Thai Police Chief Put In Charge Instead Of Army Boss For Fear Of Favouritism

[h90]

I cannot get rid of the feeling that the Government are making an absolute cluster <deleted> out of this entire situation. They have successfully turned what would have been a peaceful, short, trouble free rally into something that could now prove highly problematic. The Government seem intent on garnering an overtly aggressive response and 50 000 police officers is overkill to state the least. The command and control issues will be interesting. It seems the police are drafting in units from all over the country now. 150 police left our town for Bangkok yesterday - 900 km away. There is so much fuss being made by the Government that there are now busloads preparing to travel up from here so that they can join the protest and see what all the fuss is about. I think if the current Government had to deal with anything remotely like the red shirts inflicted on Bangkok for a month or two, they would all implode. It's going to get even more interesting I think as Governmental panic sets in !

"peaceful, short, trouble free rally" "we want a coup and overthrow the government"sounds not really peaceful to me.In the US or Europe u will sit in prison if u announce stuff like that,besides that i think it's smart of Yingluck to tell the people whats going on,and more smart to do it while half of Thailand is watching a boring Thai soap,this small announcement gives her something like "free ticket"to act the way the government want to act

"we want a coup and overthrow the government"

where in europe would you sit in prison for saying these things?

I doubt that, but might be possible......But I am sure they put you in prison for vote buying and corruption.....Two German presidents stepped back because of minor (by Thai standards) issues.

Actually that amount of vote buying, corruption and abuse of power is unthinkable in Europe, so coups are unthinkable as well.

When Hitler got power some tried to get rid of him....Extreme situations -->extreme reaktions.

[stoli]

"peaceful, short, trouble free rally" "we want a coup and overthrow the government"sounds not really peaceful to me.In the US or Europe u will sit in prison if u announce stuff like that

I can certainly assure you that the above statement is NOT true. The US has freedom of speech, and you are always free to excercise that right. No one would be going to jail for saying what they feel to be true. If on the other hand, if you turn violent, you have created something other than Freedom of Speech. As it should be.

[Emptyset]

The Government are hell bent on stirring up violence at the protest, and such an unprecedented display of overt, overwhelming police presence sets the scene nicely. When the previous protest was held at the stadium it was absolutely orderly, peaceful and not a single policeman was required other than to assist with the increased localised traffic. After such an exemplary display of how a protest should be managed, how have we now arrived at the point that this protest will be violent and involve a plot to kidnap the PM. If you cannot see through all that then there is not much more that I or anyone else here can do for you in terms of discussion is there.

I don't understand why people would say that this government is 'hell bent on stirring up violence'. If only for the same reason people were defending Abhisit's govt on the logical basis that it'd only play into the protesters hands if any violence occurs. Last thing the govt wants is a martyr, surely? It appears even more crucial that this govt avoid chaos, as the Abhisit govt had the support of the military, whereas this time the military will either stay out of it, or seize upon any violence as a justification for a coup. In fact I heard a few months ago from a friend that some anti-govt people - but not necessarily the same key figures that advised and gave behind the scenes support to PAD in 2008 - were planning a movement based on the Arab Spring. But also learning lessons from the red shirts and previous PAD protests; for instance, structuring the movement so it's on a need to know basis, someone will control the armed men that will aim to provoke the security into violence, but the leaders on the stage won't necessarily know all of this or exactly who's doing what behind the scenes. Of course, I don't know whether this will come to pass.

I actually wouldn't be surprised if there was a situation analagous to the 'watermelon' soldiers business from 2010. Thaksin's upset enough people by not giving them key positions or paying enough attention to their advice, and I've heard some of the people who advised behind the scenes on the 2010 protests aren't backing the pro-Thaksin side any more because of this. I don't know if they'd switch over to work for the other side, but they might provide them with insider information in return for something in future if the protests succeed. And the ones still involved with the govt may both give info to the protesters and also feed the govt false rumours to create a sense of panic. I just wonder if some of the rumours that the govt is putting out there, are in fact being fed to them by the other side to get them worried, rather than being fabricated by the government itself to discredit the protesters (as the 'lom chao' chart in 2010 was). It's unlikely but a possibility.

