Honda Phantom

[billd766]

I have read in a couple of places that I cannot find at the moment that the cam chain tensioner on the Honda Phantom TA 200 sometimes fails around 25,000 km.

Has anyone had this happen to them?

Also has anyone had the tensioner replaced, if so where was it done and what was the cost roughly.

I live right out in the country and while my local Honda dealer and the guys there are very good if they have the parts (Mai mee usually)I am not sure if I would be happy to let them loose on my bike to do that.

Cheers

[BigBikeBKK]

Your signature: "Of course we can fix it. We are retired engineers"

Why don't you replace it yourself?

Ride On!

Tony

[billd766]

Your signature: "Of course we can fix it. We are retired engineers"

Why don't you replace it yourself?

Ride On!

Tony

Because engineers come in many shapes and sizes.

I have never worked on a motorcycle and the last time I stripped and rebuilt a car engine was in the early 80's when I was about 40 or so.

However if you want me to build a mobile telephone network across a country that is in my skill set.

[Richard-BKK]

The cam chain tensioner problem is well known by Honda dealers, probably you need to visit the main Honda dealer in your area.

[billd766]

The cam chain tensioner problem is well known by Honda dealers, probably you need to visit the main Honda dealer in your area.

Thanks Richard

I will go into the main dealers in Khampaeng Phet sometime next week.

My bike has done a little short of 20,000 km so far and runs very well.

[12DrinkMore]

Yep, replace this little fecker regularly every 25k kms (unless they now have a more reliable device, I would do it every 15,000 kms) otherwise the shit hits the fan and the pistons hit the valves, and that is the start of all your troubles and expenses.

I have been through that, and it is somewhere you do not want to go. The garage will refuse to replace the whole engine and it has to be rebuilt bit by bit, so you are relying on the local Somchai to get it right. As a result of various Somchais' expertise I had a series of engine failures leaving me motionless in many places.

I sold the bike.

But I must admit I had some fun during the 60,000 kms it gave me.

Edited June 14, 2010 by 12DrinkMore

[billd766]

Yep, replace this little fecker regularly every 25k kms (unless they now have a more reliable device, I would do it every 15,000 kms) otherwise the shit hits the fan and the pistons hit the valves, and that is the start of all your troubles and expenses.

I have been through that, and it is somewhere you do not want to go. The garage will refuse to replace the whole engine and it has to be rebuilt bit by bit, so you are relying on the local Somchai to get it right. As a result of various Somchais' expertise I had a series of engine failures leaving me motionless in many places.

I sold the bike.

But I must admit I had some fun during the 60,000 kms it gave me.

Thanks for that info.

I MUST do it soon as I have just passed the 20,000 km mark.

Apart from not being a rocket ship in the year I have had it, it has given very few problems.

Indicator bulbs, a battery but it was the original and nearly 5 years old and for some odd reason the main fuse blew at night (when else would it blow) but the engine kept running and I was only 1 km from home.

I have grown into a love/hate relationship with it and threaten to sell it every couple of months but it is still here.

[waza]

Himy Phantoms done 50,000 Km with the original cham chain tensioner. I also read that forum message about changing it at 25,000 km, it was on a Singapore Forum, forget the name.

[billd766]

Must have been the Phantom Knights forum.

I vaguely remember it now.

The cost is not too high compared with peace of mind I think.

[billd766]

I was up in Khampaeng Phet yesterday and I managed to get a photocopy of the camshaft tensioner page which I have attached.

There was a lady there who spoke a bit of English and between us we worked on what I needed but I couldn't get anybody in the workshop to understand what I wanted.

I went to my local dealer this morning and asked them and they seem to have a but more of an idea.

The mechanic spoke no English, I speak a little Thai but no technical and the owners daughter spoke both Thai and English but no technical.

Between them they will come up with a list of parts that will be needed, (gaskets, seals etc) and the mechanic suggests that while the head and barrel is off to change the piston rings and clean up the engine so I will get them to do that.

Tomorrow I will go in and get a photocopy of the pages of parts that may need replacing and also a price.

I will pay 50% deposit on the parts and there is a 3 day ordering period.

I tried to borrow the parts manual to scan onto my computer but the daughter said that it was not allowed to leave the shop so I will tackle her Dad (the owner).

After all it is not a state or even a commercial secret.

[aitch52]

Hi Bild

following this with interest as I have just reached 23 K and toying with the idea of replacement also. I can't find the attachment of the parts needed, did you forget old chum?

Cheers

Chris

edit spelling

Edited June 23, 2010 by aitch52

[Thaifan2]

Himy Phantoms done 50,000 Km with the original cham chain tensioner. I also read that forum message about changing it at 25,000 km, it was on a Singapore Forum, forget the name.

