Foreigner Shot Dead In Saraburi

[chooka]

and they need her to witness what ?

they obviously didn't expect to have to deal with the car and the bullet hole in the windscreen - this is way above someones paygrade or the cops are somehow related to this and trying to manipulate

How much face will the evil mother in law lose if the boy even looks like he's headed to the murder victims family - I guess the police didn't think that one through when they handed him over to this evil womans custody.............grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

Right on !

In any country with a working legal system, any defence lawyer would tear this witness's testomony apart and the judge would have a stroke from astonishment that a prosecutor would rely on any evidence from a "witness" that has sooooo much to gain from testifying against the accused [her children]. Joke !!! Blood simmering, simmering, simmering .......

Thailand has a working legal system. You can buy any verdict or decision you want if you are prepared to pay the asking cost which appears to be seasonal. That's the way it works and open to rich or poor.

[Thai at Heart]

and they need her to witness what ?

they obviously didn't expect to have to deal with the car and the bullet hole in the windscreen - this is way above someones paygrade or the cops are somehow related to this and trying to manipulate

How much face will the evil mother in law lose if the boy even looks like he's headed to the murder victims family - I guess the police didn't think that one through when they handed him over to this evil womans custody.............grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

Right on !

In any country with a working legal system, any defence lawyer would tear this witness's testomony apart and the judge would have a stroke from astonishment that a prosecutor would rely on any evidence from a "witness" that has sooooo much to gain from testifying against the accused [her children]. Joke !!! Blood simmering, simmering, simmering .......

Thailand has a working legal system. You can buy any verdict or decision you want if you are prepared to pay the asking cost which appears to be seasonal. That's the way it works and open to rich or poor.

In my understanding the childrens courts act very strictly in the interest of the child, hence why the foreign father was able to get custody in the first place. If the coppers bother to get organised and get the kid back, I have little doubt the court will grant custody to the father's relatives. One can only wonder what on earth was going through anyone's mind to give custody of the child back to grandma after she was part of the scheme to murder the father in the first place. The local police and prosecutors involved in this whole mess need their heads read.

Someone in the Thai family must know where the child is.

[Bung]

Of course someone in the family knows where the child is. It's not like at 3 years old he just wandered off on his own is it?

Unfortunately, he is now collateral for ALL parties concerned here, the accused's family as well as the police. The victims family will have to spend some money to get the boy back as they know the courts will give custody to them eventually. They just want to make a bit of cash out of the boy while they can before he goes....

Kind of like why the killed the guy in the first place. Trying to squeeze money out of him.

There are some sick f**ks out there.

[TwoDogz]

This is starting to make news in Australia now, and the Thai authorities are starting to look like imbiciles.

I'm sure they can handle it with gusto.

[Gweiloman]

As far as I can tell, Oswald and the wife were divorced and fighting for custody of the child. During all this time, I assume that Oswald was still paying child maintenance.

Does anybody actually know if there was a will, inheritance etc? Was this murder about money or about custody? It's easy to jump on the bandwagon of money but could it there that there's love for the child involved as well? I'm sure all around the world, parents (be they father or mother) has killed the other partner in order to keep custody of the child and not for monetary purposes.

[mauGR1]

As far as I can tell, Oswald and the wife were divorced and fighting for custody of the child. During all this time, I assume that Oswald was still paying child maintenance.

Does anybody actually know if there was a will, inheritance etc? Was this murder about money or about custody? It's easy to jump on the bandwagon of money but could it there that there's love for the child involved as well? I'm sure all around the world, parents (be they father or mother) has killed the other partner in order to keep custody of the child and not for monetary purposes.

That a bit of a stretch IMHO...Loving the child thus killing his father..Strange kind of love.

[Gweiloman]

As far as I can tell, Oswald and the wife were divorced and fighting for custody of the child. During all this time, I assume that Oswald was still paying child maintenance.

Does anybody actually know if there was a will, inheritance etc? Was this murder about money or about custody? It's easy to jump on the bandwagon of money but could it there that there's love for the child involved as well? I'm sure all around the world, parents (be they father or mother) has killed the other partner in order to keep custody of the child and not for monetary purposes.

That a bit of a stretch IMHO...Loving the child thus killing his father..Strange kind of love.

