Lifan 250Cc Custom

[wantan]

Wow, thats looking ugly

Maybe substandard paint quality or too much exposure to sun. Its painted plastic, no metal i guess?

To get an better idea we should know if the bike is stored under some shed or if its left in sun and all weather all the time. Maybe temperature difference between cold nights and hot days in the sun?

Such thing should not happen. But with all this plastic nowadays bikes are aging much more quickly.

[Richard-BKK]

@JSexpack

The rear fender is clearly not a warranty issue and it doesn't cost much.

No, that's not so clear. It was hit lightly on the bottom of the fender but this paint issue is on the top. It could not have caused this alligator skin look. Never seen that! And the other side of the fender isn't affected. It should be a warranty issue.

The color change due to sun exposure is something that I never hear before. Is it possible to get some pictures of that?

Will get pics soon. In the meantime you can see the brown color above. That used to be deep red!

The color doesn't look like any original color and I'm not sure that the fender was bend, you get similar cracks if you put painted plastic parts in a microwave oven (don't ask how I know). If I needed to explain this I would probably search for an answer in the chemicals used to clean and take care of the motorcycle.

In the early '90s there was a car cleaning solution that damaged car paint similar like this in the combination of not rinsing the cleaning solution of the surface thorough enough and exposing it to extreme sun light.

I would be very interested to hear if anybody else has similar experience with the paint on his or her Lifan motorcycle. Other motorcycle brands with similar problems also if in combination with a cleaning/care product

If it was my motorcycle I would surely contact Lifan Bangkok, probably best that you let somebody who can speak Thai call them... ask for an email address so you can send this picture for them to take a look at it....

Edited January 24, 2013 by Richard-BKK

[Beardog]

@JSexpack

The rear fender is clearly not a warranty issue and it doesn't cost much.

No, that's not so clear. It was hit lightly on the bottom of the fender but this paint issue is on the top. It could not have caused this alligator skin look. Never seen that! And the other side of the fender isn't affected. It should be a warranty issue.

The color change due to sun exposure is something that I never hear before. Is it possible to get some pictures of that?

Will get pics soon. In the meantime you can see the brown color above. That used to be deep red!

It looks like it may be a bondo issue indicating it was either flawed or imperfect & someone decided to save the part instead of put a new one on. If it is a bondo issue they added way to much hardner in the mix causing it to spiderweb or aligator skin.

Edited January 24, 2013 by Beardog

[wantan]

Lots of speculations

I guess this was the original color. Not much different from the picture, but without damage:

[loserlazer]

@JSexpack

The rear fender is clearly not a warranty issue and it doesn't cost much.

No, that's not so clear. It was hit lightly on the bottom of the fender but this paint issue is on the top. It could not have caused this alligator skin look. Never seen that! And the other side of the fender isn't affected. It should be a warranty issue.

The color change due to sun exposure is something that I never hear before. Is it possible to get some pictures of that?

Will get pics soon. In the meantime you can see the brown color above. That used to be deep red!

Looks better than the original:lol:

So lifan can change colors like chameleon!

At least chinese found a better paint tech than japanese:D

[Richard-BKK]

@JSexpack

The rear fender is clearly not a warranty issue and it doesn't cost much.

No, that's not so clear. It was hit lightly on the bottom of the fender but this paint issue is on the top. It could not have caused this alligator skin look. Never seen that! And the other side of the fender isn't affected. It should be a warranty issue.

The color change due to sun exposure is something that I never hear before. Is it possible to get some pictures of that?

Will get pics soon. In the meantime you can see the brown color above. That used to be deep red!

Looks better than the original:lol:

So lifan can change colors like chameleon!

At least chinese found a better paint tech than japanese:D

The motorcycle is made in Thailand, and they used paint from a Thai / Japanese paint company...

[Neilly]

Looks like the top coat has reacted with the primer...either that of they used the wrong type of thinners

[YipYipYa123]

Looks like the top coat has reacted with the primer...either that of they used the wrong type of thinners

not defending cheap chinese quality at all but thai weather is pretty hardcore and will degrade even an expensive

bike if you neglect it and the changes in climate here between scorching sun ,torrential rains and year round humidity

is pretty hard on the finish of any bike thats left parked outside , regardless of cost

Ive seen many jap bikes under a 2 or even 1 years old that look very poor because they get treated like sh1t or left out in all weathers with no care etc

Edited January 24, 2013 by YipYipYa123

[YipYipYa123]

