FM Surapong Challenged To Launch Probe Into Thaksin's Japanese Visa

[webfact]

PM'S FUGITIVE BROTHER

FM challenged to launch probe into Thaksin's Japanese visa

By The Nation

Democrat Party Leader Abhisit Vejjajiva yesterday challenged Foreign Minister Surapong Towichukchaikul to launch a fact-finding probe into the Thaksin Japanese visa controversy.

Abhisit was responding to Surapong's planning to file a libel suit against the Democrat Party leader and executive board today over accusations he lobbied Japan to issue a visiting visa for ex-pm Thaksin Shinawatra. Surapong will also file a complaint accusing Abhisit of filing a fault report.

"I want to ask if (the Foreign Minister) will file a suit against Japan or not since the country exposed (the revelation). Surapong clearly abused authority. Our party legal team is launching an impeachment proceeding against him,'' Abhisit said.

Pheu Thai Party spokesman Prompong Nopparit said if the Democrat Party insisted on accusing Surapong of violating Article 270 of the Constitution by committing malfeasance, and launched impeachment proceedings against the minister, the Pheu Thai Party would file a counter suit and a complaint with the National Anti-Corruption Commission. The party will tomorrow file a complaint with the Election Commission seeking to dissolve the Democrat party since its executive board took part in the wrongdoing, Prompong said.

Democrat Party spokesman Chavanond Intarakomalyasut said the party wondered why Surapong did not file suit against Japan since the country revealed it had issued the visa at the request of the Thai government.

He said it was good the Foreign Minister wanted to take the matter to the court since the case would prove who told the truth and who lied.

"There are only two sides (who gave a conflicting statement). If the Thai government was correct, then the Japanese government told lies,'' he said.

Chavanond said the Pheu Thai was trying to distort the truth with its plan to counter-sue the Democrats and was also trying to divert public attention when it raised the allegation that the 165 mysterious bodies found in Rayong were red shirts killed during the political turmoil. He said police had proven they were victims who died in 1989 by Typhoon Gay.

Abhisit urged fugitive ex-pm Thaksin against using his ties with Cambodia to boost personal interests, following reports that Thaksin has business propositions in the making in several countries and that he was making a trip to Cambodia over a gas and oil deal.

-- The Nation 2011-08-22

[whybother]

So, because the Democrats make an accusation based on the statement of a Japanese minister, the PTP not only want to charge them with defamation, but also want to have the party disbanded.

That's certainly a good way to silence opposition.

[AleG]

So, because the Democrats make an accusation based on the statement of a Japanese minister, the PTP not only want to charge them with defamation, but also want to have the party disbanded.

That's certainly a good way to silence opposition.

Welcome to Thaksicracy.

[Moruya]

So, because the Democrats make an accusation based on the statement of a Japanese minister, the PTP not only want to charge them with defamation, but also want to have the party disbanded.

That's certainly a good way to silence opposition.

Welcome to Thaksicracy.

I hope that Surapong likes having egg on his face because if he gets a double dose for each screw up he makes he's likley to enter the Guinness Book of Records as the world's larget omelette!

[REM]

Each day I'm finding less and less to be proud of in this country. I'm finding even less words to describe the ignorance. Down to one word now....wow.

[OzMick]

I wonder how the Japanese (inscrutable as always) feel about this storm in a tea-cup. Surapong can hardly call them liars after (presumably) they did him a favour - perhaps he plans on blaming Yingluk for making the call.

A suggestion for how the could indicate, mildly, that they are not well pleased - have a uniformed constable stand either side of Thaksin every time he makes a public appearance. After all, he is a convicted fugitive on a special entry visa.

Or they could arrest him after his tour, and offer to extradite him back to Thailand.

[pauljones]

Why is it a problem if Thaksins visits japan or anywhere else?

This is just manufactured outrage so The Nation can continue the attacks until they get their coup.

[whybother]

Why is it a problem if Thaksins visits japan or anywhere else?

This is just manufactured outrage so The Nation can continue the attacks until they get their coup.

