Bangkok: Central World Shopping Mall Destroyed By Fire

[lannarebirth]

Hypothetical question. Assuming an election was held in the next few weeks, and it was actually free and fair without vote buying, without intimidation, and with national campaigning for everyone (I know a total pipe dream!) what do you reckon the result would be? (Taking into the account the fresh images of Bangkok burning.)

My guess --

Thai Democrats 55 percent

Puke Thai 35 percent

Other parties 10 percent

My guess:

Dems: 45%

PT: 30%

Other: 30%

[lemon123]

The mistake was done by the government very early on. There is simply no excuse for allowing these low-lifes hijacking a whole business district which puts thousands out of work and has now resulted in hundreds of millions of $ in damages! Not even for a day - let alone 2 MONTHS! No legal action being taken even after grenades were thrown! This is ridicoulous. Thais are unable to take responsibilty. Pissit just hoped the problem would go away. Of course once they were entrenched this was utopic but why leave them there for 2 months? Every 5 year would make a better ruler

Go to ask the initiator who use the lucky "Yellow" Shirt to give the stupid idea to those low-lifes people.. THIS is A CYCLE>>>

[lilkitty]

I still can't believe some posters are still blaming the government for this disaster.

Bangkok was a pretty happy and normal place before the reds came and screwed everything up until the end of March.

All they had to do was go home and wait six months for new elections. But no, they just wanted to screw up the place.

Instead of arson or burning places up with their free time because of envy, jealousy or anger why don't these people actually try and get a job and work like the remaining millions of Bangkokians.

I think its some kind of P.R OR trolling as most of these people have joined thai visa in the last few days either that or Glenn Beck is reporting the story on fox news.

You may be correct about some Trolling (on each side, I'd wager).

But don't assume that all those who disagree with your opinions (because that's all they are.....opinions) are Trolls or even, dare I say it, incorrect.

Some of us believe ourselves capable of looking at a situation, weighing up the evidence and then reaching something approaching a conclusion based upon our observations.

I'm not Thai (although I do have an interest in the welfare of Thailand - as do many or most of we who post here), but I can still have an opinion (which may be correct or otherwise). My opinion is that democracy = an elected Government (an elected leader would be nice, too).

If the current Thai Government really believe themselves to be legitimate, why not prove it and ask the people to democratically elect them?

Yesterday's protester is often tomorrow's terrorist if he is not negotiated with.

The Thai Government risk making matters far, far worse (there goes my opinion again) by their rubbish handling of this situation.

100,000 red-shirted protesters, out in the open, are easier to deal (and negotiate) with than 100 terrorists planting bombs, shooting members of authority and performing other acts aimed at crippling or, at least, denting the country's economy.

You would have assumed the Thai PM, an English born and bred chap, educated at Oxbridge would have been capable of holding a conversation now, wouldn't you?

Well, his reason for not calling immediate election was that chaos would erupt. Oh wait, we have that now anyways. Doh!!!!

[dtarasin]

The good people of Thailand do not deserve the viciousness of Thaksin's red horde. May they all rot.

I know CenterWorld well, and I can understand why it was burned.

The people of Thailand who suffer and then take action are not terrorists.

The violence, the injuries, and the deaths are terrible for the Thai people. But the red shirts are not terrorists. They are citizens who are being marginalized.

The government had many opportunities to diffuse the situation and it took the wrong action every time. The government is killing the Thai people. Now the red shirts are to blame??? I don't think so.

The Capitalists who built CenterWorld will not be suffering because CenterWorld has burned. They will build a new monument to consumerism and continue to benefit from their exploitation ...

Tom

OK. Posts like this really f_ucking piss me off.

"The people of Thailand who suffer and then take action are not terrorists."

Oh really? So I guess the people whose lives and jobs have been completely ruined by this two month long "protest" and subsequent burning of their city should take the law into their own hands and go to the villages of these red-shirts and burn that s_hit down, too?

"The government had many opportunities to diffuse the situation and it took the wrong action every time. The government is killing the Thai people. Now the red shirts are to blame??? I don't think so."