If the choice is to lose the son (maybe forever), then who knows? Love is a strange thing anyway.

[EyesWideOpen]

Reading the first part of this thread made me angry and sad, as another foreigner is killed by his money grubbing Thai wife. But reading the later part where the grandmother involved in the murder has been granted custody of the boy simply makes me want to puke.......

[canuckamuck]

As far as I can tell, Oswald and the wife were divorced and fighting for custody of the child. During all this time, I assume that Oswald was still paying child maintenance.

Does anybody actually know if there was a will, inheritance etc? Was this murder about money or about custody? It's easy to jump on the bandwagon of money but could it there that there's love for the child involved as well? I'm sure all around the world, parents (be they father or mother) has killed the other partner in order to keep custody of the child and not for monetary purposes.

As dumb as that suggestion is, what difference does it make anyhow. They killed an innocent man in cold blood and now have apparently abducted his child. We are talking about people dangerously out of sync with humanity. Their motivations are obviously greed arrogance and selfishness.

[weka]

Hi folks,

as it turns out I'm probably closer to this story than anyone

Let's not jump the gun here - we're all stating that the MIL is going to go free and have custody of the kid based on a newspaper article that has so many inaccuracies that, at this stage is very likely to be one of them.

The problem with this is, that it unfairly tarnishes the police in this case and the courts, who, up to now have been superb and at least the equal of western equivalents.

If. and only if, the MIL gets away scot free should we slag off the police and justice departments - this hasn't been confirmed anywhere.

The Police Lt in charge of the case (which arrested the 3 scum within 3 days) was at Oswald's funeral yesterday by his own volition and conducted himself in a very dignified manner. I'm not going to jump to conclusions based on one dodgy newspaper article, and am wondering if the saying "enough rope to hang yourself" isn't pertinent somewhere here - but I don't claim to know the whole story, just like none of us know for sure what is going on. That's just my opinion

We shall see

However it's simply not fair to run down this guy and his colleagues based on our pre-supposing stereotypes (the same thoughts have passed through my mind too, but there is room for a large chunk of benefit of the doubt).

through out the custody case, which was settled with a logical verdict, Oswald always stated that the particular court showed absolutely no distinction or impartiality towards either the Thai citizen or the South African citizen (let's dispell that myth right now).

There is a process to go through, exactly the same as in the west, and every Thai official that we have encountered have been compassionate, caring, aware and professional.

Special mentions to Siam Legal and the South African Embassy, and Siam Funeral for amazing advice and support throughout. Based on what we've been through this week, I recommend all of them.

We've laid Oswald's body to rest and now we have a long process to ensure the future and well being of those left behind.

Thanks a gain for all the positive messages and to George for delivering eulogies at the Check Inn 99 on Saturday - a lovely gesture.

i won't answer any questions, but urge you all not to jump to conclusions that slur the good work of the Police directly involved in this case or the authorities we have been in contact with - that just isn't fair or right.

It's time to be positive and move forward

thanks

Edited October 8, 2012 by weka

[NewlyMintedThai]

A refreshing dose of rationality.

Thank you, and please keep us posted.

[coma]

And then there is the otherside of the coin where Hercules, Ozwalds brother, openly stated in the pres conference that he fears for his nephews well being and doesn't know where he is. Then there is the little bit where police released the mother-in-law who was driving the car when Ozwald was shot in the back of the head. Maybe it is just me but that is a system failure and a disgrace.

[jbrain]

And then there is the otherside of the coin where Hercules, Ozwalds brother, openly stated in the pres conference that he fears for his nephews well being and doesn't know where he is. Then there is the little bit where police released the mother-in-law who was driving the car when Ozwald was shot in the back of the head. Maybe it is just me but that is a system failure and a disgrace.

When I read Weka's post, he says there is no confirmation yet that the grandmother is released nor that she received custody.

When I read the report of the press conference given by Oswalds brother, it is clearly stated that the Grandmother is still under arrest and that the police believe the little boy is with relatives of the mother, but the scumbags don't want to tell police where exactly.

So as far as I can read, and understand, is there nowhere an indication that the boy is with the grandmother

[Gweiloman]

As far as I can tell, Oswald and the wife were divorced and fighting for custody of the child. During all this time, I assume that Oswald was still paying child maintenance.

