Australian Charity Head Accused Of Faking The Rescue Of Thai Hill Tribe Children Resigns

[kerryk]

Within the last 6 months...don't remember when exactly... my Thai wife and I watched a Thai documentary on an organized child sex prositution ring that the Thai police had broken up. The girls shown were between 13 and 25. Many of the girls were not Thai...Burmese, Lao, but some Thai girls from tribal areas also. Most of the male clients were Thai, the people who ran the ring were Thai also. The girls were kept locked in their rooms and the "clients" brought to the girls rooms. Not all the girls were forced to participate, but many were...that is to say they may originally have become prostitutes voluntarily....but all of them is this sex prositution ring were not allowed to leave, no matter why they originally started prostitution. They were kept in that building, not allowed to go outside the building without male "gaurds" to escort them, and locked into their rooms at night when not "working". Of course, they themselves were not paid...all the money went to their "managers" who ran the place.ocassionaly they recieved small sums of money to buy personal items, and were given new clothes so they would look "nice" to the clients.

I don't remember exactly where this took place, but it was in Northwestern Thailand. The documentary was presented on Thai television, the Thai PBS station.

If that's not considered Thai sex slavery...what is?

This whole ducumentary was in Thai...so I had to follow it on a running commentary in broken English from my Thai wife.

Don't fool yourself, it still happens today. It's just that most Farangs and tourists don't see it...because it is delibertely hidden from them.

But as to the original point...yes, often those wanting to do a "good" thing get carried away by their enthusiasm and fabricate "evidence" or deliberately enhance the dramatic effect to sell their story to the public.

That's stupid...because the facts are bad enough. All they really had to do was just to film it, no enhancement needed.

The one you watched could just be another fake documentry. Just like the Aussie one.

Maybe fake, maybe old, maybe shot in another country. Does anyone really think a brothel owner in Thailand would allow someone to film women held prisoner???

[meithai]

This is scary, what some missionaries are doing in Thailand...

Too many topless women not blur out. This video should have a warning rating of 18+.

What a silly comment!

[kerryk]

Sex trafficing is both a global problem, and increasing. Have you already forgotten the recent case in Thailand of the Malaysian girl and her Burmese companions. The 6 people convicted in the UK last week? I will be kind and call you unaware.

No, I have not forgotten the case about the Malaysian girl.  Anyone want to bet she gets arrested for telling porkies?? I bet the headline will read, "Teenagers kidnap scam."

Edited March 27, 2012 by kerryk

[elwood]

This is scary, what some missionaries are doing in Thailand...

Too many topless women not blur out. This video should have a warning rating of 18+.

What a silly comment!

Agreed - this documentary deserves intelligent comment, not some dumbarse being clever(?)

Thanks for showing it.

[Jessi]

A lot of people think that those involved in the grey man do so only for money. How many realise that only one person actually gets paid by the organisation and that person is a THAI. Yes a Thai man at the Bangkok office unlike all the others he doesn't give up his free time and expects to be paid to help his own people.. All the others in the organisation pay for everything out of thier own pockets, airfares, accomadation, food, car hire everything. They could be spending thier holidays laying on a beach in Thailand or drinking in a bar with 1/2 dozen bargirls on thier knees like a lot of those who condem what they try to do. How many who critisise have actually stood up in a train/bus to give thier seat to an elderly frail person? How many are the 60+ expats who have gone to the villages and paid for (sinsot) thier 19 yr old brides? This isn't helping the poor Thais this is self gratification.

A number of those involved in the Greyman are actually serving police officers from the various states and territories of Australia who require written authority from thier Chief Commissioners to perform outside work be it paid or charity. Authority that will not be granted unless the organisation has been thoughly investigated. The Chairperson of the greyman is a senior Federal Court judge and the organisation has the backing of the Australian Federal Government and all donations are tax deductable.

Some say that people should donate to the education of children instead of giving to NGO's and that is a fair point. How many realise that the majority of the money raised by the grey man actually goes into education/housing programs for the children who agree to be removed from thier situations. Money that is passed onto other organisations that take the children into thier care. The finacial records which are thoughly audited by the Australian Government are available under the Freedom of Information Act.