But that's all speculation... what we do know is that, according to what I read on twitter earlier, Pitak Siam protesters have already attacked some student activists who were handing out pro-democracy flyers. Not quite sure of the full details yet. But it indicates at least some Pitak Siam protesters are up for some violence. The leaders might've changed from 2008, but again, I wouldn't be surprised if some of those same 'Srivichai Warrior' types were involved again. After all, no doubt they've hired guards and who better than those with experience from the 2008 campaign?

Edited November 23, 2012 by Emptyset

[SICHONSTEVE]

GentlemanJim

According to jayboy himself he is more intelligent than the rest of us and although I have my doubts about this I will give him the benifit of the doubt. He may be Einstein's grandson for all I know but again I have my doubts. He absolutely knows that he posts bullshit just to pull people's chains get a discussion going. So he is what he is and that is that.

GentlemanJim

According to jayboy himself he is more intelligent than the rest of us and although I have my doubts about this I will give him the benifit of the doubt. He may be Einstein's grandson for all I know but again I have my doubts. He absolutely knows that he posts bullshit just to pull people's chains get a discussion going. So he is what he is and that is that.

He is not inplying that he is more intelligent than others. He is simply commenting from a position of strength and is offering a reasoned opinion of the situation.

Exactly what point are you disagreeing with, as far as i'm concerned what he say's is true and valid in all of the aspects he has passed comment on.

Its not jayboy's fault that you have an inferiority complex, is it!!!!.

[rubl]

Goh, twitters on Pitak Siam protesters attacking, allegedly that is. No doubt soon we'll have Oak chipping in with complot details. The only thing missing to make my day is k. jatuporn warning about a coup.

BTW I heard it through the grapevine :-)

[GentlemanJim]

Goh, twitters on Pitak Siam protesters attacking, allegedly that is. No doubt soon we'll have Oak chipping in with complot details. The only thing missing to make my day is k. jatuporn warning about a coup.

BTW I heard it through the grapevine :-)

Well, as almost everyone has a phone capable of pictures or video these days, it won't be long before the evidence is uploaded surely. As for jatuporn, I agree, his normal warnings are well over due, I expect he will also warn of yellow shirts wearing red shirts then putting yellow shirts on top of the red ones to make any grenade attacks tomorrow look like it was actually red shirts

[SICHONSTEVE]

Goh, twitters on Pitak Siam protesters attacking, allegedly that is. No doubt soon we'll have Oak chipping in with complot details. The only thing missing to make my day is k. jatuporn warning about a coup.

BTW I heard it through the grapevine :-)

Well, as almost everyone has a phone capable of pictures or video these days, it won't be long before the evidence is uploaded surely. As for jatuporn, I agree, his normal warnings are well over due, I expect he will also warn of yellow shirts wearing red shirts then putting yellow shirts on top of the red ones to make any grenade attacks tomorrow look like it was actually red shirts

Why not wear yellow and red stripes - now that would really confuse people!!!.

[rubl]

Goh, twitters on Pitak Siam protesters attacking, allegedly that is. No doubt soon we'll have Oak chipping in with complot details. The only thing missing to make my day is k. jatuporn warning about a coup.

BTW I heard it through the grapevine :-)

Well, as almost everyone has a phone capable of pictures or video these days, it won't be long before the evidence is uploaded surely. As for jatuporn, I agree, his normal warnings are well over due, I expect he will also warn of yellow shirts wearing red shirts then putting yellow shirts on top of the red ones to make any grenade attacks tomorrow look like it was actually red shirts

I'm getting too old for that shirt changing nonsense. Also being Dutch I just wear orange which is probably the colour you see anyway when someone switches shirts quickly enough

[Emptyset]

Goh, twitters on Pitak Siam protesters attacking, allegedly that is. No doubt soon we'll have Oak chipping in with complot details. The only thing missing to make my day is k. jatuporn warning about a coup.

