Tot Blocking All Torrent Traffic

[SailingHome]

This had to happen. It probably a good thing. You'll "hopefully" see performance of voip, web mail, etc.. improve. Torrents are drain especially since most peers exists outside of TOT, if you look at an average torrent drainer using a steady 1mbit the economics just dont make sense. I cant even buy full transit routes on 1000mbit commits for < 550baht/mbit (or anywhere near that). So hopefully TOT stop, separate, or traffic shape them.

Ideally I'd like to see torrent drainer pay a massive premium. Part ignorance for most windoze users as the systray hides the little U, but wow imagine how fast the internet would be in Thailand without torrent drainers.

Ends rant.

You're entitled to your opinion, but I think you are very much in the minority

I suspect I am. But the reality is it is just not financially sustainable to ISP in SE Asia to provide any reasonable level of performance to Torrents - especially those where most peers will exist outside of Thailand for the type of downloads most popular. The result is degraded performance for everyone and further congestion. The only reason I believe that traffic shaping or blocking has been weak with Torrents is the cost involved in deep packet inspection hardware especially when the client/trackers evolve the protocol relatively frequently (encryption etc...). Someone has to pay..

We all are entitled to opinion. Let's look at his facts: _high bandwidth traffic slows down everything else_. If you are benefitting from sucking the life out Internet for everyone, you can complain, but the economics will not support you and thus you will likely not be heard. Likely you will say that is my opinion...

[a269652]

haven't been able to down/upload anything from 'thebox' using 'utorrent' for in excess of 24 hours now. am a TOT subscriber in BKK.

[TheBrit]

Just logged into UKNOVA to download TMaWL and getting 0/0

TB

[Araxav]

haha..Sure, of course people !

Stop using the internet, it makes is slow !

BitTorrent does not kill the bandwitdh because of what it is, it does so because it is popular...

If we follow that logic, what is next ? Argh this dam_n youtube, and all other video streaming websites, let's get rid of them too.

And skype and other Voip services ? They do not require require a high bandwith, sure, but require a high quality of service to maintain the datastream constant...

Let's cut all that off, then we don't have to improve anything.

Those stupid people who think that when they pay for 4Mb of bandwidth, they can use it !

[Faro]

Here in Udon Thani I have not been able to download torrents since yesterday. In fact I am halfway downloading two torrents and they just stopped.

[dobadoy]

My torrents have stopped completely for about 2 days now, both at home (True) and at work (service? no idea). Here's what the msg log says, tho' I confess it is a foreign language to me:

Edited August 11, 2010 by dobadoy

[djinn]

In Na Jomtien:No download ;Upload OK skype OK

Tried new download with full of seeders .doesn't work

I am on uTorrent which doesn't find any peer for downloading (DHT; 0 nodes)

And for one time my avatar is spot on topic

Edited August 11, 2010 by djinn

[kennalder]

I suspect I am. But the reality is it is just not financially sustainable to ISP in SE Asia to provide any reasonable level of performance to Torrents - especially those where most peers will exist outside of Thailand for the type of downloads most popular. The result is degraded performance for everyone and further congestion. The only reason I believe that traffic shaping or blocking has been weak with Torrents is the cost involved in deep packet inspection hardware especially when the client/trackers evolve the protocol relatively frequently (encryption etc...). Someone has to pay..

Those that pay, pay for those that don't pay.

I'll bet that if we all paid per megabyte, like an electric or water meter, three things would happen. (Assuming the ISP's adjusted everything so they got the same total revenue.)

1. My bill would go down.

2. Internet service would be faster.

3. The massive downloaders would become slowdownloaders. I.e. They would be more selective about how much they downloaded.

My two cents.

Internet is already cheap as dirt.

Your browsing and email would not be faster, even if every person on earth stopped using bit torrent. The actual bandwidth needed for regular internet browsing/email is very narrow.

Who cares if the next guy downloads 100gb a day if it doesn't slow you down.

Torrentors are an easy shoulder to lay the blame on, when it's the profiteering companies that should be making sure their equipment is keeping up with customer's demands...and with the times. And generally they are as the internet is only getting faster.... a 2mb connection is the same cost as a 1mb connection was 2 years back.