The problem is not that Thaksin is visiting Japan.

The problem is that Surapong requested that the Japanese give him a visa.

[rubl]

Why is it a problem if Thaksins visits japan or anywhere else?

This is just manufactured outrage so The Nation can continue the attacks until they get their coup.

In itself k. Thaksin's visit to Japan is no real issue. It's the Thai government and most likely FM Surapong having requested Japan grant a visa, and then lied about having done so. With k. Thaksin still being a 'fugitive criminal' that seems like breaking the law to facilitate a criminals movement.

[OzMick]

Why is it a problem if Thaksins visits japan or anywhere else?

This is just manufactured outrage so The Nation can continue the attacks until they get their coup.

You seem to have lost the plot!

[Misterwhisper]

Why is it a problem if Thaksins visits japan or anywhere else?

This is just manufactured outrage so The Nation can continue the attacks until they get their coup.

In itself k. Thaksin's visit to Japan is no real issue. It's the Thai government and most likely FM Surapong having requested Japan grant a visa, and then lied about having done so. With k. Thaksin still being a 'fugitive criminal' that seems like breaking the law to facilitate a criminals movement.

I agree with rubi. Nobody blinks an eyebrow if Thaksin travels the world with one of his acquired passports (and he has done so extensively). The issue is that Japan has a clear policy NOT to grant an entry visa to people who have been sentenced in their own countries to a jail term exceeding 1 year. However, Thailand reportedly put the Japanese government under diplomatic pressure by requesting a visa for Thaksin, thereby officially aiding a convicted felon. THAT is the issue. Would pauljones find it correct if his own government lobbied another country to grant a visa for a fugitive from his country's law?

[Colin Yai]

So, because the Democrats make an accusation based on the statement of a Japanese minister, the PTP not only want to charge them with defamation, but also want to have the party disbanded.

That's certainly a good way to silence opposition.

Welcome to Thaksicracy.

AG Are you suggesting that the Jap Minister lied?

, why should he do that?, He has nothing to gain, whereas if Surapong "comes clean" he has everything to lose!!.

Edited August 22, 2011 by Colin Yai

[hammered]

I wonder how the Japanese (inscrutable as always) feel about this storm in a tea-cup. Surapong can hardly call them liars after (presumably) they did him a favour - perhaps he plans on blaming Yingluk for making the call.

A suggestion for how the could indicate, mildly, that they are not well pleased - have a uniformed constable stand either side of Thaksin every time he makes a public appearance. After all, he is a convicted fugitive on a special entry visa.

Or they could arrest him after his tour, and offer to extradite him back to Thailand.

As long as Japan has good relations with the government in Thailand, all else is irrelvant. Japan wants to take care of its interests and isnt really worried about anything else

[Gary A]

The democrats are genuine experts at filing frivolous suits and manipulating the courts.

It still amazes me that they were able to depose a PM for hosting a cooking show of all things.

[Buchholz]

Why is it a problem if Thaksins visits japan or anywhere else?

This is just manufactured outrage so The Nation can continue the attacks until they get their coup.

In itself k. Thaksin's visit to Japan is no real issue. It's the Thai government and most likely FM Surapong having requested Japan grant a visa, and then lied about having done so. With k. Thaksin still being a 'fugitive criminal' that seems like breaking the law to facilitate a criminals movement.

I agree with rubi. Nobody blinks an eyebrow if Thaksin travels the world with one of his acquired passports (and he has done so extensively). The issue is that Japan has a clear policy NOT to grant an entry visa to people who have been sentenced in their own countries to a jail term exceeding 1 year. However, Thailand reportedly put the Japanese government under diplomatic pressure by requesting a visa for Thaksin, thereby officially aiding a convicted felon. THAT is the issue. Would pauljones find it correct if his own government lobbied another country to grant a visa for a fugitive from his country's law?

An additional factor is the originator of the request for the visa, which was Thaksin himself.

The request was relayed to his cousin, the FM (by whatever means), who then made the request to Japan to grant the visa.

