Immigration vows strictness on retirement visa requirements

[Sceptict11]

Because having family in Thailand you will pay less or inherit of house and pay the thai price. Also you don't need to spend much more money than retired couples !

????

Can someone explain what this post is saying ?

[david555]

If I was going to stash 400,000 or 800,000 baht in a Thai bank, I'd certainly want it to earn some interest, even if it be only 2 or 3%...

In the past, I know there's been an issue regarding interest credits depending on whether a farang's bank account is coded by the Thai bank as "resident" vs. "tourist" or some such titles. Typically, they pay interest on resident accounts, but not ones coded as tourist, from what I understand.

It's less clear to me that any particular Thai bank doesn't pay interest for farang accounts period, meaning for all accounts. But I guess I ought to check more on that issue.

Having simpel savings KK account as a tourist opened five years ago , and here on non O visas 1 year , some trple entry tourist & 1 Ed visa i saw interest coming yearly on my account to my surprise ......

so now your turn again ...

[Mudcrab]

Because having family in Thailand you will pay less or inherit of house and pay the thai price. Also you don't need to spend much more money than retired couples !

????

Can someone explain what this post is saying ?

Can someone explain what this has to do with the retirement visa thread?

[ignis]

.

Retirement Visa ?

I thought there is no such thing. I learnt here that it is only an extention of stay.

Correct...there is not such thing as a "Retirement Visa" or a "Marriage Visa"

It is an Extension of Stay based on retirement or marriage to a Thai national.

Someone go to Chiang Mai immigration and put them right please.

On my last annual renewal they stamped in red on the top (for some reason) 'Retirement Visa'

I wish these semantics would stop.....extension, renewal, visa......who the heck really cares what it is called, as long as it's for another year and we all know what the person means, so why the need to pick them up?

As I said if it really bothers you, pop along to CMI and give them a mouthful.

Someone must have picked up the wrong stamp!

Just looked at my retirement extensions for the last few years from CM Imm. The stamp mark [just in English] at the top for the last two years states 'Retirement' ------------- no 'visa' and no 'extension' Prior to that it was just in Thai.

Just trying to make the water fractionally less muddy for others

I can only go back to 2004, every year the stamp say's Retirement....... just over 2 years have been in and out on TR Visa's, 6 weeks ago back on Retirement, 1stamp was a conversion, 2 nd stamp 1 year extension, this time say's NON '0' Retirement..

Since my 1st back in May 2004 the stamps have all been in English, no Thai writing of any sort, same as this new one.

Edited December 6, 2013 by ignis

[Skint]

Why not offset the seasoning and share the 800k?

[crazykopite]

I think this particular officer would be better spending his time going through his data base for all those who have no type of visa at all it appears there are 100s if not thousands of falangs who have overstayed by years and have never bothered to re-apply for a visa that is a hell of a lot 20,000 baht overstay fines as a falang on an extension of stay I contribute to the Thai economy every day by spending my well earned retirement money at the local shops/markets as well as paying for my garden to be taken care off.

[aguy30]

Mudcrab, on 06 Dec 2013 - 14:45, said:

aguy30, on 05 Dec 2013 - 20:26, said:

aguy30, on 05 Dec 2013 - 16:08, said:aguy30, on 05 Dec 2013 - 16:08, said:

_{Why is a "married to a Thai" visa only requiring 400,000? Makes no sense that it should be 400,000 when two people are being supported. Why not 1,600,000 baht for a married farang?}

I will simplify what I said for those of you that can't understand. The names or types of visas is not the point.

A farang comes to Thailand and gets some sort of visa arrangement to stay. He must have 800,000 baht security deposit in the bank if it is a retirement extension. He is only supporting himself.

Another farang comes to Thailand and wants to stay. He gets married and is supporting a wife but only has to have 400,000 in the bank. That's two people being secured on half the money.

It is illogical to require half the funds to support two people (or more) when they will likely have close to double the expenses of single person. If the government is worried that the farang will have large expenses then that is more likely to happen when he is supporting two people and the extended family. Even more probable there will be emergencies and even more so when there are children. The 400,000 is completely inadequate in this situation. A working wife with a "really good" job might make 15,000 baht/month (180,000 per year) but not likely with a poorly educated Issan wife. That is still less the 800,000/year total. It is rare for a lucky farang to have a working wife and not one that expects to be taken care of. Makes perfect sense that someone supporting two or more people should have to have more SECURITY money in the bank. Well, that might not be true when Thainess and Thai logic are considered. Perhaps ThaiVisa members are acquiring Thai logic.

1. My poorly educated (University) Issan wife owns her very nice home. We live here with very little expense, no rent etc..no bar girl fines or whoring. My 400,000 baht stays in the bank and we live on my other income...quite modestly, but we are able to go overseas 2 times a year to Australia where we also have a home.

