'Ruling out the foreigner'

[plachon]

More duckin', divin' and a'jiving i'd say Tuts, judging from the past 3 pages (or is it 30?) of nonsense. Still, I'm all for keeping things light and not reaching for the mogadon's............just yet!

PS send me a PM if you get the prawn thing going, or need some advice.

[pantarei]

This is my first post after lurking on this board for several months.  I recently decided to take early retirement and change the scenery.  One of the "new scenery" candidates is LOS.  I have been to LOS approximately 10 times in the last 12 years - business, tourism and relatively moderate sanook (I am divorced).  To me the main issue is not so much the financial aspect of the hypothetical (at this time) changes but, rather, my unwillingness to live in a place where I may not be welcome.  I am not alone.  I know several rather affluent individuals who prefer not to retire in Florida, California, or Phoenix but are not willing to live in a country where foreigners are unwelcome unless they can be shaken down.  Compared to some other coutries, SO FAR Thailand is not a bad choice (even given a choice, I'd rather lease than buy a house).  Bottom line, implementation of a strict policy of trying to attract only high net-financial-worth individuals may backfire.  I do believe (wishful thinking?) that the interview published in the Chiang Mai newspaper contains some elements of misinformation/misunderstanding/mistranslation.  

 

This thread contains a number of interesting posts with some posts characterized by high entertainment value (mrvietnam is a riot!!).

 

Opalhort posted a superb post (Sept. 9) in which he expressed his concern about losing his work (water farming) permit.  He might potentially be affected by the new rules IF they require a monthly income above 40K BHT to keep one's work permit AND there is no grandfathering proviso.

In response to Opalhort's message, mrvietnam requested guidance for water farming in Florida:

mrvietnam2001  

opalhort, that's a great story and my wife and I would like to wish you the best of luck to continue all your dreams.

I'm contacting Kit to see what can be done in also the upper region 10 in the US ( Florida) as we just bought an additional 1/3 acre of virgin forest that's attached to our house and would like to do something with these water lillies and other water farming if possible. If you can help us do this, please private email me and we would like to take some guidance from you

Just 19 hours after posting the above, mrvietnam posted the following, outrageously funny, message:

mrvietnam2001

40k baht a month is nothing in the real world and you know it. If you don't know it, try slowing down on the alcohol and clear your mind.

Then become productive and make some money. It's the best therapy I know.

Isn't it illogical to seek advice from an "unproductive" person (defined by mrviet as someone with an LOS income of less than 40K BHT/month) ??  Why would someone who claims ad nauseam to be an eminently successful entrepreneur ask an "unproductive" person for guidance? How can mrviet expect guidance from a person he had insulted?  

In case someone missed his deep thoughts, mrviet found it necessary to reiterate his views on people who do not worship the "golden calf"; or is it the "golden coins"??

mrvietnam2001  

Hahahaha that's a laugh. Someone who doesn't want to be productive enough to earn ( on his own) a thousand bucks a month is going to accuse the Thai Government of creating unnecessary stress for people?

It seems that mrnam's hobby (obsession?) is pontification on the importance of being "productive".  Well, there are thousands of productive occupations - construction work, engineering, truck driving, science, fire fighting, etc., etc.  However, is buying coins low from one sucker, and selling them high to another sucker a highly "productive" occupation?  What exactly does it "produce"?  Megalomania and crassness?  

 

BTW, I had arrived at the JFK airport in NYC 30 years ago with $5, one suitcase, an American visa in my "travel document" (no passport), and an English vocabulary of about 100 words.  I am absolutely certain that, at the very least, I am as well educated and financially successful as mrviet.  And I have done things a bit more challenging and productive than selling coins, hahaha.  Well, it would be difficult not to, heeheehaha.  So what?  Am I happier than the average Isarn farmer?  I have no idea.  Am I more successful?  Only if I have been doing a better job in my area of expertise than the farmer does at farming.  

Fortunately, mrvietnam is definitely NOT representative of the thousands of Americans I have had the pleasure and privilege to work and associate with in the last 3 decades.  