Okay, if torrents don't hog bandwidth, then lets go back to 56 k and see how much you can download. 1 movie a week instead of 3 a night. If internet is as cheap as dirt, then I'm sure you won't mind paying by the Mb. I know I would love that arrangement. My usage would probably drop my bill from 850 a month to about 150. Meanwhile those that download 20 movies a week, they would go from 850 to 3000. (or some set of numbers) Point is my bill would go down, yours would go up. Under that scenario let me tell you whose internet is "cheap as dirt". Um, still guessing? Let me help. MINE.

Yes it would be great to have unlimited everything. As far as internet is concerned, probably never happen. As soon as bandwidth is improved, more apps hog more of it, so performance for the average user doesn't change much. Back in the days of 56k nobody dreamed of downloading music/movies etc. It's all about how many packets of info can get through the pipe, at any given time. I only push a few through intermittently. Others have, I can only guess how many coming through 24-7. Pay for it!

[wontok]

Just logged into UKNOVA to download TMaWL and getting 0/0

TB

I have noticed that UKNova has two trackers: http://tracker.uknova.com:8000 and http://tracker2.uknova.com:8000. I have downloaded today from "tracker" and am now seeding back, but when I try torrents on "tracker2" I get 0/0 and the tracker times out.

Can't explain this but it might mean something to someone out there...

[TheBarbarian]

No such a problem at all. Would more likely be a technical problem. I can upload and download without any problem moreover there are so many ways to get around what the TOT or other snoopers want you to do. To avoid problems with the government kissing webmasters, just do a search. I bet it takes you 5 minutes to get around any blockade.

[MarleyMarl]

People complaining about people who download stuff using bit torrent are being ridiculous. I pay every month for my 2mbit/s, If I want to use it downloading torrents, then so be it.

[leemac]

This had to happen. It probably a good thing. You'll "hopefully" see performance of voip, web mail, etc.. improve. Torrents are drain especially since most peers exists outside of TOT, if you look at an average torrent drainer using a steady 1mbit the economics just dont make sense. I cant even buy full transit routes on 1000mbit commits for < 550baht/mbit (or anywhere near that). So hopefully TOT stop, separate, or traffic shape them.

Ideally I'd like to see torrent drainer pay a massive premium. Part ignorance for most windoze users as the systray hides the little U, but wow imagine how fast the internet would be in Thailand without torrent drainers.

Ends rant.

END USER DAY 1- "I want mega speed on torrents 24/7 for the lowest price possible!"

END USER DAY 2- "WHY IS MY SPEED SO SLOW!!! YOUTUBE WONT LOAD!!!"

END USER DAY 3- "WHY ARE YOU TRAFFIC SHAPING MEEEEE!!!!"

END USER DAY 4- "YOU GUYS SUX I'M LEAVING I HATE YOU!!!"

Changes provider

END USER DAY 5- "MY LAST PROVIDER WAS BETTER!!!"

[wolf5370]

OK just tried (ToT CM). bU Torrent says incoming connections are not getting through (people wanting to seed from me - i.e. upload). I just down loaded an MP3 (legit one I might add - public domain!) and it ame down pretty fast for this time of the day!

Personally I don't tend to torrent films unless I really can't get them any other way ( I also am a regular cinema goer, so most new films I see anyway!) - some old films for the kids I have as there is no other way of getting them here (Amazon will not take my card!). I also tend to stream TV programs that I like to watch (low bandwidth) and I pay for a service for this. I do use torrent from time to time for other things though, such as music - there is plenty there that is in the public domain and NOT illegal to download - not all of it is old either.

I think blaming users because ISP's over sell the bandwidth is like blaming passengers for turning up when an airline has over booked the seats! It is not too difficult to throttle connections (especially non-HTTP) based on byte volume, amny ISPs in the UK do and I guess most other places. Extreame users should be dealt with in that way.

[jpshanik]

Just a couple of quick notes: 1. Sorry for all you ppl who have to use TOT. Had it, would never consider going back unless it was the absolute only service available. Famous last words. Haha. 2. For those of you who complain about torrents taking up space on your precious internet, get a frickin life. If you live in Thailand (or even visited for that matter) you have most likely benefitted from torrents, one way or another. Come on, admit it. And sorry to say, but if TOT has really stopped their torrent users, then good for them. That is the quickest way to lose about half their business and they need a good waking up. So for all of you who have to stay on TOT, I'm sorry. For those of you who want to stay on TOT, please take good care of your AOL account. You know what I'm talking about. And please don't let anyone on this forum catch you doing anything to annoy anyone else, because I'm sure you wouldn't be casting the first stone otherwise.

