Home Made School...

[cornishcarlos]

We have just started a small 'school' at our house.

Purely for after hours English tuition.

We opened 3 weeks ago and have 40 students already, ranging from 7 to 47..

My wife is doing the bulk of the teaching and I help her out with some games and pronunciation practice.

To be honest,I'm amazed at the amount of people in our rural area that really want to learn to speak English. It will be great for me, as my Thai is limited so if I can teach everyone in the market to speak English, problem solved

Having seen the school curriculum, it's mad that they are trying to teach 6 yr olds complex grammar when they can't even say 'Hello, my name is...'

We are hoping to rectify this for a few people here. By concentrating on speaking practice and practical lessons we will try to overcome their shyness ! My grammar sucks anyway

So, no point to this thread, other than to let you know that small changes can help...

Back to some painting for me, coffee shop to open soon ??

[Scott]

Good luck. Every little bit helps.

[CaptainSplod]

Yes, good luck with the adventure - it sounds like something of a success already!

Are you out in the sticks or in a reasonably (or bigger) sized town?

Too, it would be interesting to hear if you only teach in the evenings or in the weekend (or both).

Cheers

Splod

[Morakot]

Good luck! Sounds like a lot of work, all the formalities and stuff, plus teaching...

[cornishcarlos]

Formalities..... Mmmmmmmmmmmm

We are not in a big town... Small place about 45km out of Surat.

My wife teaches every evening for 1 1/2 hrs except Fri.

2 sessions for adults on Tues and Fri daytime (again 1 1/2 hr sessions)

Then she does 4 sessions on both Sat and Sun.

So all up about 21 hrs a week.

It seems to be going well and everyday we are getting more enquiries.

Think most of the parents would send their children to Surat and pay a lot more for the privilege if we hadn't started this little venture !

[CaptainSplod]

Sounds really good - but be careful or you'll be working all day and every day before you know it!

Best of luck to you and your wife!

Cheers

Splod

Edited December 3, 2012 by CaptainSplod

[sirchai]

Formalities..... Mmmmmmmmmmmm

We are not in a big town... Small place about 45km out of Surat.

My wife teaches every evening for 1 1/2 hrs except Fri.

2 sessions for adults on Tues and Fri daytime (again 1 1/2 hr sessions)

Then she does 4 sessions on both Sat and Sun.

So all up about 21 hrs a week.

It seems to be going well and everyday we are getting more enquiries.

Think most of the parents would send their children to Surat and pay a lot more for the privilege if we hadn't started this little venture !

Don't make enemies there. It might look alright, but some greedy guys might not like that you're taking their customers away. Even if it's not true.

Best luck for you! Greetings from lower north-east.

[stewyk71]

Formalities..... Mmmmmmmmmmmm

We are not in a big town... Small place about 45km out of Surat.

My wife teaches every evening for 1 1/2 hrs except Fri.

2 sessions for adults on Tues and Fri daytime (again 1 1/2 hr sessions)

Then she does 4 sessions on both Sat and Sun.

So all up about 21 hrs a week.

It seems to be going well and everyday we are getting more enquiries.

Think most of the parents would send their children to Surat and pay a lot more for the privilege if we hadn't started this little venture !

Don't make enemies there. It might look alright, but some greedy guys might not like that you're taking their customers away. Even if it's not true.

Best luck for you! Greetings from lower north-east.

Best of luck mate i've been doing the same thing for awhile now and enjoy it also. Good advice about the greedy guys i upset some by doing my own thing (always a fellow ex pat too) keep it low key is my advice

[loserlazer]

Cool of you man if you dont charge them.

Regards.

Sent from my GT-N7100 using Thaivisa Connect App

Edited December 3, 2012 by loserlazer

[cornishcarlos]

Formalities..... Mmmmmmmmmmmm

We are not in a big town... Small place about 45km out of Surat.

My wife teaches every evening for 1 1/2 hrs except Fri.

2 sessions for adults on Tues and Fri daytime (again 1 1/2 hr sessions)

Then she does 4 sessions on both Sat and Sun.

So all up about 21 hrs a week.