I am in know way associated with the Greyman or preaching the cause but have done just a little research and do know serving police who are associated with it. Everyone is entitled to an opinion but I do think it is a little foolish to condem something that you know absolutely nothing about. Yes I agree that some of the NGO's scoop all the cream off the top. I have a friend that worked for a Christian NGO in Kosovo and was paid 150K U.S tax free and flew 1st class. Lets not throw all NGO's into the same barrel and slap a lid on it. Some such as the greyman do not pay thier staff anything.

Its like a breath of fresh air seeing someone on thaivisa.com that actually knows what he/she is talking about. 92% of donations to greyman.org go to helping the children & that is in public record.

[kerryk]

A lot of people think that those involved in the grey man do so only for money.  How many realise that only one person actually gets paid by the organisation and that person is a THAI.  Yes a Thai man at the Bangkok office unlike all the others he doesn't give up his free time and expects to be paid to help his own people..  All the others in the organisation pay for everything out of thier own pockets, airfares, accomadation, food, car hire everything.  They could be spending thier holidays laying on a beach in Thailand or drinking in a bar with 1/2 dozen bargirls on thier knees like a lot of those who condem what they try to do.  How many who critisise have actually stood up in a train/bus to give thier seat to an elderly frail person?   How many are the 60+ expats who have gone to the villages and paid for (sinsot) thier 19 yr old brides?  This isn't helping the poor Thais this is self gratification.

A number of those involved in the Greyman are actually serving police officers from the various states and territories of Australia who require written authority from thier Chief Commissioners to perform outside work be it paid or charity.  Authority that will not be granted unless the organisation has been thoughly investigated.  The Chairperson of the greyman is a senior Federal Court judge and the organisation has the backing of the Australian Federal Government and all donations are tax deductable.

Some say that people should donate to the education of children instead of giving to NGO's and that is a fair point.  How many realise that the majority of the money raised by the grey man actually goes into education/housing programs for the children who agree to be removed from thier situations.  Money that is passed onto other organisations that take the children into thier care.  The finacial records which are thoughly audited by the Australian Government are available under the Freedom of Information Act.

I am in know way associated with the Greyman or  preaching the cause but have done just a little research and do know serving police who are associated with it.  Everyone is entitled to an opinion but I do think it is a little foolish to condem something that you know absolutely nothing about.  Yes I agree that some of the NGO's scoop all the cream off the top.  I have a friend that worked for a Christian NGO in Kosovo and was paid 150K U.S tax free and flew 1st class.  Lets not throw all NGO's into the same barrel and slap a lid on it.  Some such as the greyman do not pay thier staff anything.

Its like a breath of fresh air seeing someone on thaivisa.com that actually knows what he/she is talking about. 92% of donations to greyman.org  go to helping the children & that is in public record.

Jessie maybe you didn't read the topic of the thread. It is not about Grey Man stealing money. It is about him faking the rescue of hill tribe children which the Thai cops have accused him of and the fact that he resigned as a result. Hope this helps.

[samsiam]

and the Thai police are exemplary standup citizens..... 3 cheers

[kerryk]

and the Thai police are exemplary standup citizens..... 3 cheers

Well good. You are implying that you know. Did Grey Man rescue the kids in the photo like he said he did? That is what this is all about I think.

[oldsailor35]

chooka >> The post explains why.

no it does not...

Not to me it did'nt

[oldsailor35]

A lot of people think that those involved in the grey man do so only for money. How many realise that only one person actually gets paid by the organisation and that person is a THAI. Yes a Thai man at the Bangkok office unlike all the others he doesn't give up his free time and expects to be paid to help his own people.. All the others in the organisation pay for everything out of thier own pockets, airfares, accomadation, food, car hire everything. They could be spending thier holidays laying on a beach in Thailand or drinking in a bar with 1/2 dozen bargirls on thier knees like a lot of those who condem what they try to do. How many who critisise have actually stood up in a train/bus to give thier seat to an elderly frail person? How many are the 60+ expats who have gone to the villages and paid for (sinsot) thier 19 yr old brides? This isn't helping the poor Thais this is self gratification.

