anyway, for those who bought into the program, via the Singapore contact - transfer funds via Singapore. Ditto for HKG, Korea etc. If the re-seller was a Singaporean company selling the program in Singapore to people there, that would make sense. However, when I was considering the program (I never joined) and received an official membership application and supporting documentation from a Bangkok based agent (who is also a major sponsor on this forum), the TPCC membership application stated the membership fee was to be paid to their bank account in Singapore. A Thai company, with close links to the PM (a well known and corrupt one in a country well known for high level corruption), and based in Bangkok, selling a product that contains a government issued visa. BUT, you send the payment to Singapore. That has got to send the alarm bells ringing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hobart Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 Wonder if anyone knows, does K.Toxin have an elite card and if so is he a little bit concerned about the visa changes especially since he has lost his diplomatic passport. What is / was the commission for the seller when they managed to find someone willing to part with this large amount of money. Finally, all those of you who have nothing for praise for the card, could you possible have some interest in this card other than that of being a member. I see the same type of replies and am wondering if its the same person/people doing all of this positive posting. I know the Mods can see IP addresses, sadly we cannot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jingthing Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 (edited) That has got to send the alarm bells ringing. Indeed. And the implicit message of their marketing was this was a card for people who think 1 million baht is nothing. They were not promoting the idea of the card for cheap Charlie visa seekers, even though for the under 50's, it looked like a tempting offer visa-wise. That is another way to save face. So they cancel the program and some people protest. What? You claimed you were elite and now you care about a million baht, you aren''t very elite then, are you? Edited January 16, 2009 by Jingthing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sned Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 There is a heavy chinese involvement in this program. Many influencial business men. you dont bite the hand that feeds you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harleyclarkey Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 You can't trust them at all. No goverment programme should be suspended and back dated. Any honourable system would honour the existing terms and conditions. But then we all know there is very little honour in Thailand. The foreigner is here for one reason only ....to be shaken till the pips squeek. On the visa section here I laid out the cost to me of renewing my OA visa from Ireland at over 1,000 euro. Yes. One THOUSAND. I haven't bothered and will now holiday and play where I am more welcome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
midas Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 I have been one of the biggest skeptics of this scheme since the beginning ( the bank account in Singapore just never seemed right to me ......) but actuallyhearing this today about the visa has still suprised me. It's unthinkable that a government would do this to wealthy people who have paid this kind of money " in good faith ". I think it says an awful lot about this country and just reinforces the opinion I have had all along that whilst its enjoyable country to live in- it's the last place for foreigners to do business because Thai's simply cannot be trusted to leave the laws alone. More than anything, I can't understand the need to cancel this privilege? It's not as if it would cost them very much to keep it alive no matter how much they despise the previous government. There has to be some sort of provision to compensate these people surely? It's the same with their immigration laws in general-always changing this and changing that -there is no sense of permanence about their rules and regulations. It's like when you wake up tomorrow what rules will they have changed ? I remember the Japanese Chamber of Commerce in Thailand sometime ago being quite vocal and saying Thailand should stop changing the immigration laws so often. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smithson Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 a friend of mine signed up just recently and paid 1.5 mio. baht. He is never staying longer than a few weeks most a month each time. He doesn't need the visa benefit. He wants to expand his business which includes the more healthy people and clients in TH. The elite program promises to help making contacts, arranging meetings, translation, contracts, etc. that was his reason to join. I believe it will return his investment very soon. To be honest, I think having spent so much so easily may not be seen as good business sense and may give the wrong impression to the rich Thais he meets. I know TH sucks many times if you stay for years and get involved more than a tourist, as well for me, but most of us are here of free will and back home it wouldn't be much better or other things would suck which go smoother here. Can't have it all. First time I came over I was told 'try not to pay for anything until after you receive the service'. Good advice and shows why many were wary of the card. Thais aren't great at planning and thinking ahead, the tend to renege if it's possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaibeachlovers Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 I don't see a problem with trashing failed Thaksin programs. I do see a problem with promising customers a lifetime benefit and then taking it away. There really ought to be a lawsuit for members to recover the cost of the cards as the visa program was a huge portion of the benefit sold, for many, the only thing they were spending the money for. At one time I considered it, and the only reason I wanted it was the visa feature. I didn't really expect it to be honored for life, but that is what they at least implied. Thaksin may now be a wanted fugitive but at one time he represented the government of Thailand and put the reputation of the government of Thailand behind this card, even though it was administered by a private company (how convenient). Hmmmm, reminds me of the time the New Zealand government brought in "lifetime" driving licences, only for a later government to