Does anybody actually know if there was a will, inheritance etc? Was this murder about money or about custody? It's easy to jump on the bandwagon of money but could it there that there's love for the child involved as well? I'm sure all around the world, parents (be they father or mother) has killed the other partner in order to keep custody of the child and not for monetary purposes.

As dumb as that suggestion is, what difference does it make anyhow. They killed an innocent man in cold blood and now have apparently abducted his child. We are talking about people dangerously out of sync with humanity. Their motivations are obviously greed arrogance and selfishness.

Dumb my suggestion was, so why did you dumb yourself down to respond?

Is this thread now only solely for expressing sympathy to the victim and bashing the perps endlessly? Is it not allowed to discuss possible motivations and post one's opinion if they are different from yours? And you know for certain their motivations? That to me, smacks of arrogance.

[smedly]

There are a lot of unanswered questions on this thread and as usual Thai news reports are grossly unreliable

Most of us were shocked at the prospect of the MIL being free and the child being in her custody - that now does not "appear" to be the case if I am interpreting things correctly - I wish people would just state the situation instead of hinting at it, it would remove all the speculation, why not just come out and state what is going on and if it isn't known then say nothing

I think I speak for everyone here when I say that our concern now is that -

1. The MIL goes to jail

2. The young boy is taken into protective child care services until the Family court decides what to do.

Saving face in this country is worth more than life itself and should not be ignored, these people will go to the extreme. I was shocked and seriously concerned at the news that the MIL was free and had custody of the young boy, although that doesn't seem to be the case it is still a concern that his whereabouts seem to be unknown !!!

There is a general mistrust of the Thai authorities the police and the legal system and for good reason

To the relatives of Ozwald - I know you are trying to clarify what is going on and we are all in support 100%, the previous news report "may" not be correct and the MIL is "possibly" in jail or protective custody.

At the end of the day it's a family matter and all we can do is give support were ever possible, I also understand there may be things you don't want to disclose here while this investigation is ongoing and I think I got a hint of that reading between the lines.

[canuckamuck]

If we could get accurate news we would be spared a lot of misspent emotion and Thai bashing. The journalists have a knack for getting it wrong or saying it wrong and it makes the Thai authorities look like the Keystone cops. When, they sometimes are doing it right.

At this point it is safe to say that we have only a vague idea of what is really going on.

Is it so hard to get the facts out. Is it translation problems? Is the Thai language news just as bad?

[RickBradford]

Is it translation problems? Is the Thai language news just as bad?

Both. A lot of Thai-language news seems to get copied from one outlet to another, with no independent verification of the original report.

And translations by Thais into English often give a misleading impression, to the extent that I often have to go back and re-read the original Thai to see where the disconnect between my understanding and theirs has occurred. Sometimes it turns out to be my error in comprehension, but often their translations, while not exactly wrong, can carry a misleading message.

[coma]

And then there is the otherside of the coin where Hercules, Ozwalds brother, openly stated in the pres conference that he fears for his nephews well being and doesn't know where he is. Then there is the little bit where police released the mother-in-law who was driving the car when Ozwald was shot in the back of the head. Maybe it is just me but that is a system failure and a disgrace.

When I read Weka's post, he says there is no confirmation yet that the grandmother is released nor that she received custody.

When I read the report of the press conference given by Oswalds brother, it is clearly stated that the Grandmother is still under arrest and that the police believe the little boy is with relatives of the mother, but the scumbags don't want to tell police where exactly.

So as far as I can read, and understand, is there nowhere an indication that the boy is with the grandmother

I have quoted numerous Thai medai sources as that being the case. But don't believe me. Have a read of the content yourself or have a Thai friend translate for you. It isn't just one source. It is multiple sources, both printed and television. I know the media is not gospel but that is what is happening and Oswalds brother is quoted as saying he has/had no idea where his nephew is and is worried for his well being.

[Gweiloman]

If we could get accurate news we would be spared a lot of misspent emotion and Thai bashing. The journalists have a knack for getting it wrong or saying it wrong and it makes the Thai authorities look like the Keystone cops. When, they sometimes are doing it right.

At this point it is safe to say that we have only a vague idea of what is really going on.

Is it so hard to get the facts out. Is it translation problems? Is the Thai language news just as bad?