I BELIEVE ITS AN OLD WIFES TALE .PROBABLY ALSO DEPENDS ON HOW HARD YOU RIDE YOUR BIKE .I Will ignore it and ride on into the sunset .

[aitch52]

Having been involved with aircraft maintenance for a lifetime Thaifan, I tend to agree with you. If the bikes been thrashed then all sorts of problems are possible but the tensioner is probably the weakest point. Had the mechanics remove the inspection plate and have a look, there is no way that sort of inspection is a guarantee that it won't fail though. Looked ok but who knows?

One question though, on the very few occasions that I have had the bike flat out, the engine would miss a few beats as if it is governed, maybe a centrifugal governor to cut the HT circuit to the plug, or limit the fuel supply to the carb. I really would like to get the speciications of the TA 200 engine to find out but it seems they are a state secret. Have e-mailed Honda Thailand and received no response. Puzzled!

Aitch

If it ain't broke don't fix it.

[BigBikeBKK]

If it ain't broke don't fix it.

Good lord, if that's your approach to aircraft maintenance I hope to hel_l I never fly on a plane you've worked on!

[aitch52]

not the approach I take to aircraft maintenance BBBKK, strictly by the book, my point was, I have replaced many serviceable items that were probably good for another few hundred hours of flying. Relax, life and flight safety are the number one priority. If I took that approach to my vehicles though it would cost a fortune, an unfortunate choice of words on my part which could be easily misinterpreted.

[JSixpack]

If it ain't broke don't fix it.

Good lord, if that's your approach to aircraft maintenance I hope to hel_l I never fly on a plane you've worked on!

+1. Big believer in preventative maintenance meself.

Hope billd766 comes up w/ the attachment.

[billd766]

If it ain't broke don't fix it.

Good lord, if that's your approach to aircraft maintenance I hope to hel_l I never fly on a plane you've worked on!

+1. Big believer in preventative maintenance meself.

Hope billd766 comes up w/ the attachment.

Hi Guys

If I am lucky THIS time I will upload the page on the cam chain tensioner.

I went to see the guy this morning knowing that it would be more than just the cam chain tensioner plus gaskets etc and sure enough he is talking about rebuilding the engine.

I am looking at 2 or 3,000 baht and he photocopied the pages including the new camshaft, valves, chain, sprocket, piston rings, piston etc and all for ONLY 13,500 baht.

I can get it done by Dr Bike and have a good night or two in BKK and come home with change as well for that price.

I still cannot post this attachment no matter how I try.

I will chase it up with the forum guys and keep trying.

[br549]

I have no idea what Billd is talking about removing Barrel and top end...To replace

cam chain tensioner is a bolt on procedure...A competent mechanic can do in about

25 minutes . remove starter ( offset closed end wrench ) and remove cam chain tenser

(allen wrench) total cost was 725 baht. Be sure to note distance in bolt pattern

as far as Iknow there are 2 diffarent tensioners pending on yearbuilt . for some

reason I tried to add photos but could not. I had 26,000 km on Phantom when I

replaced . Not all Honda dealers know what you want done. the Thai word for cam

chain tensioner is " Tua domso or soo " best of luck.....Mike

[billd766]

I have no idea what Billd is talking about removing Barrel and top end...To replace

cam chain tensioner is a bolt on procedure...A competent mechanic can do in about

25 minutes . remove starter ( offset closed end wrench ) and remove cam chain tenser

(allen wrench) total cost was 725 baht. Be sure to note distance in bolt pattern

as far as Iknow there are 2 diffarent tensioners pending on yearbuilt . for some

reason I tried to add photos but could not. I had 26,000 km on Phantom when I

replaced . Not all Honda dealers know what you want done. the Thai word for cam

chain tensioner is " Tua domso or soo " best of luck.....Mike

I suspect that the local Honda guys are down a bit on work and want something to play with, but not my bike.

The reply below was in response to a thread about adding an attachment.

It seems as though you are having a problem too.

What type of file are you trying to attach?

jpeg of 14.6 mB

I tried again this afternoon for nearly 10 minutes and though it said it was transferring still nothing happened.

Edited June 25, 2010 by billd766

[billd766]

If it ain't broke don't fix it.

Good lord, if that's your approach to aircraft maintenance I hope to hel_l I never fly on a plane you've worked on!

+1. Big believer in preventative maintenance meself.

Hope billd766 comes up w/ the attachment.

I have hopefully managed to sort out my upload problem and have SOME pages from the parts manual.

Bearing in mind all I want is the cam chain tensioner and associated gaskets etc replaced the bits that my local guy wants to replace are highlighted in pink.

[JSixpack]

If it ain't broke don't fix it.

Good lord, if that's your approach to aircraft maintenance I hope to hel_l I never fly on a plane you've worked on!