It seems to be going well and everyday we are getting more enquiries.

Think most of the parents would send their children to Surat and pay a lot more for the privilege if we hadn't started this little venture !

Don't make enemies there. It might look alright, but some greedy guys might not like that you're taking their customers away. Even if it's not true.

Best luck for you! Greetings from lower north-east.

We are very low key and my wife is also very 'connected' in the area..

If there was anyone else teaching English here, then maybe we would do something else. There was a market that needed filling !

Never want to upset the locals... Haven't seen another Farang in 3 years

[cornishcarlos]

Cool of you man if you dont charge them.

Regards.

Sent from my GT-N7100 using Thaivisa Connect App

Of course we charge them... About half the rate for classes in SuratThani.

If it was free a) they wouldn't feel like they were getting something of value my wife would be spending quite a bit of time not earning a wage, if it was just a couple hrs a week it wouldn't matter and c) any local competition really would be pissed off if we took 'their' customers for free

[Scott]

Off-topic posts have been deleted.

[sirchai]

Formalities..... Mmmmmmmmmmmm

We are not in a big town... Small place about 45km out of Surat.

My wife teaches every evening for 1 1/2 hrs except Fri.

2 sessions for adults on Tues and Fri daytime (again 1 1/2 hr sessions)

Then she does 4 sessions on both Sat and Sun.

So all up about 21 hrs a week.

It seems to be going well and everyday we are getting more enquiries.

Think most of the parents would send their children to Surat and pay a lot more for the privilege if we hadn't started this little venture !

Don't make enemies there. It might look alright, but some greedy guys might not like that you're taking their customers away. Even if it's not true.

Best luck for you! Greetings from lower north-east.

We are very low key and my wife is also very 'connected' in the area..

If there was anyone else teaching English here, then maybe we would do something else. There was a market that needed filling !

Never want to upset the locals... Haven't seen another Farang in 3 years

Please be aware that not foreigners could become a problem. The laws are pretty much weird to run a language school, which seems to be the case.

A problem might be that a Thai would like to run the same business, as they always copy somebody's idea. Keep your low profile and good luck!

[cornishcarlos]

Thanks for all the positive responses.

Good advice taken on board ..

Only one negative poster but he has been removed

Just doing our thing !!!

[brucetefl]

I thought I would share my expereince from running a small school like yours... many years ago.

We were cahrginf 50 baht per hour and had groups of about 12 kids. It was enough to live comfortably on and better than working for one of the language school chains--not that there were any in the small town I was staying in. I think we were earning about 35,000 per month, and this at a time when the average teacehr earned less than 20k.

It was a lot of work--teaching and marketing. but fun too.

The interesting thing for me is when we went to regieter our school. They asked us... how long have you been operating? We had not yet opened but thought it was necessary--I had just come from Hong Kong. When we explained that we PLANNED to open they laughed and said "come back in 6 months if you are successful".

[cornishcarlos]

Hi Bruce,

Thanks for the input. Much appreciated.

Ours is a 'school' not a school It is really just private tuition after school hours.

Max class size is 10 for the kids and 3 for the adults.

I think our rates must be similar to yours, this month my wife took about 25k. Next month should be a bit more ?

Marketing is not really necessary, apart from a big sign outside the house and a few A4 posters around the village. Market gossip is all we seem to have needed. Plus we have been spreading the rumor for about 6 months now.

It is not meant to be a full time job for my wife, just something for the locals and a bit of extra income. Also my wife really enjoys teaching !!

We shall see how is grows ?

[thequietman]

yep, tried it also. only charged 50 baht an hour. at the start we had 14 students, then that dropped off. Reason: for 50 baht the parents were asking for individual lessons geared towards their individual kid. this was impossible to do as the same lesson plan had to do everyone. I had a plan and that was to start at the basics and move slowly through various grammar etc.

they werent happy with this and about 9 students fell away.

for 50 baht they wanted the world and everything in it.

so, I stopped the class.

Others said it was too expensive ! these same parents are pissed most days on a bottle of thai whiskey.

some just can't be helped. I just stick to my private classes now. still, at least they can't say I didn't try to help the kids out in the village.

good luck with your new venture. sure sounds like you actually have parents and adult learners who care.

