Immigration Directive Regarding Dual Nationality

[Arkady]

This post recently appeared on the webboard of Immigration Division 2 which is responsible for passport control at airports and other entry points.

http://imm2.go.th/ph...ic.php?f=5&t=86

A person with two nationality passport.

by pachimsawat » Thu Apr 22, 2010 6:48 am

Case

Individual who enter the kingdom with foreign passport and depart with Thai passport.

How do Immigration officers handle?

Pratice

Immigration officers do as follows.

1. Only give a permit to the passport that was used to enter into the kingdom. Under the Thailand's Nationality Act.

2. For Thai whose have two nationality, do report this matter to Special Branch then to Department of Interior and to be annouced in the Goverment Gazette.

3. For individual who enter into the kingdom with foreign passport then changed nationality to Thai. If he/she still use that foreign passport, the officer make a report to Special Branch to revoke Thai nationality.

Laws and relevant order

Immigration No 2009.142/882 lated 26 Feb 2009. Guidline, Passport holder with dependants or individual with 2 passport.

pachimsawat

I am attaching the Thai version of 0029.142.882, although it is in the post, in case the page disappears. It seems to be an internal memo of the Immigration Bureau and not an Immigration Order or a National Police Order which would be published in the Royal Gazette and have the force of law. My own translation of the relevant passages is as follows (as always, apologies for any inaccuracies - I am an amateur translator of Thai):

2. Individuals holding two passports.

2.1 Thai passport and foreign passport.

2.1.1 Using a foreign passport to enter the Kingdom and a Thai passport to leave the Kingdom.

2.1.2 Using a Thai passport to enter the Kingdom and a foreign passport to leave the Kingdom, owing to the fact that the Thai passport has expired and there is an urgent reason for travelling out of the Kingdom.

2.1.3 Using a foreign passport to leave the Kingdom and using a Thai passport which has no exit stamp to enter the Kingdom.

The immigration officer is required to act as follows.

(1) Only give a permit to the same passport that was used to enter the Kingdom or the same passport used to leave the Kingdom. Thailand's laws governing nationality only permit one nationality.

(2) In the case of a Thai observed holding two nationalities the officer is required to report the case to Special Branch so they can make a case to the Interior Ministry for the publication in the Royal Gazette of an order revoking the individual's Thai nationality.

The memo seems on the surface to deal with only very specific cases of dual nationals who inadvisably enter Thailand on their Thai passport and leave on their foreign one and vice versa. However, the statements, "Thailand's laws governing nationality only permit one nationality" and "In the case of a Thai observed holding two nationalities the officer is required to report the case to Special Branch so they can make a case to the Interior Ministry for the publication in the Royal Gazette of an order revoking the individual's Thai nationality" seem to have much more general implications.

It is not clear from the memo what Immigration's policy is towards dual nationals who assiduously enter and leave Thailand on their Thai passports. However, another webboard, operated by Immigration Division 1 which issues and extends visas to foreigners already in Thailand has numerous posts from a few years ago in Thai from senior Immigration officers, indicating that the Immigration Bureau makes a very literal interpretation of the Nationality Act and staunchly believes that dual nationality is prohibited in all circumstances, except the case of luk kreung who have not yet reached the age of 21 - according to Immigration they are expected to revoke Thai nationality between the ages of 20 and 21, if they choose to retain their other nationality. In one post an Immigration officer stated that a Thai leaving the country to fly to a country for which Thais need a visa without a visa for that country in their passport would have trouble with Immigration, since it would be clear that they had another nationality. However, what kind of trouble was not specified. Against this is the view expressed on the Ministry of Foreign Affairs' website that, since there is, in their opinion, no specific wording prohibiting dual nationality in the Nationality Act it is OK for Thais to hold dual nationality, as long as the other country permits it. The MFA supports this view by issuing passports without fuss to Thai nationals that it knows have another nationality by the thousands. The Interior Ministry, the guardian of the Nationality Act, is not known to have made any public pronouncements on its interpretation of the law, which like many Thai laws is ambiguous, and I am unaware of any revocations of Thai nationality made purely on the grounds of holding another nationality, unlike countries like Singapore and Malaysia where this is done routinely.

See the following for examples of postings on Immigration Div 1 and MFA websites.

http://www.immigrati...x.php?board=9.0 (Thai)

http://www.immigrati...php?topic=252.0 (Thai)

http://www.mfa.go.th...473.php?id=3179 (English as below)

e-Passport Application for Thai Nationals Living Abroad

Is it possible to apply for a new e-Passport or an extension of validity in a foreign country?

- Yes, it is possible to apply for a new e-Passport at a Thai embassy or consulate-general but it is not possible to extend the validity of an e-Passport.

