tinfoilhat Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 it seems to me the more money you try to save on a tablet the more cost you accrue in accessories. being cheap is a double edged sword Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giddyup Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 it seems to me the more money you try to save on a tablet the more cost you accrue in accessories. being cheap is a double edged sword I'm inclined to agree. I don't know a lot about tablets, but it seems you have to spend the bucks if you want all the features, reliability and quality. Same with anything really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeverSure Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 I don't at all disagree, but if the most expensive tablet or notebook or laptop or whatever is going to get internet from that topology, somewhere there's going to have to be a router if more than one appliance is online. Also, if the tablet doesn't have an Ethernet port but is rather wireless only, there will have to be a router. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pib Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 Excellent info on all of this, thanks. One quick question. 9 inch tablet, what resolution should one be aiming for, for watching Videos in something close to HD resolution? 720p HD video requires a 1280 x 720 Width x Height (WxH) resolution to take full advantage of HD video 1080p HD video requires a 1920 x 1080 WxH resolution to take full advantage of the HD video Note: not to imply the device might not automatically scale down the HD video to a lower resolution if unable to fully display at a higher resolution. Tablets will normally come in the following resolutions: WVGA: 800x600 WSVGA: 1024x600 XGA: 1024x768 WXGA: 1280x800 or 1366x768 WSXGA+: 1600x900 WUXGA: 1920x1080 or 1920x1200 QXGA: 2048x1536 Once you start going above 1280x800 resolution on a tablet a wide model variety will be much less and the price starts going up. For low cost Android models most fall in the WSVGA and XGA display category. Personally, I wouldn't get one below a 1024x768 resolution unless you were just getting it for the kids/play games/use basic Apps. And it also depends on your age...older eyes can't see the definition/resolution of what they could when young. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpaceKadet Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 If your neighbor provides you with a cable that plugs in straight to the PC then it's probably Ethernet connection from his router/switch and not ADSL. The quickest, cheapest and easiest way to create a WiFi hotspot with your PC is to get a USB WiFi Adapter (500 baht or less) and use Connectify ( free program) to run your hotspot. Connectify will set everything up for you without the need to mess with ICS settings. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeverSure Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 Well, let's agree to disagree on this one. Don't forget that USB has finite power and bandwidth to share among all devices, and most of us use USB for several things. The dongle doesn't have a good adjustable antennae(s). The dongle is horizontal and doesn't do well vertically such as up or downstairs and its range is more limited. The dongle may not produce advertised speeds unless you're really close to it. The dongle is great for close work such as everyone sitting around the host computer, but it may still not give advertised speeds due to USB overload or directional issues. It won't give the range. A modern variety of PCI slot on the other hand has much more direct bandwidth, and the card has adjustable omnidirectional antennas for optimum coverage. It isn't that hard to set up ICS, and probably not harder than the software for the dongle. I realize that it's a matter of logistics and preference, but I'll take the bandwidth to memory and the HDD from the PCI bus over the dongle in USB 2.0. If I had a portable device with no PCI slot and with internet access I'd want a dongle. This is a tower. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roban Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 (edited) You need a wireless router if you don't have one already in range and you want a wireless LAN, and his incoming internet is wired. A range extender/repeater lacks a DHCP server and an internal switch and can't itself route traffic by IP. It just acts as a, well, repeater of what the router is doing. It's like a relay in a way. I assume, the routing, DHCP and everything else is done by his neighbour's router, who provides him with the ethernet connection... If your neighbor provides you with a cable that plugs in straight to the PC then it's probably Ethernet connection from his router/switch and not ADSL ^^ That's, what I was talking about. If this is the case, a repeater is sufficient. Many (most?) wlan router can also work in this mode. My routers can... The second one (repeater), which is connected via Lan cable to the first one (basis), has a menu-entry like "Use an already existing Internet connection". Edited December 19, 2012 by roban Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpaceKadet Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 Yes, I agree that USB will have a limited power and thus range. But for an easy, quick and dirty, USB is OK. The installation is easy and Windows7 has drivers for all the generic chisets so doesn't need additional installs. PCI cards are about the same price and definitely better, but require more work to install and thus can be daunting for the technically challenged people. I suggested Connectify as it is easy to install and manage and also free. It allows for easy switch on or off for the hotspot (Security!), without the need to drill down to obscure settings in the Control Panel and Network and Sharing. I use Connectify myself to share my ThinkPads 3G or wired connection over WiFi with my phone and "Andropad" during travels. