Thai Health Ministry Considering Plan To Force Foreign Tourists To Buy Insurance

[Payboy]

From "approved" insurance companies, I bet.

As i understand the travel insurance will be taken from your country and when you apply for visa you show the travel insurance so you can get the visa. As i know many countries now ask for travel insurance before give any kind of visa

How does that work for the visa exempt arrivals?

[paz]

Yes but without a Schengen visa you can't enter most countries in Europe. A Schengen is a tourist visa valid normally for three months. Makes perfectly sense for any visitor to the Kingdom when applying for a visa to proof that he/she has a travel insurance during their stay in Thailand and it must be specially for older farangs that often end up in hospitals in Thailand.

It doesn't make perfect sense to me. It would be a bit complicated to have to take out travel insurance to apply for a visa - which of course could be refused. You'll find that refused tourist visa applications are quite common if you read through the visa section here.

I don't know about other countries, but when you apply for a visa for Australia and New Zealand they tell you NOT to buy a ticket until your visa has been approved. Are you suggesting travellers should take out travel insurance BEFORE they have been granted a visa?

Yes, EU countries requires that insurance is purchased before Visa is granted, from an approved company, and shown together will the other document. Example, Italy:

http://www.italy-ng.com/images/Tourism.pdf

Then if the Visa is refused, neither application fees nor insurance cost can be recovered. Happens all the time.

[EyesWideOpen]

I admit to a bit of confusion regarding this topic. Is the government implying that a farang tourist can walk into a hospital, get instant medical care, and then stiff the hospital by not paying the bill? That is contrary to everything I have seen and experienced in all my years here.... So all the arguements on this thread become a bit moot if that is the case.

I did have one small emergency where I used the services of a Thai government hospital, whose rate was incredibly cheap. Doubtless a subsidized Thai price that I really was not entitled to. So I can see the logic of those hospitals charging more to farangs. But forced insurance is going down a strange path, as it address a problem which does not exist. Don't believe that?

Next time you have an emergency, tell the admitting clerk you do not have a baht on you, and tell me what they do then......

[FritsSikkink]

Well, usually if you pay your ticket with a credit card , there is always an insurance included no ?

No, there is not. You can buy it as an option.

What about foreigners living here who arrange for private heath insurance in Thailand? Like me?

If you live here, you are not a tourist.

[smutcakes]

I admit to a bit of confusion regarding this topic. Is the government implying that a farang tourist can walk into a hospital, get instant medical care, and then stiff the hospital by not paying the bill? That is contrary to everything I have seen and experienced in all my years here.... So all the arguements on this thread become a bit moot if that is the case.

I did have one small emergency where I used the services of a Thai government hospital, whose rate was incredibly cheap. Doubtless a subsidized Thai price that I really was not entitled to. So I can see the logic of those hospitals charging more to farangs. But forced insurance is going down a strange path, as it address a problem which does not exist. Don't believe that?

Next time you have an emergency, tell the admitting clerk you do not have a baht on you, and tell me what they do then......

In Thailand they would treat you, in other countries like the US they would probably let you die.

[anjing]

With regard to over 50's tourists I think it is more likely the young gadabouts on motor bikes who are the major problem with the hospitals. Older folks normally DO have their own insurance but young ones never think it will happen to them!

[Jingthing]

In Thailand they would treat you, in other countries like the US they would probably let you die.

Don't count on that, mate.

[Pimay1]

I admit to a bit of confusion regarding this topic. Is the government implying that a farang tourist can walk into a hospital, get instant medical care, and then stiff the hospital by not paying the bill? That is contrary to everything I have seen and experienced in all my years here.... So all the arguements on this thread become a bit moot if that is the case.

I did have one small emergency where I used the services of a Thai government hospital, whose rate was incredibly cheap. Doubtless a subsidized Thai price that I really was not entitled to. So I can see the logic of those hospitals charging more to farangs. But forced insurance is going down a strange path, as it address a problem which does not exist. Don't believe that?

Next time you have an emergency, tell the admitting clerk you do not have a baht on you, and tell me what they do then......

In Thailand they would treat you, in other countries like the US they would probably let you die.

Wrong my dear friend. Even illegal immigrants in the US cannot be denied emergency room care.

Edited March 13, 2013 by Pimay1

[NewlyMintedThai]

I admit to a bit of confusion regarding this topic. Is the government implying that a farang tourist can walk into a hospital, get instant medical care, and then stiff the hospital by not paying the bill? That is contrary to everything I have seen and experienced in all my years here.... So all the arguements on this thread become a bit moot if that is the case.