Can I apply for a Thai e-Passport if I am already holding a foreign Passport?

-Yes, if you are a Thai national, you may apply for a Thai e-Passport. However, many countries will not recognize dual citizenship. Therefore, you may be required to give up other nationalities before you can apply for a Passport from that country.

http://www.mfa.go.th/web/1071.php (Thai)

The Immigration directive has been in force for over a year now. Does any one know of any cases where dual nationals have had trouble at Immigration or even had their case reported to Special Branch for revocation of Thai nationality?

Immigration_Order_No_0029.142.882_26_Feb_2009.doc

Edited May 1, 2012 by Maestro

[Mario2008]

I have to agree with the MFA minstry interpretation. The law says you should choose when you rach the age of 21, but doesn't mention any penalty for no chosing. Therefor there is no legal basis to revoke Thai citizenship from a person who has dual nationality by birth.

Could be different for persons who got Thai nationality by way of naturalisation.

In any case, it explains why some people are having difficulty entering Thailand when immigration find they have two nationalities/passports. The question is if the immigration stance will stand up to scrutiny by a judge. As far as I know no Thai nationality has been revoked in this way.

[nakachalet]

HERE is a translation in english from the ministry of foreign affairs....

in reference to DUAL CITIZENSHIP.... and circumstances and country of jurisdiction.... and revocation issues....

somehow thaivisa does not allow me to post the original thai text and doc for some unknown reasons.... if anyone needs original thai text to verify accuracy, plse email me, ok?

(any error is attributable largely to my advanced senility)

Thai Foreign Affairs Dept

The response IN REFERENCE TO DUAL CITIZENSHIP as referenced in item No. 2 above, is to be deemed only as preliminary and a personal opinion, which can not be construed nor interpreted as a departmental nor a governmental policy.

Question: Does Thailand allow Thai citizen to have two nationalities? And under what circumstances? In my case, I (female) already attained Permanent Residency in Australia and is going to apply for an Australian Citizenship. But before finalizing my decision, I would like to know if Thailand would permit its citizen to hold dual citizenship. And in case if Thailand does not permit dual citizenship, if I become an Australian naturalized citizen, and sometime in the future I am desirous to relocate to Thailand and wish to purchase dwelling and real property under my own name; can I do that? And can I reapply to reinstate my Thai nationality again?

Response: The Law dealing with Nationality of 1965 which was rectified in 1992 (2^nd and 3^rd Editions) does not directly expound regarding having Thai Nationality and other Nationality at the same time and it does not regulate that a Thai national having another Nationalization at the same time shall lost the Thai Nationality because of the fact that, that person also having another nationality. Therefore, if a person holding a Thai Nationality and also another Nationality concurrently, does not express intention to denounce the Thai Nationality nor commit any act which might cause the government to revoke its Nationality status; and no other circumstances (offenses) that might cause the person to lose the Thai Nationality; or does or says anything which can be construed as admitting oneself as an alien; such person can therefore hold Thai Nationality and another Nationality concurrently. However, whether the person will lose one Nationality or not, would depend on the law of the country of jurisdiction. In your case, Ms. DuangJai, you may seek further additional details and policies from the Ministry of Defense which proscribes over Nationality laws and practices.

[Arkady]

The original Thai text translated by Nakachalet above is here on the MFA's website, if any one wants to refer to it. http://www.mfa.go.th/web/1071.php . In the last line "Ministry of Defense" should read "Ministry of the Interior".

Interestingly the Nationality Act of 1992 (Version 2), referred to above (Thai version attached), dated 19th February 1992, does contain a reference to a requirement to hold only one nationality. Section 14, amended in Version 2 read like this,

"Section 14. A person of Thai nationality, who was born of an alien father and has acquired the nationality of his father according to the law on nationality of his father’s country, or a person who acquires Thai nationality under Section 12 paragraph 2 is required to show his desire to hold only one nationality by making a declaration of his intention according to such form and in the manner as prescribed in the Ministerial Regulations within one year after his attaining the age of twenty years. In the event that no such declaration of intent is made within this specified time limit, it shall be considered that that person has renounced their Thai nationality, unless the Minister instructs otherwise in individual cases."

However Version 3 was rushed out a few weeks later on 31st March 1992 and amended Section 14 thus:

"Section 14. A person of Thai nationality, who was born of an alien father and has acquired the nationality of his father according to the law on nationality of his father, or a person who acquires Thai nationality under Section 12 paragraph 2 is required, if he or she desires to retain his or her other nationality, to make a declaration of his intention to renounce his Thai nationality within one year after his attaining the age of twenty years, according to such form and in the manner as prescribed in the Ministerial Regulations."