OH F-UCK YOU. The government has repeatedly tried to negotiate and offer solutions to this crisis including a roadmap for peace that called for new elections in November. But NOOOO... red shirt mongrels decided to go for the whole hog. Now please, pray tell, has the reds EVER offered anything constructive to the discussion table other than "WAAHHHHh WE'RE OPPRESSED LIFE'S NOT FAIR FOR US".

Wake up call, you morons. Life's not fair for EVERYONE. In the US, 10% of the population own 80% of the country's wealth. You don't see farmers from Tennessee and Alabama storming DC with their militias and burning it to the ground. Instead they voice their complaints through the electoral process, something vital to every democracy. Unfortunately the red shirts are too f_ucking busy drinking their f_ucking Sangsoms and gambling their finances away to actually do some research into who they should elect to best represent their interests, and instead believe everything their village idiot says as long as he gives them 500 baht to spend on more f_ucking sangsom and somtam.

Notice I am not blaming the red shirt leaders. You know why? Because when you see an opportunity to lead sheep to the wolves while making a few bucks in the process, you do it. It's the evils of capitalism. Ironically, it's also the type of "elite" injustice you all are so against.

Also, what I just said goes double for you yellow shirt morons! Screw you for setting a bad precedent.

This is what i call a MAJOR Bitchy statement from a person

I have to watch my city burn from halfway around the world and it seems there's nothing anyone can do about it. Bitchy is an understatement.

Edited May 19, 2010 by dtarasin

[jonclark]

Oh really? So I guess the people whose lives and jobs have been completely ruined by this two month long "protest" and subsequent burning of their city should take the law into their own hands and go to the villages of these red-shirts and burn that s_hit down, too?

It appears you and my wife are reading from the same playbook.. she is disgusted right now with the "thai" people that did this.. she can't understand how anybody for ONE second that claims to respect the King would ever even consider doing something like is happening in BKK right now. She wondered aloud what would happen if a group of people headed up to KK or Bumfuc_k Nakon to do the same how things would go. Of course she caught herself and said what am I thinking those crazy buggers would shoot us all on site just for being born in BKK... sad sad sad... more so that its so close to the truth for some of these thugs

Indeed my wife mirrors the sentiments of your wife as well - How can people who claim to love Thailand and the King do these things

[SebD]

Would that be the same Central World (that used to be called The World Trades Center) which, when I afforded it my one and only disappointed visit, had become scruffy, old, tired and with half of the retail outlets empty and unlettable because so many newer, more prestigious shopping malls have been developed since it waved bye-bye to it's glory-days?

Just a thought

...Mis-informed thought. It was recently renovated, at great expense, and is (was) a very pleasant mall to stroll in. Very nice place indeed.

As i said, I only went there the once (it was a god-awful miserable place, with a stench of pending failure about it).

Pity I never knew it had been revamped, or I would have taken a look-see for myself.

Oh well, it must be the Red-Shirts who torched it then.............................................Or someone else with an interest, perhaps .

Only one thing's for sure and that is that we'll never know for definite.

[My Friend Same]

I think the reds are basically peacefull, but Abhisit always changes his mind saying I will desolve parliament and organise elections, the putting all this on hold!

How can anyone trust him?

I would get violent too

Abhisit has to resign if he wants peace back in Thailand!

when I read this post only one word comes to mind

JACKASS

[indothai]

Not sure if this has been posted

http://vimeo.com/11867448

The humanity... I wonder how many jobs will be lost as a result of this stupidity.

The impact will be great and far reaching.

I feel for the employees who just lost their jobs... I just can't imagine what I'll do if it was me.

[Grey11]

I completely agree with that. I remember when the protests was at the bridge, not yet at Rajprasong. The government wanted the bridge cleared and ordered the protesters to move elsewhere. Then they moved to Rajprasong. When they got tired of that, instead of negotiating and keeping it at Rajprasong, they started pushing them out of Rajprasong and they ended up spreading all over the city. I believe a UN official compared it to squeezing a water balloon.

