TAT Denies Move To Give Farangs Right To Own Land

[george]

BANGKOK: Reports that foreigners who buy the one-million-baht Thai Privilege Card will be able to own land have been denied by a senior official of the Tourism Authority of Thailand (TAT) parent company of the card issuer, the Thai Privilege Card Co Ltd (TPC).

The reports suggested that the government was moving to allow card-holders to buy and own up to 10 rai of land for a home.

But Sakol Thongkham, the Government Coordinator of the TAT, told the Gazette that the most a card-holder could expect would be that the TPC would hold the land on his or her behalf.

“It is not our aim to allow foreigners to own land,” K. Sakol said. “Indeed, we would be unhappy if people bought the card only because of the land issue.

“It is not possible for a foreigner’s name to be on a land deed – the owner must be Thai,” he explained. However, if requested by a card-holder, the TPC, as a Thai entity, will “own” the land on behalf of the foreigner and issue a certificate of “possession” to the foreigner.

“If the cardholder wants to transfer possession to another foreigner, then it must be on the same condition, that it is for a home only. But if the transfer is to a Thai then of course, the Thai person may own the land outright,” K Sakol added.

He offered a faint hope that, in future, card holders might receive some sort of ownership privileges. “We will try to find the best way for members to own land – not 100%, but will do as much as we can.

“We want to built on the confidence of members but if we can’t do this, we will revert to the old system of [holding land on behalf of card holders].

There is a level of comfort in this, he pointed out, “because [TPC] belongs to the government.”

But, he noted, “It is very difficult to change the law to allow foreigners to own the land outright. Our project doesn’t means that we want to sell land or the country,” K Sakol added.

He said that information about the land-holding facility had not been iposted on the TPC website at www.thailandelite.com because TPC is still waiting for the procedures to be put in place.

So far, the company – launched in October – has sold about 300 of the million-baht cards, most of them to people living overseas.

Benefits of membership include fast-track immigration services with automatic one-year permits to stay and special deals and discounts on hotels, restaurants, golf courses, spas, shops and transport, including private aircraft and helicopters.

For more information, call 02-6528325 or 02-6528304 during office hours or visit http://www.thailandelite.com

Source: Phuket Gazette

[Whale]

What they did not say is that the residence you build - which must have planning permission within a year and be constructed in 3 years must have a minimum value of 20 million Baht!

[thalenoi]

>So far, the company – launched in October – has sold about 300 of the million-baht cards, most of them to people living overseas.

Who are those 300 people ? just curious...

It seems we will never be allowed to own land in this country.

Very sad attitude indeed.

[dr_Pat_Pong]

That's only 20 times more than the card...no problem

[The_Moog]

Unrestricted ownership of land was never a perk allocated under the new TAT card.

Yes, there was a proviso that some intermediate might be used, or some sort of property company established as holding vehicle.

Where things have become muddied is in the press reporting (and I daresay spokesmen's comments).

I too was confused the first time I heard of the property scheme - it seemed inequitable and was expressed in an opaque way - but on inspection, it was clear what was meant.

[villario]

Yes, I guess the government of Thailand will never allow any foreigner to own any land in Thailand. What I wonder about, is why our countries (whether it be US, Canada, EU country) allow Thais to own land in our countries. They should change that as well for any country that discriminates as they do in Thailand.

F.e. Vancouver was literally run over by Hong Kong Chinese and do they have any rights there? Oh yes, ALL rights as any Canadian. So they took over the city!!

The same is true in Europe regarding people from all over the world.

Well, that's utter blindness of our governments, now isn't it?

I will NEVER buy a house or condo, they can stuff that where the sun never shines even in Thailand -. Until that discriminative law has been changed!!

Even worse, if you marry a Thai, your spouse is automatically derived of her birthright as well, she can then only own a maximum of some rais.

Pure discrimination, not befitting the 20th century! But then, protecting the interests of the Thainese (Chinese Thais) is of the outmost importance, obviously. They seem to own all the land that is worth owning!

greetings

Joe

[fred110]

Villario, you just gave the best reason Thailand does not allow foreigners to own land, they don't want to end up like Canada and the US (mainly Hawaii). I agree with them, and I wish the US would follow suite but that is too late.