The 1992 amendments to the Nationality Act, under the enlightened Anand Panyarachun's premiership, opened the flood gates to "luk kreung" with dual nationality by allowing Thai women to pass on their nationality to their children for the first time. However, the initial thinking was apparently to limit the flood by writing in a mechanism whereby their Thai nationality could be revoked by default. Then some one must have decided that was either too discriminatory or too difficult to enforce and Section 14 was amended to be the ambiguous version still in force today. The MFA's interpretation of Section 14 is that it provides a mechanism and a time frame for voluntary renunciation of Thai nationality for "luk kreung" who want to retain their other nationality, if that country doesn't permit them to hold dual nationality. Immigration seems to think otherwise.

Thai_Nationality_Act_1992__Version_2_.pdf

Edited April 29, 2010 by Arkady

[Arkady]

I have to agree with the MFA minstry interpretation. The law says you should choose when you rach the age of 21, but doesn't mention any penalty for no chosing. Therefor there is no legal basis to revoke Thai citizenship from a person who has dual nationality by birth.

Could be different for persons who got Thai nationality by way of naturalisation.

In any case, it explains why some people are having difficulty entering Thailand when immigration find they have two nationalities/passports. The question is if the immigration stance will stand up to scrutiny by a judge. As far as I know no Thai nationality has been revoked in this way.

Unfortunately the Nationality Act doesn't provide for any judicial processes. All matters of granting or revoking nationality are up to the sole discretion of the Interior Minister. I think the only way to put a case in front of a judge would be to file a case against the minister in the Administrative Court after the event.

As you mention, some people have had problems entering Thailand with a brand new Thai passport issued abroad with no stamps in it, and in particular no visa from the country they are living in, and have been told by Immigration officers to enter using their foreign passport. This behaviour seems intended to imply that these people have no right to Thai nationality. Recent cases could well be influenced by this directive, although no one has reported that they have been threatened with revocation of nationality.

[bapak]

Situation:

Wife is Thai by birth..

She is Australian by naturalisation..

She holds both Thai and australian passports.

I was present at a meeting last year in Sydney of Thais and guest speaker was the Thai Consulate-General.

When asked by member of the audience what to do in case similar to my wife's status when travelling to Thailand.

He said depart and arrive in Australia on Australian passport. Arrive and depart Thailand on Thai passport.

He was emphatic that this was the right thing to do.

In fact, my wife has followed this practice for over 9 years. Have never once been queried on arrival by Thai Immigration.

[Maestro]

...Interestingly the Nationality Act of 1992 (Version 2), referred to above (Thai version attached), dated 19th February 1992, does contain a reference to a requirement to hold only one nationality. Section 14, amended in Version 2 read like this,

"Section 14. A person of Thai nationality, who was born of an alien father and has acquired the nationality of his father according to the law on nationality of his father’s country, or a person who acquires Thai nationality under Section 12 paragraph 2 is required to show his desire to hold only one nationality by making a declaration of his intention according to such form and in the manner as prescribed in the Ministerial Regulations within one year after his attaining the age of twenty years. In the event that no such declaration of intent is made within this specified time limit, it shall be considered that that person has renounced their Thai nationality, unless the Minister instructs otherwise in individual cases."

However Version 3 was rushed out a few weeks later on 31st March 1992 and amended Section 14 thus:

"Section 14. A person of Thai nationality, who was born of an alien father and has acquired the nationality of his father according to the law on nationality of his father, or a person who acquires Thai nationality under Section 12 paragraph 2 is required, if he or she desires to retain his or her other nationality, to make a declaration of his intention to renounce his Thai nationality within one year after his attaining the age of twenty years, according to such form and in the manner as prescribed in the Ministerial Regulations."...

In 2008, version 4 made that Section 14 gender non-specific, ie no discrimination based on the parent's gender:

"Section 14. A person of Thai nationality, who was born of an alien father or mother and has acquired the nationality of the father or mother according to the law on nationality of the father or mother..."

Nationality_Act_amended_until_2551.pdf

--

Maestro

P.S. Missing in my collection is the original Nationality Act of B.E. 2508 (1965) without amendments. If anybody has it, in Thai and/or English, I would appreciate receiving a copy by PM.

Edited April 29, 2010 by Maestro
Added postscript - Maestro

[skipvice]

Situation:

Wife is Thai by birth..

She is Australian by naturalisation..

She holds both Thai and australian passports.

I was present at a meeting last year in Sydney of Thais and guest speaker was the Thai Consulate-General.

When asked by member of the audience what to do in case similar to my wife's status when travelling to Thailand.