[cornishcarlos]

yep, tried it also. only charged 50 baht an hour. at the start we had 14 students, then that dropped off. Reason: for 50 baht the parents were asking for individual lessons geared towards their individual kid. this was impossible to do as the same lesson plan had to do everyone. I had a plan and that was to start at the basics and move slowly through various grammar etc.

they werent happy with this and about 9 students fell away.

for 50 baht they wanted the world and everything in it.

so, I stopped the class.

Others said it was too expensive ! these same parents are pissed most days on a bottle of thai whiskey.

some just can't be helped. I just stick to my private classes now. still, at least they can't say I didn't try to help the kids out in the village.

good luck with your new venture. sure sounds like you actually have parents and adult learners who care.

Sorry to hear that your attempt didn't succeed, I guess it depends where you are ?

It seems that there are quite a few well off folk in this area that really want their kids to learn.

Sometimes I think they push them too much and don't give them any time to be kids ! But there is so much pressure here to be top of the class. I didn't want my wife to teach on Sundays, not for any religious reasons, just to not encourage the parents to make their children study everyday, I didn't win that battle and we are full on Sundays

We have a 7 rai plot that we live on. My wife tries to utilize all the areas in her classes. As I said, she focuses on more practical and talking lessons but attempts to help them with any school homework problems too. We feed our animals with the kids, go on river walks (carefully) and move the teaching venue around to keep them awake..

As for paying, we figured it had to be a reasonable amount but affordable. The price is for 12 hrs spread over 4 weeks and ranges from 400 to 800 depending on age group. Adult classes, limited to 3 students are 800 for the 1st month to see if they enjoy it and can benefit from the class, it then goes up to normal rate of 1600. This way my wife can plan ahead knowing that classes have been paid for and the students are more inclined to turn up, seems to work and people are still calling everyday.

Maybe we have been lucky, maybe we are in the right area, maybe we picked the right time to start ? Lets hope it continues to be a success for everyone involved.

[thequietman]

yep, tried it also. only charged 50 baht an hour. at the start we had 14 students, then that dropped off. Reason: for 50 baht the parents were asking for individual lessons geared towards their individual kid. this was impossible to do as the same lesson plan had to do everyone. I had a plan and that was to start at the basics and move slowly through various grammar etc.

they werent happy with this and about 9 students fell away.

for 50 baht they wanted the world and everything in it.

so, I stopped the class.

Others said it was too expensive ! these same parents are pissed most days on a bottle of thai whiskey.

some just can't be helped. I just stick to my private classes now. still, at least they can't say I didn't try to help the kids out in the village.

good luck with your new venture. sure sounds like you actually have parents and adult learners who care.

Sorry to hear that your attempt didn't succeed, I guess it depends where you are ?

It seems that there are quite a few well off folk in this area that really want their kids to learn.

Sometimes I think they push them too much and don't give them any time to be kids ! But there is so much pressure here to be top of the class. I didn't want my wife to teach on Sundays, not for any religious reasons, just to not encourage the parents to make their children study everyday, I didn't win that battle and we are full on Sundays

We have a 7 rai plot that we live on. My wife tries to utilize all the areas in her classes. As I said, she focuses on more practical and talking lessons but attempts to help them with any school homework problems too. We feed our animals with the kids, go on river walks (carefully) and move the teaching venue around to keep them awake..

As for paying, we figured it had to be a reasonable amount but affordable. The price is for 12 hrs spread over 4 weeks and ranges from 400 to 800 depending on age group. Adult classes, limited to 3 students are 800 for the 1st month to see if they enjoy it and can benefit from the class, it then goes up to normal rate of 1600. This way my wife can plan ahead knowing that classes have been paid for and the students are more inclined to turn up, seems to work and people are still calling everyday.

Maybe we have been lucky, maybe we are in the right area, maybe we picked the right time to start ? Lets hope it continues to be a success for everyone involved.

I really wish you every sucess. Sounds like a very good "school."

take care.