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeverSure Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 (edited) You need a wireless router if you don't have one already in range and you want a wireless LAN, and his incoming internet is wired. A range extender/repeater lacks a DHCP server and an internal switch and can't itself route traffic by IP. It just acts as a, well, repeater of what the router is doing. It's like a relay in a way. I assume, the routing, DHCP and everything else is done by his neighbour's router, who provides him with the ethernet connection... If your neighbor provides you with a cable that plugs in straight to the PC then it's probably Ethernet connection from his router/switch and not ADSL ^^ That's, what I was talking about. If this is the case, a repeater is sufficient. Many (most?) wlan router can also work in this mode. My routers can... The second one (repeater), which is connected via Lan cable to the first one (basis), has a menu-entry like "Use an already existing Internet connection". You're making good points and I may be wrong here. Rule one is that you can't have two routers on a subnet. It's past midnight here and I'm dragging. I'm going to have to think some more, starting from the beginning. Tomorrow, LOL. I think it's going to take more than a repeater. I think it needs to be more like a switch. Something has to direct traffic on his subnet. But I don't know the new equipment to know if there is a wireless switch and I'm too tired to find out, LOL. I shouldn't even be posting right now - I'm brain dead. What if the neighbor's router is wireless and unsecured and in range for a repeater to boost the signal? Most wireless routers have ethernet ports one of which he could be using. Or what if it's just in range as is? Lemme sleep on it. You have some good points. Edited December 19, 2012 by NeverSure Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roban Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 (edited) You're making good points and I may be wrong here. Rule one is that you can't have two routers on a subnet Yepp, thats why you have to put the second one, which is not connected to the ADSL line, into a so called "repeater-mode" When I switch my second router into the "repeater-mode", all the routing, portforwarding, etc. capabilities are automatically disabled. For the OP imho the easiest solution, if he has a working Internet connection via his neighbour's router. No need to fiddle with USB sticks, internet connection sharing, connectify, etc.pp... good night Edited December 19, 2012 by roban Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaimite Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 (edited) Any router can be used to extend ports. Just plug the cable from the other router in to one of the normal ports (NOT the WAN port) and use other ports for more connections. No setup should be required. Some routers let you reconfigure the WAN port to be used this way but by no means all. Remember do not use the WAN port, and yes the wireless will work this way too Edited December 19, 2012 by thaimite Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpaceKadet Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 Why wouldn't you connect to the WAN port? Using the WAN port you are just creating a new subnet, isolating OPs environment from his neighbor. This will also enable the firewall in the router, preventing the neighbor from hacking the PC. There is also another thing to consider. Is the neighbor aware that the OP is intending to create maybe open and unprotected WiFi hotspot on his home connection? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbrer Posted December 19, 2012 Author Share Posted December 19, 2012 (edited) Great info on the internet issue. I'll sort that out after I buy the tablet. Thanks for all the info. So back to the tablet: I have to make a list of things to check. It has Flash. It has Google Play. If only 8 or 16GB then it should have at least a SD or micro SD card slot for expansion. Dual-Core CPU. Single-Core is much slower. 720p HD video requires a 1280 x 720. 1080p HD video requires a 1920 x 1080 WxH Five items already. Edited December 19, 2012 by cbrer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roban Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 (edited) ^^ With a HDMI output, you will be able to playback movies in 1920x1080 (Full HD) on your TV, regardless from the native tablet-display resolution. My cheap tablet has a 1024x768 display resolution, but connected to a TV, the GPU (Mali400) it is capable to output a Full-HD, hardware-accelerated picture/movie/stream/whatever Edited December 19, 2012 by roban Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbrer Posted December 19, 2012 Author Share Posted December 19, 2012 (edited) Thanks, to be honest I doubt I'll connect it to my TV even once. I use my PC for that. Edited December 19, 2012 by cbrer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giddyup Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 ^^ With a HDMI output, you will be able to playback movies in 1920x1080 (Full HD) on your TV, regardless from the native tablet-display resolution. My cheap tablet has a 1024x768 display resolution, but connected to a TV, the GPU (Mali400) it is capable to output a Full-HD, hardware-accelerated picture/movie/stream/whatever Why would you need to play your tablet through the TV? Wouldn't it be easier to download to a flash drive or even a DVD-RW and then play through the TV? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roban Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 (edited) Why would you need to play your tablet through the TV? Wouldn't it be easier to download to a flash drive or even a DVD-RW and then play through the TV? Easy to answer...a lot of scenarios... Live (TV) Streams!! Youtube, Ustream, Veetle, Justin, Netflix, Hulu.... and many more.. Upnp/DLNA streaming from your PC/NAS/Home server/Router.... DVD is so what from dead and you need a (dinosaur) player too...not forget, we live in 2012/13 not in the early 1990's. You also need to burn the DVD on your PC/Notebook first..Who want to do this? Not every TV can playback H.264/mp3 streams/movies via USB or has UPNP/DLNA capabilities Internet Radio Internet Browser and many more things, I will remember tomorrow... A least, an Android tablet is a great Multimedia Player/Mediacenter device.... Edited December 19, 2012 by roban Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giddyup Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 Why would you need to play your tablet through the TV? Wouldn't it be easier to download to a flash drive or even a DVD-RW and then play through the TV? Easy to answer...a lot of scenarios... Live (TV) Streams!! Youtube, Ustream, Veetle, Justin, Netflix, Hulu.... and many more.. Upnp/DLNA streaming from your PC/NAS/Home server/Router.... DVD is so what from dead and you need a (dinosaur) player too...not forget, we live in 2012/13 not in the early 1990's. You also need to burn the DVD on your PC/Notebook first..Who want to do this? Not every TV can playback H.264/mp3 streams/movies via USB or has UPNP/DLNA capabilities Internet Radio Internet Browser and many more things, I will remember tomorrow... A least, an Android tablet is a great Multimedia Player/Mediacenter device.... Ah, OK. I was only thinking of movie playback. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeverSure Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 Any router can be used to extend ports. Just plug the cable from the other router in to one of the normal ports (NOT the WAN port) and use other ports for more connections. No setup should be required. Some routers let you reconfigure the WAN port to be used this way but by no means all. Remember do not use the WAN port, and yes the wireless will work this way too OK, I haven't done this. I've built some big enterprise networks, but not this way so... ?? I don't see how you get NAT translation to the various computers at OP's house with a repeater. I do see it with a switch, but I don't know of a wireless switch to accommodate a tablet. Maybe the tablet has a LAN port, maybe not. I do now remember that you can't have two routers on the same network or subnet because of the confusion in IP assigning (DHCP) and NAT. In the beginning I wasn't thinking of the neighbor's router, but just as an internet access line coming in. This is something I haven't done - taking one line from a user and trying to split for two or more computers. The closest I've come is using a switch to isolate a subnet, and it does the NAT, but another router is too and is also assigning the IP's. A switch is the answer but I've never heard of a wireless switch. I don't know how you could isolate that. Maybe I'm just behind the times. I'm going to drop out of this because I think my first advice was bad for his situation (although ICS is very viable directly from a modem) and I don't know what he has to work with, with the tablet. This is to say the least unusual and I'll let you young bucks sort it. I'm back to wondering if he can get an unsecured wireless signal from the neighbor and boost it with a repeater if needed. Cheers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaimite Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 Any router can be used to extend ports. Just plug the cable from the other router in to one of the normal ports (NOT the WAN port) and use other ports for more connections. No setup should be required. Some routers let you reconfigure the WAN port to be used this way but by no means all. Remember do not use the WAN port, and yes the wireless will work this way too OK, I haven't done this. I've built some big enterprise networks, but not this way so... ?? I don't see how you get NAT translation to the various computers at OP's house with a repeater. I do see it with a switch, but I don't know of a wireless switch to accommodate a tablet. Maybe the tablet has a LAN port, maybe not. I do now remember that you can't have two routers on the same network or subnet because of the confusion in IP assigning (DHCP) and NAT. In the beginning I wasn't thinking of the neighbor's router, but just as an internet access line coming in. This is something I haven't done - taking one line from a user and trying to split for two or more computers. The closest I've come is using a switch to isolate a subnet, and it does the NAT, but another router is too and is also assigning the IP's. A switch is the answer but I've never heard of a wireless switch. I don't know how you could isolate that. Maybe I'm just behind the times. I'm going to drop out of this because I think my first advice was bad for his situation (although ICS is very viable directly from a modem) and I don't know what he has to work with, with the tablet. This is to say the least unusual and I'll let you young bucks sort it. I'm back to wondering if he can get an unsecured wireless signal from the neighbor and boost it with a repeater if needed. Cheers. If you want to be seperate from the main router using