So what really is your point?

2. You need to understand that the monetary requirements are for expenses to be incurred in the next 12 months...you get sick or whatever..its a guarantee of sorts that you won't be a burden on the Thai people and rightly so.

3. You want the right to retire where you see fit? based on what... a sense of superiority over the Asian peoples? Or simply because your pension allows you to just live here...and any changes to the regulations threatens that? Good luck old mate.

I think I understand your position and desperate attempt to justify the difference in requirements, old mate.

Item 1. I think you probably wouldn't make the minimum if they increased the security requirement and that is exactly why the minimum should be raised. If your wife is university educated and owns a nice house then you are the exception, not the norm.

Item 2. Your position explains why the amount for the security amount should be much higher than an unmarried retired person.

Item 3. Strange response. Retire where I see fit? Did I say anything like that? I never said anything about or to imply a sense of superiority. It is all about you (a farang married to Thai) having to show too little income or security and probably unable to pay your way if disaster happens.

If a retired person has to show 800,000 baht then a married to a Thai should have to show a lot more based on what "might" happen.

Carry on old mate and better luck for the future.

[aguy30]

Skint, on 06 Dec 2013 - 15:28, said:

Why not offset the seasoning and share the 800k?

I'm guessing that you understood what you were trying to say.

[TheNativeSon]

Why should a falang married to a thai be treated any different from what i have seen thai woman seem to cost more to keep than a falang wife think it is time to move onto the next door neighbours Malaysia, Cambodia or even the Philippines.

Thailand may have it's issues for foreigners to deal with, but Malaysia is a dirty, socially uptight and Muslim dominated environment. Cambodia has no infrastructure, compared to Thailand. The Philippines is wild, crime ridden, and dangerous for all foreigners, despite the English proficiency. Check those places out for yourself, if you (probably) don't believe that fat meat is greasy. Stay in Thailand. Have fewer worries

[Arkady]

This has become a convoluted mess of comments. Regardless of what you might call the visa or extension or whatever, lets get back to the simple reason why a farang married to Thai has to show a yearly source of 400,000 and a single retired farang need to show 800,000 baht. That is only 200,000 per person for the farang married to a Thai. Just doesn't make sense to have it reversed. Someone supporting two people show have to show more available income than a person that supports only himself.

That is your logic but not the logic of the people who make the rules. The 400k extension is for those with a Thai family member, not just a wife. It could be some one who comes to live his grown up son or daughter and be partly supported by them. A Thai wife could be working and helping support the family. There is also a concept of giving people a 50% discount because they have Thai family for humanitarian reasons, so that the family can stay together in Thailand, even if they are hard up. Foreign retired couples cannot legally have a source of income from working in Thailand and they are treated as tourists who are welcome to indefinite 12 month extensions, if they meet minimum financial requirements, so they are likely to spend more. Virtually every country on earth gives some sort of immigration concession to family members of their nationals to allow them to be together and it is considered a concession to the local family member is a voting member of their society, not to the foreigner. I am just explaining how they think about this. Sorry, if some one doesn't like that.

[mikekim1219]

I plan to bring my Chinese wife next year. She is 32 and I am on Retirement Extension. Does she need to have 800k in the bank? She is not over 50 yet so not eligible for retirement visa.

[icare999]

Some regular used words by foreigners are very hard to find in Thai dictionaries

Like why?

Now perhaps this is one of the main structural problems in Thai society, not to question anything except when it is useful (prayood)

opposite world were we question in order to gain knowledge They question when its to late.

Oh well

A nice day anyway.

actually if you know anything about thai upbringing and education they are from start told not to question and definitely not to question anyone deemed or seemed higher in status. Its totally 100% ingrained in them from birth or for 99% of them. Some like my wife rebel but most don't but even for her she still after 30 years of living western type of life finds it difficult to ask and has to force herself.

sorry off topic but just trying to explain a bit

on subject of 800k each you only need to keep it in bank for 3 months and as someone pointed out you can stagger your applications so its same 800k. IMO if a retired couple don't have that in savings then they should not be here since if one of them gets seriously ill they will need that for their medical needs. If they have health insurance then they should still have that if living here since their is little social services or other help nor should there be IMO for forang. THe UK now requires I believe proof of 25k gbp income pa if I wanted to bring my This wife to UK to live not that id want to. The UK also seem to take no account of her income or fact she owns a place to live in UK.

So Thailand rules do not appear over difficult except for quite poor retirees who IMO cannot really afford to live here. In any case its their country and they are quite entitled as UK does to make whatever rules they want.

[Totster]

... think it is time to move onto the next door neighbours Malaysia, Cambodia or even the Philippines.