[TheBarbarian]

May I say that Thailand is one of the most expensive places to get on the internet in the world with one of the lowest speeds? In Europe I get for a 1200 Baht 40 MB plus internet phone plus TV. In Thailand you get a lousy 8 MB or 12 MB connection that delivers no more than 30% of the promised speed. Moreover since the army booted out an elected government they have throttled on purpose the connections t the outside world. Problem is that this government does not want you to communicate with the outside world. Undemocratic regimes have lots of things to hide and internet would give people up country better chances not something the elite wants. they have to fill their brothels their fishing fleets and need mea-bahns who work 24/7 for 5000 baht or less a month. So Anupong will suppress them, Sondhi will squeeze them like a citruys and Abhisit will take care that they stay uneducated.

I suspect I am. But the reality is it is just not financially sustainable to ISP in SE Asia to provide any reasonable level of performance to Torrents - especially those where most peers will exist outside of Thailand for the type of downloads most popular. The result is degraded performance for everyone and further congestion. The only reason I believe that traffic shaping or blocking has been weak with Torrents is the cost involved in deep packet inspection hardware especially when the client/trackers evolve the protocol relatively frequently (encryption etc...). Someone has to pay..

[Beetlejuice]

Any chance a moderator can delete the last three posts as they are all off-topic?

Also can the moderator go through this thread and delete all of the anti-p2p posts?

It might reduce this thread to a single page.

As for you guys - mattcodes, vediovis, etc - please start your own thread about the unfairness of p2p. Your posts are not on topic and not wanted here. They just clutter up the place.

@TAWP: Do not feed the trolls.

Thanks JetsetBkk - couldn't have put it better myself. Those that want an argument can do so by PM please!

Back on topic I've just started a new download from Demonoid ...and it's working! But everything else, my beloved "TheBox" and a few others are still dead.

Hi geoffphuket, this is what I believe:

This has nothing to do with whether we are for or against torrents. This is about the ISPs adapting their systems to accommodate new technologies.

Like with all technology, there are always going to be new advances and add ons over period of time. This meaning that the original apparatus has to be adapted and more resources added to accommodate new services and increased user traffic.

It seems however that ISPs in Thailand are enjoying the benefits of monopolising Internet services from area to area and huge profits gained from increased clientele because the customers have no where else to go, it is a use us or use nothing marketing approach.

These ISPs are putting very little new resources into their services, it`s all out for more profit and giving sweet FA in return. In fact I see the throttling of on line traffic as taking the technology backwards, hardly any progress at all since the introduction of broadband over 10 years ago. For example if there is a demand for p2p services which was not about only a few years ago, then the ISPs have to consider ways of accommodating this system. What is going to happen in the future when something else new hits the system. Are there never going to be any advances and always nothing more then how it was 10 or so years ago because the ISPs will not put more resources into the networks?

No, sorry, this has to be wrong.

Edited August 11, 2010 by Beetlejuice

[welsh1]

It would appear, that as of yesterday, TOT are blocking all torrent traffic in Thailand.

Why did it appear that way?

I have it on good authority that torrent traffic in Thailand wasn't blocked yesterday.

That explains why me and a few fellow workers where having trouble hitting various torrents sites .. loading loading and loading then comes up webpage can not be found

[farang62]

No problem Just very slow TOT and TT&T no service for 2 days, can't go any where.

You can look at what is happening on the WWW by continent and area just go to http://www.internettrafficreport.com and click on Asia you will see the major routers and their status, right now Singapore is down. The locations of the major routers for Asia is also interesting!

[perax]

Did you see the latest packages from TRUE?

30M/2M @ 120 USD/month

50M/3M @ 180 USD/month.

Of course, if they sell this sort of packages they are expected to have enough capacity on their backbone to carry it. P2P traffic is nothign new, any half decent telco will know very well what to expect, and how to QOS it out to preserve service levels.

BTW, if you want a 3M/3M SDSL, youre looking at about 40K THB per month.

[wontok]

May I say that Thailand is one of the most expensive places to get on the internet in the world with one of the lowest speeds? In Europe I get for a 1200 Baht 40 MB plus internet phone plus TV. In Thailand you get a lousy 8 MB or 12 MB connection that delivers no more than 30% of the promised speed.