He said depart and arrive in Australia on Australian passport. Arrive and depart Thailand on Thai passport.

He was emphatic that this was the right thing to do.

In fact, my wife has followed this practice for over 9 years. Have never once been queried on arrival by Thai Immigration.

My wife has been doing the same when traveling to Thailand from the USA for the last 7 years with no problems.

[samran]

As you mention, some people have had problems entering Thailand with a brand new Thai passport issued abroad with no stamps in it, and in particular no visa from the country they are living in, and have been told by Immigration officers to enter using their foreign passport. This behaviour seems intended to imply that these people have no right to Thai nationality. Recent cases could well be influenced by this directive, although no one has reported that they have been threatened with revocation of nationality.

Not withstanding this directive, my take is that this has got more to do with a couple facts:

- Thai immigration want to stamp you in on the passport you originally left Thailand on, even if it has expired. This is so a passport has the entry stamp next to the exit stamp when the passport has been issued in Thailand. This has happened to me where I was stamped in on my old passport despite it being two years out of date.

- If they don't have the old passport, some immigration officers have no problem in just stamping you in (as happened to my sister who entered Thailand for the first time in 20 years), but some simply 'don't get it' or can't cope and insist that the traveller use their foreign passport to enter Thailand. A small talk to that persons supervisor always lets that person being stamped in on.

[Arkady]

P.S. Missing in my collection is the original Nationality Act of B.E. 2508 (1965) without amendments. If anybody has it, in Thai and/or English, I would appreciate receiving a copy by PM.

I would also like a copy, if any one has it. Maestro, you might be interested in the attached presentation in Thai which shows in bullet points what was changed in all the Nationality Acts and amendments from the year dot. I think I found it on the website of the Local Administration Dept which is responsible among other things for district offices.

History_Nationality_Laws1.ppt

Edited April 30, 2010 by Arkady

[Alwaysright]

P.S. Missing in my collection is the original Nationality Act of B.E. 2508 (1965) without amendments. If anybody has it, in Thai and/or English, I would appreciate receiving a copy by PM.

I would also like a copy, if any one has it. Maestro, you might be interested in the attached presentation in Thai which shows in bullet points what was changed in all the Nationality Acts and amendments from the year dot. I think I found it on the website of the Local Administration Dept which is responsible among other things for district offices.

Will they revoke Thaksin's passport?

[Arkady]

Will they revoke Thaksin's passport?

Thaksin's diplomatic and ordinary Thai passports have already been revoked by the Ministry of Foreign Affairs but he remains a Thai citizen. The MFA has the right to revoke or refuse to issue passports but this doesn't have any effect on citizenship. In this case revoking his ordinary passport was justified on the grounds that he is a convicted criminal who jumped bail to avoid a prison sentence.

Edited May 1, 2010 by Arkady

[Arkady]

Thanks Maestro for PMing me the original version of the 1965 Nationality Act without the 1972, 1992 and 2008 amendments.

One thing of historical interest that I notice is in Section 14. While Section 14 in the Act, as it stands today, applies mainly to people who have dual nationality as a result of having one Thai parent and one foreign parent, in the original 1965 Act it applied mainly to people who had Thai nationality as a result of being born in Thailand either to a foreign father and Thai mother or two foreign parents, whether on temporary or permanent visas. The wording of the original Section 14 was totally unambiguous in permitting dual nationality to these people after they have reached the age of majority as follows:

"Section 14. A person of Thai nationality, who has Thai nationality as a result of being born in the Kingdom of Thailand of an alien father and who may hold the nationality of his father according to the law on nationality of his father, or a person who acquires Thai nationality under Section 12 paragraph 2 is required, if he desires to renounce his Thai nationality, to make a declaration of his intention to renounce his Thai nationality within one year after his attaining the age of twenty years, according to such form and in the manner as prescribed in the Ministerial Regulations."

What is the significant difference? The wording, "if he desires to renounce his Thai nationality" is replaced in the current version of the Act with the wording, "if he desires to retain his other nationalilty" which was the ambiguous comprise reached in the 1992 Version 3 of the Act, following the short lived 1992 Version 2 which made it completely unambiguous that dual nationality was not permitted past the age of 21.

Edited May 1, 2010 by Arkady

[frenchfarangjomtien]

So the result is that they could do something but that they won't ?

[sawadeeken]

My Thai wife of 15 years has had U.S. passport the last ten years, she has used it every time to enter and leave Thailand with no question -- however has never stayed over 30 days......................