BTW I heard it through the grapevine :-)

Well, as almost everyone has a phone capable of pictures or video these days, it won't be long before the evidence is uploaded surely. As for jatuporn, I agree, his normal warnings are well over due, I expect he will also warn of yellow shirts wearing red shirts then putting yellow shirts on top of the red ones to make any grenade attacks tomorrow look like it was actually red shirts

There's a video here: http://asiaprovocateur.blogspot.co.uk/2012/11/pitak-siam-we-have-no-control.html ~ doesn't appear to show too much though. Anyway, Pitak Siam have already apologized - but also stated that they have 'no control' over the protesters. Which is true, of course, but also means there's no way for them to guarantee it'll be a peaceful protest (not that I believe they want such a thing).

[rubl]

Goh, twitters on Pitak Siam protesters attacking, allegedly that is. No doubt soon we'll have Oak chipping in with complot details. The only thing missing to make my day is k. jatuporn warning about a coup.

BTW I heard it through the grapevine :-)

Well, as almost everyone has a phone capable of pictures or video these days, it won't be long before the evidence is uploaded surely. As for jatuporn, I agree, his normal warnings are well over due, I expect he will also warn of yellow shirts wearing red shirts then putting yellow shirts on top of the red ones to make any grenade attacks tomorrow look like it was actually red shirts

There's a video here: http://asiaprovocate...no-control.html ~ doesn't appear to show too much though. Anyway, Pitak Siam have already apologized - but also stated that they have 'no control' over the protesters. Which is true, of course, but also means there's no way for them to guarantee it'll be a peaceful protest (not that I believe they want such a thing).

From the link provided by our empty set:

"This startling admission by Pitak Siam is a genuine cause for concern. That benign student activists holding placards evinces violence we can plainly see the game plan of Pitak Siam emerging. The need for the democratically-elected government to protect itself from violent fascists by invoking the ISA is now self-evident."

Interesting. Reminds me of a similar incident when two protesters wanted to lay a wrath next to Government House which was disliked and seen as provocation by some friendly 'government protecting' red-shirts who found it necessary to make their own opinion clear to those two. Of course neither the Government nor Pheu Thai have any control over the UDD chaps and other red-shirts. Startling really

Edited November 23, 2012 by rubl

[rubl]

Goh, twitters on Pitak Siam protesters attacking, allegedly that is. No doubt soon we'll have Oak chipping in with complot details. The only thing missing to make my day is k. jatuporn warning about a coup.

BTW I heard it through the grapevine :-)

Well, as almost everyone has a phone capable of pictures or video these days, it won't be long before the evidence is uploaded surely. As for jatuporn, I agree, his normal warnings are well over due, I expect he will also warn of yellow shirts wearing red shirts then putting yellow shirts on top of the red ones to make any grenade attacks tomorrow look like it was actually red shirts

There's a video here: http://asiaprovocate...no-control.html ~ doesn't appear to show too much though. Anyway, Pitak Siam have already apologized - but also stated that they have 'no control' over the protesters. Which is true, of course, but also means there's no way for them to guarantee it'll be a peaceful protest (not that I believe they want such a thing).

If the 'Green Group' and 'Green Light' organisations are the same I think I know why those Pitak Siam activists were annoyed. From the OP on 'Chalerm warns again against the third hand':

"Meanwhile, representatives of the independent Anti-Corruption Network and the Green Group submitted letters to the Office of the Ombudsman, calling for the Constitution Court to strip all cabinet members of their posts for unlawfully invoking the ICA despite the fact that the Pitak Siam’s rally hasn’t started. (MCOT online news)"

[Emptyset]

Interesting. Reminds me of a similar incident when two protesters wanted to lay a wrath next to Government House which was disliked and seen as provocation by some friendly 'government protecting' red-shirts who found it necessary to make their own opinion clear to those two. Of course neither the Government nor Pheu Thai have any control over the UDD chaps and other red-shirts. Startling really

So your point seems to be that both the pro and anti-goverment sides are capable of harassment and violence and that the leadership of both sides is incapable of fully controling its protesters?* I agree and I've never said anything different.

