Liverpool F.c.

[Abrak]

So Kenny's gone. It is easy to understand why.

The last 19 games we scored 18 points and came 17th in the League in the second half of the season.

For the season, as a whole, although we finished 8th, we were closer to relegated Bolton (16 points) than Spurs (17 points) who qualified to qualify for CL.

Having said that, I was all for giving him more time. Expectations were very high that things would improve and it is brave to fly in the face of expectations. All FSG has done in effect is to transfer the pressure for the Club to improve from Kenny to themselves by sacking him.

As for who they bring in, I think the DOF will be just as important as the manager.

[pmacaodh]

Sorry if you guys have mentioned this before (I'm new here and just caught this thread), but in the light of studies into the manager effect, e.g. http://leastthing.blogspot.com/2012/01/quantifying-value-of-football-manager.html it is a bad move to remove someone who restored cohesion to a club and unified a team with potential. If league position is mostly determined by wage spend, then it is key to hold your best players and finance new talent. Removing Daglish jeopardises the most important factor in success - a squad of talented and well paid players. As Hansen pointed out, there is a real risk of losing talent now.

On form: the loss of key players in the second half of the season perhaps illustrates the wage effect as form was poorer when Suarez, Lucas, Gerrard and Adam where unavailable for periods.

My 2c as supporter: I don't see the need to appoint a top-flop guy like AVB. They really need someone with vision to keep the squad together and motivate current and new talent. Who could do that? Capello? (I can't see the current players playing to Guardiola's pass-move-offer style of play).

[SantiSuk]

I agree Abrak. Indeed it is a no-lose situation for an incoming new manager. Expectations of the fans finally down to realistic levels, some world class players (Suarez, Enrique, Lucas), some good prospects (Carroll, Henderson) and immediate competition (Arsenal, Chelsea and Tottenham) suffering their own disarrays and with major question marks about next year.

Any manager would not expect to do worse than this year. A good manager - even one without top flight experience like Martinez - would expect to come in the top 4 with the existing squad. A good manager with the addition of Falcao (or similar), and a couple of good centre backs could be contender for 2nd. No more ex-legends as manager please; does anyone know of one of those that worked anywhere - there must be a few but I can't immediately think of them.

PS - who is going to pick up Falcao in the Summer? Wasted on a non-CL team (ok ditto L'pool but you have the pedigree). Maybe the only reason for going with AVB? [Hopefully he's still buyable when a vPersie-less Arsenal come hunting].

[see - I'm not always nasty towards the Reds!]

[StevieH]

I agree Abrak. Indeed it is a no-lose situation for an incoming new manager. Expectations of the fans finally down to realistic levels, some world class players (Suarez, Enrique, Lucas), some good prospects (Carroll, Henderson) and immediate competition (Arsenal, Chelsea and Tottenham) suffering their own disarrays and with major question marks about next year.

Any manager would not expect to do worse than this year. A good manager - even one without top flight experience like Martinez - would expect to come in the top 4 with the existing squad. A good manager with the addition of Falcao (or similar), and a couple of good centre backs could be contender for 2nd. No more ex-legends as manager please; does anyone know of one of those that worked anywhere - there must be a few but I can't immediately think of them.

PS - who is going to pick up Falcao in the Summer? Wasted on a non-CL team (ok ditto L'pool but you have the pedigree). Maybe the only reason for going with AVB? [Hopefully he's still buyable when a vPersie-less Arsenal come hunting].

[see - I'm not always nasty towards the Reds!]

not enrique santisuk. reina, agger, skrtel, lucas, suarez. gerrard probably still. johnson's pretty top class. enrique's not all that.

we need additions in centre mid and wide attack. top class additions. and a proper finisher would be nice. one who knows that the big area inside the white sticks is the important bit, not the white sticks themselves.

[rijit]

Will any new manager have to sign up to the Sabermetrics/Moneyball theory of buying players? It doesn't seem to be working, whatever it was. Or will it get quietly tossed.

Abrak, is the manager supposed to work this out or leave it to the Yanks to deterine who to buy?

I ask because whoever was operating the system didn't buy well, and if those bad buys were down to someone other than KK, using some flawed theory, it is even worse to visit KK with punishment for them having been non-performing buys.

commoli was sacked. dalglish has now been sacked too. i would hope that they will appoint a senior, experienced director of football who tells them where to shove any talk of moneyball and just sets about scouting good players and trying to sign them for the best value possible.

I must admit to having some 'dislike' ??? for commoli, recently listened to him on a talk sport podcast interview with andy gray and richard keyes, Ive got to say he was interesting and impressive. I was totally taken by surprise.

c what you think http://www.talksport...l-method-171751

Edited May 18, 2012 by rijit

[longstebe]

Interesting to see 47% of Liverpool fans want Rafa back with AVB coming a close second with 15%. On LFCTV forum.

[nev]

Interesting to see 47% of Liverpool fans want Rafa back with AVB coming a close second with 15%. On LFCTV forum.

There is talk Martinez is the front runner and wanted by the owners, i think it would be suicide for him to take the job as the he is not the one the fans want they will not back him like they didn't back Hodson.