A number of those involved in the Greyman are actually serving police officers from the various states and territories of Australia who require written authority from thier Chief Commissioners to perform outside work be it paid or charity. Authority that will not be granted unless the organisation has been thoughly investigated. The Chairperson of the greyman is a senior Federal Court judge and the organisation has the backing of the Australian Federal Government and all donations are tax deductable.

Some say that people should donate to the education of children instead of giving to NGO's and that is a fair point. How many realise that the majority of the money raised by the grey man actually goes into education/housing programs for the children who agree to be removed from thier situations. Money that is passed onto other organisations that take the children into thier care. The finacial records which are thoughly audited by the Australian Government are available under the Freedom of Information Act.

I am in know way associated with the Greyman or preaching the cause but have done just a little research and do know serving police who are associated with it. Everyone is entitled to an opinion but I do think it is a little foolish to condem something that you know absolutely nothing about. Yes I agree that some of the NGO's scoop all the cream off the top. I have a friend that worked for a Christian NGO in Kosovo and was paid 150K U.S tax free and flew 1st class. Lets not throw all NGO's into the same barrel and slap a lid on it. Some such as the greyman do not pay thier staff anything.

Its like a breath of fresh air seeing someone on thaivisa.com that actually knows what he/she is talking about. 92% of donations to greyman.org go to helping the children & that is in public record.

Jessie maybe you didn't read the topic of the thread. It is not about Grey Man stealing money. It is about him faking the rescue of hill tribe children which the Thai cops have accused him of and the fact that he resigned as a result. Hope this helps.

Yes Kerryk...........but many in here are trying to say that The Grey Man Org is not trustworthy. And as has been said,it is purely a volunteer org and just about every penny goes to kids in Thailand, not many charities can say that can they.

[oldsailor35]

It would be good if Sean would make a statement her to explain his situation. This man is an honest hard working person, with helping underprivileged kids his sole aim. Did he make an innocent mistake ? maybe yes, but don't we all. What that man has done for kids in Thailand far outweighs the efforts of the usual crop of 'knockers' in TV.

One innocent error in years of struggle and the "hang em high" mob come swarming out like locusts.

[kerryk]

A lot of people think that those involved in the grey man do so only for money.  How many realise that only one person actually gets paid by the organisation and that person is a THAI.  Yes a Thai man at the Bangkok office unlike all the others he doesn't give up his free time and expects to be paid to help his own people..  All the others in the organisation pay for everything out of thier own pockets, airfares, accomadation, food, car hire everything.  They could be spending thier holidays laying on a beach in Thailand or drinking in a bar with 1/2 dozen bargirls on thier knees like a lot of those who condem what they try to do.  How many who critisise have actually stood up in a train/bus to give thier seat to an elderly frail person?   How many are the 60+ expats who have gone to the villages and paid for (sinsot) thier 19 yr old brides?  This isn't helping the poor Thais this is self gratification.

A number of those involved in the Greyman are actually serving police officers from the various states and territories of Australia who require written authority from thier Chief Commissioners to perform outside work be it paid or charity.  Authority that will not be granted unless the organisation has been thoughly investigated.  The Chairperson of the greyman is a senior Federal Court judge and the organisation has the backing of the Australian Federal Government and all donations are tax deductable.

Some say that people should donate to the education of children instead of giving to NGO's and that is a fair point.  How many realise that the majority of the money raised by the grey man actually goes into education/housing programs for the children who agree to be removed from thier situations.  Money that is passed onto other organisations that take the children into thier care.  The finacial records which are thoughly audited by the Australian Government are available under the Freedom of Information Act.

I am in know way associated with the Greyman or  preaching the cause but have done just a little research and do know serving police who are associated with it.  Everyone is entitled to an opinion but I do think it is a little foolish to condem something that you know absolutely nothing about.  Yes I agree that some of the NGO's scoop all the cream off the top.  I have a friend that worked for a Christian NGO in Kosovo and was paid 150K U.S tax free and flew 1st class.  Lets not throw all NGO's into the same barrel and slap a lid on it.  Some such as the greyman do not pay thier staff anything.