Something must have happened last night, though. The Democrat Senators that were negotiating with the red shirts seemed to come in kind of an agreement and there was even answer from Abhisit that they would hold tri-party (government, senators, red shirts) talks on Wednesday. Then however, on Wednesday morning, the government started with the crackdown.

I'm sure that nearly every stage of what has happened has been mishandled. And especially last night, when a breakthrough seemed so near and negotiations almost resuming ...the crackdown was launched. And now the city is burning. This didn't need to happen. I would have liked to see all sides give peace another chance.

We need A LOT MORE people thinking in this kind of pragmatic manner now. But sadly all I hear is "THAT's WHAT THEY WANTED ALL ALONG!" CRUSH THE RED VERMINS!". If we go at it that way, there will be civil war. We were warned this would be the result of a violent crackdown, and yet goverment and red leaders alike steadily worked towards it. Clinging to empty principles and blown up egos on both sides, made most negotiations look like kindergarten.

To make things worse the government totally miscalculated the whole affair right from the start, constanly underestimating the reds while overestimating their own strength (a game the red are also really good at). They knew seizing his assets would provoke a criminal egomaniac like Thaksin to push for another red shirt protest, but they thought it could be dispersed of relatively easy like a year before. So they made a spectacle out of it, applauding themselves daily for finally showing their archenemy that they had the upper hand. They could have let the court case linger, just keeping the money forzen, at least until the next elections would have given them a clear mandate. But they didn't and instead gave the radical reds all the ingredients they needed to exploit rurals Thailand's feelings of political disenfranchisement and turn a big part of the movement into a violent mob, that now took on a life of its own. Concerning Central World and several government buildings in the provinces one should ask why it they were not better protected, even though new threats to do exactly what we see today were issued nearly every day of the week. Once again it seems the government and many hardliners that thought military force alone could end this crisis underestimated the impact the crackdown would have. Now the warnings we hear are of a possible Civil War. And again they are overtoned by cries for military force, unrestricted killings and draconic punishments to give all anti-reds a sense of revenge.

This is a crossroads for Thailand. One path leads to peace achieved through a pragmatic policy of real reconciliation that stops the spiral of hate. But the more likely possibility is indeed Civil War, and then it won't matter anymore who's had the moral highground today.

Any other country in the world would have used military force to clear these terrorists out one week at the latest. That includes all democracies, Socialist & Communist countries. The dictatorships & Communist governments might have allowed the terrorists two days to disperse. The government tried to negotiate with people (Red Shirts) who didn't want to negotiate. They came to Bangkok to overthrow the government by any means possible. For more than two months the PM tried to negotiate with them, tried to avoid bloodshed. But you can't negotiate with thugs, terrorists, especially those who are paid mercenaries.

I think it was a near miracle that the government got thousands of women & children out of the Red Shirt camps without any of them dying today. It looks as though the burning of certain buildings belonging to the "yellow Shirts" by Thaksin's army was all planned. We will know the real story when the Red Shirt leaders begin to sing. There are Seh Daeng's Black Shirts that were captured they will also sing. Twenty-30 years in prison or tell who your financiers were and we can give you a mere two years in prison. Many of the women in the Red Shirt camps were afraid to leave. They were told that the soldiers would kill them. That they weren't really Thai soldiers. That they might be harmed if they took the government's buses back to Isaan. Those who actually believe in the Red Shirts - and I think many on TV do not but are just plain revolutionaries that enjoy any band of the "poor/peasants" who try to overthrow a government - will soon know the real truth. Not that it matters to many of the Red Shirt apologists. Too many people have been taken into custody that some will not break and squeal like a pig. Thaksin WILL be implicated and the whole world will know how one man orchestrated an attempt to overthrow a sovereign government by force. Thaksin will be an international pariah and unwelcome in any civilised country and just may be branded a terrorist and eventually captured and imprisoned in Thailand.

R

[toenail]

Does anyone know how the fire was set? Did a couple Red thugs go in with a liter of gas , or was it a whole mob of people. I imagine most buildings in BKK are easy to crash and trash since the guards would run away.