It has to be Rafa as the love in is already there.

[sharecropper]

Interesting to see 47% of Liverpool fans want Rafa back with AVB coming a close second with 15%. On LFCTV forum.

There is talk Martinez is the front runner and wanted by the owners, i think it would be suicide for him to take the job as the he is not the one the fans want they will not back him like they didn't back Hodson.

It has to be Rafa as the love in is already there.

But one thing's for certain. The owners don't care what the fans think.

[carmine]

Interesting to see 47% of Liverpool fans want Rafa back with AVB coming a close second with 15%. On LFCTV forum.

There is talk Martinez is the front runner and wanted by the owners, i think it would be suicide for him to take the job as the he is not the one the fans want they will not back him like they didn't back Hodson.

It has to be Rafa as the love in is already there.

But one thing's for certain. The owners don't care what the fans think.

No they clearly don't. Mindyou, it could be argued that if the fans are stupid enough to want Benitez back then its probably better if they don't listen to their whims. I follow the same principle that you never get back together with an old girlfriend as it rarely works out.

The owners should give a young manager a chance and appoint someone like Dalglish as Director of Football to ride shotgun for him. That will keep solidarity within the squad and keep the fans happy. It takes a risk with a relatively unproven and covers them with an old hand that knows the club inside out.

I'm not saying for one moment thats what they will do but to me it makes sense.

[rixalex]

Interesting to see 47% of Liverpool fans want Rafa back with AVB coming a close second with 15%. On LFCTV forum.

There is talk Martinez is the front runner and wanted by the owners, i think it would be suicide for him to take the job as the he is not the one the fans want they will not back him like they didn't back Hodson.

It has to be Rafa as the love in is already there.

But one thing's for certain. The owners don't care what the fans think.

No they clearly don't. Mindyou, it could be argued that if the fans are stupid enough to want Benitez back then its probably better if they don't listen to their whims. I follow the same principle that you never get back together with an old girlfriend as it rarely works out.

The owners should give a young manager a chance and appoint someone like Dalglish as Director of Football to ride shotgun for him. That will keep solidarity within the squad and keep the fans happy. It takes a risk with a relatively unproven and covers them with an old hand that knows the club inside out.

I'm not saying for one moment thats what they will do but to me it makes sense.

Kenny is clearly still a fiercely competitive man and a proud one too, and what you suggest is akin to getting second prize. Not sure it will interest him. Not a bad idea though.

[StevieH]

But one thing's for certain. The owners don't care what the fans think.

correct.

Kenny is clearly still a fiercely competitive man and a proud one too, and what you suggest is akin to getting second prize. Not sure it will interest him. Not a bad idea though.

also correct. they offered kenny an upstairs role at their meeting last week and he declined it.

[carmine]

Agreed but i'm just saying what they should have done. It was wrong and negative to sack him. It just heaps more pressure on them and the new guy. I also disagree with someone like Kenny Dalglish being sacked full stop.

[sharecropper]

Agreed but i'm just saying what they should have done. It was wrong and negative to sack him. It just heaps more pressure on them and the new guy. I also disagree with someone like Kenny Dalglish being sacked full stop.

They have compounded that mistake by the inept way they are going about the search for a replacement. That guy Ian Arye seems to put his foot in it every time he opens his mouth.

[CiaranO]

I am a Liverpool fan and have been my whole life....I love KK and think he is a real legend. Even after he was let go he still was a true red and told the fans to get behind the owners and the club.....class act.....in my eyes and many other fans he will be a legend for the club forever regardless of this season. However yes the league was terrible but he nearly landed 2 domestic cups......so he still has something......no champions league foot ball probably was his downfall this season because as we all know thats where the money is.

I truly believe that the new owners have the clubs interests at heart and want to deliver trophies to the loyal fans.

So the question is who next? Martinez, AVB, Laudrup ? My money is on Laudrup. Simply for one reason......his teams play football the way its meant to be played. ......attack....attack....attack.....in the true tradition of Liverpool. He also has worked with smaller clubs with small budgets and I suspect whoever takes over wont be getting 120m like KK got.......I think it will be more of a case of sell to buy....and use youth players and build a team over time.....

Whatever happens with Liverpool they will be back......its only s matter of time......and us Liverpool fans have patience.......you need to have lol.......

[StevieH]

I truly believe that the new owners have the clubs interests at heart and want to deliver trophies to the loyal fans.

i remain unconvinced about this.

[CiaranO]

I truly believe that the new owners have the clubs interests at heart and want to deliver trophies to the loyal fans.

i remain unconvinced about this.

I can see that view but lets just rewind to the Gillette and Hicks era.......... compared to those 2 these new owners are angels lol

[brit1984]

I truly believe that the new owners have the clubs interests at heart and want to deliver trophies to the loyal fans.

i remain unconvinced about this.

Exactly, we won one trophy this season (and very nearly won two). In fact, I think Kenny's "mistake" was to give the impression (through interviews and team performance) that he was focused primarily on winning trophies.