[tomy]

they don't want to end up like Canada and the US (mainly Hawaii).

you tell me how does the Canada and U.S end up? i don't see anything wrong with it, we're not any poorer, people that own property live there and pay tax there, and the governemnt make money, as far as i see it, its all good.

talking about hawaii, AHH! i love that place, oahu. the thing you don't know about hawaii is that, all the foreign that buy land in hawaii now they can't sell it, they loose million and million of their investment, and still they have to pay tax, over all the government still make money.

[marquess]

I have never know anyone to be able to take land out of a country, but I suppose the Thai government think otherwise. Personally speaking if I were fortunate enough to have a substantial amount of money, I would not invest a single Baht of it here (ie. Land, property or business)

[ThaiAdventure]

I have never know anyone to be able to take land out of a country, but I suppose the Thai government think otherwise. Personally speaking if I were fortunate enough to have a substantial amount of money, I would not invest a single Baht of it here (ie. Land, property or business)

I would.

I'd buy the lot and charge Thais twice as much as farang to rent it!

The worm turns!

[bernard]

what if I build a house on land that my Thai wife owns. Can I own the house?

[taxexile]

what if I build a house on land that my Thai wife owns. Can I own the house?

you'd better ask your wife !

[marquess]

what if I build a house on land that my Thai wife owns. Can I own the house?

NO! The only way a foreigner can own a house is if he forms a Thai registered company, and purchases sthe house in the company name, or by becoming a resident. Finally I believe that you can inherit property here as well.

[NedKelly]

Well I'll add my bit for what it's worth. Australia's policy of multi-culturalism has of course changed the socio-demographic face of the country. It is a necessity for the genetic diversity of future populations. However, the contentious issue is obviously the way that the Aussie government has allowed a free and often rampant opportunity for anyone with the cash, to go ther and buy up real estate. the result is the that ordinary working class Aussies have often been left behind in the propery market. You hear the horror stories like the ones about car loads of Japanese going around buying up houses without even going inside to look at them or even negotiating the price. My friends father was a real estate business man on the northern beaches of Sydney and he personally experience this type of business with Japanese business men. This is only one story, there are others, but the point is that the Thai government is trying to protect Thai people. Can u imagine the situation we were all able to purchase land here. The value would shoot up overnight and would make our plight even more difficult. In a way it is to our benefit to have things the way it is now as prices are low. Maybe we just have to forfiet any profit making on land but use our business skills to make money from the use of the land, so that in future we will have enough money to do what we want and to also get the visa we want. One idea which is not completely stupid is for someone to set up an expat bank or company to assist people to buy their land. If the elite card corporation can 'hold' land for rich farang card holders then there is no reason anotehr company cannot do the same thing.

[ThaiAdventure]

Finally I believe that you can inherit property here as well.

If thats true, perhaps there will be more Thail g/f suicides in Pattaya!

[mrvietnam2001]

Can u imagine the situation we were all able to purchase land here. The value would shoot up overnight and would make our plight even more difficult. In a way it is to our benefit to have things the way it is now as prices are low. thing.

It's already way way overpriced considering the lack of property rights. Ocean view land on samui, phuket is already higher than in many parts of the US and you "own it" ini the US. Beach land in Costa Rica, Colombia, parts of the British Virgin Islands are a much better buy and that's high in comparison to where it was 10 years ago. ( alas, no Asian women though)

Unless you're specifically referring to locations where the infrastructure is virtually non existent.....( and STILL you can't own it so it's a mute point)

A friend of mine just bought an entire island in the Philippines two weeks ago for 80K US. ( near Palawan) No infrastructure. 50 Year lease. Legally able to extend it. 2 small beaches. Even if he has to invest 100K on desal, satellite, etc etc ( out of my realm of knowledge), it seems pretty cheap in comparison to los with the same or similar location and views doesn't it?

Say you like it and are willing to put up with the visa regs etc, but don't claim it's cheap, or that the lack of property rights are a good thing.

