I hope I wasn't going going too fast for him!

Did any of you guys seee that... ??

........

It looked like a million flying past at a wowsand miles an hour!

My intial point exactly.

The Bearpit is the venue for that.  So what's with all the badgering of late?

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1. Fighting Terror

2. Slow Friday

3. Has Pip Opened A Can Of Worms?

4. Declaration Of Independence

5. Revolution Begins On Platform 18

6. Jaw Dropper Of The Day

7. Snip Snip

8. London Underground Bombing 'exercises' Took

...or is the attention span too short?

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My point, Mr. Merton, is we don't need to be lectured to by some "Ivory Tower" academic with some agenda here in TV...hmmmm?

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..whilst on the other hand you think it is perfectly acceptable for everyone else to bombarded with your propagandist posturing whenever the spirit moves you?

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You're dodging the question: What's your agenda here in TV?

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Tms agenda on tv is to irritate everyone with his self righteous holier than though pompous lecturing, by thinking he is better than everyone else one this forum, all the while looking down the end of his nose while he is sat on his little self proclaimed pedestal.

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'Bout right. But then if you only had a mail order degree from some junior college and still hadn't attained Tenure status yet, you'd be a blow-hard too like Melton...

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How dare you.

My mate Melton had to give over 1000 baht to a nice man who said he was Chancellor of a university for his qualifications - picked them up from Printip centre himself.

Were yours on special offer, too?

BTW, just a little reminder:

Perhaps we can reach an agreement.

I propose that we agree, all political posturing, especially on matters not directly related to Thailand, either from the right or from the left, takes place in the Bearpit - not in Bedlam or elsewhere on Thaivisa.

Then I, and others will be freed from thinking of new ways to describe boys who run away from a challenge; pussy cats who hide behind George and the good doctor; cheats who go for the man instead of playing the ball - in fact, everyone will be able to live happily ever after.

The choice is yours.

Until then, the challenge remains and eyes are watching.

My intial point exactly.

The Bearpit is the venue for that.  So what's with all the badgering of late?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

1. Fighting Terror

2. Slow Friday

3. Has Pip Opened A Can Of Worms?

4. Declaration Of Independence

5. Revolution Begins On Platform 18

6. Jaw Dropper Of The Day

7. Snip Snip

8. London Underground Bombing 'exercises' Took

...or is the attention span too short?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

My point, Mr. Merton, is we don't need to be lectured to by some "Ivory Tower" academic with some agenda here in TV...hmmmm?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

..whilst on the other hand you think it is perfectly acceptable for everyone else to bombarded with your propagandist posturing whenever the spirit moves you?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You're dodging the question: What's your agenda here in TV?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Tms agenda on tv is to irritate everyone with his self righteous holier than though pompous lecturing, by thinking he is better than everyone else one this forum, all the while looking down the end of his nose while he is sat on his little self proclaimed pedestal.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

'Bout right. But then if you only had a mail order degree from some junior college and still hadn't attained Tenure status yet, you'd be a blow-hard too like Melton...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

How dare you.

My mate Melton had to give over 1000 baht to a nice man who said he was Chancellor of a university for his qualifications - picked them up from Printip centre himself.

Were yours on special offer, too?

BTW, just a little reminder:

Perhaps we can reach an agreement.

I propose that we agree, all political posturing, especially on matters not directly related to Thailand, either from the right or from the left, takes place in the Bearpit - not in Bedlam or elsewhere on Thaivisa.

Then I, and others will be freed from thinking of new ways to describe boys who run away from a challenge; pussy cats who hide behind George and the good doctor; cheats who go for the man instead of playing the ball - in fact, everyone will be able to live happily ever after.

The choice is yours.

Until then, the challenge remains and eyes are watching.

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Does this mean I won?

Apparantly not - the bullsh*t continues.

Ah yes.

The self-appointed arbiter of what is and what is not acceptable to post on TV bleats again...