[CaptainSplod]

^ Shame about the school not really kicking off. But, yes - often the parents seem to want to influence the teaching - and quite out of proportion, too. I can imagine that parents' "suggestions" are welcome to a certain degree, though it must be slightly frustrating to hear of the excessive demands. 50 baht an hour doesn't seem too much for looking after - and teaching - a child.

@ cornishcarlos

Many thanks for your very informative replies, very impressed by your setup! It really sounds like a nice place you have - and 7 rai ought to be enough to keep the kids busy for a long time.

My wife and I are thinking along the same lines as yourself - and have been for quite some time. However, we haven't yet found any suitable areas - and as far as we're concerned, there's no acute hurry to get anything started. We'd rather wait until we see the ideal place before thinking seriously about starting such a venture. Too, there's always the business of acquiring a license, if that's at all necessary - and to being as 'legitimate' as possible. One problem (for us) is, that there appears to be so many rules and regs, that we're not sure if it's really worth all the bother - if the end result is, that you're only teaching a (relatively) small amount of kids.

I've also been informed, that avoiding the term of "School" or "Language Center" - and the like, in such a business venture - makes things easier. Mind you, I can't get any explanation as to exactly what "things" might be easier.....

Cheers

Splod

[Loaded]

I know that in Chiang Mai unlicensed and unregistered informal schools (massage, language, cooking etc.) will be visited very soon by the revenue department. If they are unlicensed, they also are not registered with the revenue department. Intentionally avoiding tax payments is a criminal offense in Thailand.

[brucetefl]

Of course schools have a difficult time getting in trouble for failure to pay tax since they are tax exempt.

There are three types of Educatonal organizations in Thailand, universities, formal education (Pratom 1 through Matayom 6) and non-formal education--everything from English schools to massage schools. All are tax exempt.

Here in Rayong about 1/2 the non-formal schools are unregistered. In the bigger cities they probably are more rigid in complying with the rules.

I know that in Chiang Mai unlicensed and unregistered informal schools (massage, language, cooking etc.) will be visited very soon by the revenue department. If they are unlicensed, they also are not registered with the revenue department. Intentionally avoiding tax payments is a criminal offense in Thailand.

Edited December 6, 2012 by brucetefl

[Loaded]

I think you missed the bit about unlicensed. If a 'school' isn't licensed by, or even registered with, the MoE , it isn't a school; and therefore, it's income is taxable.

Of course schools have a difficult time getting in trouble for failure to pay tax since they are tax exempt.

There are three types of Educatonal organizations in Thailand, universities, formal education (Pratom 1 through Matayom 6) and non-formal education--everything from English schools to massage schools. All are tax exempt.

Here in Rayong about 1/2 the non-formal schools are unregistered. In the bigger cities they probably are more rigid in complying with the rules.

I know that in Chiang Mai unlicensed and unregistered informal schools (massage, language, cooking etc.) will be visited very soon by the revenue department. If they are unlicensed, they also are not registered with the revenue department. Intentionally avoiding tax payments is a criminal offense in Thailand.

Edited December 6, 2012 by Loaded

[cornishcarlos]

I'll let my wife worry about the tax and license etc.

Have mentioned it to her but she doesn't want to register as then you have to comply with too many regulations.

As for tax ?? It's her choice and she seems to know how business works in this area.

Maybe this is starting to go into a different topic !

The kids love coming here, the parents seem happy to have their kids here and I'm keeping a low profile

[cornishcarlos]

I know that in Chiang Mai unlicensed and unregistered informal schools (massage, language, cooking etc.) will be visited very soon by the revenue department. If they are unlicensed, they also are not registered with the revenue department. Intentionally avoiding tax payments is a criminal offense in Thailand.

How do you know that they will be visited soon ??

[Loaded]

I'll let my wife worry about the tax and license etc.

Have mentioned it to her but she doesn't want to register as then you have to comply with too many regulations.

As for tax ?? It's her choice and she seems to know how business works in this area.

Maybe this is starting to go into a different topic !

The kids love coming here, the parents seem happy to have their kids here and I'm keeping a low profile

That's why schools that conform to these regulations and organizations that represent them (PSA) are very angry with schools that ignore the regulations but compete directly with them. The regulations create extra work and a higher operating overhead. It's unfair competition. There are also valid reasons for these regulations such as safety, insurance, health, employee protection, work permits etc.