+1. Big believer in preventative maintenance meself.

Hope billd766 comes up w/ the attachment.

I have hopefully managed to sort out my upload problem and have SOME pages from the parts manual.

Bearing in mind all I want is the cam chain tensioner and associated gaskets etc replaced the bits that my local guy wants to replace are highlighted in pink.

Thanks! Very helpful.

[billd766]

My pleasure.

I am trying to get the whole manual but it seems to be more valuable than state secrets.

[aitch52]

My pleasure.

I am trying to get the whole manual but it seems to be more valuable than state secrets.

Hi Bild

ordered a new cam chain tensioner a couple of weeks ago and it arrived on Friday. So trundled to shop, like you my guy wanted to remove the barrel etc, but I pointed out how to get to it via the crankcase and top access panel, thanks br549. My local shop deals mainly with scooters and step throughs and they are learning on my Phantom. They seem to have a competent bunch of mechanics though and I have been pleased with the level of service and care in their approach.

Replacement cost 750 Baht, Honda genuine part, I opened the seal on the bag personally. The cam chain tensioner looks to be a high quality injection moulding of thermoplastic, on inspection of the old one it had a few witness marks from the chain, other than that it was perfect, but age hardened, the new one seemed softer and more flexible. Using the old one as a paper weight, weighs about 5 or 6 ounces, gave a satisfying clunk on my mutts head when I gave her a soft tap as she was trying to steal my Szechuan honey chicken, gave me a look of utter disgust as she ambled off to wait for the scraps.

In my view there is an inbuilt design flaw, in that the rounded top mounting portion meets the arm in a sharp corner, so that would be a stress raiser. If it had been radiused then that would allow the stresses to flow around the corner and be evenly distributed. As it is all of the stress will focus on that sharp corner and is the most probable point to fail.

Also had the carb cleaned and tuned, oil changed, spark plug changed and a new headlamp, total bill 1070 Baht, well pleased. Just done my weekly commute to my job of 180 Kms, cruises effortlessly at 100 Kph accelerates well to 120Kph with more power to go quicker but that is outside of my chicken$hit comfort zone. 31kms per litre on the trip back, from 22kpl on the trip home. Mind you the engine was missing around the 100Kph mark and was running like a bag of nails when I got home.

Happy Trails

Aitch

[Kf6vci]

Hello Bill,

my perception of the Phantom was changed by riding it for a few days around Mae Hong Son. Now I understand you wanting to bore it out and keep it!

After some 6+ hours in the saddle with a few stops, how's your rear end handling it? I hated the soreness of the buttocks although the seat felt quite comfortable the first 100 km.

Fuel economy is amazing - depending on your driving style. And it certainly sounds like a much bigger bike. As it was selling well, can someone explain to me why Honda discontinued it and the CBR 150?

Hope you can find a good shop for boring and honing when you are at it, too.

Ride on,

Chris

[billd766]

Hello Bill,

my perception of the Phantom was changed by riding it for a few days around Mae Hong Son. Now I understand you wanting to bore it out and keep it!

After some 6+ hours in the saddle with a few stops, how's your rear end handling it? I hated the soreness of the buttocks although the seat felt quite comfortable the first 100 km.

Fuel economy is amazing - depending on your driving style. And it certainly sounds like a much bigger bike. As it was selling well, can someone explain to me why Honda discontinued it and the CBR 150?

Hope you can find a good shop for boring and honing when you are at it, too.

Ride on,

Chris

Hi Chris

I was out with Dave Boo last month and we went from my place near Mae Wong up to Khampeang Phet, Tak and a bit further north then over to Mae Ramat on the 1175 through the Mae Tean wildlife preserve, on down to Mae Sot then back home via Tak.

I did about 470 km and the Phantom held up very well though Dave was going slow and out of his (narrow) power band.

I felt comfortable most of the way and I was fine the next day.

I went to BKK later in the month then down to Pattaya with a friend who is not that experienced a rider so I stayed down around 75 kmh and I was getting about 34 km/l though on the way back up from BKK to home with the throttle wide open I was down around 23 km/l.

Its that dam_n 5th and 6th gear. They are like an overdrive and I need more throttle to stay at the same speed.

I have had the Phantom for just over a year and put 16,000 km on it and if I am honest I like it very much thogh I would still like something a bit bigger.

[billd766]

My pleasure.

I am trying to get the whole manual but it seems to be more valuable than state secrets.

Hi Bild

ordered a new cam chain tensioner a couple of weeks ago and it arrived on Friday. So trundled to shop, like you my guy wanted to remove the barrel etc, but I pointed out how to get to it via the crankcase and top access panel, thanks br549. My local shop deals mainly with scooters and step throughs and they are learning on my Phantom. They seem to have a competent bunch of mechanics though and I have been pleased with the level of service and care in their approach.