Ah yes.

The self-appointed arbiter of what is and what is not acceptable to post on TV bleats again...

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Ah…bleating – make us Welshmen (and a few New Zealanders, I’ve heard) reach for our Wellington boots and dream of succulent juices supplemented by the sweet smell of mint.

A much more satisfying occupation than reading the political posturing of lost souls.

Ah yes.

The self-appointed arbiter of what is and what is not acceptable to post on TV bleats again...

Ah…bleating – make us Welshmen (and a few New Zealanders, I’ve heard) reach for our Wellington boots and dream of succulent juices supplemented by the sweet smell of mint.

A much more satisfying occupation than reading the political posturing of lost souls.

Tell you what Taff, you don't have to read it if you don't wish?

Political posturing - good one!

Ah yes.

The self-appointed arbiter of what is and what is not acceptable to post on TV bleats again...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Ah…bleating – make us Welshmen (and a few New Zealanders, I’ve heard) reach for our Wellington boots and dream of succulent juices supplemented by the sweet smell of mint.

A much more satisfying occupation than reading the political posturing of lost souls.

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Tell you what Taff, you don't have to read it if you don't wish?

Political posturing - good one!

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..and I don't have to be a member of Thaivisa, or to have relatives in Thailand, or... - but I do and I read Bedlam.

What I cannot understand is why you, on the one hand, sight George and the doctor as your authority for saying political argument not directly connected to Thailand, should take place in the Bearpit ( a point I do not dispute), whilst, on the other hand you (and Tornado) persist in bombarding Bedlam with your posturing?

The only reason for which (instead of arguing via PMs) , as far as can see, is because you must derive some exhibitionistic pleasure from others, such as myself, also reading these postings (which I don't have to if I don't wish – so you say).

Just why are you continuing to post right-wing propaganda in Bedlam on Thaivisa?

Ah yes.

The self-appointed arbiter of what is and what is not acceptable to post on TV bleats again...

Ah…bleating – make us Welshmen (and a few New Zealanders, I’ve heard) reach for our Wellington boots and dream of succulent juices supplemented by the sweet smell of mint.

A much more satisfying occupation than reading the political posturing of lost souls.

Tell you what Taff, you don't have to read it if you don't wish?

Political posturing - good one!

Just why are you continuing to post right-wing propaganda in Bedlam on Thaivisa?

Not 'right-wing propaganda' as you lable it but perhaps a more correctly defined objective anaylsis of events versus this race to the bottom for example in the UK where politicians like George Galloway and London mayor Ken Livingstone are vying for the title of Most Disgusting Statement of Appeasement in the face of Islamic terrorism: Red Ken: We Deserved the Bombings

And here he is lashing out again...

Boon Mee... I don't usually get involved.. however...

Are you denying that...

"western policies in the Middle East, Afghanistan and Iraq may have influenced the bombers."

and also this...

"We created these people. We built them up. We funded them."

Even though Ken made these remarks, he hasn't said the terrorists had a right to bomb, or that he was sympathetic to their cause....

So please explain... Why is the statement disgusting....

And also outline the concessions that Ken Livingstone made to terrorists in order to help stop the violence.

totster

Boon Mee... I don't usually get involved.. however...

Are you denying that...

"western policies in the Middle East, Afghanistan and Iraq may have influenced the bombers."

and also this...

"We created these people. We built them up. We funded them."

Even though Ken made these remarks, he hasn't said the terrorists had a right to bomb, or that he was sympathetic to their cause....

So please explain... Why is the statement disgusting....

And also outline the concessions that Ken Livingstone made to terrorists in order to help stop the violence.

totster 

Totster~

Well, first off it has become fashionable to be anti-Semitic again. At least in The EU countries.

Second, "We created these people. We built them up. We funded them.”

Who is this "we" they're talking about?

And, "illegal invasion of Egypt and Jordan in the Six Day War"1. If this is illegal, who is the "controlling legal authority"

Isn't he forgetting something about the few days prior to the "invasion"?