Unfortunately, the unintended effect of mrvietnam's posts is to propagate the UNJUSTIFIED and UNFAIR "ugly American" stereotype.  It does, however, require an IQ of at least 80 to realize that.  

 

In summary, get a life and a PRODUCTIVE, REAL job.  "It's the best therapy" for megalomania and crassness but, then, mrvietnam is likely to be an incurable specimen.  Ciao.

[ChiangMaiThai]

Dear Mr. Vietnam,

Thanks for the therapy session. I really do feel enlightened. Now if you had even bothered to read my previous posts, you would have saved yourself a little embarrasment. You see, I've said many times that these rules don't affect me personally. I must show an income of 40,000 a month? Okay, no problem. However, I do feel some empathy for those farangs in Thailand, leading responsible yet simple lives, taking care of a family, perhaps living on 15k or 20k a month.

I wonder what it is about yourself which makes you feel such anger and disdain towards those who have either not dedicated their lives to the pursuit of the dollar or have not been successful in such a pursuit. I will say again, there are plenty of good, repsponsible farangs living in Thailand who do not have an income of 40k a month and yet who can still take care of themselves and their families and get this, they do so happily! Imagine that!

How you could feel no sympathy for such a person in light of these new rules is beyond me. Perhaps you are the one who needs the therapy session.

[mrvietnam2001]

Post removed - please use email or Pm fpr personal off-topic attacks! Thanks! /Admin

[DaveYo]

oops typo error, meant O

:blues:

[Zendesigner]

in think mr nam should be banned as a troll on this forum.

[DaveYo]

Gosh I did not know that there was a War between Thailand and Vietnam.  Whhhhhhhhhhhhhhooooooooooooo boy.  Now we can really hear the armour chinking!  hahahahahahahaha :laugh:    :cool:  :blues:

[mrentoul]

However, I do feel some empathy for those farangs in Thailand, leading responsible yet simple lives, taking care of a family, perhaps living on 15k or 20k a month.

On the whole, I do not feel sorry for such people, because they made their choices a long time ago.

I feel sorry for Thais I know who work piggishly long hours for B5000 a month (or less). They don't have anything like the choices or options open to the average westerner, and this is their land.

If a westerner messes up his life in the West there's nothing to stop him starting again, but some seem simply to opt out.

That's the ultimate freedom and for it you pay a high price.

Most of my Thai friends have no choice but to work to support themsevles and their families. Withdrawing from life is a luxury they cannot afford.

The average westerner without such skills will find it hard finding work here, because he's a foreigner in a strange land, an immigrant. He is likely to suffer the lot of most immigrants: picking up only that work which nationals are not prepared to do.

Hardly surprising, then, if he doesn't have much money. That's a choice he made, I'm afraid: to leave the West, where presumably he had a career and stood a chance of earning a decent wage.

The idea of these changes is not to break up families, but to keep out undesirable (terrorist) elements. In striking a balance between keeping together families which usually include a Thai national, and driving out foreigners whose lack of profile in the workplace or public life makes them hard to detect, the government may have erred too far on the side of safety (though I don't think so).

But those westerners do have choices open to them, many more than the average Thai.

You think the West rolls out the welcome mat for Thai immigrants seeking work? It doesn't. Let's say the country that a Thai labourer is working in makes it harder for poor immigrants to stay, and he decides to come home.

You think he has a bright future awaiting him back here? In most cases, I would say not.

So you're right. I don't feel sorry for the average westerner. In most cases he wil be here as a result of choices he has made, not circumstances that were forced upon him. And choices have a price.

[Khun Larry]

This is my first post after lurking on this board for several months.  I recently decided to take early retirement and change the scenery.  One of the "new scenery" candidates is LOS.  I have been to LOS approximately 10 times in the last 12 years - business, tourism and relatively moderate sanook (I am divorced).  To me the main issue is not so much the financial aspect of the hypothetical (at this time) changes but, rather, my unwillingness to live in a place where I may not be welcome.  I am not alone.  I know several rather affluent individuals who prefer not to retire in Florida, California, or Phoenix but are not willing to live in a country where foreigners are unwelcome unless they can be shaken down.  Compared to some other coutries, SO FAR Thailand is not a bad choice (even given a choice, I'd rather lease than buy a house).  Bottom line, implementation of a strict policy of trying to attract only high net-financial-worth individuals may backfire.  I do believe (wishful thinking?) that the interview published in the Chiang Mai newspaper contains some elements of misinformation/misunderstanding/mistranslation.  