*Of course there's no protest leadership in the world capable of fully controlling their protesters, even if they're fully commited to anti-violent methods themselves, they can't regulate the emotions of every individual at the protest. If people get hotheaded, things can blow up and there's often little the leadership can do to keep a lid on it.

[Emptyset]

If the 'Green Group' and 'Green Light' organisations are the same I think I know why those Pitak Siam activists were annoyed.

No, they're totally unrelated. The Green Group was part of the PAD movement but later split. I think it's lead by Suriyasai who'll be at the Pitak Siam protest. Whereas I believe The Green Light group are students who wish to defend parliamentary democracy against those who seem to desire a military government - hence them handing out flyers encouraging people not to join the Pitak Siam protest.

Although it's worth noting that many liberals that would probably be characterized (by those on the opposing side at least) as being pro-government are against the imposition of the ISA. Pravit of The Nation has voiced such criticism. The problem is one of democratic principles; why seek to prevent - or deter - free association of protesters before any violent acts have been commited? And partly that the government is guilty of double standards because some of their members were obviously against the ISA when Abhisit invoked it to deal with the red shirts.

Edited November 23, 2012 by Emptyset

[rubl]

Interesting. Reminds me of a similar incident when two protesters wanted to lay a wrath next to Government House which was disliked and seen as provocation by some friendly 'government protecting' red-shirts who found it necessary to make their own opinion clear to those two. Of course neither the Government nor Pheu Thai have any control over the UDD chaps and other red-shirts. Startling really

So your point seems to be that both the pro and anti-goverment sides are capable of harassment and violence and that the leadership of both sides is incapable of fully controling its protesters?* I agree and I've never said anything different.

*Of course there's no protest leadership in the world capable of fully controlling their protesters, even if they're fully commited to anti-violent methods themselves, they can't regulate the emotions of every individual at the protest. If people get hotheaded, things can blow up and there's often little the leadership can do to keep a lid on it.

Actually my point was that it may be ease for some to provoke a reaction and say 'well, aren't they bent on violence' ?

Maybe re-read these two topics from August last year:

"Wreath For House Speaker Sparks Red-Shirt Attack"

"Thai Parliament Wreath-Layer Denies Paid For Protest"

[h90]

Goh, twitters on Pitak Siam protesters attacking, allegedly that is. No doubt soon we'll have Oak chipping in with complot details. The only thing missing to make my day is k. jatuporn warning about a coup.

BTW I heard it through the grapevine :-)

Well, as almost everyone has a phone capable of pictures or video these days, it won't be long before the evidence is uploaded surely. As for jatuporn, I agree, his normal warnings are well over due, I expect he will also warn of yellow shirts wearing red shirts then putting yellow shirts on top of the red ones to make any grenade attacks tomorrow look like it was actually red shirts

Why not wear yellow and red stripes - now that would really confuse people!!!.

than both groups beat you....

[Buchholz]

Thailand Live Friday 23rd #28:

"Deputy PM Chalerm asserts authorities won't use violence responding to anti-government rally; ISA enforcement reasonable; apologises to public for traffic inconvenience /MCOT"

A bit improper addressing, it should have been "Dept. PM Pol. Captain Chalerm"

tut tut... don't overlook that Deputy Prime Minister Police Captain Doctor Chalerm obtained a doctorate.

Graduation Day. Chalerm, along with his sons Artharn (far left), Duangchalerm (2nd left), and Wanchalerm (far right).

The title page of his dissertation.

It's reassuring, coming from such an honorable source, that authorities won't use violence

.