I did have one small emergency where I used the services of a Thai government hospital, whose rate was incredibly cheap. Doubtless a subsidized Thai price that I really was not entitled to. So I can see the logic of those hospitals charging more to farangs. But forced insurance is going down a strange path, as it address a problem which does not exist. Don't believe that?

Next time you have an emergency, tell the admitting clerk you do not have a baht on you, and tell me what they do then......

In Thailand they would treat you, in other countries like the US they would probably let you die.

Wrong my dear friend. Even illegal immigrants in the US cannot be denied emergency room care.

Happens ALL THE TIME in the good ol' USA.

[EyesWideOpen]

I admit to a bit of confusion regarding this topic. Is the government implying that a farang tourist can walk into a hospital, get instant medical care, and then stiff the hospital by not paying the bill? That is contrary to everything I have seen and experienced in all my years here.... So all the arguements on this thread become a bit moot if that is the case.

I did have one small emergency where I used the services of a Thai government hospital, whose rate was incredibly cheap. Doubtless a subsidized Thai price that I really was not entitled to. So I can see the logic of those hospitals charging more to farangs. But forced insurance is going down a strange path, as it address a problem which does not exist. Don't believe that?

Next time you have an emergency, tell the admitting clerk you do not have a baht on you, and tell me what they do then......

In Thailand they would treat you, in other countries like the US they would probably let you die.

Google is your friend...or your enemy.... By law in America the hospitals MUST treat you. They do not have a choice regarding emergency treatment. I f you need a liver transplant that is a different story.

A friend of mine from Sweden had a motorcycle accident in Pattaya, and went to Bangkok Pattaya Hospital with a severe scalp laceration. In the course of the accident he lost his wallet so showed up at the hospital with nothing. He says he sat outside the emergency room holding onto his scalp with blood dripping off his elbows. Finally the hospital felt sorry for him, and sent a hospital staff person to his hotel to get some additional credit cards from his room. When the hospital discovered he was a multimillionaire, his treatment instantly changed. Lots of apologies, and straight to a VIP room.......

So let me make my point one more time . They will NOT treat you for a serious injury, which of course is the only one that matters. I guess if you cut your finger, they would patch it up and hope you pay at the front desk instead of running outside.....

[473geo]

I admit to a bit of confusion regarding this topic. Is the government implying that a farang tourist can walk into a hospital, get instant medical care, and then stiff the hospital by not paying the bill? That is contrary to everything I have seen and experienced in all my years here.... So all the arguements on this thread become a bit moot if that is the case.

I did have one small emergency where I used the services of a Thai government hospital, whose rate was incredibly cheap. Doubtless a subsidized Thai price that I really was not entitled to. So I can see the logic of those hospitals charging more to farangs. But forced insurance is going down a strange path, as it address a problem which does not exist. Don't believe that?

Next time you have an emergency, tell the admitting clerk you do not have a baht on you, and tell me what they do then......

In Thailand they would treat you, in other countries like the US they would probably let you die.

Wrong my dear friend. Even illegal immigrants in the US cannot be denied emergency room care.

Happens ALL THE TIME in the good ol' USA.

I suppose you could try telling them you think USA wasted millions on the space program so they should carry the cost of your healthcare.......in the world of Pimay this appears to be acceptable

Edited March 13, 2013 by 473geo

[jocko]

40 % of this hospital visits is made by expats living in the country. A higher fee on air fare and hotels does not effect the expats living in Thailand.

But if these fees are implemented does that mean as an expat living in the Kingdom we get free medical care?

Or will the next rule be: A proof of medical insurance when you apply for a visa?

As far as I'm aware, you can't get medical insurance in Thailand unless you are under 60 years old, so that would mean once expats reach 60 they will have to go back to their own countries as they won't get a visa to live here with no medical insurance. I don't think so, Thailand does not want us, but they want our money.

What would happen if all us old geezers where forced to leave Thailand because of health insurance issue's I wonder what would become of the wife's and families they support and many other spends and help they give the local economy I think if the government could calculate that(not easy) we would hear no more about how much we are costing the health service .

I am sure they come up with all these plans just to give us something to discuss on TV and of course like all government departments worldwide they need something to think about.

I for one just pick up sticks and ship out without a backward glance .

We will never be forced to leave Thailand Jocko, they need us too much. Unlike you, I will never go back to stay in Scotland, not even if it became independent.

Go back to Scotland geez a break Jimmy I was thinking about just over one of Thais borders or anywhere that will have me as long as there is no snow.

I agree that it's unlikely to happen if you think about all future plans you have read about for Thailand nothing much happens.