In terms of: "western policies in the Middle East, Afghanistan and Iraq may have influenced the bombers" - that position is little different from the "findings" released just the other day by the great thinkers at The Royal Institute of International Affairs.

Check this out:

Britain's highly respected (until now) Chatham House, formerly known as the Royal Institute of International Affairs, announced its considered judgment last week that Britian's alliance with the United States in Iraq contributed to the cause of the terrorist strike on London a fortnight ago. The report then went on to pronounce that the key problem in Britain for preventing terrorism is that the country is "riding as a pillion passenger with the United States in the war on terror." What a vile, lying, contemptuous assertion.

For those unfamiliar with the term, a pillion is a padded, woman's passenger seat on a motorcycle driven traditionally by a man.

The British are riding as a "pillion passenger"? Tell that to Royal Scots Dragoons, the Black Watch Regiment, the Irish Guard, the 7th Armoured Brigade, the Royal Highland Fusiliers, the 33rd Engineers Explosive Ordinance Disposal Regiment,the Royal Marines, the Special Air Service (special forces), the Staffordshire Regiment, the Royal Air Force the Princess of Wales Royal Regiment and the many other British military units fighting and dying in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Pillion passengers? My horse's back side! (and its even wider than my own).

According to the British newspaper the Guardian, Chatham House is staffed by "leading academics and former civil servants." For such as these to disparage the flower of British manhood, which may yet again be the savior of the nation as it has countless times through her history, is shameful.

These unworthy heirs to an England that "Never did, nor never shall, Lie at the proud foot of a conqueror," to an England that is "this royal throne of kings, this sceptred isle, this earthly majesty, this seat of Mars," these unworthies, by their analysis and conclusions prove they have as little between their ears as they presumedly do between their legs.

These hapless, hopeless "thinkers" are following in the foolish, timorous tradition of the European "neutrals" who were the object of Winston Churchill's wise but unheeded guidance back in January 1940.

Maybe this time America won't (or won't be able to) save Europe from it's suicidal socialist do-gooders and Jew haters.

Good luck EU.

Boon Mee... I don't usually get involved.. however...

Are you denying that...

"western policies in the Middle East, Afghanistan and Iraq may have influenced the bombers."

and also this...

"We created these people. We built them up. We funded them."

Even though Ken made these remarks, he hasn't said the terrorists had a right to bomb, or that he was sympathetic to their cause....

So please explain... Why is the statement disgusting....

And also outline the concessions that Ken Livingstone made to terrorists in order to help stop the violence.

totster 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Totster~

Well, first off it has become fashionable to be anti-Semitic again. At least in The EU countries.

Second, "We created these people. We built them up. We funded them.”

Who is this "we" they're talking about?

And, "illegal invasion of Egypt and Jordan in the Six Day War"1. If this is illegal, who is the "controlling legal authority"

Isn't he forgetting something about the few days prior to the "invasion"?

In terms of: "western policies in the Middle East, Afghanistan and Iraq may have influenced the bombers" - that position is little different from the "findings" released just the other day by the great thinkers at The Royal Institute of International Affairs.

Check this out:

Britain's highly respected (until now) Chatham House, formerly known as the Royal Institute of International Affairs, announced its considered judgment last week that Britian's alliance with the United States in Iraq contributed to the cause of the terrorist strike on London a fortnight ago. The report then went on to pronounce that the key problem in Britain for preventing terrorism is that the country is "riding as a pillion passenger with the United States in the war on terror." What a vile, lying, contemptuous assertion.

For those unfamiliar with the term, a pillion is a padded, woman's passenger seat on a motorcycle driven traditionally by a man.

