Nationalists threaten violence if ICJ verdict goes in favour of Cambodia

[Lite Beer]

Nationalists threaten violence if ICJ verdict goes in favour of Cambodia
Pravit Rojanaphruk
The Sunday Nation

BANGKOK: -- War, cyber-attack and the refusal to abide by international justice - these are just some of the actions threatened by Thai nationalists if the International Court of Justice (ICJ) rules in favour of Cambodia tomorrow over the Preah Vihear temple territory dispute.

Zoom, the pen-name of a well-known columnist at Thai Rath, the country's best-selling Thai-language newspaper, advised his readers to launch a cyber-attack on the ICJ's website in the hope of incapacitating the site and making their feelings known to the world.

"Use a modern means, click on the 'dislike' button at the court's website, say, 5 to 10 million clicks, so it will crash," Zoom wrote.

The veteran columnist also slammed a statement from the King Prajadhipok Institute (KPI) as expedient in stating that it would be best to accept any ruling, since Thailand is no "superpower" and must co-exist as a member of the international community.

Others have gone further, taking to online social networks like Facebook and Twitter to call for military action if the ICJ rules against Thailand.

"Let me be frank and ask this: When the US waged war against Mexico and gained Texas and New Mexico, was there any International Court of Justice to adjudicate?" Porncheewin Suksumrual, who works at a travel agency, posted on Facebook.

While many Thais are willing to peacefully accept the ruling, no matter which way it goes, local villagers along the Thai-Cambodian border are taking no chances and have been building bunkers and fortifications for days now in case violence breaks out. The anti-government People's Army to Overthrow the Thaksin Regime yesterday called on the Yingluck Shinawatra administration not to accept the authority of the court prior to the ruling tomorrow and said they were ready to defend Thai territory with force

-- The Nation 2013-11-10

[edwinchester]

Nationalists threaten violence if ICJ verdict goes in favour of Cambodia

Pravit Rojanaphruk

The Sunday Nation 

 

BANGKOK: -- War, cyber-attack and the refusal to abide by international justice - these are just some of the actions threatened by Thai nationalists if the International Court of Justice (ICJ) rules in favour of Cambodia tomorrow over the Preah Vihear temple territory dispute.

Zoom, the pen-name of a well-known columnist at Thai Rath, the country's best-selling Thai-language newspaper, advised his readers to launch a cyber-attack on the ICJ's website in the hope of incapacitating the site and making their feelings known to the world.

"Use a modern means, click on the 'dislike' button at the court's website, say, 5 to 10 million clicks, so it will crash," Zoom wrote.

The veteran columnist also slammed a statement from the King Prajadhipok Institute (KPI) as expedient in stating that it would be best to accept any ruling, since Thailand is no "superpower" and must co-exist as a member of the international community.

Others have gone further, taking to online social networks like Facebook and Twitter to call for military action if the ICJ rules against Thailand.

"Let me be frank and ask this: When the US waged war against Mexico and gained Texas and New Mexico, was there any International Court of Justice to adjudicate?" Porncheewin Suksumrual, who works at a travel agency, posted on Facebook.

While many Thais are willing to peacefully accept the ruling, no matter which way it goes, local villagers along the Thai-Cambodian border are taking no chances and have been building bunkers and fortifications for days now in case violence breaks out. The anti-government People's Army to Overthrow the Thaksin Regime yesterday called on the Yingluck Shinawatra administration not to accept the authority of the court prior to the ruling tomorrow and said they were ready to defend Thai territory with force

 

-- The Nation 2013-11-10

Thought process of an ignorant bullying child.

[chooka]

Seems to be the Thai way, if you don't get what you want then turn to violence.

[soi41]

Again proving that nationalism and low IQ is a dangerous cocktail!!

Let the people living in the boarder areas go on with their peaceful lives, without intervention from idiots like Mr Zoom!!

[MaiChai]

Geography implies it should be in Thailand since the Cambodia side is a sheer cliff. However a much earlier ruling made it Cambodian (whatever the politics of the day made it that way). I recon ICJ will favour the earlier ruling and ignore the more logical geography. Either way there is no way to make both parties happy, other than joint custody.

[EricBerg]

Who tried to burn Bangkok when not getting his way? I suppose the missunderstood fugitive set an example.

[soundman]

Its a pity that resorting to threats of violence has likely stemmed from Thailand being inadequately, or most likely maliciously represented at the ICJ because of influential entities with vested interests most likely working to distort the outcome.

Hope common-sense prevails amongst those deliberating, however, fear they will make decisions on less than accurate information and back room handshakes.