They just think them up so they don't have to think about more serious stuff , keeps them happy

[thailand49]

This must be a big joke? The Minister of Health should worry more about taking care of his/her own people or improving the current lousy service that are given to them instead of worrying about foreign tourist.

I think many here is missing the real point and that is not about whether we should buy travel insurance or whether a credit card has insurance?

This story smell like the dead rat like the office of Health! I would like to see some stats how many tourist are actually getting sick and draining Thailand?

Here is my reply to your idea " K-ss My A-S!

[jocko]

I admit to a bit of confusion regarding this topic. Is the government implying that a farang tourist can walk into a hospital, get instant medical care, and then stiff the hospital by not paying the bill? That is contrary to everything I have seen and experienced in all my years here.... So all the arguements on this thread become a bit moot if that is the case.

I did have one small emergency where I used the services of a Thai government hospital, whose rate was incredibly cheap. Doubtless a subsidized Thai price that I really was not entitled to. So I can see the logic of those hospitals charging more to farangs. But forced insurance is going down a strange path, as it address a problem which does not exist. Don't believe that?

Next time you have an emergency, tell the admitting clerk you do not have a baht on you, and tell me what they do then......

In Thailand they would treat you, in other countries like the US they would probably let you die.

Wrong my dear friend. Even illegal immigrants in the US cannot be denied emergency room care.

He has never watched ER.

[bhakta]

Its a ridiculous proposal, which will never fly as Thailand wants tourists, as many as possible to keep coming into the country.

[sushi5734]

I don't see a problem with having to show proof of insurance when you turn up at the airport, if you don't have any you buy it there, it would probably be expensive but as long as people have advance notice I don't see the problem.

I'm also surprised that its not a requirement for renewing a visa for expats, it should be.

If you work in a government school you can join the government health scheme for 750 baht a month, the school pays another 750 baht, this gives full access to all public hospitals. Why not implement something like this for retired expats starting at 18000 baht a year for full health care, raising according to age, pre existing conditions etc. seems very good value to me.

[EyesWideOpen]

473geo

I suppose you could try telling them you think USA wasted millions on the space program so they should carry the cost of your healthcare.......in the world of Pimay this appears to be acceptable

What the bleep ???? How did America and its space program get dragged into a thread about forced health insurance in Thailand ?? Guess I know now why mods are needed here... :-)

Edited March 13, 2013 by EyesWideOpen

[MaxiJaz]

The article is not clear. Where are these 2.5 million foreigners getting free hospital care? 40% Live here and probably have some medical cover anyway, Unless they are stupid. 32% accidents - Understandable with the conditions of the roads, etc.

It mentions THB 140 Bn but for care of the elderley?

So how much did it actually cost the health service?

140bn / 2.5m = 56,000 baht each on average.

How much does tourism bring in?

Wiki said 560,000 Million Baht in 2007 - 7% GDP

C'mon Thailand Wake Up.. Look after your foreign friends..

Not to mention the profit on unfortunate foreigners who do get injured or sick and do pay!

Edited March 13, 2013 by MaxiJaz

[Sheryl]

40 % of this hospital visits is made by expats living in the country. A higher fee on air fare and hotels does not effect the expats living in Thailand.

But if these fees are implemented does that mean as an expat living in the Kingdom we get free medical care?

Or will the next rule be: A proof of medical insurance when you apply for a visa?

I suspect that as regards the high hospital bills that go unpaid it is a lot more than 40%, it is a large majority that is due to long term expats....many of whom are no longer able to access the health systems of their home countries due to having lost residency etc. Which is obviously not an issue for tourists.

It may be hard for the Govt to get a full handle on since as we all know, being in a tourist visa doesn't necessarily mean one is not living here longterm or most of the time. That's even assuming they have data on the visa types of expats with unpaid bills, which they may not.

A mandatory insurance policy for one year visa extensions has been mooted for some time and I expect will happen sooner or later. It's not unfeasible since there is a detailed examination of documents involved anyhow. And who knows, maybe it would give a much needed impetus for a lower price, policy covering expats for care in govt hospitals only and regardless of age and pre-existing conditions. Which would be a win-win. Lots of expats unable to get insurance here, or unable to afford what is on the market which are comparatively costly plans aimed at ensuring access to private hospitals (not that these aren't worth getting if you can...but there is a potential market for something more basic and downscale).

A mandatory policy for tourists on the other hand does not seem feasible to implement. How on earth would immigration sort out who has what type of insurance covering what where? They'd end up just slapping a tax of some kind on everyone despite many people being already adequately covered. ,

[Jingthing]

...