Edited November 23, 2012 by Buchholz

[marshbags]

As a pertinent type observation,Thaksin is a master for providing timely diversions when something serious is about to take place in relation to questionable governmental policies ect. ect.he has implemented and are about to be debated on by the opposition, within parliament / Senate.

The government face at least 2 and several more major issues which are definitely worthy of such distraction

Number one being of course the censure motion itself.

The rice pledging policy that was supposedly implemented to benefit the poor farmers ect. ect. and in real terms is enriching everyone else within a chosen circle while endebting Thai for many years to come. Aka one of several major corruptive practices.

Then the Chinese MOU has seemingly been falsely quoted as to it,s actual contents and supposed agreements to sell a large amount of the prestocked rice and future harvests ect. ect. are a figment of Yinglucks imagination.. inspired of course by her CEO brother

Not forgetting the Senate debate on the performance of leading cabinet ministers of the goverment and thier questionable interests and representations and on who,s behalf they are acting.

Lastly the no confidence vote is conveniently delayed re the Senate debate which would normally follow.

As a consequence of this instead of having a peaceful demonstration voicing democratic opposition to the government, we now have the potential of it turning into one of chaos and what could be, a violent orchestrated blood bath of which the exiled fugitive has deviously planned for and hopes will take place.

marshbags

Not forgetting the peaceful demonstrators who will have been put off attending in support of thier dis satisfaction relating to an abundance of practices being implemented for the chosen few, mainly under the Shinwatara umbrella.

The reds are most certainly on standby at the very least to mobilise behind the police security forces as and when required, along with a certain Jatuporn rallying them

[h90]

As a pertinent type observation,Thaksin is a master for providing timely diversions when something serious is about to take place in relation to questionable governmental policies ect. ect.he has implemented and are about to be debated on by the opposition, within parliament / Senate.

The government face at least 2 and several more major issues which are definitely worthy of such distraction

Number one being of course the censure motion itself.

The rice pledging policy that was supposedly implemented to benefit the poor farmers ect. ect. and in real terms is enriching everyone else within a chosen circle while endebting Thai for many years to come. Aka one of several major corruptive practices.

Then the Chinese MOU has seemingly been falsely quoted as to it,s actual contents and supposed agreements to sell a large amount of the prestocked rice and future harvests ect. ect. are a figment of Yinglucks imagination.. inspired of course by her CEO brother

Not forgetting the Senate debate on the performance of leading cabinet ministers of the goverment and thier questionable interests and representations and on who,s behalf they are acting.

Lastly the no confidence vote is conveniently delayed re the Senate debate which would normally follow.

As a consequence of this instead of having a peaceful demonstration voicing democratic opposition to the government, we now have the potential of it turning into one of chaos and what could be, a violent orchestrated blood bath of which the exiled fugitive has deviously planned for and hopes will take place.

marshbags

Not forgetting the peaceful demonstrators who will have been put off attending in support of thier dis satisfaction relating to an abundance of practices being implemented for the chosen few, mainly under the Shinwatara umbrella.

The reds are most certainly on standby at the very least to mobilise behind the police security forces as and when required, along with a certain Jatuporn rallying them

the censure motion is no serious issue: Let the democrats ranting and play a soap opera in TV at the same time....no issue. But the rice policy is as many rice farmers voted PTP based on their promises and the they now slowly start to disbelieve the PTP. At one point they might be so fed up that even vote buying won't work anymore.

[Thai at Heart]

As a pertinent type observation,Thaksin is a master for providing timely diversions when something serious is about to take place in relation to questionable governmental policies ect. ect.he has implemented and are about to be debated on by the opposition, within parliament / Senate.

The government face at least 2 and several more major issues which are definitely worthy of such distraction

Number one being of course the censure motion itself.

The rice pledging policy that was supposedly implemented to benefit the poor farmers ect. ect. and in real terms is enriching everyone else within a chosen circle while endebting Thai for many years to come. Aka one of several major corruptive practices.