NATing then use the WAN port. The WAN port should have an IP address on the other network, and you should set the routers default gateway and DNS to point the the parent router. If you do this there will be no connection between the two networks, but both will have access to the Internet. This is the set up I am curently using in my apartment. The previuos setup is what I use in my home in Thailand where I have 3 routers configured as switches so they all share the same subnet, and I can roam between them on the wirelsss (One wireless does not give me the coverage I need) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeverSure Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 ...and you should set the routers default gateway and DNS to point the the parent router. OK, I can see that working. Thanks. I've just never done that. I've always been in a position to grab what I need in the form of a bridge or switch or repeater so... My home network has a modem and wireless router and it covers the whole house well due to where I have it. Then I have a cat 5 cable plugged into it and it comes into my office. Then I have a switch plugged into that cable and it feeds every computer in the room. I have another subnet which is another switch hooked to the first switch for my "lab" which has Microsoft Server and 4 clients all hooked up to a KVM switch, one monitor, one keyboard and one mouse. But this is all standard topology where I start with my own ISP's cable coming in to a modem and then the router. If I needed more range or more computers I'd just get a repeater(s) and if I didn't have enough ports I'd add a switch(s). The OP's setup is different from standard, so you guys have fun. And still, if he does need a cheap wireless router, he can still put a wireless NIC in his tower and enable ICS and then configure it as you said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaimite Posted December 19, 2012 Share Posted December 19, 2012 ...and you should set the routers default gateway and DNS to point the the parent router. OK, I can see that working. Thanks. I've just never done that. I've always been in a position to grab what I need in the form of a bridge or switch or repeater so... My home network has a modem and wireless router and it covers the whole house well due to where I have it. Then I have a cat 5 cable plugged into it and it comes into my office. Then I have a switch plugged into that cable and it feeds every computer in the room. I have another subnet which is another switch hooked to the first switch for my "lab" which has Microsoft Server and 4 clients all hooked up to a KVM switch, one monitor, one keyboard and one mouse. But this is all standard topology where I start with my own ISP's cable coming in to a modem and then the router. If I needed more range or more computers I'd just get a repeater(s) and if I didn't have enough ports I'd add a switch(s). The OP's setup is different from standard, so you guys have fun. And still, if he does need a cheap wireless router, he can still put a wireless NIC in his tower and enable ICS and then configure it as you said. This is getting a little off topic, so my last post on the router issue. I agree with Neversure about buying switches and repeaters, however I spend most of my life working overseas for a year or 2 at atime, and each time I come home I have another wireless router to add to my collection hence I use them as switches and repeaters by not using the WAN port (unless of course it can be configured as a standard LAN port). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roban Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 (edited) ^^ I think you guys make it too complicated... OP: My landlord lives in the house next door and he's graciously hooked up a DSL cable to come into our house from his 10m/b connection Most propable translation: My neighbour has hooked up a LAN-cable from his DSL-Router, which I plugged straight in the Ethernet port of my PC. Another setup seems rather unlikely Yes or no? If yes, he needs something like this, maybe with two Ethernet-ports or in combination with a switch. (or a cheap router) Edited December 20, 2012 by roban Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbrer Posted December 20, 2012 Author Share Posted December 20, 2012 Thanks. I'll sort all that out after I get the tablet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David006 Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 we have NEX 200 androids....4700bt I think. Fricking amazing...like you am a laptop guy with mouse and whatnot..touch screen takes a bit of getting used to. The NEX does everything you are looking for and then some. The instruction booklet is of no help at all though ..spent a lot of time fiddling to see how stuff works, find menus etc..probably stuff I still have not found. I use mine for an e-reader exclusively..download PDFs onto lap top first though..never bothered with the SIM card. Should have bought he non sim card version with WIFI as it was about 3700bt. Would buy the biggest unit you can for use as an e-reader...my 7 in is a bit of a strain after a couple of hours which is also about the limit of battery life. Have a USB extension cord on charger when at home reading. Tried to find Thai language books ...very limited...could not find any free most priced almost as much as paper. ( reverted to second hand book stores ) Wife just uses hers as a coaster and a game toy now methinks. Quite a few free English language e- book sites out there. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giddyup Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 we have NEX 200 androids....4700bt I think. Fricking amazing...like you am a laptop guy with mouse and whatnot..touch screen takes a bit of getting used to. The NEX does everything you are looking for and then some. The instruction booklet is of no help at all though ..spent a lot of time fiddling to see how stuff works, find menus etc..probably stuff I still have not found. I use mine for an e-reader exclusively..download PDFs onto lap top first though..never bothered with the SIM card. Should have bought he non sim card version with WIFI as it was about 3700bt. Would buy the biggest unit you can for use as an e-reader...my 7 in is a bit of a strain after a couple of hours which is also about the limit of battery life. Have a USB extension cord on charger when at home reading. Tried to find Thai language books ...very limited...could not find any free most priced almost as much as paper. ( reverted to second hand book stores ) Wife just uses hers as a coaster and a game toy now methinks. Quite a few free English language e- book sites out there. I just bought a Nook off Ebay, still yet to receive it. I want to use it just as a dedicated E reader, but am a bit worried that a 6" screen will be too small. Yet people who own either a Nook or a Kindle swear by them, so hopefully it will suit my needs. The beauty of the Nook is a very long battery time, well over a month, and the ability to store over 1000 books. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ignis Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 Off topic to what the OP was asking but Tablet related....... As said earlier have/had no idea what a Tablet was other then seen girls using as a mirror.......... So have a very old [12 years] Sony Laptop need replacing, not used to much only when out and about and is painfully slow.......... Been reading up on these Tablet things, can/could I use a tablet instead of a laptop ? have no idea Something like this looks interesting and under 20 K http://eee.asus.com/en/transformer-300/features all laptops I have been looking at cost 10 - 15 K more......... I can plug in my 1 TB HDD Passport to the above Asus right ? use as a laptop with that docking pad thing [keyboard] connected ? Down side ? upside ? to using a Tablet over a laptop........... at home have a fairly high grade Desktop, so a laptop/tablet is not something used 100% of the time.......... Many thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinfoilhat Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 (edited) Any router can be used to extend ports. Just plug the cable from the other router in to one of the normal ports (NOT the WAN port) and use other ports for more connections. No setup should be required. Some routers let you reconfigure the WAN port to be used this way but by no means all. Remember do not use the WAN port, and yes the wireless will work this way too OK, I haven't done this. I've built some big enterprise networks, but not this way so... ?? I don't see how you get NAT translation to the various computers at OP's house with a repeater. I do see it with a switch, but I don't know of a wireless switch to accommodate a tablet. Maybe the tablet has a LAN port, maybe not. I do now remember that you can't have two routers on the same network or subnet because of the confusion in IP assigning (DHCP) and NAT. In the beginning I wasn't thinking of the neighbor's router, but just as an internet access line coming in. This is something I haven't done - taking one line from a user and trying to split for two or more computers. The closest I've come is using a switch to isolate a subnet, and it does the NAT, but another router is too and is also assigning the IP's. A switch is the answer but I've never heard of a wireless switch. I don't know how you could isolate that. Maybe I'm just behind the times. I'm going to drop out of this because I think my first advice was bad for his situation (although ICS is very viable directly from a modem) and I don't know what he has to work with, with the tablet. This is to say the least unusual and I'll let you young bucks sort it. I'm back to wondering if he can get an unsecured wireless signal from the neighbor and boost it with a repeater if needed. Cheers. you are over complicating connect the two routers via ethernet ports, and switch off all router functions DCHP, NAT etc on the secondary router. that way the first router handles everything, the second just provides a second wireless access point on the same network. the only real issue is privacy in that you are extending the network rather than creating a sub net. i have two routers at home, one primary for mobile devices and kids computer that cannot do wireless N and for guests and one dedicated to wireless N for streaming video and my laptop. given that the OP is not willing to splash out for a private connection, and he is already vulnerable in someone else's network, i hardly think this is an issue. Edited December 20, 2012 by tinfoilhat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbrer Posted December 20, 2012 Author Share Posted December 20, 2012 we have NEX 200 androids....4700bt I think. Fricking amazing...like you am a laptop guy with mouse and whatnot..touch screen takes a bit of getting used to. The NEX does everything you are looking for and then some. Thanks very much, I'll take a look for it in 9 inches, and see if it crosses off many of the things on my list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tywais Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 @ignis Rather then repeat myself in this topic will point to my post in the other tablet topic - Choosing a Tablet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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