[sjjmmi]

Game over here, better leave now

[Greer]

I still wonder if, as it is such a contentious issue, can there be no form of joint custody as an important historic site, and as a place of worship for both Thai and Cambodian?

[NongKhaiKid]

Surely the ICJ wouldn't dare rule against Thailand, don't they realise who they are dealing with and it's not a two bit, tin pot dictatorship like Cambodia ?

[lemonjelly]

Its a pity that resorting to threats of violence has likely stemmed from Thailand being inadequately, or most likely maliciously represented at the ICJ because of influential entities with vested interests most likely working to distort the outcome.

Hope common-sense prevails amongst those deliberating, however, fear they will make decisions on less than accurate information and back room handshakes.

Can you explain and give evidence to these points so that we might understand your ideas.

[soundman]

Its a pity that resorting to threats of violence has likely stemmed from Thailand being inadequately, or most likely maliciously represented at the ICJ because of influential entities with vested interests most likely working to distort the outcome.

Hope common-sense prevails amongst those deliberating, however, fear they will make decisions on less than accurate information and back room handshakes.

Can you explain and give evidence to these points so that we might understand your ideas.

The Thai delegation is led and directed by Surapong Towichukchaikul, Sukampol Suwannatha & Phongthep Thepkanjana amongst others. All men with higher allegiances to a certain fugitive than anybody else, proved over and over by their actions in the past.

Hardly transparent.

[Halion]

Historic site ! don't think so. These old ruins of a Hindu temple and a few square miles of rural land seem to be most important to some for reasons other than national pride. If national pride was so bloody important to this nation then why do they simply sit back and allow the southern provinces to burn ,kill and maim with relative impunity but are prepared to throw the toys out of the pram with regard to this rather insignificant land parcel.

This could be settled in an amicable fashion by having joint custody and turning the area into a free trade zone between Cambodia and Thailand for the benefit of both sides and the local population.

Like so many situations in this country this issue is being fueled by a few with personal gain in mind such as mineral rights and also to deflect the current loss of face from the public outcry regarding the this nations overwhelming rejection to the Amnesty ill which was also an instrument for personal gain and little to do with democratic process.

[toonsai]

This temple - like many others in Thailand and in the region - was built by Khmers. That's it and all. Now as usual, Thailand will probably divert focus it own internal problems and weakness to this on-going Preah Vihar issue. Let's see what ICJ will say but it is time for Thailand to learn to accept international decisions.

[smutcakes]

Its a pity that resorting to threats of violence has likely stemmed from Thailand being inadequately, or most likely maliciously represented at the ICJ because of influential entities with vested interests most likely working to distort the outcome.

Hope common-sense prevails amongst those deliberating, however, fear they will make decisions on less than accurate information and back room handshakes.

Can you explain and give evidence to these points so that we might understand your ideas.

The Thai delegation is led and directed by Surapong Towichukchaikul, Sukampol Suwannatha & Phongthep Thepkanjana amongst others. All men with higher allegiances to a certain fugitive than anybody else, proved over and over by their actions in the past.

Hardly transparent.

Has the likely outcome of the ICJ decision changed at all since the PTP came to power? Perhaps you can expand what has changed so much with regards this issue since they have come to power, which you believe would back up your assertion that Thailand has been maliciously represented.

[LomSak27]

"Let me be frank and ask this: When the US waged war against Mexico and gained Texas and New Mexico, was there any International Court of Justice to adjudicate?" Porncheewin Suksumrual, who works at a travel agency, posted on Facebook.

[LomSak27]

Now as usual, Thailand will probably divert focus it own internal problems and weakness to this on-going Preah Vihar issue

well that is what this thing is all about

[jdinasia]

Its a pity that resorting to threats of violence has likely stemmed from Thailand being inadequately, or most likely maliciously represented at the ICJ because of influential entities with vested interests most likely working to distort the outcome.

Hope common-sense prevails amongst those deliberating, however, fear they will make decisions on less than accurate information and back room handshakes.

Can you explain and give evidence to these points so that we might understand your ideas.

The Thai delegation is led and directed by Surapong Towichukchaikul, Sukampol Suwannatha & Phongthep Thepkanjana amongst others. All men with higher allegiances to a certain fugitive than anybody else, proved over and over by their actions in the past.

Hardly transparent.

Has the likely outcome of the ICJ decision changed at all since the PTP came to power? Perhaps you can expand what has changed so much with regards this issue since they have come to power, which you believe would back up your assertion that Thailand has been maliciously represented.

I think you may be missing some critical background information about the relationship between Hun Sen and Thaksin ...