It's directly working for a convicted fugitive. (AKA aiding and abetting)

Before the backtracking when, before Japan spilled the beans, he was saying...

Surpong Tovijakchaikul, Thailand’s new foreign minister, said Mr. Thaksin had requested the visa on his own.

- New York Times / August 15, 2011

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/16/world/asia/16thaksin.html?_r=1

.

Edited August 22, 2011 by Buchholz

[animatic]

Foreign Minister threatens to sue the Shadow government

for exposing IN Thailand things said by a foreign government publicly

about the F.M. designate of Thailand's actions prior to his full installment.

So ignoring that a proper shadow governments job is to do JUST THAT, keep watch and keep the serving government with in legal parameters. How can he imagine threatening to sue MP's in the Shadow Government, for announcing the reasoning to move to impeach him has ANY legal grounds, especially considering MP immunity and Shadow Gov. duty to do so?

If the facts as repeated in several instances are accurate, then likely the guy is toast, but seemingly doesn't realize it yet.

Thought the ludicrous nature of demanding he investigate his own actions, on a dare, is high black comedy....

[jayboy]

An additional factor is the originator of the request for the visa, which was Thaksin himself.

The request was relayed to his cousin, the FM (by whatever means), who then made the request to Japan to grant the visa.

It's directly working for a convicted fugitive. (AKA aiding and abetting)

One tempted to respond to this post that Japan should also be be accused of aiding and abetting.Let's all gather at the Japanese embassy with Dr Tui and his gang of crazies to protest.Let's call for a boycott of wasabi and Toyotas.

Back in the real world,the Government of Japan is a serious and major player.Japan is not a country which takes actions against its own interests, and if there was a view in Tokyo that a visa should not be granted, it would not be granted.As de Gaulle once pointed out the state is a cold creature.

On our own parochial stage there will obviously be yapping noises, usually from those who realise the recent election represented a slap in the face for the political viewpoint they espouse.

[animatic]

The democrats are genuine experts at filing frivolous suits and manipulating the courts.

It still amazes me that they were able to depose a PM for hosting a cooking show of all things.

He was removed by Thaksin and replaced with Somchai.

Samak was found guilty in court of conflict of interest as PM,

and had to resign. BUT could have been re-elected

by parliament as PM the very next day... A seamless transition.

His OWN PARTY PPP aka Thaksin Inc,. did not reappoint him.

"Deposed" means to take a legal statement under oath and under questioning,

and Samak lied while being 'deposed' and that is what got him into court,

He lied under oath and got caught which forced his resignation,

but not his permanent removal as PM... Thaksin did that.

Now this Surapong incident, probably a debacle, is much more like Noppadoms early exit from the Samak Cabinet. It appears Surapong took actions he legally had no standing to take, and the contravened Thai laws. And that parallels Noppadoms signing the Temple demarcation treaty with Cambodia, without legal authority to do so. Bye bye Noppadom, soon to become Thaksin's rope-a-dope public mouth propaganda outlet piece.

Wonder what next title Surapong will be holding in the Thaksin Machine?

Edited August 22, 2011 by animatic

[whybother]

The democrats are genuine experts at filing frivolous suits and manipulating the courts.

It still amazes me that they were able to depose a PM for hosting a cooking show of all things.

Frivolous? Do you think the PM should be able to have a second paid job AND to lie to the courts about it?

Do you also think that a minister should be able to request another country to give a visa to a convicted criminal?

It seems that the Thaksin proxy party is good at filing frivolous law suits, with their defamation suit against Abhisit AND a call to disband the Democrats, all because the Japanese said that the Thai government requested they give Thaksin a visa.

[Buchholz]

An additional factor is the originator of the request for the visa, which was Thaksin himself.

The request was relayed to his cousin, the FM (by whatever means), who then made the request to Japan to grant the visa.