Sent from iPhone; please forgive any typos or violations of forum rules

[Abrak]

I am not wild on the idea of Rafa myself. He was clearly one of LFC's most successful managers, he knows the club and is well qualified. But that is half the problem really, you cant go on living on past glories and the expectations of many of the supporters in Rafa are so ridiculously high it can only lead to disappointment down the road. I think a clean break from the past would be good for the club.

Still worst than Rafa I feel would be to get a manager like Capello who is 65, the embodiment of the past, and close to retirement.

Hopefully we will get a young up and coming manager. AVB would be ideal.

[rixalex]

Hopefully we will get a young up and coming manager. AVB would be ideal.

Young, yes. Up and coming? Seemed to be going in the other direction last time i saw him managing.

[CiaranO]

Hopefully we will get a young up and coming manager. AVB would be ideal.

Young, yes. Up and coming? Seemed to be going in the other direction last time i saw him managing.

I wouldn't be too bothered by what went on at Chelsea......I mean this is a club that will prob get rid of RDM after winning the champions league and FA cup. Just look at how many managers they have had in the last few years.....

Rafa....no f in way.........he left Liverpool in a mess when he left........he may have been successful but the past is the past and lets leave him there.....

[StevieH]

I truly believe that the new owners have the clubs interests at heart and want to deliver trophies to the loyal fans.

i remain unconvinced about this.

I can see that view but lets just rewind to the Gillette and Hicks era.......... compared to those 2 these new owners are angels lol

think it's a real mistake to compare any owners to hicks and gillett. FSG must be judged on their own merits - and so far they are a bit of a letdown.

[rixalex]

I wouldn't be too bothered by what went on at Chelsea......I mean this is a club that will prob get rid of RDM after winning the champions league and FA cup. Just look at how many managers they have had in the last few years.....

True, but of all the managers to have been sacked at Chelsea, i think AVB was one of the ones you could kind of understand. From day one he didn't establish authority and was floundering. I'm sure he'll get his career back on track but not sure such a high profile and high pressure job would be right for him now.

[rott]

Interesting to see 47% of Liverpool fans want Rafa back with AVB coming a close second with 15%. On LFCTV forum.

And 100% of Everton fans want to see Rafa back, longstebe.

[tw25rw]

Papers today suggest Avram Grant is the favourite.

[rott]

I am not wild on the idea of Rafa myself. He was clearly one of LFC's most successful managers, he knows the club and is well qualified. But that is half the problem really, you cant go on living on past glories and the expectations of many of the supporters in Rafa are so ridiculously high it can only lead to disappointment down the road. I think a clean break from the past would be good for the club.

Still worst than Rafa I feel would be to get a manager like Capello who is 65, the embodiment of the past, and close to retirement.

Hopefully we will get a young up and coming manager. AVB would be ideal.

So Rafa ''was clearly one of LFC's most successful managers'', Abrak. I do see why Blue Kipper describes kopites as deluded.

Please clarify how long he was there and what he won, (and that was with someone else's team).

[rott]

Papers today suggest Avram Grant is the favourite.

And how are the most knowledgeable fans in the world reacting to this I wonder.

[CiaranO]

Papers today suggest Avram Grant is the favourite.

The only reason that was even mentioned was because he quit belgrade....the owners know they would never get away with appointing him......and they would have a Roy Hodgson situation all over again....I dont know what papers you are reading but from just googling Liverpool and AG nothing comes up.....after thinking about this more I wouldnt be surprised of they go with AVB....with the aim of rebuilding Liverpool FC....over a 3 year period.....

[tw25rw]

Papers today suggest Avram Grant is the favourite.

The only reason that was even mentioned was because he quit belgrade....the owners know they would never get away with appointing him......and they would have a Roy Hodgson situation all over again....I dont know what papers you are reading but from just googling Liverpool and AG nothing comes up.....after thinking about this more I wouldnt be surprised of they go with AVB....with the aim of rebuilding Liverpool FC....over a 3 year period.....

I was on a wind up. Would love it to happen though..

[CiaranO]

Papers today suggest Avram Grant is the favourite.

The only reason that was even mentioned was because he quit belgrade....the owners know they would never get away with appointing him......and they would have a Roy Hodgson situation all over again....I dont know what papers you are reading but from just googling Liverpool and AG nothing comes up.....after thinking about this more I wouldnt be surprised of they go with AVB....with the aim of rebuilding Liverpool FC....over a 3 year period.....

I was on a wind up. Would love it to happen though..

you had me franticly googling there mate..................my heart skipped a beat lol

[sharecropper]

AVB is definitely a strong contender: This from the, er, Express:

:ANDRE VILLAS-BOAS will this week be offered the job of succeeding sacked Liverpool manager Kenny Dalglish.

Bruised owners John W Henry and Tom Werner, who have come under fire from large sections of Liverpool’s support for their botched handling of Dalglish’s departure, are cutting short their interview process.

An original plan to invite around 10 candidates to state their cases to become the new Liverpool manager has been hastily scrapped.

Now, just a handful of potential Kop bosses will be questioned by the Boston-based Anfield hierarchy.

http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/321304/Anfield-chiefs-will-ask-Andre-Villas-Boas-to-make-Kop-great-again-