[smutcakes]

Has the likely outcome of the ICJ decision changed at all since the PTP came to power? Perhaps you can expand what has changed so much with regards this issue since they have come to power, which you believe would back up your assertion that Thailand has been maliciously represented.

I think you may be missing some critical background information about the relationship between Hun Sen and Thaksin ...

yeah thanks for your wonderful insight, so now perhaps you can let the question be answered on what has suddenly changed around the likely outcome which leads him to believe Thailand were maliciously represented.

[HeavyDrinker]

What really guts these imbeciles is that this kicks into touch their claims that they were never colonised, influenced or dominated by a foreign power ever....ever...

it can be quite sad/funny seeing the wind being sucked out of the toad-faced, key ring laden halfwits as they sit slumped in a plastic chair as they clamour over a cheap bottle of 100 Pipers...with their arms flopping around like wet socks on a washing line...

[jdinasia]

Smut ..nothing has suddenly changed and PTP has nothing to do with this really ....

and HeavyDrinker ..I have no idea what you are trying to say.

Edited November 10, 2013 by jdinasia

[backtonormal]

Its a pity that resorting to threats of violence has likely stemmed from Thailand being inadequately, or most likely maliciously represented at the ICJ because of influential entities with vested interests most likely working to distort the outcome.

Hope common-sense prevails amongst those deliberating, however, fear they will make decisions on less than accurate information and back room handshakes.

Political colours nailed to the mast with that post. Not to worry its exactly the same rhetoric as the sponsors

[jaidam]

A better question would be why there wouldn't be violence with the knowledge that any act of violence such as the attempted assassination of a sitting PM as we saw with Abhisits car in riot rouge will be fully pardoned and the instigators likely paid millions of baht if they have to spend a night in the cells. Forcing the police or army to shoot at armed and violent private militias will also cause the PM to be charged by DSI for premeditated murder in a personal capacity. Thaksins opponents stand to win big-time from any violence due to the farcical application of law since PTP came to power. Thaksin has well and truly shot himself in the foot again.

[bigbamboo]

Geography implies it should be in Thailand since the Cambodia side is a sheer cliff. However a much earlier ruling made it Cambodian (whatever the politics of the day made it that way). I recon ICJ will favour the earlier ruling and ignore the more logical geography. Either way there is no way to make both parties happy, other than joint custody.

Spot on.

Unfortunately Thailand blew it when it failed to prepare properly decades ago.... an all too familiar trait which still continues today.

[chainarong]

One suggestion, pull yer head in , Thailand is in no position to dictate to anyone, this should not have gone as far as it has, if the countries concerned would have shown some maturity. Thailand has much more to worry about , I suggest the Nationalists concentrate their efforts to try and make Thailand a better country.

[GentlemanJim]

The Thai delegation is led and directed by Surapong Towichukchaikul, Sukampol Suwannatha & Phongthep Thepkanjana amongst others. All men with higher allegiances to a certain fugitive than anybody else, proved over and over by their actions in the past.

Hardly transparent.

Has the likely outcome of the ICJ decision changed at all since the PTP came to power? Perhaps you can expand what has changed so much with regards this issue since they have come to power, which you believe would back up your assertion that Thailand has been maliciously represented.

Perhaps this info can help you understand what is really going on with this piece of rock and the surrounding forest.

From another similar thread with thanks to waza.

This issue may be the downfall of the Thaksin proxy government, they want the anti-amnesty protestors off the street before the verdict, as it has the potential to explode into a large scale anti-government protest too popular and disruptive for them to control. Thaksin and his proxy governments have a long political history with this emotive issue.

"Following military skirmishes along the Thai-Cambodian border, Cambodia asked the court in 2011 to interpret the previous judgement and to make clear the vicinity of the temple. However, the border dispute became the centre of a political dispute as opposition and conservative groups accused the government under the Thaksin Shinawatra camp of making a deal with Phnom Penh over the temple, for personal interests."

Thaksin's involvement began in 2001......."In 2001, officials from both nations signed a Memorandum of Understanding regarding the joint development of the 26,000-kilometre area, believed to be rich in oil and gas. The potential for a windfall is tantalising for both countries, not to mention the companies holding concessions for the extraction, which won’t start until 2016." http://www.phnompenhpost.com/national/cambodia-thailand-eye-overlapping-claims-area

Then in 2006 rumour has it Thaksin did a deal with Hun Sen to divide the Gulf of Thailand resourses between Thailand and Cambodia, with him and Hun Sen holding the concessions....