ALSO.... Her son came to the US at age 12.... When mom got citizenship he automatically got citizenship too (up to age 17) He met and married a Thai girl who immigratedto and became citizen of New Zezland and moved there permanently and has New Zealand citizenship -- So now he has 3 nationalities *** Getting ready for the "Giunness World Book of Records"*** (Trying to displace Taksin's record there)

When he turned !8 he was still required to register for the Thai Army, even though he lived permanently in the US at that time.....

EDITED: to add quip about Taksin

Edited May 2, 2010 by sawadeeken

[samran]

Went through immigration last night, flying down to Australia with no visa in my Thai passport. Went though as per normal.

[simon43]

This question over dual nationality does give me some cause for concern. It suggests that for a luk-kreung, they must choose a single nationality (Thai or their second nationality), when they are between the ages of 20 and 21. What about the many luk-kreung, (mine included), who live in Thailand, but who have the opportunity (by nature of their dual nationality), of unrestricted entry into the EU for study and work? It seems that they will be forced to decide between their country of birth and the benefits of holding an EU passport. That seems to me to be a very 'unfair' decision to force upon someone who, at aged 20, is probably in the middle of their college studies.

Simon

[Mario2008]

Immigration has a total different interpretation of the law than the Foreign Ministry. In case of a person being born with two nationalities there is no problem. The law states one should choose, but doesn't give any penalty if you don't choose. It doesn't have any consequences, so you can just kep having two nationalities. (Some countries even don't allow you to renounce their nationality).

It is other for persons who apply to become a Thai citizen. They shouldn't make use of their other nationality, that can be a reason to revoke Thai nationality. Many countries have the rule that if you become a citzen of their country by free will, you must give up your old nationality.

The Thai nationality law doesn't state that you have t give up your old nationality, just that you are not allowed to use it anymore.

[Arkady]

This question over dual nationality does give me some cause for concern. It suggests that for a luk-kreung, they must choose a single nationality (Thai or their second nationality), when they are between the ages of 20 and 21. What about the many luk-kreung, (mine included), who live in Thailand, but who have the opportunity (by nature of their dual nationality), of unrestricted entry into the EU for study and work? It seems that they will be forced to decide between their country of birth and the benefits of holding an EU passport. That seems to me to be a very 'unfair' decision to force upon someone who, at aged 20, is probably in the middle of their college studies.

Simon

I got the opportunity to get an informal opinion from some one at Special Branch on this. He was unaware of the Immigration directive and said they have not had any complaints about dual nationality referred to them by Immigration. He did feel that the specific situation referred to in the Immigration memo of people using different passports to enter and leave Thailand was a legitimate concern, as it makes it impossible for Immigration to track these people properly in their computer. (Note that the memo also goes on to discuss the case of foreigners using two passports of different foreign nationalities to enter and leave the country.) However, his personal opinion was that the view expressed in the memo that dual nationality for Thais was illegal is not supported by law or ministerial regulations and wasn't sure what would happen, if anything, if Immigration actually referred a case to them.

There is no doubt that the issue of dual nationality is one that comes up regularly at the Interior Ministry which clearly knows there are now many thousands of Thais with another nationality. Under the current minister attitudes seen to have hardened, as evidenced by the new requirement for applicants for naturalization to declare their intention to renounce their their existing nationalities and the ministry's new policy to inform embassies when nationality is granted. There is clearly a lobby that would like to amend the law to make dual nationality strictly illegal. Apparently there is a now a feeling that dual nationalilty can be used by criminals to evade Thai and other countries' laws by fleeing abroad and using different names and identities, no doubt influenced by Thaksin's globetrotting under various names and passports. It is possible that the law will indeed be changed for the worse at some point in the future. Mitigating against this possibility is that the current minister may not be in the job much longer and the existence of a another lobby that wants to keep things ambiguous, as they are now, or even make dual nationality specifically legal. Without doubt there are people with influence, who either enjoy dual nationality themselves or have wives or children that do, and don't want things to change. These people must have lobbied for an urgent change in the law when, for a brief period in 1992 from 19 February to 31 March, it was incontrovertibly illegally for luk kreung to hold a second nationalilty beyond their 21st birthdays and their Thai nationality could be autmotically revoked. Apparently this lobby still exists.