[robint]

This stinks of an insurance scam to me, buit then i have gone troppo

[lilkitty]

I'm kind of wondering why the fire extinguishers in Central World didn't work. Possibly because the government turned off the water?

[My Friend Same]

Would that be the same Central World (that used to be called The World Trades Center) which, when I afforded it my one and only disappointed visit, had become scruffy, old, tired and with half of the retail outlets empty and unlettable because so many newer, more prestigious shopping malls have been developed since it waved bye-bye to it's glory-days?

Just a thought

...Mis-informed thought. It was recently renovated, at great expense, and is (was) a very pleasant mall to stroll in. Very nice place indeed.

As i said, I only went there the once (it was a god-awful miserable place, with a stench of pending failure about it).

Pity I never knew it had been revamped, or I would have taken a look-see for myself.

Oh well, it must be the Red-Shirts who torched it then.............................................Or someone else with an interest, perhaps .

Only one thing's for sure and that is that we'll never know for definite.

NO NO, youre mistake, that stench was when the wind blew your way

[mdechgan]

Any updates?

Is it still on fire?

[Democrat]

Oh really? So I guess the people whose lives and jobs have been completely ruined by this two month long "protest" and subsequent burning of their city should take the law into their own hands and go to the villages of these red-shirts and burn that s_hit down, too?

It appears you and my wife are reading from the same playbook.. she is disgusted right now with the "thai" people that did this.. she can't understand how anybody for ONE second that claims to respect the King would ever even consider doing something like is happening in BKK right now. She wondered aloud what would happen if a group of people headed up to KK or Bumfuc_k Nakon to do the same how things would go. Of course she caught herself and said what am I thinking those crazy buggers would shoot us all on site just for being born in BKK... sad sad sad... more so that its so close to the truth for some of these thugs

I couldn't agree more this has got out of hand and there is no reason for the govt or anyone to kill people, and no reason to loot and burn buildings. but if I shot your brother, sister, wife husband, daughter, son you would retaliate, I would have to run for my life. I am not condoning it and it should stop, but I can understand they are Angry. So I guess the previous posters are angry at the people that caused this peacefull protest to turn into the shambles it is today. Well done whoever ordered army, rifles, armoured cars, tanks, anti-aircraft guns etc.

[whybother]

Would that be the same Central World (that used to be called The World Trades Center) which, when I afforded it my one and only disappointed visit, had become scruffy, old, tired and with half of the retail outlets empty and unlettable because so many newer, more prestigious shopping malls have been developed since it waved bye-bye to it's glory-days?

Just a thought

...Mis-informed thought. It was recently renovated, at great expense, and is (was) a very pleasant mall to stroll in. Very nice place indeed.

As i said, I only went there the once (it was a god-awful miserable place, with a stench of pending failure about it).

Pity I never knew it had been revamped, or I would have taken a look-see for myself.

Oh well, it must be the Red-Shirts who torched it then.............................................Or someone else with an interest, perhaps .

Only one thing's for sure and that is that we'll never know for definite.

I don't imagine there were a lot of other people around to do it. We will never know the particular red shirt that did it, but IMO we can be pretty certain it was a red shirt that did it.

Edited May 19, 2010 by whybother

[dttk0009]

I'm kind of wondering why the fire extinguishers in Central World didn't work. Possibly because the government turned off the water?

Probably because armed red shirts were preventing firefighters from getting there before the fire spread, as has been reported, but you'll say ANYTHING to relay the blame onto someone else. Please stop posting. This isn't your city. Let us who grew up here mourn the loss of what is our home to a bunch of drugged up terrorists on a revenge spree. What exactly are you trying to achieve with your posts? You want to enrage posters? Be controversial? Just fuc_k off already.

[erikr_]

Not sure if this has been posted

http://vimeo.com/11867448

The humanity... I wonder how many jobs will be lost as a result of this stupidity.

The impact will be great and far reaching.

I feel for the employees who just lost their jobs... I just can't imagine what I'll do if it was me.

There are always more employees then customers in the building anyway. Gayson is even worse, handfull of customers a day.