"CAMBODIA and Thailand were nearing a resolution over the disputed oil blocks in the Gulf of Thailand just as Thaksin Shinawatra was ousted from office in 2006, a US embassy cable revealed yesterday.......“He said they had agreed on a formula for dividing the revenue: 80% for Thailand and 20% for Cambodia in the tier nearest Thailand, 50%-50% in the middle and 20% for Thailand and 80% for Cambodia in the area closest to Cambodia,”.http://www.phnompenhpost.com/national/thaksin-oil-deal-interrupted

Sounds like a fair and equitable deal, but in reality the Thai tier is described as.........."not significant enough to make exploitation of that block alone profitable”. While the Cambodian tier is described as..........“one of the best areas for exploration in the world” and it could “revolutionise Cambodia."

But why would Hun Sen want to give Thaksin a share of his pie? Rumours that Thaksin had sold out Prea Vihear for oils and gas concessions gained momentum when he became economic advisor to the Cambodian government.....

.......Three years later, the MoU was shelved by then-Thai Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva, after Shinawatra was named an economic adviser to the Kingdom.

Then, "In 2008, Cambodia proposed its intention to apply for the inscription of the Preah Vihear in the UNESCO World Heritage site list...... The application sent by Cambodia referred to an adjacent land to the temple under Cambodia’s jurisdiction which was actually Thailand’s territory. The Thai opposition party protested on this plan and argued that Cambodia had the ownership rights only over the temple and not the adjacent territory.......... There was widespread dissatisfaction with the (PPP) government when the then- Foreign Minister of Thailand Noppodon Pattama signed a communiqué with Cambodia accepting the proposal to UNESCO in 2008 (The Constitutional Court, 2008). The oppositions claimed that Noppodon and the then-Prime Minister Sumak had business concessions with the Cambodians due to which they sacrificed the nation’s sovereignty and prestige. " http://www.ipcs.org/special-report/southeast-asia/the-dispute-over-prea-vihear-seen-problems-unseen-stakes-129.html

So after 13 years of political involvement and concessions by Thaksin and his proxy government in the Prea Vihear affair, they then have the gall to say......

"Surapong,.....urged Thais not to politicise the Preah Vihear issue. "Please don't use it to fuel anti-government sentiment," he said.....He added that the government had fought in the national interest of the country over the case and denied rumours that the administration's close ties with Cambodia were paving for way for their collusion on the issue.....Surapong blamed the previous Democrat government for Cambodia's decision to revive the Preah Vihear issue at the ICJ."

This is what has Thaksin running scared, protestors on the street when the ICJ hands down a verdict that casts him in a poor light.

More evidence of the outright rape of this country's resources and assets courtesy of public enemy number 1 in Dubai.

[Time Traveller]

As if the ICJ is worried about the comments of some journalist that doesn't even have the courage to use their own name. Enjoy your little war.

[chooka]

So if Thailand is awarded the Temple and territory, what will become of the Cambodians who have lived there for generations? People whose ancestors probably built the place and worshiped there. Will they automatically be considered as part of Thailand's Heritage and be considered Thai, provided with identity cards and the right to vote? Maybe they will be stripped of their land and homes, rounded up in cattle trucks and dumped across the border? Will their homes and businesses then be given to Thai's?

[Lupatria]

Historic site ! don't think so. These old ruins of a Hindu temple and a few square miles of rural land seem to be most important to some for reasons other than national pride. If national pride was so bloody important to this nation then why do they simply sit back and allow the southern provinces to burn ,kill and maim with relative impunity but are prepared to throw the toys out of the pram with regard to this rather insignificant land parcel.

This could be settled in an amicable fashion by having joint custody and turning the area into a free trade zone between Cambodia and Thailand for the benefit of both sides and the local population.

Like so many situations in this country this issue is being fueled by a few with personal gain in mind such as mineral rights and also to deflect the current loss of face from the public outcry regarding the this nations overwhelming rejection to the Amnesty ill which was also an instrument for personal gain and little to do with democratic process.

This could be settled in an amicable fashion by having joint custody and turning the area into a free trade zone between Cambodia and Thailand for the benefit of both sides and the local population.

I like your proposal. However, because it is a Hindu- and not a Buddhist Temple, why not put it under the administration of an international acting Hindu organization? There are 66 of them to choose from.

[smutcakes]

The Thai delegation is led and directed by Surapong Towichukchaikul, Sukampol Suwannatha & Phongthep Thepkanjana amongst others. All men with higher allegiances to a certain fugitive than anybody else, proved over and over by their actions in the past.

Hardly transparent.

Has the likely outcome of the ICJ decision changed at all since the PTP came to power? Perhaps you can expand what has changed so much with regards this issue since they have come to power, which you believe would back up your assertion that Thailand has been maliciously represented.