Then the Chinese MOU has seemingly been falsely quoted as to it,s actual contents and supposed agreements to sell a large amount of the prestocked rice and future harvests ect. ect. are a figment of Yinglucks imagination.. inspired of course by her CEO brother

Not forgetting the Senate debate on the performance of leading cabinet ministers of the goverment and thier questionable interests and representations and on who,s behalf they are acting.

Lastly the no confidence vote is conveniently delayed re the Senate debate which would normally follow.

As a consequence of this instead of having a peaceful demonstration voicing democratic opposition to the government, we now have the potential of it turning into one of chaos and what could be, a violent orchestrated blood bath of which the exiled fugitive has deviously planned for and hopes will take place.

marshbags

Not forgetting the peaceful demonstrators who will have been put off attending in support of thier dis satisfaction relating to an abundance of practices being implemented for the chosen few, mainly under the Shinwatara umbrella.

The reds are most certainly on standby at the very least to mobilise behind the police security forces as and when required, along with a certain Jatuporn rallying them

the censure motion is no serious issue: Let the democrats ranting and play a soap opera in TV at the same time....no issue. But the rice policy is as many rice farmers voted PTP based on their promises and the they now slowly start to disbelieve the PTP. At one point they might be so fed up that even vote buying won't work anymore.

Possible. So where are the media reports of this mass dissatisfaction?

[hellodolly]

I cannot get rid of the feeling that the Government are making an absolute cluster <deleted> out of this entire situation. They have successfully turned what would have been a peaceful, short, trouble free rally into something that could now prove highly problematic. The Government seem intent on garnering an overtly aggressive response and 50 000 police officers is overkill to state the least. The command and control issues will be interesting. It seems the police are drafting in units from all over the country now. 150 police left our town for Bangkok yesterday - 900 km away. There is so much fuss being made by the Government that there are now busloads preparing to travel up from here so that they can join the protest and see what all the fuss is about. I think if the current Government had to deal with anything remotely like the red shirts inflicted on Bangkok for a month or two, they would all implode. It's going to get even more interesting I think as Governmental panic sets in !

Ifv it implodes on them and turns into another 2010 I can just see Yingluck standing in a well defended department store saying do as I say not as we did in 2010

[smedly]

the big error this government (Charlerm/Thaksin) has just made is trying to put a red thaksin supporting police chief in charge of the army - this single thing will bring down this government

what a stupid move to undermine the army chain of command - you heard it here first

[asiawatcher]

This is a very dangerous situation indeed and is developing into the makings of a one man dictatorship.

One sided democracy at it,s worst IMHO.

This Government when it was elected in the first instance, promised faithfully and acceptedand supposedly recognised the democratic wishes of all Thai when it was confirmed to office.

What is happening now is in effect similar to a boardroom take over with it,s CEO in exile gradually enforcing his devious plans to control / takeover of the Thai institutions and in doing so realising total control of the country.

This in turn will then allow ( he hopes ) his main objective to return to the country and then personally take total control, assisted by his coherts at present surrogated to oversee his wishes and slowly activate a stranglehold on all opposing authorities.

Carried out in such a way as to appear unalarming but is in effect a devious one side take over of this phoney gov't who supposedly represent democracy for all Thai Citizens.

Sadly if it is allowed to continueThailand will find out to it,s cost that there is no future for those who rightly oppose him /them and a very bleak and bloody clampdown will most certainly ensue.

The powers in charge of security will I fear at the first excuse follow a similar path that took place in the not to distant past.

How better and convenient to create an atmosphere that in their eyes gives them legitimacy to use force and spread fear and chaos among the legitimate demonstrators / opposition. ect. ect.

Especially with a few rogue infiltraters strategically placed among the demonstrators to make sure their is trouble and unrest.

( Thaksins infamous unethical red stormtroopers in the provinces will of course make sure there is no opposition allowed to peacefully demonstrate out side of the capital )

Hopefully the armed forces will be equal to anything untoward that has the potential to take place and will act accordingly to protect the innocents and this beloved country.

marshbags

Great post mate.