I'm amazed at how cheap my internet is here! About 18 months ago I signed on for with TOT (2.5/512 connection which I do actually get most of the time even here in rural Isaan) for B790 a month. No installation fee for the phone line, no rental fee, unlimited downloads and, wait for it, B790 free phone calls every month!!! All I pay is the tax! It's ridiculously cheap and I'd happily may more, (but donations are hardly the way to go in Thailand are they?) If they charged a more realistic fee then they could keep their network updated and at least some of the problems we face today would be averted.

[keithcresswell]

I am on TOT in Pattaya.

UK Nova: not working

The Box: not working

Radioarchive: not working

TVchaos: working at the moment.

BTJunkie: Has a red button, but downloading, slowly.

I phoned TOT and got through within two minutes. However, we must remember, Thai companies give only minimal training to staff and the person I spoke to had not heard of Torrents or File sharing. She kept asking me if the lights were working on my modem.

I'm on the fence as far as the ethics of file sharing are concerned I used to despise file sharers who hogged the bandwidth, but then it was a case of the gamekeeper turning poacher. I was able to cancel my True UBS subscription and see the programmes I actually wanted to watch.

Anyway maybe its only a glitch. There are more important things in life, er.. aren't there?

[peterpop]

H2oDunc says he's no problem downloading loading from TOT, but hasn't replied to my question asking where he is

SoRry to be ignorant but I don't know what 'Torrents are but if it is streamed internet information like getting a live stock market index, then I am having no problems whatsoever with my internet in CHIANG MAI. I use TOT

Edited August 11, 2010 by peterpop

[kennalder]

May I say that Thailand is one of the most expensive places to get on the internet in the world with one of the lowest speeds? In Europe I get for a 1200 Baht 40 MB plus internet phone plus TV. In Thailand you get a lousy 8 MB or 12 MB connection that delivers no more than 30% of the promised speed. Moreover since the army booted out an elected government they have throttled on purpose the connections t the outside world. Problem is that this government does not want you to communicate with the outside world. Undemocratic regimes have lots of things to hide and internet would give people up country better chances not something the elite wants. they have to fill their brothels their fishing fleets and need mea-bahns who work 24/7 for 5000 baht or less a month. So Anupong will suppress them, Sondhi will squeeze them like a citruys and Abhisit will take care that they stay uneducated.

I suspect I am. But the reality is it is just not financially sustainable to ISP in SE Asia to provide any reasonable level of performance to Torrents - especially those where most peers will exist outside of Thailand for the type of downloads most popular. The result is degraded performance for everyone and further congestion. The only reason I believe that traffic shaping or blocking has been weak with Torrents is the cost involved in deep packet inspection hardware especially when the client/trackers evolve the protocol relatively frequently (encryption etc...). Someone has to pay..

How the h_ell did that happen. I said nothing of the sort.

Anyway, for you torrent users, I have probably switched to your side. After reading everything, I agree, the real bad guys here are the ISP's that over-promise and under-deliver. As long as you are using less than what you paid for, then you are good by me.

My message to ISP's. Advertise only what you can deliver around the clock, no matter what!

[jacko45k]

Well I would be happy just to have reliable internet from TOT, never mind torrents.

Telephoning and complaining doesn't cut it with them!

[yellow1red1]

I know there s a bandwidth problem for Internet data outside of Thailand as the number of backbones is limited.

More, I know torrent uses an incredible amount of bandwidth for data mostly located outside of the country.

Most of the torrent users download illegal things. I regularly ask myself why some people have the need to crash the quality of service for all the other users when they are in a country where the whole DVD is at 100 Bt in the local market with perfect quality.

I pay my Internet connection like the others and I want to have my Skype strong enough to talk to people in Europe. I want also my websites to display faster on my browser, and youtube videos to be more reactive. I make normal usage of my connection and I expect it to work fine. But the quality of my connection is scrapped by torrent users who use all the bandwidth in my area, and reduce the amount of available bandwidth for data located outside of the country.

In these conditions, I don't want to be located to the same router or backbone than torrent/donkey users. This is the reason why I'm not with TT&T as you have to share your connection with your neighbors and you can't do anything anymore when they start they p2p.