It's directly working for a convicted fugitive. (AKA aiding and abetting)

the Government of Japan is a serious and major player.Japan is not a country which takes actions against its own interests, and if there was a view in Tokyo that a visa should not be granted, it would not be granted.As de Gaulle once pointed out the state is a cold creature.

- flames omitted -

Which is why Abhisit is asking why Surapong doesn't sue Japan also... (for telling the truth).

[tragickingdom]

The world challenged Abhisit to launch a probe in the mass murder of demonstrators. We all know the whitewash outcome. Japan was till a few minutes ago an independent Nation..... Did Abhisit's boss Suthep know?

[whybother]

The world challenged Abhisit to launch a probe in the mass murder of demonstrators. We all know the whitewash outcome. Japan was till a few minutes ago an independent Nation..... Did Abhisit's boss Suthep know?

There is an ongoing investigation into the 2010 protests. Nothing has been whitewashed. That will be up to the current government.

The issue here isn't that Japan issued a visa for Thaksin. It's that Surapong requested them to. But you already knew that, didn't you.

[rubl]

One tempted to respond to this post that Japan should also be be accused of aiding and abetting.Let's all gather at the Japanese embassy with Dr Tui and his gang of crazies to protest.Let's call for a boycott of wasabi and Toyotas.

Back in the real world,the Government of Japan is a serious and major player.Japan is not a country which takes actions against its own interests, and if there was a view in Tokyo that a visa should not be granted, it would not be granted.As de Gaulle once pointed out the state is a cold creature.

On our own parochial stage there will obviously be yapping noises, usually from those who realise the recent election represented a slap in the face for the political viewpoint they espouse.

As I and a few more posters have indicated, the problem is not that the Japanese government granted k. Thaksin a visa. The problem is that the Thai government requested the Japanese government grant him one. The problem gets even more serious with the FM lying about it. Whatever one may think of the conviction and sentencing to two years imprisonment of k. Thaksin, it makes him a criminal and jumping bail just before sentencing a fugitive. The Thai government has been seen to help a fugitive criminal whereas they are supposed to upheld the law, not break it.

So, no need to protest at the Japanese Embassy, take your protest placard to Government House.

A word of advise and warning, my dear friend. If FM Surapong would elect to sue you for defamation, deportation is a real possibility. Life can be harsh for farang here in Thailand

[Bakseedaa]

Why is it a problem if Thaksins visits japan or anywhere else?

This is just manufactured outrage so The Nation can continue the attacks until they get their coup.

K Thaksin is a convicted criminal on the run from a 2 year sentence... would Japan issue you a visa if you were a criminal on the run..?

[Bakseedaa]

I wonder how the Japanese (inscrutable as always) feel about this storm in a tea-cup. Surapong can hardly call them liars after (presumably) they did him a favour - perhaps he plans on blaming Yingluk for making the call.

A suggestion for how the could indicate, mildly, that they are not well pleased - have a uniformed constable stand either side of Thaksin every time he makes a public appearance. After all, he is a convicted fugitive on a special entry visa.

Or they could arrest him after his tour, and offer to extradite him back to Thailand.

As long as Japan has good relations with the government in Thailand, all else is irrelvant. Japan wants to take care of its interests and isnt really worried about anything else

Did your wife tell you that piece of nonsense..?

[rubl]

Does anyone know if FM Surapong or anyone else of the government or Pheu Thai filed a defamation case against the Dem's today, as was said yesterday? I can imagine k. Surapong didn't have time today to do so personally. He's probably busy preparing for the coming two days of policy statements and debate

[JohnAllan]

Government would fare much better, were the oppositon - whether Democrats or Pheu Thai - to concentrate on the job of GOVERNING, as in administering, and OPPOSING, as in exerting some control over government excesses. But this being Thailand, no politician seems able top get beyond the irrelevant and the absurd.

That said, Surapong's actions, to date, strongly suggest that he is in office for no better reason than to serve Thaksin's interests. But then, as far as the Japanese visa affair is concerned, the Japanese, in issuing the visa, have overridden their OWN law.