Replacement cost 750 Baht, Honda genuine part, I opened the seal on the bag personally. The cam chain tensioner looks to be a high quality injection moulding of thermoplastic, on inspection of the old one it had a few witness marks from the chain, other than that it was perfect, but age hardened, the new one seemed softer and more flexible. Using the old one as a paper weight, weighs about 5 or 6 ounces, gave a satisfying clunk on my mutts head when I gave her a soft tap as she was trying to steal my Szechuan honey chicken, gave me a look of utter disgust as she ambled off to wait for the scraps.

In my view there is an inbuilt design flaw, in that the rounded top mounting portion meets the arm in a sharp corner, so that would be a stress raiser. If it had been radiused then that would allow the stresses to flow around the corner and be evenly distributed. As it is all of the stress will focus on that sharp corner and is the most probable point to fail.

Also had the carb cleaned and tuned, oil changed, spark plug changed and a new headlamp, total bill 1070 Baht, well pleased. Just done my weekly commute to my job of 180 Kms, cruises effortlessly at 100 Kph accelerates well to 120Kph with more power to go quicker but that is outside of my chicken$hit comfort zone. 31kms per litre on the trip back, from 22kpl on the trip home. Mind you the engine was missing around the 100Kph mark and was running like a bag of nails when I got home.

Happy Trails

Aitch

Hi Aitch

Do you think your guys could do my Phantom for me?

I am not toooo happy when my lot want to tear the engine apart in what is reall a fairly simple job.

Did you see the parts of the manual I posted a while back?

Cheers

Bill

[aitch52]

Hi Bill

Sorry I've taken so long to reply to you, but been off line for a while. I am sure that they would be more than happy to do your Phantom. Their shop is in Nong Phai, Phetchabun. There are also a couple of good Honda dealers here in Phitsanulok, there are many Phantoms in this city and they are conversant with the bike, If I can help at all, gimme a shout.

Chris

[billd766]

Hi Bill

Sorry I've taken so long to reply to you, but been off line for a while. I am sure that they would be more than happy to do your Phantom. Their shop is in Nong Phai, Phetchabun. There are also a couple of good Honda dealers here in Phitsanulok, there are many Phantoms in this city and they are conversant with the bike, If I can help at all, gimme a shout.

Chris

Hi Chris

I am in Chiang Mai for several days and back home by the weekend.

Next week we have some of the family up from BKK plus the holiday on Monday and I have to get my visa extension sorted out very soon.

I will PM you after that and pick your brains if I may.

I spoke to my local guys on Saturday as my chain was a bit slack and he adjusted it to the limit.

I have ordered a new chain plus front and back sprockets plus a few other bits which will set me back 3,300 baht but only 150 for labour.

It seems that there are only 4 Phantoms down my way.

Cheers

Bill

[billd766]

Hi Bill

Sorry I've taken so long to reply to you, but been off line for a while. I am sure that they would be more than happy to do your Phantom. Their shop is in Nong Phai, Phetchabun. There are also a couple of good Honda dealers here in Phitsanulok, there are many Phantoms in this city and they are conversant with the bike, If I can help at all, gimme a shout.

Chris

Hi Chris

I am in Chiang Mai for several days and back home by the weekend.

Next week we have some of the family up from BKK plus the holiday on Monday and I have to get my visa extension sorted out very soon.

I will PM you after that and pick your brains if I may.

I spoke to my local guys on Saturday as my chain was a bit slack and he adjusted it to the limit.

I have ordered a new chain plus front and back sprockets plus a few other bits which will set me back 3,300 baht but only 150 for labour.

It seems that there are only 4 Phantoms down my way.

I have found Nong Phai on my GPS map.

Cheers

Bill

[billd766]

Hi Bill

Sorry I've taken so long to reply to you, but been off line for a while. I am sure that they would be more than happy to do your Phantom. Their shop is in Nong Phai, Phetchabun. There are also a couple of good Honda dealers here in Phitsanulok, there are many Phantoms in this city and they are conversant with the bike, If I can help at all, gimme a shout.

Chris

Hi Chris

I am in Chiang Mai for several days and back home by the weekend.

Next week we have some of the family up from BKK plus the holiday on Monday and I have to get my visa extension sorted out very soon.

I will PM you after that and pick your brains if I may.

I spoke to my local guys on Saturday as my chain was a bit slack and he adjusted it to the limit.

I have ordered a new chain plus front and back sprockets plus a few other bits which will set me back 3,300 baht but only 150 for labour.

It seems that there are only 4 Phantoms down my way.

I have found Nong Phai on my GPS map.

Cheers

Bill