My conclusion is that, despite their sabre rattling and occasional abusive attitude, there is nothing that Immigration can do to those who have Thai nationality through birth to a Thai parent, whether they are luk kreung or Thais who have naturalized as something else. Those who are potentially vulnerable are those who have naturalized as Thais and those who are Thai as a result of being born in Thailand to foreign parents. The Act does appear to provide for revocation of these Thais' nationality in Sections 17 and 19, if they make use of another nationality or reside abroad for 5 years. Perhaps it could be argued that these sections could only be invoked, if they use their foreign nationality in Thailand. However, if we look at the history of the law to try to understand the intent behind these sections, this interpretation seems less hopeful. These revocation provisions seem, in fact, to have been aimed, not so much at naturalized Thais, but at the large number of Chinese who acquired Thai nationality through birth in Thailand to a Chinese father between 1913, the date of the first Nationalilty Act, and 1972 when Revolutionary Decree 377 put the kybosh on this route to Thai nationality. China under the Qing Dynasty and the Nationalist republics took a broad view of Chinese nationality and regarded all the overseas Chinese in Southeast Asia as a part of Greater China. Before the communist take over in China, this was probably not regarded as much of a threat in Thailand or by the colonial governments of the rest of Southeast Asia. However, with the creation of the People's Republic the existence of large numbers of Chinese citizens in Southeast Asia owing allegiance to a communist state suddenly did appear to be a major threat to Thailand and the emerging independent states in Southeast Asia and Thailand put a stop to immigration from China in about 1950. Three nationality acts were promulgated under the nationalist military governments of the early and mid 50s and, although I have been unable to get hold of these laws, I would bet that Sections 17 and 19 first appeared in one of these. (The laws banning of Chinese schools, the teaching of Chinese and Chinese language signage without a Thai translation also date from this era). Before the communist victory in China, Chinese migrants still viewed China as their homeland and there was a lot of movement between Thailand and China for business and study and some successful migrants moved back to China and maybe sent relatives to replace them. After the communist takeover, the Thai government viewed the Chinese who continued to visit their homeland with great suspicion and feared with some justification that the PRC would infilitrate the Thai Chinese community. This seems to be the origin of the provisions to revoke nationality in the case that some one makes use of another nationality or lives abroad for 5 years. I cannot find the details but I am aware that a generation of Thai Chinese students studying in China, whose fathers presumably didn't have Thai nationality, had their Thai nationalities revoked in the mid or late 50s, just because there were studying in China. They were also blacklisted by Immigration and not allowed to visit Thailand again until the late 80s. I remember reading about the tearful family reunions after 30 years in the Bkk Post. Even though the precedent is from the Cold War, there does, unfortunately, seem to be one for revocation of Thai nationality of naturalized Thais and those born in Thailand to foreign parents.

Although naturalized Thais and Thais born in Thailand to foreign parents are potenially more vulnerable to a hawkish drive by Immigration, I think that, despite the rhetoric, it is unlikely that anything much is really going to happen, while the current law remains in place. Obviously, all Thai dual nationals should do whatever they can to avoid showing their second passports to Immigration and should certainly never use their foreign passports to enter or leave Thailand under any circumstances. Most importantly, dual nationals should keep their ears to the ground in case there are changes to the law in future, for better or for worse.

Edited May 2, 2010 by Arkady

[elektrified]

My Thai wife of 15 years has had U.S. passport the last ten years, she has used it every time to enter and leave Thailand with no question -- however has never stayed over 30 days......................

ALSO.... Her son came to the US at age 12.... When mom got citizenship he automatically got citizenship too (up to age 17) He met and married a Thai girl who immigratedto and became citizen of New Zezland and moved there permanently and has New Zealand citizenship -- So now he has 3 nationalities *** Getting ready for the "Giunness World Book of Records"*** (Trying to displace Taksin's record there)

When he turned !8 he was still required to register for the Thai Army, even though he lived permanently in the US at that time.....

EDITED: to add quip about Taksin

Having 3 passports is not so unusual. Everyone on my mother's side of the family held 3 passports dating back to the 1940's.

[frankthetank]

I have been in and out of Thailand for 7 years now, not once have I had any problem!!

Wait a minute.......sorry no Thai passport just a Brit one!

[Maestro]

Thanks Maestro for PMing me the original version of the 1965 Nationality Act without the 1972, 1992 and 2008 amendments....

To give credit where credit is due, with the permission of GarryP I can reveal that it was he, GarryP, who was able to hunt down the original Thai version of the Nationality Act B.E. 2508 (1965) and sent me the links by PM.

Thank you, GarryP!

--

Maestro

[Arkady]

Thanks Maestro for PMing me the original version of the 1965 Nationality Act without the 1972, 1992 and 2008 amendments....

To give credit where credit is due, with the permission of GarryP I can reveal that it was he, GarryP, who was able to hunt down the original Thai version of the Nationality Act B.E. 2508 (1965) and sent me the links by PM.

Thank you, GarryP!

--

Maestro

Thanks Garry P. Does any one have any Nationality Acts earlier than 1965 for my collection,particularly the ones in the 50s?