 

This thread contains a number of interesting posts with some posts characterized by high entertainment value (mrvietnam is a riot!!).

 

Opalhort posted a superb post (Sept. 9) in which he expressed his concern about losing his work (water farming) permit.  He might potentially be affected by the new rules IF they require a monthly income above 40K BHT to keep one's work permit AND there is no grandfathering proviso.

In response to Opalhort's message, mrvietnam requested guidance for water farming in Florida:

mrvietnam2001  

opalhort, that's a great story and my wife and I would like to wish you the best of luck to continue all your dreams.

I'm contacting Kit to see what can be done in also the upper region 10 in the US ( Florida) as we just bought an additional 1/3 acre of virgin forest that's attached to our house and would like to do something with these water lillies and other water farming if possible. If you can help us do this, please private email me and we would like to take some guidance from you

Just 19 hours after posting the above, mrvietnam posted the following, outrageously funny, message:

mrvietnam2001

40k baht a month is nothing in the real world and you know it. If you don't know it, try slowing down on the alcohol and clear your mind.

Then become productive and make some money. It's the best therapy I know.

Isn't it illogical to seek advice from an "unproductive" person (defined by mrviet as someone with an LOS income of less than 40K BHT/month) ??  Why would someone who claims ad nauseam to be an eminently successful entrepreneur ask an "unproductive" person for guidance? How can mrviet expect guidance from a person he had insulted?  

In case someone missed his deep thoughts, mrviet found it necessary to reiterate his views on people who do not worship the "golden calf"; or is it the "golden coins"??

mrvietnam2001  

Hahahaha that's a laugh. Someone who doesn't want to be productive enough to earn ( on his own) a thousand bucks a month is going to accuse the Thai Government of creating unnecessary stress for people?

It seems that mrnam's hobby (obsession?) is pontification on the importance of being "productive".  Well, there are thousands of productive occupations - construction work, engineering, truck driving, science, fire fighting, etc., etc.  However, is buying coins low from one sucker, and selling them high to another sucker a highly "productive" occupation?  What exactly does it "produce"?  Megalomania and crassness?  

 

BTW, I had arrived at the JFK airport in NYC 30 years ago with $5, one suitcase, an American visa in my "travel document" (no passport), and an English vocabulary of about 100 words.  I am absolutely certain that, at the very least, I am as well educated and financially successful as mrviet.  And I have done things a bit more challenging and productive than selling coins, hahaha.  Well, it would be difficult not to, heeheehaha.  So what?  Am I happier than the average Isarn farmer?  I have no idea.  Am I more successful?  Only if I have been doing a better job in my area of expertise than the farmer does at farming.  

Fortunately, mrvietnam is definitely NOT representative of the thousands of Americans I have had the pleasure and privilege to work and associate with in the last 3 decades.  

Unfortunately, the unintended effect of mrvietnam's posts is to propagate the UNJUSTIFIED and UNFAIR "ugly American" stereotype.  It does, however, require an IQ of at least 80 to realize that.  

 

In summary, get a life and a PRODUCTIVE, REAL job.  "It's the best therapy" for megalomania and crassness but, then, mrvietnam is likely to be an incurable specimen.  Ciao.

EXCELLENT OBSERVATIONS.

IRREFUTABLE!!!

[tutsiwarrior]

heyyyyy...lets chill out fellas...mrvietnam has an abrasive personality...it don't mean that he should be barred from the forum. Alternative views, so long as they are socially acceptable should always be welcome. mr saigone has succeded in winding you up.

mrvietnam, I support your contributions to this thread...although you should be shot for barbarizing popular music...

[PREM-R]

The idea of these changes is not to break up families, but to keep out undesirable (terrorist) elements.

mrentoul Posted on Sep. 12 2003,12:50

 Don't think Bin Laden  and his mates will have much trouble finding 400k Baht or 40,000 baht per month!