Early on here I learnt that just because someone has a motorcycle mechanic sign up on the front of his tin shed doesn't mean that he knows the slightest thing about motorbikes. It just means that he once had enough money to pay for someone to make him up a sign.

your post reminded me of some other thai standards of "professionalism"

you could probably say the same about many aging thai doctors in small soi "clinics" who only have a green cross sign outside and charge 50-100 thb

i know someone with a fever who went to see the doctor and was prescribed antibitotics which were] apparently correct

but 2 x tablets 4 times a day was 4 x times the correct dosage which was discovered 2 days later in Siriraj hospital when the sickness had gotten worse ,no thanks to the the excess medicine

On another occasion our employee was stripping alumimuim and sliced his hand ,the same doctor/clinic told him its not serious and wrapped it up tight in dis-infectant and bandages

fast forward to later in the evening and the blood started coming through the bandages so we changed bandages ,it didnt look like it was going to stop after the fresh bandages were red inside a few minutes so i made him go to a real hospital A+E

There a young english speaking -thai doctor (probably with a real M.D cert ) proceeded to lecture us on why we should have came as soon as it happened (after 10 hours it was impossible to stitch due to scabbing but it was too deep to just bandage and had required stitched in morning )

At some stage it may be possible to sue people /businesses in thailand for negligence,western style ,then professionalism and accountability might raise up a bit but probably not until it can hurt them financially ........where it counts !

i would have loved to take the young doctor to the old doctor to explain his <deleted> up to him but TIT so the young doc would likely be afraid

of making the old doc lose face by pointing out his ignorant incompetence and so the cycle continues .........

[Richard-BKK]

Looks like the top coat has reacted with the primer...either that of they used the wrong type of thinners

As I said before the source of the problem is probably a chemical reaction.

If the source of the problem was the thinner used, would the chemical reaction not happen much sooner? A chemical reaction from thinner after 1-year you would expect that all the thinner would be evaporated a few days after they painted the parts.

Partly because the problem with the paint happened after 1-year, I would expect that another chemical, maybe introduced to the paint by a car-care product, would be the source of the problem.

Also if the paint was incorrectly mixed we should be able to find many people complaining on the Internet about the paint, not only in Thailand. Not forget that the Thai factory that builds them is the main manufacturing location for the Lifan LF250-B for global distribution.

[Beardog]

It most likely is not the paint to fault. Most of the shops are using Dupont paints imported from America. The lower end shops are notorius for using gasoline to use as a thinner & it will work but will not dry at the proper rate especially for enamel.It is not to great for laquer either. But a chemical reaction usually occurs that day to a week later. I think it was under the paint. Since 1976 painting cars trucks bikes busses & planes I have only seen this type of occurrence in the prep work under the pain(with the exception of jets -There is no bondo used----unless your on China Air Lol)

Now it may be possible the Dupont they are using is a clone copy made in Thailand (TIT)

Edited January 25, 2013 by Beardog

[Richard-BKK]

It most likely is not the paint to fault. Most of the shops are using Dupont paints imported from America. The lower end shops are notorius for using gasoline to use as a thinner & it will work but will not dry at the proper rate especially for enamel.It is not to great for laquer either. But a chemical reaction usually occurs that day to a week later. I think it was under the paint. Since 1976 painting cars trucks bikes busses & planes I have only seen this type of occurrence in the prep work under the pain(with the exception of jets -There is no bondo used----unless your on China Air Lol)

Now it may be possible the Dupont they are using is a clone copy made in Thailand (TIT)

The paint used by Lifan Thailand is supplied by TOA-Shinto (Thailand) Co., Ltd. Which also supplies automotive paint to the Thai and overseas factories of Mazda, Mitsubishi, Isuzu, Ford and Thai Summit Group who assembles and manufacturers motorcycles and cars for several other manufacturers.

Edited January 25, 2013 by Richard-BKK

[Phronesis]

I find it rather ridiculous that posters here are arguing the about the warranty and support nuances between Jap and Chinese bikes.

I frequently use the mechanics at the big Yamaha dealer just up the road from me.

The tidyness (lack of) and workmanship is no different to the ling changs in the tin shed shops. They have Yamaha uniforms but still use a hammer on threaded studs much the same as would a trained monkey.

The simplest solution to the warranty/price/follow up service conundrum being debated here is to assume ZERO assistance.

The real issue is whether or not replacement parts are available.

I will be purchasing a Lifan Cross this week. I am assuming that I will receive ZERO (valuable) service support.

The ONLY issue that concerns me is that parts for the Lifan will remain available and not disappear unexpectedly as happend with Platinum bikes a few years back.