[JimGant]

but some simply 'don't get it' or can't cope and insist that the traveller use their foreign passport to enter Thailand. A small talk to that persons supervisor always lets that person being stamped in on.

Just make sure your 'non-Thai' passport is tucked away in your bag, thus not allowing the Immigration officer the opportunity to stamp the wrong passport. When he insists on seeing your 'foreign' passport, that's when you insist on seeing his supervisor.

[clockworkorange]

As you mention, some people have had problems entering Thailand with a brand new Thai passport issued abroad with no stamps in it, and in particular no visa from the country they are living in, and have been told by Immigration officers to enter using their foreign passport. This behaviour seems intended to imply that these people have no right to Thai nationality. Recent cases could well be influenced by this directive, although no one has reported that they have been threatened with revocation of nationality.

Not withstanding this directive, my take is that this has got more to do with a couple facts:

- Thai immigration want to stamp you in on the passport you originally left Thailand on, even if it has expired. This is so a passport has the entry stamp next to the exit stamp when the passport has been issued in Thailand. This has happened to me where I was stamped in on my old passport despite it being two years out of date.

- If they don't have the old passport, some immigration officers have no problem in just stamping you in (as happened to my sister who entered Thailand for the first time in 20 years), but some simply 'don't get it' or can't cope and insist that the traveller use their foreign passport to enter Thailand. A small talk to that persons supervisor always lets that person being stamped in on.

Arkady, as always, has a detailed and well researched commentary into the opaque and ambiguous machinations of Thai law, and thanks to him for sharing such an interesting and detailed analysis on this forum.

As a naturalised Thai, who enters and leaves the kingdom on a Thai passport unfettered, never, ever using any other passport but my Thai one to enter and leave Thailand, I have not so far been subject to any harrassment at all. When I applied for my first Thai passport in 2007 at the passport office in Bang Na, they did ask to see my UK passport, but issued my Thai passport without comment.

That said, the PR / citizenship approval process hass has gound to aa halt of late, and there are new requirements that people applying for Thai nationality provide evidence that they are willing to renounce their original nationality. These observations coincide with a variety of other recent restrictions on foreigners rights. There does seem to be a tightening of the screws on foreigners rights in general of late, so restictions on dual nationals would seem to be in keeping with the general trend.

Keeping my fingers crossed that I will not have to make a decision one way or the other, and be asked to renounce my UK nationality at some point, but who knows? Like Arkady says, it is common practice elsewhere in the region, so it would come as no great surprise to see Thailand take a more well defined position on dual nationals.

Edited May 5, 2010 by clockworkorange

[Arkady]

That said, the PR / citizenship approval process hass has gound to aa halt of late, and there are new requirements that people applying for Thai nationality provide evidence that they are willing to renounce their original nationality. These observations coincide with a variety of other recent restrictions on foreigners rights. There does seem to be a tightening of the screws on foreigners rights in general of late, so restictions on dual nationals would seem to be in keeping with the general trend.

Keeping my fingers crossed that I will not have to make a decision one way or the other, and be asked to renounce my UK nationality at some point, but who knows? Like Arkady says, it is common practice elsewhere in the region, so it would come as no great surprise to see Thailand take a more well defined position on dual nationals.

The naturalization process is apparently still functioning, albeit at its normal snail's pace. Special Branch said that about 10 people were approved last year, which I think is about par for the course, and recently showed me a freshly printed naturalization certificate. The PR process has, indeed, effectively ground to a halt since 2006, although there are unconfirmed reports in Camerata's thread of approvals of a handful of 2006 and 2007 applicants.

Since you are British, you could, in the worst case, renounce and then re-register as a British citizen for a price but to exercise this right (once only) under the 1981 UK Nationality Act you would need to produce a letter from the relevant authorities to confirm that the renunciation was necessary in order to obtain or retain another nationality. The current situation, even for new naturalization applicants, would not appear to comply with this condition for re-registration, since they are asking for voluntary renunciation and the law doesn't specifically prohibit dual nationality. Without this evidence, re-registration would be up to the discretion of the Home Secretary who would normally require evidence that the applicant intends to settle permanently in the UK. The process of re-registration is not a fast track, even if the automatic right is accepted by the Home Office. Applicants still need to be vetted for good character and go in the queue with applicants for British naturalization. There is also a significant cost involved. Looking at it the other way round, former Thai citizens are entitled to permanent residence in Thailand. There is a complex thread somewhere in TV where some one said he tried to get Thai nationality through a Thai parent but was rejected by the Interior Ministry due to missing documents after a lengthy consideration but recently given PR instead on the grounds that they acknowledged he was a former Thai citizen due, I think, to the existence of an expired Thai passport. Like everything else this right to PR is, of course, discretionary and there is no guarantee that it would work for a former naturalized Thai. Hopefully you won't be forced to choice but those seem to be potential options in the worst case.