Its like a breath of fresh air seeing someone on thaivisa.com that actually knows what he/she is talking about. 92% of donations to greyman.org  go to helping the children & that is in public record.

Jessie maybe you didn't read the topic of the thread.  It is not about Grey Man stealing money.  It is about him faking the rescue of hill tribe children which the Thai cops have accused him of and the fact that he resigned as a result.  Hope this helps.

Yes Kerryk...........but many in here are trying to say that The Grey Man Org is not trustworthy. And as has been said,it is purely a volunteer org and just about every penny goes to kids in Thailand, not many charities can say that can they.

Grey man does not seem like a dishonest organization to me. I certainly never said so. If it is it is a difficult way to con people. I know it also raids brothels in Australia that are involved in trafficking women from other countries in Asia, not Thailand. I would imagine that Australia because of its income and proximity to poor countries would be a veritable hot bed of trafficked sex slaves and there must be enough work for these officially sponsored vigilantes to do there. I can see Thai police not really knowing what to do with 20 paramilitary guys who don't speak Thai let alone hill tribe dialects. On the other hand I would think the Aussie constabulary would be more than happy to have military and police trained volunteers to dress up in camo and help them raiding whore houses. Maybe I am wrong though. I don't live there. Maybe Australia has no crime and the only thing a crime fighter can do to satisfy that crime fighting urge is to go to Thailand.

[meithai]

This is scary, what some missionaries are doing in Thailand...

Too many topless women not blur out. This video should have a warning rating of 18+.

What a silly comment!

Agreed - this documentary deserves intelligent comment, not some dumbarse being clever(?)

Thanks for showing it.

Thanks Elwood, if you found that interesting, there is a lot of similar info on here: http://akha.org/

[TAWP]

If an organization claims they rescue kids when they do not, why would I believe it when they claim to give 92% of their donations to children?

[geriatrickid]

Jessie maybe you didn't read the topic of the thread. It is not about Grey Man stealing money. It is about him faking the rescue of hill tribe children which the Thai cops have accused him of and the fact that he resigned as a result. Hope this helps.

sorry, but what we have are allegations made by local Thai police. These allegations have yet to be proven.

I find it od that the Thai police who are not known for integrity are immediately assumed to be accurate in their statements.

Here on Phket, there is a cosy relationship between the bars that offer the services of young men and women for sex. I recall sitting and having a drink and there across the area was a guy packing a gun and drinking whiskey. He was an owner of the bar. The same bar where one paid 300 baht to take someone home for boom boom. That is called living off the avails of prostitution. And now here I am expected to accept the allegations of the police who have been repeatedly embarrassed over their inability to control their own misbehaviour and the rampant drug and sex trades.

Forgive me if I wait for the evidence please.

[samsiam]

Jessie maybe you didn't read the topic of the thread. It is not about Grey Man stealing money. It is about him faking the rescue of hill tribe children which the Thai cops have accused him of and the fact that he resigned as a result. Hope this helps.

sorry, but what we have are allegations made by local Thai police. These allegations have yet to be proven.

I find it od that the Thai police who are not known for integrity are immediately assumed to be accurate in their statements.

Here on Phket, there is a cosy relationship between the bars that offer the services of young men and women for sex. I recall sitting and having a drink and there across the area was a guy packing a gun and drinking whiskey. He was an owner of the bar. The same bar where one paid 300 baht to take someone home for boom boom. That is called living off the avails of prostitution. And now here I am expected to accept the allegations of the police who have been repeatedly embarrassed over their inability to control their own misbehaviour and the rampant drug and sex trades.

Forgive me if I wait for the evidence please.

You need to stop stating the obvious for K's benefit....

[metisdead]

An off topic post has been removed as well as the replies.