[Richard-BKK]

On this forum most people have something against two-wheelers if they are not manufactured by Honda, Kawasaki or Yamaha... Suzuki is still accepted to some degree.

For instance one of my friends who has a Platinum PX175 was at our facility this morning and his motorcycle still runs fine, after I believe 4 years, I not say that others not had a bad experience with them... but the truth is that people with bad experiences always have bigger mouths, so we hear on this forum 6 to 10 people who complain that the quality of Chinese and other none Honda, Kawasaki and Yamaha motorcycles are bad quality but the sales figures released by the Thai government shows that almost 30,000 people bought last year a Chinese motorcycle. If Chinese motorcycles from companies life Lifan and Zongshen would really be so bad we should hear from much more people... But the thing is happy people are quiet people....

Lifan alone sold 5,400 motorcycles in 2012, Zongshen – Ryuka sold 15,990 motorcycles, and M-Bike sold 4,090 motorcycles, plus a few Chinese manufacturers who sold all together about 4,000 motorcycles, sure it is not the 1.3 million motorcycles that Honda sold. But still Lifan doubled the sales figures in 1 year.... That is for any company an accomplishment.

[JSixpack]

@JSexpack

The rear fender is clearly not a warranty issue and it doesn't cost much.

No, that's not so clear. It was hit lightly on the bottom of the fender but this paint issue is on the top. It could not have caused this alligator skin look. Never seen that! And the other side of the fender isn't affected. It should be a warranty issue.

The color change due to sun exposure is something that I never hear before. Is it possible to get some pictures of that?

Will get pics soon. In the meantime you can see the brown color above. That used to be deep red!

The color doesn't look like any original color and I'm not sure that the fender was bend, you get similar cracks if you put painted plastic parts in a microwave oven (don't ask how I know). If I needed to explain this I would probably search for an answer in the chemicals used to clean and take care of the motorcycle.

In the early '90s there was a car cleaning solution that damaged car paint similar like this in the combination of not rinsing the cleaning solution of the surface thorough enough and exposing it to extreme sun light.

I would be very interested to hear if anybody else has similar experience with the paint on his or her Lifan motorcycle. Other motorcycle brands with similar problems also if in combination with a cleaning/care product

If it was my motorcycle I would surely contact Lifan Bangkok, probably best that you let somebody who can speak Thai call them... ask for an email address so you can send this picture for them to take a look at it....

The owner sent the pic above to Lifan and Lifan said the warranty is one year and won't do anything but sell new parts. However, the papers need re-checking. Also the dealer and factory will be contacted, but given the Lifan headquarters' attitude, I'm not optimistic.

Here you can see how the color has turned brown where the bike has had most sun exposure. Less exposed parts still have some of the original deep red.

Note that water has leaked into the speedo and fogged it up. The bike isn't garaged.

Another area where the paint has the alligator skin look. Unlike the rear fender, this part wasn't bumped in any way (that we know of). Only two areas on the bike have this particular problem. No special cleaner or polish was applied to these areas alone. True, these are plastic parts, but still the paint shouldn't do that. So it's clearly a manufacturing paint fault of some kind.

Edited January 25, 2013 by JSixpack

[Phronesis]

On this forum most people have something against two-wheelers if they are not manufactured by Honda, Kawasaki or Yamaha... Suzuki is still accepted to some degree.

For instance one of my friends who has a Platinum PX175 was at our facility this morning and his motorcycle still runs fine, after I believe 4 years, I not say that others not had a bad experience with them... but the truth is that people with bad experiences always have bigger mouths, so we hear on this forum 6 to 10 people who complain that the quality of Chinese and other none Honda, Kawasaki and Yamaha motorcycles are bad quality but the sales figures released by the Thai government shows that almost 30,000 people bought last year a Chinese motorcycle. If Chinese motorcycles from companies life Lifan and Zongshen would really be so bad we should hear from much more people... But the thing is happy people are quiet people....

Lifan alone sold 5,400 motorcycles in 2012, Zongshen – Ryuka sold 15,990 motorcycles, and M-Bike sold 4,090 motorcycles, plus a few Chinese manufacturers who sold all together about 4,000 motorcycles, sure it is not the 1.3 million motorcycles that Honda sold. But still Lifan doubled the sales figures in 1 year.... That is for any company an accomplishment.

Richard

It is clear what side of the debate your sentiments lie, however (short term) sales figures have little (if any) correlation with after sales service and parts availability.

I would suggest that improved marketing and distribution by Lifan account for your reported short term sales increase.