If Thailand changes anything, hopefully it will not use the Taiwanese model which must be the most unfair system in the world. Those born as Taiwanese are entitled to acquire as many additional nationalities as they wish and there is a very large community of Taiwanese-Americans living in the US. Foreigners wishing to naturalize as Taiwanese, on the other hand, are obliged to provide evidence that they have already renounced their original nationalities for their applications to be accepted. The process takes some time with no guarantee of success, during which time the applicants remain stateless. Several thousand Vietnamese mail order brides have fallen foul of this system after being persuaded by their Taiwanese husbands to apply for Taiwanese nationality. Their marriages broke up before they got their Taiwanese nationality, so they were no longer qualified for it. Vietnamese nationality is very difficult to recover and they have had to return to Vietnam as stateless aliens, unable to work legally, send their stateless children to school or get access to healthcare.

Edited May 10, 2010 by Arkady

[Arkady]

I just noticed that Pachimsawat has recently posted another scanned document in the Immigration webboard http://imm2.go.th/phpbb3/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=86 . This document is almost indecipherable but seems to be a letter from a senior official in the Interior Ministry to a senior official in the Ministry of Foreign Affairs dated 14 October 1970. In this letter, Interior Ministry appears to have asked the MFA to get Thai embassies overseas to collect names and addresses of Thais living overseas who have been naturalized as aliens The MFA was requested to send the names and addresses to the Interior Ministry, so that the ministry could arrange for the revocation of their Thai nationality in accordance with Section 5 of the 1965 Nationality Act which states that the acquisition, loss or recovery of Thai nationality takes effect on publication in the Royal Gazette.

The significance of this seems to be that it is one of the few examples of an interpretation of the Nationality Act vis a vis dual nationality from the Interior Ministry, albeit from 40 years ago and pre-dating the 1992 amendments which created a vast number of dual national luk kreung by permitting Thai nationality to be passed through the female line. Although the interpretation is negative, one can perhaps take consolation in the fact that he has not been able to dig up anything more recent and that the MFA seems to be ignoring this letter.

Edited May 10, 2010 by Arkady

[Arkady]

Below is a recent post from another thread: Dual Citizenship? - Thailand Forum Does this reflect a change in official interpretation by the Ministry of Foreign Affairs or just another ignorant Thai civil servant making up the rules as they go along?

Posted 2010-06-16 16:38

"A friend of ours recently obtained Australian citizenship. She was contacted by the Thai consulate in Brisbane today and informed that the rules have changed and she now has to choose Australian or Thai citizenship, she can't keep both."

[Maestro]

Vanessa-Mae to represent Thailand at 2014 Winter Olympics in Sochi

Famous violinist Vanessa-Mae

15:34 26/07/2010 © RIA Novosti

Famous violinist Vanessa-Mae plans to represent Thailand in downhill skiing at the 2014 Winter Olympics in Sochi, Russia, Thailand's Bangkok Post reported on Monday.

...

Vanessa-Mae is a British citizen, but has the right to Thai citizenship because her father, Vorapong Vanakorn, is a national of that country. The newspaper reported she currently has a Thai passport.

Vanessa-Mae wanted to represent Thailand in ski events at the 2002 Winter Olympics, but her dream of becoming a professional international skier did not materialize. Thai authorities at that time requested that she give up her UK passport in exchange for a Thai passport. Later bureaucratic barriers were overcome and Vanessa-Mae received her Thai passport on an exceptional basis and retained her British one as well.

...

Read more: en.rian.ru/sports/20100726/159953221.html

[Maestro]

The fact that the above story, if true, happened to a famous Thai dual national is disconcerting and indicates that it can happen to anybody in the same situation, ie any dual national with a Thai parent.

I have gone through Thailand's Nationality Act once more, for the umpteenth time, just now and still can find nothing that would give a Thai government official the right to ask a dual Thai national to renounce her other nationality.

A dual national can be reminded, but only at the age of 20 to 21, to fulfill his legal obligation "if he desires to retain his other nationality, to make a declaration of his intention to renounce his Thai nationality within one year after his attaining the age of 20 years, according to such forms and in the manner as prescribed in the Ministerial Regulations." The law mentions no penalty for not making this declaration. No mention of any requirement to renounce a non-Thai nationality.

The story of Vanessa Mae was published in various international newspapers over the past few days, plus in one English language paper in Thailand.

--

Maestro

Nationality Act amended until 2551 - EN.pdf