The British are riding as a "pillion passenger"? Tell that to Royal Scots Dragoons, the Black Watch Regiment, the Irish Guard, the 7th Armoured Brigade, the Royal Highland Fusiliers, the 33rd Engineers Explosive Ordinance Disposal Regiment,the Royal Marines, the Special Air Service (special forces), the Staffordshire Regiment, the Royal Air Force the Princess of Wales Royal Regiment and the many other British military units fighting and dying in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Pillion passengers? My horse's back side! (and its even wider than my own).

According to the British newspaper the Guardian, Chatham House is staffed by "leading academics and former civil servants." For such as these to disparage the flower of British manhood, which may yet again be the savior of the nation as it has countless times through her history, is shameful.

These unworthy heirs to an England that "Never did, nor never shall, Lie at the proud foot of a conqueror," to an England that is "this royal throne of kings, this sceptred isle, this earthly majesty, this seat of Mars," these unworthies, by their analysis and conclusions prove they have as little between their ears as they presumedly do between their legs.

These hapless, hopeless "thinkers" are following in the foolish, timorous tradition of the European "neutrals" who were the object of Winston Churchill's wise but unheeded guidance back in January 1940.

Maybe this time America won't (or won't be able to) save Europe from it's suicidal socialist do-gooders and Jew haters.

Good luck EU.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I've changed a large portion of text to color red. I believe that this is all from the link you presented. It would be good if you could make it clearer what is copied and pasted from your source and what is your own writing.

The portion in red is all stemming from the use of the term "pillion passenger." The person who wrote the link has a really good imagination in interpreting this term. The writer interprets this to mean that England is a woman (meaning weak) who is riding on a padded seat and thus have an easy time while the US is the man (meaning stronger) who is doing the work....this interpretation is really good for raising the nationalistic sentiment that the writer wants to achieve from the writing. I googled the term "pillion passenger" on google and at least the first five results talked about how to ride a motorcycle or getting certified on a motorcycle so that you can carry a passenger on the back. It turns out that a "pillion passenger" simply means the passenger on the back of a motorcycle. It is clear in my mind that when the term "pillion passenger" was used it simply meant that the US was the driver and went whereever it wanted while UK was merely a passenger and went along with the US whatever the path. It has nothing to do with saying that UK troops are not valiant or any of the other nationalist rhetoric that the writer uses to create the emotional reaction in the reader. Basically this is a propogandists technique....raise the emotions and lower the intellect....this is not a specialty of the left or the right...less respectable elements of both sides use it and when everyone believes in it it rings the death knoll of government by reason. Boon Mee, it seems to me, after reading a number of your links, that you buy in to this type of rhetoric. Don't you see it for what it is?

Well, one of the points is that the Royal Institute of International Affairs has in effect labled Blair's Government and the UK as pillion passangers when indeed they are not. The example the author cites of the presence of the Royal Scots Dragoons, the Black Watch Regiment, the Irish Guard, the 7th Armoured Brigade, the Royal Highland Fusiliers, the 33rd Engineers Explosive Ordinance Disposal Regiment,the Royal Marines etc. all shoulder to shoulder with the US in the war.

If we're looking at propogandist techniques, it's those on the left attempting to belittle the UK's contributions. Recall in 1944, Germans citizens of Britain condemned Churchill’s foreign policy. Claimed the PM should do more to address Hitler’s polite request for living space (lebensraum) and that Churchill is partly to blame for recent V-2 missile attacks.

See any parallels with the homegrown Islamists?

Good evening Booners (you bigs girls blouse), I hope you are worki ng hardb with all the othert seaman.

Good evening Booners (you bigs girls blouse), I hope you are worki ng hardb with all the othert seaman.          

You're up late, Gent...

The keyboard is kinda tough this time of morning, huh?

Good evening Booners (you bigs girls blouse), I hope you are worki ng hardb with all the othert seaman.          

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You're up late, Gent...

The keyboard is kinda tough this time of morning, huh?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I never sleep mate - Im like a ? hmmmmmmm

say hello to Billy Bob.