Perhaps this info can help you understand what is really going on with this piece of rock and the surrounding forest.

From another similar thread with thanks to waza.

This issue may be the downfall of the Thaksin proxy government, they want the anti-amnesty protestors off the street before the verdict, as it has the potential to explode into a large scale anti-government protest too popular and disruptive for them to control. Thaksin and his proxy governments have a long political history with this emotive issue.

"Following military skirmishes along the Thai-Cambodian border, Cambodia asked the court in 2011 to interpret the previous judgement and to make clear the vicinity of the temple. However, the border dispute became the centre of a political dispute as opposition and conservative groups accused the government under the Thaksin Shinawatra camp of making a deal with Phnom Penh over the temple, for personal interests."

Thaksin's involvement began in 2001......."In 2001, officials from both nations signed a Memorandum of Understanding regarding the joint development of the 26,000-kilometre area, believed to be rich in oil and gas. The potential for a windfall is tantalising for both countries, not to mention the companies holding concessions for the extraction, which won’t start until 2016." http://www.phnompenhpost.com/national/cambodia-thailand-eye-overlapping-claims-area

Then in 2006 rumour has it Thaksin did a deal with Hun Sen to divide the Gulf of Thailand resourses between Thailand and Cambodia, with him and Hun Sen holding the concessions....

"CAMBODIA and Thailand were nearing a resolution over the disputed oil blocks in the Gulf of Thailand just as Thaksin Shinawatra was ousted from office in 2006, a US embassy cable revealed yesterday.......“He said they had agreed on a formula for dividing the revenue: 80% for Thailand and 20% for Cambodia in the tier nearest Thailand, 50%-50% in the middle and 20% for Thailand and 80% for Cambodia in the area closest to Cambodia,”.http://www.phnompenhpost.com/national/thaksin-oil-deal-interrupted

Sounds like a fair and equitable deal, but in reality the Thai tier is described as.........."not significant enough to make exploitation of that block alone profitable”. While the Cambodian tier is described as..........“one of the best areas for exploration in the world” and it could “revolutionise Cambodia."

But why would Hun Sen want to give Thaksin a share of his pie? Rumours that Thaksin had sold out Prea Vihear for oils and gas concessions gained momentum when he became economic advisor to the Cambodian government.....

.......Three years later, the MoU was shelved by then-Thai Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva, after Shinawatra was named an economic adviser to the Kingdom.

Then, "In 2008, Cambodia proposed its intention to apply for the inscription of the Preah Vihear in the UNESCO World Heritage site list...... The application sent by Cambodia referred to an adjacent land to the temple under Cambodia’s jurisdiction which was actually Thailand’s territory. The Thai opposition party protested on this plan and argued that Cambodia had the ownership rights only over the temple and not the adjacent territory.......... There was widespread dissatisfaction with the (PPP) government when the then- Foreign Minister of Thailand Noppodon Pattama signed a communiqué with Cambodia accepting the proposal to UNESCO in 2008 (The Constitutional Court, 2008). The oppositions claimed that Noppodon and the then-Prime Minister Sumak had business concessions with the Cambodians due to which they sacrificed the nation’s sovereignty and prestige. " http://www.ipcs.org/special-report/southeast-asia/the-dispute-over-prea-vihear-seen-problems-unseen-stakes-129.html

So after 13 years of political involvement and concessions by Thaksin and his proxy government in the Prea Vihear affair, they then have the gall to say......

"Surapong,.....urged Thais not to politicise the Preah Vihear issue. "Please don't use it to fuel anti-government sentiment," he said.....He added that the government had fought in the national interest of the country over the case and denied rumours that the administration's close ties with Cambodia were paving for way for their collusion on the issue.....Surapong blamed the previous Democrat government for Cambodia's decision to revive the Preah Vihear issue at the ICJ."

This is what has Thaksin running scared, protestors on the street when the ICJ hands down a verdict that casts him in a poor light.

More evidence of the outright rape of this country's resources and assets courtesy of public enemy number 1 in Dubai.

So a few cut and pastes of parts of a couple of articles over the past 13 years which in themselves use words such as 'rumor', now constitutes proof that Thailand have been maliciously represented by the Government? If you are such a 'know all' why don't you point out this malicious representation which has suddenly changed the likely outcome of the ICJ ruling which was being referred to by 'Soundman'.Why have the opposition, the PAD, the various other against Thaksin groups ever really raised this issue?or the army or the Navy, or PTT? Have you got insight which they dont?

Also using 'Waza' as a source to back up a point!!! Really scraping the barrel of legitimacy there, because his posts are so rational and devoid of bias