I totally agree with TOT decision and I expect it to make my connection working better.

Torrent users have to pay more or to have their own network. Or to go to the shop to buy their dvd.

and make their own porn

[wolf5370]

May I say that Thailand is one of the most expensive places to get on the internet in the world with one of the lowest speeds? In Europe I get for a 1200 Baht 40 MB plus internet phone plus TV. In Thailand you get a lousy 8 MB or 12 MB connection that delivers no more than 30% of the promised speed. Moreover since the army booted out an elected government they have throttled on purpose the connections t the outside world. Problem is that this government does not want you to communicate with the outside world. Undemocratic regimes have lots of things to hide and internet would give people up country better chances not something the elite wants. they have to fill their brothels their fishing fleets and need mea-bahns who work 24/7 for 5000 baht or less a month. So Anupong will suppress them, Sondhi will squeeze them like a citruys and Abhisit will take care that they stay uneducated.

I suspect I am. But the reality is it is just not financially sustainable to ISP in SE Asia to provide any reasonable level of performance to Torrents - especially those where most peers will exist outside of Thailand for the type of downloads most popular. The result is degraded performance for everyone and further congestion. The only reason I believe that traffic shaping or blocking has been weak with Torrents is the cost involved in deep packet inspection hardware especially when the client/trackers evolve the protocol relatively frequently (encryption etc...). Someone has to pay..

Sorry conspiracy theory nonsense - if that was the case they would just lock it out completely other than for static IP's given to 'those men in black'. I guess the 40Mb/Phone/TV deal was a cable deal - hence only available to city dwellers where a cable has been run. The UK is pretty behind times too - look at the connection speeds in Japan and S.Korea - even over the 4G phone networks!

Most of the international problems with speed are due to insuffiient cabling (only to USA - so Euro coms is routed via America - doubling the bandwidth to America and the hop to Europe - i.e. more than twice as bad), insufficient badwidth budget (shared between several countries - Singapore probably gets lion share - and business dedicated bandwidth the lion share of that too).

[garydubbs]

bad news: my wife just phoned TOT and was advised that they are indeed blocking torrent traffic. engineer was quite open about it.

good(ish) news: he also advised that torrent traffic will be turned on between 10pm and 5am - reason to give faster traffic during the day for "normal" use.

it was stated as temporary though he couldn't give a timespan as to when full service would be resume.

we'll see at 10pm lads.

Edited August 11, 2010 by garydubbs

[wolf5370]

H2oDunc says he's no problem downloading loading from TOT, but hasn't replied to my question asking where he is

SoRry to be ignorant but I don't know what 'Torrents are but if it is streamed internet information like getting a live stock market index, then I am having no problems whatsoever with my internet in CHIANG MAI. I use TOT

No torrent is a way of downloading files (usually nbigger ones - such as software or movies). It allows for the files to be hosted on many computers and then manages the p2p (peer to peer - i.e. one computer talking (almost) directly to another) connections and can take packets (think of a file as made up of blocks of information that together, in the right order, make up the whole file) from various host computers (other users that have copies of the file - the original uploader and others who have (or are) downloaded it already) and piece it back together on your machine. This allows computers hosting the file to be turned off without it causing the download to fail, it continues if it can find other seeders - peers with the file available) and allows for faster (parallel) downloads.

It is often used as a means to copy pirated software and films/music, but not always. Streaming is a whole other technology and is not the topic here.

[SamritT]

Against the law or not? This download thing?

[alex_aka_P]

TOT Pathumthani

1. BT: no any single connections to any http trackers (zero-length responce, probably block) since yesterday 16:40

2. More than that, ED2k is also dead (no connections to the servers, only one in Korea gives me LowID and provides zero peers online) since the same time

3. More than that, my TeamViewer (IP2IP remote admin service & more) also dead since that.

Called to TOT. They confirmed that "Yesterday TOT had an Internet service issue but now it is all back to normal". Which is not, as I can see.

If it wont be fixed in a day or two - I'll be onmy way to TRUE or something. Enough TOT's surprises and incompetence. Since 2yrs ago they "temporary" disable SMTP within their system except their own single SMTP server. I got to use it, or got to use another mail-senging protocols through proxies (which is not acceptable to most mail programs without pretty deep system "tuning").

And now - here we go again. Idiotic service!!!!!!