Good evening Booners (you bigs girls blouse), I hope you are worki ng hardb with all the othert seaman.          

You're up late, Gent...

The keyboard is kinda tough this time of morning, huh?

I never sleep mate - Im like a ? hmmmmmmm

say hello to Billy Bob.

Got a better idea: Let's say hello to our pal Tom Merton?

BTW - where's that 67 page dissertation you were writing?

Please don't forget.....there's only one country in the world that has already dropped a nuke on innocent women and children

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Excuse me! You really had the gall to say that! You don't know your history, and I'd be thankful if you'd keep your mouth shut until you do!

Please don't forget.....there's only one country in the world that has already dropped a nuke on innocent women and children

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Although I believe it to be 2 nukes during WWII, do you think that it would have ended the war any quicker if the US had not done this. Maybe a better question would be: Do you believe that it saved more ALLIED forces by dropping these bombs. It's not a cut and dry world. You seem to be at least a couple of years older than I and I for one, would have thought you or at least your parents were happy to see the WAR end sooner than later. War is not a pretty thing and this war on terrorism is hurting everyone. I just think that the muslim religion ITSELF needs to do more to get the respect from the rest of the world that THEY are not just turning a BLIND EYE to what is happenning.

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I agree up to a point. What I was trying to get across is that Bush's holier than thou attitude is all wrong. If you stop and think about it a little, Sadam Hussien had more constitutional right to march into Washington and demand to see the USA's weapons of mass destuction,than Bush had to attack Iraq. After all we know they have them, and WILL USE them if the need arises against anyone that gets in their way. We don't know if Iraq has them,or will use them . Okay I agree Saddam was probably a monster, but only to his own people, who, incidently have lost their hate of Saddam and now hate the man who freed them. In fact the whole world is in greater turmoil through countries sticking their noses in where it is not wanted. So there.

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They were not nukes, they were atomic. Nukes weren't developed until the 1950s.

Do still have a healthy fear of the Japanese, or Germans? Do you think that neither of them would have done the same thing to win? Einstien was German, he went to the U.S. where he helped develop the atom bombs. What if Hitler had found a way to get him to help German develop those bombs, you don't think Hitler would have used them?

Please don't forget.....there's only one country in the world that has already dropped a nuke on innocent women and children

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Excuse me! You really had the gall to say that! You don't know your history, and I'd be thankful if you'd keep your mouth shut until you do!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

.,....I......can't.......take....it......anymore.....-Urrghh! Aarchkkk!

Off, I was being roped in and nearly - so nearly...- got involved....

kayo

Please don't forget.....there's only one country in the world that has already dropped a nuke on innocent women and children

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Excuse me! You really had the gall to say that! You don't know your history, and I'd be thankful if you'd keep your mouth shut until you do!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

.,....I......can't.......take....it......anymore.....-Urrghh! Aarchkkk!

Off, I was being roped in and nearly - so nearly...- got involved....

kayo

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Please tell me what stopped you. Do you believe, like some others here, that Americans want to use nukes to get what we want?

I find the comments made by Lampard10 to be unfair. I don't think that he really knows the history of that time, or is choosing to ignore what doesn't jive with his own beliefs. And to group all Americans into one because of one d1ck head from Texas, is also unfair.

I felt he was, politely, attacking Americans, I had to say something. I know must here would be very mad if posters went around taking stabs at others countries.

.,....I......can't.......take....it......anymore.....-Urrghh! Aarchkkk!

Off, I was being roped in and nearly - so nearly...- got involved....

kayo  

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Please tell me what stopped you. Do you believe, like some others here, that Americans want to use nukes to get what we want?

I find the comments made by Lampard10 to be unfair. I don't think that he really knows the history of that time, or is choosing to ignore what doesn't jive with his own beliefs. And to group all Americans into one because of one d1ck head from Texas, is also unfair.

I felt he was, politely, attacking Americans, I had to say something. I know must here would be very mad if posters went around taking stabs at others countries.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Alright, fair enough. i never can refuse an invite .