[kerryk]

Jessie maybe you didn't read the topic of the thread. It is not about Grey Man stealing money. It is about him faking the rescue of hill tribe children which the Thai cops have accused him of and the fact that he resigned as a result. Hope this helps.

sorry, but what we have are allegations made by local Thai police. These allegations have yet to be proven.

I find it od that the Thai police who are not known for integrity are immediately assumed to be accurate in their statements.

Here on Phket, there is a cosy relationship between the bars that offer the services of young men and women for sex. I recall sitting and having a drink and there across the area was a guy packing a gun and drinking whiskey. He was an owner of the bar. The same bar where one paid 300 baht to take someone home for boom boom. That is called living off the avails of prostitution. And now here I am expected to accept the allegations of the police who have been repeatedly embarrassed over their inability to control their own misbehaviour and the rampant drug and sex trades.

Forgive me if I wait for the evidence please.

Question number One, I think you are capable of military style thinking and planning. Who would you get to conduct undercover operations with Hill Tribe children traffickers? Aussie blokes right? They would not stand out, right? Would you perhaps want people who spoke Thai or maybe the local Hill Tribe language?

Question number two, If you were waiting for further investigation would you quit the organization that you founded?

Question number three, What evidence are you waiting for? Where is it going to come from?

Is there some kind of trial we don't know about?

Whoever wanted Grey Man out has apparently won. He is gone. It is over.

The Empower people said it best when they told the story of the NGO's asking for underage girls so often that the managers convinced girls who were not working in that side of the business to switch. A girl who had come to Thailand and got a job as a cashier was, jailed and sent home in disgrace all because she wanted to help her family. The good guys have become the bad guys. There is a thread with a 120 some page current survey done by Thai women in Thailand documenting this fact.

"Hit & Run: Sex Workers' Research on Anti-trafficking in Thailand".

It is a good read, factual, current and done by women about women.

[TAWP]

Did someone just say that we must accept the dis-reputed organizations account of the event, even if the local police oppose it, unless we have much more evidence from other sources?

Strange - shouldn't it be the job of The Grey Men to prove their assertions?

But it doesn't matter - journalists have already done the trip, talked to the kids and the families and the truth is out. The rescue was faked. The photo-op was staged.

What is the defense over this?

[chooka]

A lot of people think that those involved in the grey man do so only for money. How many realise that only one person actually gets paid by the organisation and that person is a THAI. Yes a Thai man at the Bangkok office unlike all the others he doesn't give up his free time and expects to be paid to help his own people.. All the others in the organisation pay for everything out of thier own pockets, airfares, accomadation, food, car hire everything. They could be spending thier holidays laying on a beach in Thailand or drinking in a bar with 1/2 dozen bargirls on thier knees like a lot of those who condem what they try to do. How many who critisise have actually stood up in a train/bus to give thier seat to an elderly frail person? How many are the 60+ expats who have gone to the villages and paid for (sinsot) thier 19 yr old brides? This isn't helping the poor Thais this is self gratification.

A number of those involved in the Greyman are actually serving police officers from the various states and territories of Australia who require written authority from thier Chief Commissioners to perform outside work be it paid or charity. Authority that will not be granted unless the organisation has been thoughly investigated. The Chairperson of the greyman is a senior Federal Court judge and the organisation has the backing of the Australian Federal Government and all donations are tax deductable.

Some say that people should donate to the education of children instead of giving to NGO's and that is a fair point. How many realise that the majority of the money raised by the grey man actually goes into education/housing programs for the children who agree to be removed from thier situations. Money that is passed onto other organisations that take the children into thier care. The finacial records which are thoughly audited by the Australian Government are available under the Freedom of Information Act.

I am in know way associated with the Greyman or preaching the cause but have done just a little research and do know serving police who are associated with it. Everyone is entitled to an opinion but I do think it is a little foolish to condem something that you know absolutely nothing about. Yes I agree that some of the NGO's scoop all the cream off the top. I have a friend that worked for a Christian NGO in Kosovo and was paid 150K U.S tax free and flew 1st class. Lets not throw all NGO's into the same barrel and slap a lid on it. Some such as the greyman do not pay thier staff anything.