Those shops are not owned by little people, all big chains and franchises.

So it really is not a miss for the ordinary thai.

I liked to sit on the square in front of it though with the water and have a drink.

What happened is not right, but to blame it on 40% of the population? It is the work from a handfull of thugs not defined by any political coloring but by alcohol and money.

[xenomorph]

Even more Central World video footage on vandalism:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7JsTmSCVqNQ

[cdnverbalkint]

Everyone also know that they accept it but they just wanna the vice Pm to be investigated.. if majority of your friends die.. will you just stay there and do nothing? So.. if it necessary to kill them when they ask for investigation?? Think properly ..

dam_n trolls they are everywhere tonight...

1. They asked for the Vice PM to be charged and make bail... not possible due to his position and the agency handling the case, LEARN before you post.

2. They did not ask for this until AFTER the moderates had said they liked the roadmap as is... only their "dear leader" did not like it

3. Roughly 60 (way too many I agree) died, hardly the majority of the protesters.

4. I can assure you that any normal somewhat educated and civilized human being would NOT lay waste to an entire city (country?) if people I was with where killed in the course of an ILLEGAL insurgency.

5. You should heed your own advice and learn to think "properly" before you post any more rubbish.. thanks

[SomTumTiger]

Tweets from the Nation that Central World might be collapsing.

[bendejo]

I'm kind of wondering why the fire extinguishers in Central World didn't work. Possibly because the government turned off the water?

good point

[erikr_]

I'm kind of wondering why the fire extinguishers in Central World didn't work. Possibly because the government turned off the water?

Probably because armed red shirts were preventing firefighters from getting there before the fire spread, as has been reported, but you'll say ANYTHING to relay the blame onto someone else. Please stop posting. This isn't your city. Let us who grew up here mourn the loss of what is our home to a bunch of drugged up terrorists on a revenge spree. What exactly are you trying to achieve with your posts? You want to enrage posters? Be controversial? Just fuc_k off already.

It is not about the blame. Besides it is none of ours city. Also not yours, even when you live in it. Try being a bit more pragmatic and rational

the bold part really describes what this is though. A bunch of, not everyone that did wear a red shirt

Sad sad situation

[indothai]

Based on news release by the military, Central World fire is still on going. 10:41pm.

[roykeanz]

I am sure that those behind this preplanned city-wide arson

are not concerned about the short-arm of the law.

They perhaps should be concerned about crossing Thai-Chinese business interests.

A list from Wednesday's SITREP

Details of Fires in Bangkok as Red-shirt Renegades Lashed out

A number of fires and chaotic incidents broke out in Bangkok after the red-shirt core leaders have called off the red-shirt protest earlier today. The firefighting department has been able to put the fire under control at some areas but others remain unreachable and unsafe for firemen to entire. These areas include;

1. Siam Square and Paragon: firefighters are unable to enter the area, red-shirt protesters are armed and are shooting at will

2. Centara Grand: fire has been put out

3. Stock Exchange of Thailand office: firemen unable to enter the area

4. Mahachon Plaza (entrance of Wireless Rd-Ploenchit Rd): firemen also unable to approach the area

5. Krung Thai and Bangkok Bank (Asoke Branch)

6. Narcotics Control Board

7. Bangkok Bank (Din Daeng): fire under control

8. Maleenont Building: firemen unable to enter the area

9. Bangkok Bank and Lotus Rama 4: firemen unable to get in

10. EGAT Klongtoey: fire under control

11. Central World: currently being put out by firefighters

12. Bangkok Bank (Victory Monument)

Plus, of course, the various other attacks on Banks not listed here - as well as a slew of Bank ATMs - plus the attacks on Thai Channel 3 plus The Nation and The BKK Post - not to mention the insidious broad threat to media (well, perhaps BBC and CNN deserve it for their ridiculous reporting of events!! )

Disguised as acts of random hooliganism. All well planned in advance. And carefully overseen.

All being attacks on entities believed by Thacky to be, or represent, his enemies.