Since you are fully aware that the news is inaccurate, why get emotional and start bashing? No better than the locals, it seems to me.

[GentlemanJim]

What is interesting is that many people have based their emotion and decisions on the 93 yr old Australian guy on what is effectively one media report, cut and pasted by many. If we point out to them, hey cool it the Thai media are notorious for inaccuracies in their reporting we get labeled as 'Thai bashers', and yet here we have a prime example of how there are major conflicting stories in the Thai media and the people who defend them on the other thread slag them off here. Funny isn't it.

[NewlyMintedThai]

What is interesting is that many people have based their emotion and decisions on the 93 yr old Australian guy on what is effectively one media report, cut and pasted by many. If we point out to them, hey cool it the Thai media are notorious for inaccuracies in their reporting we get labeled as 'Thai bashers', and yet here we have a prime example of how there are major conflicting stories in the Thai media and the people who defend them on the other thread slag them off here. Funny isn't it.

Funny? Not really.

In the Oswald case, we have someone close to the investigation who has come forward with first-hand information that indicates press reports may not be accurate.

In the pedophile case, no one with any first-hand information has come forward -- only armchair Dick Tracy's with unfounded speculation.

So -- while acknowledging that the accuracy of the press reports may not be 100%, they are all we have to go on for the time being.

I'm sure if additional information from a reliable source becomes available, we'll give them full consideration.

[coma]

What is interesting is that many people have based their emotion and decisions on the 93 yr old Australian guy on what is effectively one media report, cut and pasted by many. If we point out to them, hey cool it the Thai media are notorious for inaccuracies in their reporting we get labeled as 'Thai bashers', and yet here we have a prime example of how there are major conflicting stories in the Thai media and the people who defend them on the other thread slag them off here. Funny isn't it.

Exactly. Well said Jim. It seems that it all depends on one's point of view on the topic / subject as to who, what and when one wants to listen to media. If it supports their point of view then it gets green flagged. If not ......

[Jimjim]

What kind of people do such a thing? What kind of people were they that would kill like this?

Such a horrible story, it makes you so angry.

He seemed like a very respectable man and for this to happen, just mindboggling.

Am very curious as to the background of these disgusting people.

Edited October 9, 2012 by Jimjim

[coma]

There can be no misinterpretations with a picture. Tell me what is wrong with this picture ? Or should I ask. What is missing in this picture ?

[coma]

What kind of people do such a thing? What kind of people were they that would kill like this?

Such a horrible story, it makes you so angry.

He seemed like a very respectable man and for this to happen, just mindboggling.

Am very curious as to the background of these disgusting people.

Greed and vengence. Thais can hold and bear a grudge with the best of them.

[chooka]

There can be no misinterpretations with a picture. Tell me what is wrong with this picture ? Or should I ask. What is missing in this picture ?

Umm the matriarch is missing and the woman has quite the smug smile on her face as if she is thinking "I'll get a slap on the wrist." Hows that for a guess?

[coma]

There can be no misinterpretations with a picture. Tell me what is wrong with this picture ? Or should I ask. What is missing in this picture ?

Umm the matriarch is missing and the woman has quite the smug smile on her face as if she is thinking "I'll get a slap on the wrist." Hows that for a guess?

Well done Chooka. Go to the top of the class.

[Thai at Heart]

What kind of people do such a thing? What kind of people were they that would kill like this?

Such a horrible story, it makes you so angry.

He seemed like a very respectable man and for this to happen, just mindboggling.

Am very curious as to the background of these disgusting people.

Greed and vengence. Thais can hold and bear a grudge with the best of them.

Interesting concept vengeance, when one is supposed to be unable to escape the circle of one's Karma.

[Vale Tudo]

Look for a "brother" driving a redplated pickup-truck !

I am just trying to figure out what your post is saying. So my question is do you have information on this murder?

"brother" what does that mean? Are is this just another troll post?

I am sure that 90% of the posters here will understand, what I meant. If you don't get, it really doesn't matter, as considering the topic, maybe was not the most intelligent post from me!

I think he means a black dude!

[kurnell]

There can be no misinterpretations with a picture. Tell me what is wrong with this picture ? Or should I ask. What is missing in this picture ?

That looks like the smile of a psychopath