Forgive me if I am wrong and please feel free to correct me. As far as I know the board of directors of Grey Man asked Sean McBride aka John Curtis the founder of Grey Man to resign because the Thai police in Chiang Mai cut ties with the group siting that the 21 hill tribe children from a village in northern Chiang Rai province were not rescued from prostitution as the charity claimed on its website.It is being reported in many Thai and Aussie newspapers that, "Police from the Chiang Mai police transnational crime unit said more than 20 hill-tribe children from a village in northern Chiang Rai province were not rescued from prostitution as the charity claimed on its website along with appeals for funds."

It is quite normal for CEO's and the like to step down if there is any form of investigation. This is not an admission of any wrong doing but simply allows for a free and open investigation. If he didn't step aside there would be a lot more questions.

[chooka]

Did someone just say that we must accept the dis-reputed organizations account of the event, even if the local police oppose it, unless we have much more evidence from other sources?

Strange - shouldn't it be the job of The Grey Men to prove their assertions?

But it doesn't matter - journalists have already done the trip, talked to the kids and the families and the truth is out. The rescue was faked. The photo-op was staged.

What is the defense over this?

The defence over what? Where is the crime? There is no misappropriation of funds and all books are in order. This is allegations by a disgrunted former Thai employee and the BIB who are concerned about corruption and Australian farangs being scammed. This from probably the most corrupt police in the world who have matresses jammed packed full of tea money scammed from farangs and others. People who drive around in expensive imported luxury vehicles that they purchased on thier 4,000 baht per month wage which has not raised suspicion of corrution in thier own ranks.

[flyingsporran]

Did someone just say that we must accept the dis-reputed organizations account of the event, even if the local police oppose it, unless we have much more evidence from other sources?

Strange - shouldn't it be the job of The Grey Men to prove their assertions?

But it doesn't matter - journalists have already done the trip, talked to the kids and the families and the truth is out. The rescue was faked. The photo-op was staged.

What is the defense over this?

The defence over what? Where is the crime? There is no misappropriation of funds and all books are in order. This is allegations by a disgrunted former Thai employee and the BIB who are concerned about corruption and Australian farangs being scammed. This from probably the most corrupt police in the world who have matresses jammed packed full of tea money scammed from farangs and others. People who drive around in expensive imported luxury vehicles that they purchased on thier 4,000 baht per month wage which has not raised suspicion of corrution in thier own ranks.

On a point of fact this enquiry had nothing to do with a disgruntled former employee although I understand there are a few of them. It started when the Australian press reports of a dramatic rescue of 21 hill tribe children in Chiang Rai reached Thailand and everybody wanted to know what it was all about.

The fact that there are corrupt Thai police is a given but not relevant to this case. Having said that, apart from hyping, and laying on the ex-special forces stuff a bit thick there is no question that 'The Grey Man' and its members and supporters all have good intentions.

Edited March 29, 2012 by flyingsporran

[softgeorge]

Did someone just say that we must accept the dis-reputed organizations account of the event, even if the local police oppose it, unless we have much more evidence from other sources?

Strange - shouldn't it be the job of The Grey Men to prove their assertions?

But it doesn't matter - journalists have already done the trip, talked to the kids and the families and the truth is out. The rescue was faked. The photo-op was staged.

What is the defense over this?

The defence over what? Where is the crime? There is no misappropriation of funds and all books are in order. This is allegations by a disgrunted former Thai employee and the BIB who are concerned about corruption and Australian farangs being scammed. This from probably the most corrupt police in the world who have matresses jammed packed full of tea money scammed from farangs and others. People who drive around in expensive imported luxury vehicles that they purchased on thier 4,000 baht per month wage which has not raised suspicion of corrution in thier own ranks.

On a point of fact this enquiry had nothing to do with a disgruntled former employee although I understand there are a few of them. It started when the Australian press reports of a dramatic rescue of 21 hill tribe children in Chiang Rai reached Thailand and everybody wanted to know what it was all about.