The Government's clampdown yesterday on Thacky's/Cronies' funding sources (why they didn't do that months ago is beyond me!) really, really hurt!! 

Let's hope that on/off Terrorism Arrest Warrant for Thacky gets fully processed without delay. Plus the evil hag who's his so-called "ex-wife" and the prime terrorist loot distributor.

And, of course, too hope that swift and proper justice is brought to bear upon the 'Red' terrorist thugs who carried out these dastardly dees, plus their insidious 'Red' overseers! 

Edited May 19, 2010 by roykeanz

[cdnverbalkint]

I'm kind of wondering why the fire extinguishers in Central World didn't work. Possibly because the government turned off the water?

Probably because armed red shirts were preventing firefighters from getting there before the fire spread, as has been reported, but you'll say ANYTHING to relay the blame onto someone else. Please stop posting. This isn't your city. Let us who grew up here mourn the loss of what is our home to a bunch of drugged up terrorists on a revenge spree. What exactly are you trying to achieve with your posts? You want to enrage posters? Be controversial? Just fuc_k off already.

Thanks for saving me the trouble of posting the same msg.. that is one kitty that should be an outside cat... and away from the computer... utter nonsense filled posts every time.

[Rucharee]

I just hope they imprison as many of the savage animals as possible for a long long time. I'm still hoping for Issan to be made into a separate country so that animals can live with animals.

This is very rude. People is people. People is not animals.

[ballpoint]

The reds never actually asked for an election. They asked for dissolution which by its very nature causes a power vacuum.

Inquiring minds may want to think about what wouldhave occured in that power vacuum.

The reds never actually asked for anything. They demanded, demanded, demanded. They had three days of negotiations, then demanded that their demands be met before they'd "negotiate" further. They initially accepted the road map and November elections, then demanded that Suthep turned himself in to the police. He did so. They demanded he turn himself in to some other police, and the government quite rightly withdrew its proposal. They demanded that the army cease fire and withdraw, despite the army being away from the main protest site and it was the reds' own thugs that were coming out to attack it. And despite all these demands, not once did they ever tell us just what they ultimately wanted. Sure, they demanded dissolution of parliament, but then what? They demanded a change to the system, but how? By voting in the same old corrupt PTP mob? Chalerm and Co? The same miserable bunch of thieving, murdering rogues who, by decades of support for the rice barons, the joke education system and the "do what you like if you're rich" mentality, are directly responsible for the poor being in the position they're in?

No, the current protests and thuggery began when Thaksin had over half his frozen assets confiscated, it ended for the leaders when he, and his family and associates, had their monetary transactions frozen, although the glut of new pro Thaksin members here suggests he's found a new way to "invest" his money, now he no longer has to pay off the protestors. The assurances by his brother, and by Seh Daeng, that it would all be over if he was pardoned. How much more evidence is required?

The current burning and looting is an aftershock. Hundreds of young men, many who are, from video evidence, plainly drugged up and/or drunk, who have been wound up by the constant hate speech coming from the stage, and broadcast around the country, are running riot. It has happened in all major riots in the west too, a group of violence lovers who seize the temporary lapse in law and order to go on the rampage. They'll be rounded up and dealt with over the next weeks, if not days. Sorry for bursting the bubbles of all those gleefully posting here on the fall of the country, the start of the civil war, the beginning of the end. You're out of luck boys, go find another country to tear apart. But then again, anyone celebrating the senseless, willfull destruction of property and people livelihoods doesn't really warrant having any time spent on them, so, other than saying my own thoughts on hearing of the destruction of Central World, and all the other places burning tonight, are simply ones of immense sadness, that's enough.

[SomTumTiger]

I just hope they imprison as many of the savage animals as possible for a long long time. I'm still hoping for Issan to be made into a separate country so that animals can live with animals.

This is very rude. People is people. People is not animals.

People who kill other people, and burn and destroy - have lost their rights to be labeled - human.

[asiawatcher]

I hope that the owners of this Mall sue the finacial backers of the Red Shirts for every penny they have!

They won't sue but they will exact revenge.... rest assured.