I am going to purchase a Lifan because I have reviewed the bike and I am confident I can service and maintain it myself (provided spare parts remain available).

I have had several horrific service outcomes with my many other (Japenese) bikes since living here and trying to find a decent mechanic.

I will not be buying any more high end bikes in Thailand. My personal conclusion that having one here is like throwing strawberries to pigs.

Better to buy a cheap, and hopefully utilitarian, Chinese bike and carry out all required maintenance yourself...

[anto]

I took the rear seat off my Lifan 250 cruiser ,as i use that area for a storage box on occasion .I also got that cracked web paint damage on the top of the back exposed fender .My bike is a black color .As its only that area thats normally covered by the rear seat it does not concern me .

[BSJ]

It's like some sort of chemical used to clean the parts before painting hasn't been washed off.

[Phronesis]

It's like some sort of chemical used to clean the parts before painting hasn't been washed off.

It is actually small amounts of spent uranium. The Chinese have addressed their growing problem of storing spent nuclear waste by exporting it, a few micrograms at a time, under the primer coat of newly manufactured motorbikes.

[crazygreg44]

Wow, thats looking ugly

Maybe substandard paint quality or too much exposure to sun. Its painted plastic, no metal i guess?

To get an better idea we should know if the bike is stored under some shed or if its left in sun and all weather all the time. Maybe temperature difference between cold nights and hot days in the sun?

Such thing should not happen. But with all this plastic nowadays bikes are aging much more quickly.

it's the pigment type contained in the laquer.

If they use an anilin-based pigment red, it changes to brown under UV exposure. This effect has been observed with cars and motorcycles alike, when painted with red that contained the wrong organic pigment type.

It is clearly a faulty manufacturing process and should/could be traced back to the China plant of Lifan. You can expect it does not occur with all red Lifan models . I'd rather suspect they ran out of red laquer at some time while manufacturing, and used a substandard red for a limited period.

Edited January 27, 2013 by crazygreg44

[crazygreg44]

I took the rear seat off my Lifan 250 cruiser ,as i use that area for a storage box on occasion .I also got that cracked web paint damage on the top of the back exposed fender .My bike is a black color .As its only that area thats normally covered by the rear seat it does not concern me .

Did you check the battery . .does it have a tiny hose attached to the breather outlet, that leads from the battery downwards until it almost hits street level? If not, uncontrolled fumes from the battery might have caused the cracks in the paint. In case it is a mainteneance free battery without any breather, forget this post

Edited January 27, 2013 by crazygreg44

[crazygreg44]

Wow, thats looking ugly

Maybe substandard paint quality or too much exposure to sun. Its painted plastic, no metal i guess?

To get an better idea we should know if the bike is stored under some shed or if its left in sun and all weather all the time. Maybe temperature difference between cold nights and hot days in the sun?

Such thing should not happen. But with all this plastic nowadays bikes are aging much more quickly.

it's the pigment type contained in the laquer.

If they use an anilin-based pigment red, it changes to brown under UV exposure. This effect has been observed with cars and motorcycles alike, when painted with red that contained the wrong organic pigment type.

It is clearly a faulty manufacturing process and should/could be traced back to the China plant of Lifan. You can expect it does not occur with all red Lifan models . I'd rather suspect they ran out of red laquer at some time while manufacturing, and used a substandard red for a limited period.

The cracks result from another source. could be due to improper cleaning before priming, or the primer used has a much higher/lower expansion in heat value than the top coating.

[wantan]

Just saw this picture in an add at GT-Rider Forum. So these cracks seem to be an issues on some of the newer Lifan cruisers. Maybe Lifan has changed the paint nowadays if they are aware of the problem, maybe not. Of course such thing shouldn't happen.

[featography]

Lots of speculations

I guess this was the original color. Not much different from the picture, but without damage:

I have the same paint color on mine and it stands out from the black ones on the street. I really like the color. I live in Chiang Mai now, and am searching for an independent big bike repair shop. The wannabe mechanics at Lifan dealership here in C.M. did some bad work on mine. I took it in with a list of things needed done. They did none of them and helped themselves to doing things i didnt want, then took the bike on a 40 kilometer joy ride. Now I need, among other things corrected, is adjust the timing, and carb after them monkeying around with it. There is less than 4000 kilometers on the bike. Down in Samut Sakohn where I lived before, Lifan had a pair of mechanics that were top quality in their knowledge and their work. I miss them very much, and have hit a number of independent big bike shops and they wont touch a Lifan. Does anyone have in their possession a service manual for this bike? I have the owners manual, green book, and all the legal stuff of ownership.