[Artisi]

boring boring boring - most posters are now so far off the point there is no longer any point to this discussion in its present form.

To those who are interested in the likely changes, how about we kick off a new thread to discuss the proposed changes to some of the rules regarding visa's. The others can continue their games in the first thread and leave the interested ones to have a normal intelligent discussion.

[mrentoul]

To those who are interested in the likely changes, how about we kick off a new thread to discuss the proposed changes to some of the rules regarding visa's.

That's what some of us are doing. By all means, start a new thread. Go on, be brave.

[george]

boring boring boring - most posters are now so far off the point there is no longer any point to this discussion in its present form.

To those who are interested in the likely changes, how about we kick off a new thread to discuss the proposed changes to some of the rules regarding visa's. The others can continue their games in the first thread and leave the interested ones to have a normal intelligent discussion.

Good idea, thanks all for your postings in this thread!

We are closing this now, and welcome you to open new topics. /Admin

[Ajarn]

i'm in agreement with roger here, i think that these new rules will be enforced with discretion and that those deemed as undesirables may find life tougher,those of you who think that complaining to the thai government about these new rules,(quoting human rights,threatening to bring down the thai economy when you move to cambodia or mexico,you wont be able to live without us,WE'LL SHOW YOU!etc.) will aid your cause should sober up,grow up and get real.a lot of foriegn long stayers here live on relatively small amounts of money and are adept at making that money last as long as possible,the thai economy is hardly dependant on it.a  proportion of long stayers and visa extenders are here only for the low prices,often living on meagre benefits from their home country that are sent over and , and in truth thailand would not suffer from their absence,and,ask yourselves,does thailand really honestly need more foriegn nightlife afficionados in pattaya,patong and bangkok.it does the thai image no good at all.i'm sure that legitimate workers will be given the appropriate permits and that legitimate husbands will be allowed to support legitimate wives.so i dont think that there is too much to worry about so long as the paperwork is in order and the attitude good.the authorities are just pulling in the reins a bit,because the influx has been getting out of hand.

Good Post! I agree, but....one never knows what will happen here, na'?

Maybe the unpredictibility and the challenge is part of what makes life interesting here!  

California was sooo boring, compared to life here  ::

[TizMe]

We are closing this now, and welcome you to open new topics. /Admin

George, looks like you forgot to close the thread.  

[flackjacket]

I have been off the web for a while due to a move from the land of hook nosed gentlemen wearing skirts to a cooler much more expensive land.

I have read the threads here and feel it has all got out of hand, yes, some contributors feel that because  a Farang with moderate income wishes to live with his Thai family then he must be a failure.

In that case I will be one of those "beggers" due to the fact that I have spent a big chunk of my capital building a worthwhile house in Thailand for my family to live in, paid for my step sons education and now to cap it all, the Thai Government wants to make my OFFICIAL contribution to living in Thailand astronomical. Dont take into consideration that I provided a Thai work force of builders etc with 8 months employment, bought all the materials in Thailand and will be spending all my pension in Thailand.

Of courser the Govennment does not worry about abandoned Thai familys, why should they as long as they can run their BMW's.

Lets get back to the original point, the constant upward trend of all visas and associated documentation can only point to the fact that now Thailand has cleared their IMF loan they do not want us. But of course the IMW will step in again if needed, they have short memories and it does not affect them.

Even Tony Blair and his team of clowns are more astute than their Thai counterparts, but dont make the mistake of thinking the they or the British Embassy will help or support you, no way.

They have their own problems except the immigrants to Uk have no cash and a minimum of 20 "dependants" Try stepping off the aircraft at DM airport and saying I want political asylum and see the reaction. Political correctness does not exist in Thailand.

Lets wair until the BIG conference is over and see what transpires.

[Billion]

Hi! Can anyone tell me how much money I must have

in Thai bank. (One year marriage visa)

Thanks.

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Right now....200,000 baht...set to double in later 2004. Do it now. We hope it'll be grandfathered, although the stories about suggest it will not be.