[rubl]

Government would fare much better, were the oppositon - whether Democrats or Pheu Thai - to concentrate on the job of GOVERNING, as in administering, and OPPOSING, as in exerting some control over government excesses. But this being Thailand, no politician seems able top get beyond the irrelevant and the absurd.

That said, Surapong's actions, to date, strongly suggest that he is in office for no better reason than to serve Thaksin's interests. But then, as far as the Japanese visa affair is concerned, the Japanese, in issuing the visa, have overridden their OWN law.

"Japan does not allow the entry of people who have been found guilty of a crime and sentenced to jail terms of more than one year, but the government occasionally makes exceptions. In light of the request from the Thai government and various related considerations, we have decided to issue a visa."

http://news.xin.msn.com/en/regional/thailand/article.aspx?cp-documentid=5161736

Most likely the law has provisions allowing exceptions if in the interest of the country. A request from a befriended country in which there is a large economical interest would fulfill criteria for an exception, I would assume.

Edited August 22, 2011 by rubl

[jayboy]

As I and a few more posters have indicated, the problem is not that the Japanese government granted k. Thaksin a visa. The problem is that the Thai government requested the Japanese government grant him one. The problem gets even more serious with the FM lying about it. Whatever one may think of the conviction and sentencing to two years imprisonment of k. Thaksin, it makes him a criminal and jumping bail just before sentencing a fugitive. The Thai government has been seen to help a fugitive criminal whereas they are supposed to upheld the law, not break it.

So, no need to protest at the Japanese Embassy, take your protest placard to Government House.

A word of advise and warning, my dear friend. If FM Surapong would elect to sue you for defamation, deportation is a real possibility. Life can be harsh for farang here in Thailand

I don't think Thaksin has been that astute in all this, but it's hardly the biggest challenge facing Thailand.Many of those bitter with defeat at the last election are desperate to latch on to some legality to unseat the government given the failure to persuade the Thai people at the last election of their way of thinking. If it's not Thaksin's visa it will be something else.Any excuse will do rather than accept the popular verdict.As to the location of protest suggest address Dr Tui and his deranged acolytes who were picketing the Japanese Embassy.

No idea what your reference to Surapong means.I haven't even mentioned him.

[rubl]

As I and a few more posters have indicated, the problem is not that the Japanese government granted k. Thaksin a visa. The problem is that the Thai government requested the Japanese government grant him one. The problem gets even more serious with the FM lying about it. Whatever one may think of the conviction and sentencing to two years imprisonment of k. Thaksin, it makes him a criminal and jumping bail just before sentencing a fugitive. The Thai government has been seen to help a fugitive criminal whereas they are supposed to upheld the law, not break it.

So, no need to protest at the Japanese Embassy, take your protest placard to Government House.

A word of advise and warning, my dear friend. If FM Surapong would elect to sue you for defamation, deportation is a real possibility. Life can be harsh for farang here in Thailand

I don't think Thaksin has been that astute in all this, but it's hardly the biggest challenge facing Thailand. Many of those bitter with defeat at the last election are desperate to latch on to some legality to unseat the government given the failure to persuade the Thai people at the last election of their way of thinking. If it's not Thaksin's visa it will be something else.Any excuse will do rather than accept the popular verdict.As to the location of protest suggest address Dr Tui and his deranged acolytes who were picketing the Japanese Embassy.

No idea what your reference to Surapong means.I haven't even mentioned him.

"Many of those bitter with defeat at the last election are desperate" is off topic. Asking what my reference to FM Surapong means is obtuse. You didn't mention him, but he is part of the topic. Since you suggested people protest at the Japanese Embassy, I gave reasoning why protesting at Government House would be more to the point. Since I suggested you might do so, I felt the need to warn you as well, FM Surapong is in a suing mood.

It's really amazing the length some people go to either justify 'this is not about Thaksin' or to try to deflect with accusing others of being desperate.

PS did FM Surapong find the time to file the defamation case against the Dem's, or did he drop it in the spirit of reconciliation and democracy

Edited August 22, 2011 by rubl