Can This Land Title Be Changed?

[Azul_Blanco]

My wife took some of her investement money and just purchased a bit of land near her family's home. It's wasn't too much money so I didn't question her too much about the title. I believe it's called a Tor Bor Gor.

She says this:

The land was given to the original owner by the government quite a long time ago. She has paid this person and went to the ampur to change it to her name. The document has been given a new number in her name and she is now waiting on a stamp to make it official which she says will take about 3 months to get. At this point the land is hers but with the title it will have she will not be able to sell it. The land is only for agricultural use.

Also her father helped her arrange the deal and he's an honest guy and holds a admisnistrative position in the local government. He doesn't seem worried about it.

I'm much more familiar with Chanot and Nor Sor Sam but then again you do pay the premium for a good land title. Has anyone had any experience with the above mentioned type of title? My wife claims that if she does have a crop grown on it and pays taxes on that income that she can eventually have the title changed (upgraded). True?

Thanks.

.

[69_68iou1]

lookingt at land titles:

here is what I have found out so far:

Chanott titles, issued by the Provincial office of the Thailand Department, are accurately surveyed, plotted in relation to a national survey grid and also marked by unique numbered marker posts set in the ground. It is the long term goal of the Land Department, that all land in Thailand will be covered under the Chanott title system, but with currently available funds, manpower and resources this process will take several decades to complete.

Most "titles" in rural Thailand are however of the Nor. Sor. Sam or Nor Sor Sam kor (N.S.3) variety and are in the strictest interpretation "land exploration testimonial deeds". They are to all practical purposes land titles deeds (issued and maintained by the Ampher, the District land office) in as much as clear records of ownership are maintained, and that they maybe sold, leased, used as mortgage collateral etc. In the case of the Nor.Sor.Sam. (But not the more recently issued Nor.Sor.Sam.Kor) there is however a requirement that 30 days public notice is necessary before any change of status over the land can be registered.N.S.3. titles are in general less accurately surveyed than Chanott titles. In the case of the older (now increasingly rare N.S.3) titles the boundaries are only recorded in relation to the neighboring plots and survey errors in length of boundary or area of as much as 20% are not unusual.

The newer Nor.Sor.Sam. Kor. Is in general much more accurately surveyed and each plot is crossed referenced to a master survey of the area and a corresponding aerial photograph. For this reason whenever purchasing N.S.3 land which lacks clearly defined physical boundaries it is a wise precaution to ask the owner to stake out the boundary and then ask neighboring land owners to confirm the vendors interpretation of the boundary do not rely solely on the drawing on the deed.

The Chanott and the Nor.Sor.Sam.Kor. are the only titles over which register able right of ownership or lease can exist, and are as such the only once that a prudent foreigner should consider.

Summaries of some of the lesser land title/claims are covered in Understanding Land Titles, Part 2.

Below the Chanott and N.S.3.title outlined in Understanding land Titles, part 1, there are a host of other forms of land claim document such as the Sor.Kor. Nung (S.K.1); the Tor.Bor Tor.Hoc (T.B.T.6) and the Tor.Bor.Tor.5). These rights are essentially a form of squatter or settlers claim, which has been filed with the district office and upon which a small fee has been paid. Unlike the Chanott and N.S.3., it is neither possible to register a sale or lease over these land rights, nor will a bank accept them for collateral and most importantly you cannot apply for (or obtain approval) to build on such land.

In certain circumstances, based on the length of the claim and the user to which the land has been put, it is possible to upgrade these land claims (to N.S.3or Chanott titles. The steps involved is such an application and the number of government departments required to approve such an application (where such approval is often discretionary) is however quite daunting and most definitely not recommended to anyone without the best of connections at the district, provincial and (in many cases) national level.

The more recently issued Sor.Bor. Kor. Titles about which there was such a political scandal in 1997 are very different to the above claims. These are true title deeds, accurately surveyed and pegged (like a Chanott). They may be mortgaged, planning permission for development may be sought and granted. The one significant thing that may not happen with a Sor.Bor.Kor is that it may not be sold or transferred (except under last will and testament). Many of those who claimed and received (and in a few notable cases-had them rescinded) these titles, expect that this limitation will change in time or that the titles can be quickly upgraded to a full Chanott. This is not a universal interpretation of the intention of the new titles and with the Democrat government anxious not to burn its fingers the same way a second time, it is unlikely that any upgrading will granted in the near future.

[Azul_Blanco]

I apreciate the response. I'm resigned now to not worrying about it. She wanted to do it and I wish her luck. We don't live in the area and it gives her father something to watch over in retirement so everyone seems happy. I was curious though. It all sounds shady when you try to compare it to land use laws in the West, but... mai bpen rai!