And who knows, maybe it would give a much needed impetus for a lower price, policy covering expats for care in govt hospitals only and regardless of age and pre-existing conditions. Which would be a win-win. Lots of expats unable to get insurance here, or unable to afford what is on the market which are comparatively costly plans aimed at ensuring access to private hospitals (not that these aren't worth getting if you can...but there is a potential market for something more basic and downscale).

...

I would WELCOME mandatory insurance in that scenario. But without the offering, it's goodbye Thailand for a lot of us.

[Beetlejuice]

What about those who continually do the border crossings, the forever tourists, but tourists nevertheless? And if the Thai Government is not prepared to include the ex-pats in any government schemes, than surely this group has to also be included for the imposed medical coverage.

Linked to a visa could set an annual maximum of say 20k for annual renewal same multi entry

So what?

Eventually if those of little wealth continue to come here and get into difficulties, become a burden, which means, not being able to meet the required visa regulations and not able to afford medical care and treatment, than that will have a knock on affect for all ex-pats anyway.

I do hope that the authorities will implement the now considered medical insurance scheme, and for those who cannot afford it, than there are other destinations to plonk themselves that maybe more affordable for them.

[Pimay1]

Quotes got me again.

Wrong my dear friend. Even illegal immigrants in the US cannot be denied emergency room care.

Happens ALL THE TIME in the good ol' USA.

I suppose you could try telling them you think USA wasted millions on the space program so they should carry the cost of your healthcare.......in the world of Pimay this appears to be acceptable

Space program? My taxes at work. No issues there. But I do have issues if foreigners come here, get medical care and don't pay the bill. But I think it is unfair for the government, any government to penalize all for the indiscretions of a few. If the foreigners don't pay the hospital bill then detain them until they do. I expect in most cases the money would come swiftly to pay the bill.

[h5kaf]

Well, usually if you pay your ticket with a credit card , there is always an insurance included no ?

No, there is not. You can buy it as an option.

What about foreigners living here who arrange for private heath insurance in Thailand? Like me?

Maybe in all depends on "what country --what card "---my Visa Card here in N.Z gives me 90 days cover --if I pay fare with it--that saves me $200-$500--depending how long I stay

Bucko it would be of benefit to you if you check the small print regarding the cover you have with your visa card. You will find that they exclude all 'pre existing conditions' and 'those conditions which you are aware of or could have been aware of before travelling'. You would find them very reluctant to pay out for anything other than an accident, and with plenty of wriggle room for their medical advisors to deny any claim. Also beware age restrictions.

[Eddy B]

Regardless if you have insurance, you still need to lump out the cash from your own pocket first (foot the bill) and then send the receipts to your insurance before they give you the money back. That includes tourists as well as expats. Either way, no money to pay your hospital charges you are in the LOS and it will rape your ass!

[mickjn]

I hope it works great idea

[Lingba]

Forcing people to buy insurance is ridiculous...why can't the hospitals take responsibility for their own decisions on they choose to treat or not treat..plain and simple...I for one would refuse to be coerced into purchasing something I don't agree with...Sounds like to me the Insurance are actually the ones behind this strong arm tactic

[Briandajew]

Can someone tell me how you get out of a Thai hospital without settling the bill? I have a friend that was treated in a local hospital and was escorted to the bank ATM to get the money before he was allowed to go.....sorry, this just looks like another SCAM from the HUB OF SCAMS to try to get foreign visitors to cough up cash to pay for the inadequate health provisions of the Thai government for its own citizens.

In my experience, I have been hospitalized on three or four occaisions here over the past 10 years, and they make you pay for your board/lodging/medication Dr. Fees on a daily basis if you are kept in overnight or on an extended stay. (I am not saying they possibly do not get ripped off, but it cannot be a lot - I always pay when asked and have always received excellent treatment)

[NewlyMintedThai]

Forcing people to buy insurance is ridiculous.

Ridiculous enough for many, many other countries to do the same. EU, Schengen, many others. It is so easy and cheap to get, everyone should have it anyway.

[IAMSOBAD]

The Health Minister has probably never traveled outside of Thailand.

He also probably just invested in an insurance company or has a brother in law who sells policies.

[thailand49]

I admit to a bit of confusion regarding this topic. Is the government implying that a farang tourist can walk into a hospital, get instant medical care, and then stiff the hospital by not paying the bill? That is contrary to everything I have seen and experienced in all my years here.... So all the arguements on this thread become a bit moot if that is the case.