No, I don't believe that the North Americans wanted, as such, to use just devestating weapons. I do, however, believe that the relevant decision makers at that time, and and only they, did really want to use their brand new toy, the one they'd spent a lot of time and money developing, in anticipation of other nations getting the toy first. ie: a race, to develop a weapon of mass destruction by some of the supposedly world leaders.

Agreed, that lampards sweeping comments are to be expanded upon, if they are to be taken seriously. A sweeping generalisation in my books does not a discussion make. There would be no options available to any parties privvy to it.

That the desire to respond exists many a time in many a discussion, I do not deny. Especially at the bar I tend. I try to avoid or ignore the pettier comments, which yours were not. I respect your comments, and you've managed to bring me in.

And here is the why, "Please tell me what stopped you" of my above humerous quote.

I don't know what all the fuss is about. Lampard10 is absolutely correct when he posted, "there's only one country in the world that has already dropped a nuke on innocent women and children", and that country was the good ol' US of A. They dropped the bomb on cities filled with innocent women and children, and innocent men as well I might add, and to try to deny this is insanity or at least gross ignorance. When they dropped these bombs they knew full well that they were killing innocent people and they decided that the sacrifice was worth the benefit. You can argue until the cows come home as to whether they were moral in their evaluation of the cost benefit ratio...but...it is a well documented and undeniable fact that the US of A did drop two nuclear devices on two Japanese cities filled with innocent people knowing full well that they would kill hundreds of thousands of them.

They also dropped 1000's of bombs on Iraq and have killed more people than Saddam did. It seems a funny way to help the people.

Lets also not forget that many of these "bombs" were depleted uranium shells.

They also dropped 1000's of bombs on Iraq and have killed more people than Saddam did. It seems a funny way to help the people.

Lets also not forget that many of these "bombs" were depleted uranium shells. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

It doesn't really matter now. The yanks are about to leave the place and it will soon turn into a ###### hole with many more deads. What a great way to help the Iraqi people. I guess the invasion plan didn't go as expected. Like we didn't tell them so 3 years ago

People never learn

I don't know what all the fuss is about.  Lampard10 is absolutely correct when he posted, "there's only one country in the world that has already dropped a nuke on innocent women and children", and that country was the good ol' US of A.  They dropped the bomb on cities filled with innocent women and children, and innocent men as well I might add, and to try to deny this is insanity or at least gross ignorance.  When they dropped these bombs they knew full well that they were killing innocent people and they decided that the sacrifice was worth the benefit.  You can argue until the cows come home as to whether they were moral in their evaluation of the cost benefit ratio...but...it is a well documented and undeniable fact that the US of A did drop two nuclear devices on two Japanese cities filled with innocent people knowing full well that they would kill hundreds of thousands of them.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

That's the exact definition of terrorism. Killing civilians to further your agenda. Mind you that the other "Allies" were also guilty of those same acts over in Germany.

I don't know what all the fuss is about.  Lampard10 is absolutely correct when he posted, "there's only one country in the world that has already dropped a nuke on innocent women and children", and that country was the good ol' US of A.  They dropped the bomb on cities filled with innocent women and children, and innocent men as well I might add, and to try to deny this is insanity or at least gross ignorance.  When they dropped these bombs they knew full well that they were killing innocent people and they decided that the sacrifice was worth the benefit.  You can argue until the cows come home as to whether they were moral in their evaluation of the cost benefit ratio...but...it is a well documented and undeniable fact that the US of A did drop two nuclear devices on two Japanese cities filled with innocent people knowing full well that they would kill hundreds of thousands of them.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

That's the exact definition of terrorism. Killing civilians to further your agenda. Mind you that the other "Allies" were also guilty of those same acts over in Germany.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Interesting point.

I wonder when this killing of civilians started? Who was responsible?

When was the last war fought in which civilians did not lose their lives?