The fact that there are corrupt Thai police is a given but not relevant to this case. Having said that, apart from hyping, and laying on the ex-special forces stuff a bit thick there is no question that 'The Grey Man' and its members and supporters all have good intentions.

Whre did you get your facts? I would be interested to know.

Edited March 29, 2012 by softgeorge

[kerryk]

Did someone just say that we must accept the dis-reputed organizations account of the event, even if the local police oppose it, unless we have much more evidence from other sources?

Strange - shouldn't it be the job of The Grey Men to prove their assertions?

But it doesn't matter - journalists have already done the trip, talked to the kids and the families and the truth is out. The rescue was faked. The photo-op was staged.

What is the defense over this?

The defence over what? Where is the crime? There is no misappropriation of funds and all books are in order. This is allegations by a disgrunted former Thai employee and the BIB who are concerned about corruption and Australian farangs being scammed. This from probably the most corrupt police in the world who have matresses jammed packed full of tea money scammed from farangs and others. People who drive around in expensive imported luxury vehicles that they purchased on thier 4,000 baht per month wage which has not raised suspicion of corrution in thier own ranks.

On a point of fact this enquiry had nothing to do with a disgruntled former employee although I understand there are a few of them. It started when the Australian press reports of a dramatic rescue of 21 hill tribe children in Chiang Rai reached Thailand and everybody wanted to know what it was all about.

The fact that there are corrupt Thai police is a given but not relevant to this case. Having said that, apart from hyping, and laying on the ex-special forces stuff a bit thick there is no question that 'The Grey Man' and its members and supporters all have good intentions.

Whre did you get your facts? I would be interested to know.

George did you read,

"Grey Man President Resigns After Flying Sporran Investigation"

http://www.andrew-dr...ory.php?sid=530

[TAWP]

Did someone just say that we must accept the dis-reputed organizations account of the event, even if the local police oppose it, unless we have much more evidence from other sources?

Strange - shouldn't it be the job of The Grey Men to prove their assertions?

But it doesn't matter - journalists have already done the trip, talked to the kids and the families and the truth is out. The rescue was faked. The photo-op was staged.

What is the defense over this?

The defence over what? Where is the crime? There is no misappropriation of funds and all books are in order. This is allegations by a disgrunted former Thai employee and the BIB who are concerned about corruption and Australian farangs being scammed. This from probably the most corrupt police in the world who have matresses jammed packed full of tea money scammed from farangs and others. People who drive around in expensive imported luxury vehicles that they purchased on thier 4,000 baht per month wage which has not raised suspicion of corrution in thier own ranks.

Defense over faking a rescue to gain founds, perhaps?

I am starting to get worried over the well-being of some of you.

[samsiam]

Thats a tad 'sensational'.....like he resigned as a result of Drummonds investigation.

[softgeorge]

Did someone just say that we must accept the dis-reputed organizations account of the event, even if the local police oppose it, unless we have much more evidence from other sources?

Strange - shouldn't it be the job of The Grey Men to prove their assertions?

But it doesn't matter - journalists have already done the trip, talked to the kids and the families and the truth is out. The rescue was faked. The photo-op was staged.

What is the defense over this?

The defence over what? Where is the crime? There is no misappropriation of funds and all books are in order. This is allegations by a disgrunted former Thai employee and the BIB who are concerned about corruption and Australian farangs being scammed. This from probably the most corrupt police in the world who have matresses jammed packed full of tea money scammed from farangs and others. People who drive around in expensive imported luxury vehicles that they purchased on thier 4,000 baht per month wage which has not raised suspicion of corrution in thier own ranks.

Defense over faking a rescue to gain founds, perhaps?

I am starting to get worried over the well-being of some of you.

You might get a huge shock when this blows up in the face of some Thais

[kerryk]

Thats a tad 'sensational'.....like he resigned as a result of Drummonds investigation.