[CaptainSplod]

Yes, please do continue to keep a low profile, CC, for it would be a shame if your place was closed down. It can sometimes be frustrating to want to help others, only to have officialdom prevent such help - even when there are absolutely no other alternatives in the area. It would be a definite plus if officials chose to try and "assist" and "guide" in a positive fashion to set up such a business as your own. Farmers, for example, get help via courses and seminars to improve their farming - and I'm sure other occupational areas get positive help from officials.

Teaching, of one sort or another, that differs from government- and perhaps private schools seems mostly to get a negative view from government officials - even though education is one of the most important areas in a person's lifespan.

Many areas away from the big(ger) towns just don't have people remotely qualified to teach. Kids (and adults) don't get much of a chance to improve their education one bit. I'm always happy to see a "school" open up (language school or "extra curriculum" school), as hopefully it'll lead to some improvement in education for the students that are able to attend.

Cheers

Splod

[cornishcarlos]

Yes, please do continue to keep a low profile, CC, for it would be a shame if your place was closed down. It can sometimes be frustrating to want to help others, only to have officialdom prevent such help - even when there are absolutely no other alternatives in the area. It would be a definite plus if officials chose to try and "assist" and "guide" in a positive fashion to set up such a business as your own. Farmers, for example, get help via courses and seminars to improve their farming - and I'm sure other occupational areas get positive help from officials.

Teaching, of one sort or another, that differs from government- and perhaps private schools seems mostly to get a negative view from government officials - even though education is one of the most important areas in a person's lifespan.

Many areas away from the big(ger) towns just don't have people remotely qualified to teach. Kids (and adults) don't get much of a chance to improve their education one bit. I'm always happy to see a "school" open up (language school or "extra curriculum" school), as hopefully it'll lead to some improvement in education for the students that are able to attend.

Cheers

Splod

As I originally said, this is not a business for us, sure we charge but I have covered the reasons why we have to.

I also hope we don't attract any unwanted attention, it would be a shame for the kids (also the parents pockets ).

@Loaded..

I understand your comments about unfair competition but such is life, happens everywhere..

As for health and safety, I can assure you that we are at a significantly higher level on this than most Thai organizations. Employee protection, my wife can look after herself and I wouldn't dream of working without a permit

But your point is valid and duly noted.

[brucetefl]

As I mentioned, in the small town where we started, not only were they unconcerned about us operating before being registered, they encouraged it! But this is typical of the differences between small-town and big-city Thailand. They simply did not want to waste their and our time if the school was not sustainable.

I would guess that most businesses in Thailand are unregistered. An example would be the 100 road-side restaurants that are on the beach between Ban Phe and Suan Son. The taxes on these businesses are very arbitrary--the tax guy shows up once per year and basically negotiates. My friend's shop was assessed at 40,000 baht for the year which they eventually negotiated down to 10,000--this for selling Thai and western food which is unquestionably taxable.

I am not trying to encourage you not to register. Its certainly a good idea. Heck my wife is the Provincial Association head of non-formal education. But in a small town if you do not step on any toes and are a positive influence on the community (maybe let a few poorer kids study for free or even a few kids of policemen?) its unlikely anyone is going to hassle you. Even my wife is frustrated that so many schools in Rayong have never bothered to register.

Edited December 6, 2012 by Scott
format

[Loaded]

@Loaded..

I understand your comments about unfair competition but such is life, happens everywhere..

As for health and safety, I can assure you that we are at a significantly higher level on this than most Thai organizations. Employee protection, my wife can look after herself and I wouldn't dream of working without a permit

But your point is valid and duly noted.

You are correct that unfair competition happens everywhere. However, if you are taking customers from another school that is licensed, you have made an enemy. You may even upset a jealous neighbour who doen't want to see you earning extra money. It is not difficult for them to report your activities to the departments of Labour and Revenue. If you have been working there, your work permit from another school won't protect you. In this situation, you are very vulnerable - such is life.