I did have one small emergency where I used the services of a Thai government hospital, whose rate was incredibly cheap. Doubtless a subsidized Thai price that I really was not entitled to. So I can see the logic of those hospitals charging more to farangs. But forced insurance is going down a strange path, as it address a problem which does not exist. Don't believe that?

Next time you have an emergency, tell the admitting clerk you do not have a baht on you, and tell me what they do then......

In Thailand they would treat you, in other countries like the US they would probably let you die.

Google is your friend...or your enemy.... By law in America the hospitals MUST treat you. They do not have a choice regarding emergency treatment. I f you need a liver transplant that is a different story.

A friend of mine from Sweden had a motorcycle accident in Pattaya, and went to Bangkok Pattaya Hospital with a severe scalp laceration. In the course of the accident he lost his wallet so showed up at the hospital with nothing. He says he sat outside the emergency room holding onto his scalp with blood dripping off his elbows. Finally the hospital felt sorry for him, and sent a hospital staff person to his hotel to get some additional credit cards from his room. When the hospital discovered he was a multimillionaire, his treatment instantly changed. Lots of apologies, and straight to a VIP room.......

So let me make my point one more time . They will NOT treat you for a serious injury, which of course is the only one that matters. I guess if you cut your finger, they would patch it up and hope you pay at the front desk instead of running outside.....

Just a small clarification!

I hear this line a lot from people and it is somewhat true? When someone refers to the U.S. that they can't refused treatment and Immigrants get free treatment?

Here is how it works! Yes in he U.S. this is very true! especially when you visit the Emergency room. In the U.S. you can sue if they don't and something happens! In the Emergency room you will be ask to fill out some forms requesting information about yourself and if you can't the request goes to friend or family. The two things they are looking for is a Address and your Social Security Number!

The Doctors doesn't give a rat ass as to whether you can pay or not they are there to treat you and let the adminitrators of the hospital worry about whether you can pay or not! This was what I was told a few years back when I needed treatment but didn't have healthcare. The Big difference is I'm a upstanding citizen have a small savings that is over the limit for getting free or adjusted discount for like low income. I have a legitimate Social Security Number and If I don't pay the bill they send my account to a collection agency and can ruin my credit and attach a lien to anything I owned. As for a Immigrant most likely in general their income is so low they don't get charged or they don't have a legal or any Social Security Number or even a valid address. In most major cities hospital aren't there to deal with illegal immigrants! Guys like me end up paying the full scope of the service and not what someone that has insurance would have to pay? If you don't understand this for example a person with insurance the cost for service for the flu might be 100 dollars, with someone that doesn't have insurance 500 dollarsunless you can prove you need assistance. As stated, the resentment from people like me is I pay into the system my whole life, the system wants me to use every penny of my saving before I can get free treatment while a illegal immigrant most likely gets it free at my expense and yours?

In Pattaya a few years ago a big stink was made because a American school teacher was run down on Beach Road by a construction truck, of course the guy took off and got off scott free! They took the American to Bangkok/Pattaya but couldn't verify that he had insurance the guy was unconcious and no I.D. they supposely stablilized him and ship him off in the back of a pickup truck to provincial hospital 50KM ChonBuri, he died on the way!

Last year, I was in the emergency room with a family member waiting to be transported to a room. There was another Farang in great pain next to us! For nearly a hour I heard him say " help me I don't want to die " The doctors knew exactly what was wrong and how to correct it but the problem after listening staff come and go was how was the surgery going to be paid? He has insurance at home but time difference the office couldn't confirm payment? The staff kept coming in trying to ask his friend can you help with payment? and his friend not sure how good a friend but he said he didn't have that kind of money? A hour later while I was heading to our room he was still crying " help me I don't want to die "

A few years ago my brother daugther was heading ot surgery, he has been using Bangkok/Pattaya for over ten years and has paid cash time after time for his family. Just before they were to roll her into surgery a guy came from the office and said he need to pay 50% of the 100,000 baht, he nearly snapped but I stepped in between them. I told the guy, don't hold up the surgery and if you don't back off I'll write about this in the Bangkok Post and the local foreign newspaper. I basically B.S. him as to who I was that I will do everything I can to let everyone know about your hospital.

They have a law here in Thailand same as in the U.S. they must treat you and yes they too have the ability to write it off on taxes or credit from the government if they get stiff? Because of the language along with other things Thailand hospital is having a hard time recovering medical expenses from foreigners this might be the reason? From my research a few years ago private hospitals like Bangkok/Pattaya or Bumrungrad in Bangkok will accept or do direct billing for medical services, very few from what I was told. You pay first, they make a nice English ledger for you and you get back your money on your own!

Edited March 13, 2013 by thailand49