change it to 10 year licences ( no refund there either ). Nothing any government does is for ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mangostays Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 Thailand elite program is dying! Special Entry Visa suspended! I am a Thailand elite member and I was informed today by Thailand elite company that the renewal of Thailand elite 5 year Special Entry Visa has been suspended. The Thailand elite program was marketed as a government backed program that gives its members indefinite visa privileges in a form of a special visa entry that is renewable every 5 years. As a result of this extraordinary privilege many members has bought in to this program for 1 million baht. Apparently today the renewal of visa privilege has been suspended! There has been a lot of negative comments in the past towards this program coming mainly from expats that live in Thailand and are not members of this program. Apparently those fears about the government not continuing to respect this program are coming to be true! My personal opinion is that this situation will kill the programs reputation completely regardless the outcome of the expected cabinet vote about Thailand elite visa privilege approval. As for today there are about 2500 members in the program. I am just wondering what will be the consequences of this move by thai government after not respecting a program it has self established, generating significant profits of this scam and insulting influential wealthy people from many nation around the world? What does this say about the country? What does this say about the people of this country? What does this say about doing business in this country? For more information about this program you can visit thailandelite web site Sympathies to all Elites for wasting almost 15,000 GBP on such a load of old twaddle. Here comes the however.... If one can purchase an elite pass that circumvents (for one) the conventional visa system WITHOUT dimplomatic status, and gives the bearer immunity from double charging, tea money and basically any other privileges a high soc Thai citizen demands, then this system is almost certainly a scam and nothing more than a cash cow for a select few brain childs in the ex-administration. My scepticism in the entire package came simply from the fact that for this system to work, every single atom of public society and government/political official make-up throughout the Kingdom would have to have bought into it without question or debate and have be promised a fee equal or more that that they were already receiving from their current 'business set up'.. A mere 1 million THB per foreigner (for 2500 bods) would not even scratch the surface. VIP status was a poorly planned short cut to residency and a feeble attempt to extend the elite class system out and beyond the borders of the kingdom for non Thai subjects and at the same time (phew) no doubt cut tasty a profit for the inventors. An age old system for Thailand's elite only works for Thailand's elite. Foreigners live by a different set of rules. SCAM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yamaharr1 Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 As for today there are about 2500 members in the program. I am just wondering what will be the consequences of this move by thai government after not respecting a program it has self established, generating significant profits of this scam and insulting influential wealthy people from many nation around the world? What does this say about the country? What does this say about the people of this country? What does this say about doing business in this country? To me all it says is good for you I am glad it happen to all of the members who raised there noses to the majority who tried to warn against it. But yet as the so called influential wealthy people have just now found out, you are not so influential and wealthy after all. You are gullible and naive for ever thinking this program was ever going to last. If Thailand hasn't taught you influential wealthy people anything you should have at the least already known once the money stopped and the enrollments stopped then the program stops. O unless you are ready to cough up another 1 mill hahahaha this is some funny and great news. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sholaisen Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 I recently became a member and received my 5 year visa without any hassel (about 3 weeks ago). So far they seem to deliver what thet have promissed. Seems that the recent issue is just an official confirmation needed every time there is a change of gouvernment. So unless they surprise us all and decline the current policy, no need to panic just yet. There are absolutely no reasonable explenation why they should decline the current program. The latest information that they are now voiding all visa fees for the next few months is a step in the softening of visa policy to attract more tourists. So why should they distroy their reputation by cancelling the SE visa offered by Thai Elite. Wouldn't make sense. Thai Elite is not Mr. Taksins company! He only supported it after it started... The implementation of the 15 day rule crossing over land is to reduce the amount of "free loaders" in this country. Who do you think leave the most behind, the guys in Pattaya driving up to Cambodia every month or the members of Thai Elite? It's all about money unless you where ever in any doubt... Mr. H. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
midas Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 I recently became a member and received my 5 year visa without any hassel (about 3 weeks ago). So far they seem to deliver what thet have promissed.Mr. H. You have to be joking right ? if you have only recently become a member maybe you are not aware of all the other features that have gradually " evaporated " from this scam.............? This has been like watching a tyre deflate slowly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aznyron Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 Well I am happy all you rich guys did not lose your investment YET but it would have to be snowing in the equator before i put down 1 million baht for a visa to any country and Thailand would be on the bottom of the list with the way they lie and B/S about every thing mainly the thai baht which is worthless and being prop up by USD but I guess the money was burning a hole in your pocket or your a show off with your wealth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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