Feb 18 Drummond ran this story, "Queensland Police investigating The Grey Man Charity" http://www.andrew-drummond.com/view-story-other.php?sid=510

In that story is another story titled Bittersweet charity.

http://www.onlineopinion.com.au/view.asp?article=13243

Which writes, "Scarlet Alliance and other sex worker projects in the region were concerned about The Grey Man’s ad hoc methods and unchecked success claims. We know that raid and rescue operations do not work in assisting victims of trafficking, underage sex workers or exploited workers, we know that in fact raid and rescue operations create further barriers for sex workers in accessing human rights. However The Grey Man’s cowboy image and vigilante operating style caught the public’s imagination.

[BookMan]

Did someone just say that we must accept the dis-reputed organizations account of the event, even if the local police oppose it, unless we have much more evidence from other sources?

Strange - shouldn't it be the job of The Grey Men to prove their assertions?

But it doesn't matter - journalists have already done the trip, talked to the kids and the families and the truth is out. The rescue was faked. The photo-op was staged.

What is the defense over this?

The defence over what? Where is the crime? There is no misappropriation of funds and all books are in order. This is allegations by a disgrunted former Thai employee and the BIB who are concerned about corruption and Australian farangs being scammed. This from probably the most corrupt police in the world who have matresses jammed packed full of tea money scammed from farangs and others. People who drive around in expensive imported luxury vehicles that they purchased on thier 4,000 baht per month wage which has not raised suspicion of corrution in thier own ranks.

Defense over faking a rescue to gain founds, perhaps?

I am starting to get worried over the well-being of some of you.

You might get a huge shock when this blows up in the face of some Thais

How will it blow up in their faces? Are you saying that the the 21 Hill tribe children are in fact victims of child sex trafficking?

[kerryk]

Did someone just say that we must accept the dis-reputed organizations account of the event, even if the local police oppose it, unless we have much more evidence from other sources?

Strange - shouldn't it be the job of The Grey Men to prove their assertions?

But it doesn't matter - journalists have already done the trip, talked to the kids and the families and the truth is out. The rescue was faked. The photo-op was staged.

What is the defense over this?

The defence over what? Where is the crime? There is no misappropriation of funds and all books are in order. This is allegations by a disgrunted former Thai employee and the BIB who are concerned about corruption and Australian farangs being scammed. This from probably the most corrupt police in the world who have matresses jammed packed full of tea money scammed from farangs and others. People who drive around in expensive imported luxury vehicles that they purchased on thier 4,000 baht per month wage which has not raised suspicion of corrution in thier own ranks.

Defense over faking a rescue to gain founds, perhaps?

I am starting to get worried over the well-being of some of you.

You might get a huge shock when this blows up in the face of some Thais

Quote from Drummond, “McBride (The Greyman) promised to shoot down allegations made against him, he has not done so. But he still insists that he saved the Akha kids in Baan Khun Suay from the sex slave trade, or forced child labour in factories.

End of Drummond quote.

But I don't think it is really about that. If you read further into Drummond's story you find the below article link.

http://www.scarletalliance.org.au/media/News_Item.2012-02-02.4312

Janelle Fawkes said 'Raids and rescue type approaches have consistently not uncovered victims of trafficking - they are a failed approach and must be recognised as a waste of resources.

While trafficking continues to be low scale in the Australian sex industry, resources have been wasted on approaches largely reliant on boosting policing in Australia and in the region' she said ‘ We know now the approach was simplistic and ineffective - it's time to move forward if Australia is serious about this issue."

End of quote.

It is saying the same thing the Empower Foundation in Thailand is saying. Cowboy go home. Women in the sex trade for whatever reason are not helped by ex SAS, CIA, Navy Seals or whatever. That thought is silly.

The Greyman whole idea is silly on the surface and gets sillier when you dig into it. An Aussie is never going to go undercover in Thailand or Burma. To tall and not Asian and doesn't speak the language like a native.

There are women in Thailand who need help. But that help is not the kind learned in combat or military training schools. It is help from other females who are social workers and medical workers and economic advisors. Grey Man and the other guys into that stuff are doing the same thing as punters who have a “Knight in Shining armor complex.”

The hidden agenda in the whole thing is the religious nuts in America working through some Australian dupes to re-criminalize sex workers.