Your points fall way short.

Mr Vietnam

[wuggiman]

IMO the whole farang not being able to own land issue(without special company formation), is a joke. It hinders another source of income for the Thai government, as well as an expanded growth of economics for the general Thai population.

I cannot see any real merit to the law, even from their point off view. It seems Thailand is the exception to Global market economy. For profit? cant see where the profit is, perhaps on a very short term basis, but not in the long run.

I think it is just another sign off narrowminded vision, which may benifit the few rather than the mayority and that is what will keep Thailand from becoming a real economic power by itself.

All Industrial Western countries, set criterias (some harder than others), but once fullfilled, you can buy and set up there. What makes Thailand so special?

[Guest ka1234]

what if I build a house on land that my Thai wife owns. Can I own the house?

Yes. Some land lease paperwork is required, but a farang _can_ own a house but not the land it is built upon.

[Guest ka1234]

Even worse, if you marry a Thai, your spouse is automatically derived of her birthright as well, she can then only own a maximum of some rais.

Incorrect. It used to be that a Thai woman married to a farang lost certain rights, land ownership included (while Thai men married to farang women did not lose any rights).

Not anymore. But if a thai woman married to a farang want to register a land title, she must prove to the land dept that it was purchased for her own money and the farang husband must sign a document where he forfeits any claims to the land etc etc. Just a bit of extra paperwork, took us less than 30 min in the land dept office.

[thalenoi]

Nevertheless thousands of houses have been built with farang money. Not a Win/Win situation for both parties. The farang is the looser.

Thank you vely mut.

[The_Moog]

Yet if you're a mining company with concessions, you can literally dig bits of the country up and ship them abroad. Yet you can't buy the land, put a house on it and let it sit there.*

Bonkers.

Moog

* Especially in Indonesia, where there's more things to dig up and similar property laws apply.

[sabaijai]

When I ask my Thai friends if they don't think it seems unfair that a Thai can buy land in the US or Canada, but Americans & Canadians and other foreigners can't buy land here in Thailand, they say "that's because Thailand is a small country. There's lots more land available in the US and Canada." I can't convince them to see it any other way and have stopped trying.

By the way, most of the Elite cards purchased so far have gone to Taiwan and Hong Kong Chinese, plus a sprinkling of Japanese. Check the special Elite card passport lines at Don Muang -- I've only seen Asians standing in line.

So the Thaivisa.com headline that read "Too many privileges for farangs in Thailand" with reference to the Elite card doesn't really apply to the quoted BKK Post article, which talked about foreigners in general, not farang.

It's funny, too, how some Thai officials are ignorant of the actual law as applied to Elite holders. Foreigners don't end up owning the land at all, it's owned by TPC, the company issuing the Elite cards. And the restrictions are so numerous as to make this hardly a privilege at all.

I think most of the Asians buying the card are ranking executives who travel here frequently and just want some VIP treatment. Especially the lifetime greens fees. The land aspect has been blown way out of proportion.

[Axel]

To play golf in Japan, Taiwan or Hong Kong is expensive. In comparision Thailand is cheap. If you can save on green fees on top of this, fine.

I do not play golf, what other privileges can I get? The promise of land-buying was already cancelled. Perhaps the MFA will announce one day any provileges for immigration procedures have not been discussed with them?

Wait and see, however, I only believe all this VIP-treatment, when it's clear what you really can get. And than I still want to do a calculation on return of this 1 million-Baht 'investment'.

[tomy]

When I ask my Thai friends if they don't think it seems unfair that a Thai can buy land in the US or Canada, but Americans & Canadians and other foreigners can't buy land here in Thailand, they say "that's because Thailand is a small country. There's lots more land available in the US and Canada." I can't convince them to see it any other way and have stopped trying.

most of them never travel anywhere furthur than the local supermaket, the only concept they understand is we are thai, and then we are thai some more.

[taxexile]

tomy,sunday 10.41,quote:

Don't look at me, i aint know nothing

[sabaijai]

Axel, one more 'privilege' is a 5-year, multiple-entry visa, as I understand it.