Well off you go then....

totster

[icare999]

Why should a falang married to a thai be treated any different from what i have seen thai woman seem to cost more to keep than a falang wife think it is time to move onto the next door neighbours Malaysia, Cambodia or even the Philippines.

It has nothing to do with the "cost" of maintenance (to put it crudely) it's because someone married to and supporting a Thai wife. and maybe children. is allowed compassionate consideration. If you are staying here and not supporting a Thai wife, they want you to have (and to spend) an amount that is considered a benefit to the economy. Thailand is not operating a UN refugee camp for farang who can't afford life back in farang ville. If you are looking for the cheapest place to live they would prefer you give another country the privilege of having you. It has nothing to do with whether Thai people love you or not, they want foreigners here whose presence contributes to the economy.

in order to apply for or renew retirement visas

I assume this wording is the reporter's interpretation of what was said because people don't apply for or renew "retirement visas" at Immigrations in any case.

oops I've been going to wrong place all these years both in BKK and Issan since ice been going to immigration office for last 8-10 years to get my retirement visa renewed. Pretty good scam by those boys.

[icare999]

States can be sued and embarrassed in front of the world for breaching their international commitments to Human rights if they are unreasonably forcing married couples and families apart, ie by prohibitive and unreasonable financial requirements, 400k baht is pushing their luck.

why uk do it all the time. I know plenty of people over last 30 years who have had even a temporary visitor visa refused to a Thai married to a UK citizen and a friend of mines Thai wife who was dying was refused a visa to keep him company in last few weeks when he went back to Australia for urgent medical treatment he could not afford here, It broke his wife's heart not to be able to be with him Start looking at what your country does please before complaining about here.

This apples to forang couples who are both for nag so why on earth should Thailand not make whatever rules they want. IF couple do not like it they don't need to apply and can just go back to their own country.

Even though I've been married to a Thai for nearly 30 years I went on a retirement visa (they call it that at immigration so don't be nit picking to say its a extension permission to stay bla bla bla).

Id be pretty embarressed if after a lifetimes work I could not come up with around 16k gbp or 32k for that matter.

Im also sick and tired of meeting and seeing these pathetic poor forang who do not have a pot to piss in and believe they have some sort of right to live here. Im amazed Thais but up with such low capital or income forang and it would be great if they just shipped most of them out or stopped all this multiple visa runs.

[icare999]

_{Why is a "married to a Thai" visa only requiring 400,000? Makes no sense that it should be 400,000 when two people are being supported. Why not 1,600,000 baht for a married farang?}

Two things.

First, that would mean a foreigner married to a Thai wife having show a disposable monthly income of 130,000 baht.... in excess 2500 STG or 4000US. Now I don't know about you but I don't know too many retirees with dependents here who could hack that. If we did we'd be living in another country in one of those high end resorts that TAT is always saying it wants to emulate. So to demand that amount would be self defeating.

Secondly, if you must give our hosts ideas like that please go somewhere else and do it.

i don't know what sort of life you read and yes it is quite possible to live on 25k gbp in uk but not very well and possible to live here on less than 130,000 pm but not that well. Id guess most forang retired couples here have 130,000 am onto income. I know with 2 kids and I admit a very nice life style we can't manage on less than around 200,000 baht a month but kids schools fees are 50,000 or so of that and foreign trips eat about 50,000 a month on average. I can actually live cheaper in UK than here due to free schools and free medical and a lot of other things if you live to a western standard are much cheaper in UK but then in UK we would not have a maid and gardenor since we could not afford them nor need them given wed in UK have a much smaller house and gardens.

25k gbp is hardly these days a massive income

[Jingthing]

That's the rule for the pure income method. 65K is a round number. What's the problem? Anyway income especially pension income I think is the more desirable method as far as immigration is concerned -- proof the person is actually solvent more long term.

[Sceptict11]

"oops I've been going to wrong place all these years both in BKK and Issan since ice been going to immigration office for last 8-10 years to get my retirement visa renewed." (sic)

Really ?

-

Can you scan one or two of these "visas renewals" to show those of us who have just been getting "Extensions of stay "

We have all clearly been given the wrong stamp !

This anomaly must be stopped ------------!

Edited December 6, 2013 by Sceptict11

[Skint]

Skint, on 06 Dec 2013 - 15:28, said:

Why not offset the seasoning and share the 800k?

I'm guessing that you understood what you were trying to say.

Erm yes are you struggling? Would you like detailed post on how to use the same 800k for both?

[aguy30]

No, I would not like details. No idea where the 800,000 sharing idea came from. Did you just make that up?

You don't understand the concept of more risk for two people, so more security should be required, not less in the event of a disastrous event and therefore you can't validate your ideas.

[Skint]

No, I would not like details. No idea where the 800,000 sharing idea came from. Did you just make that up?

 

You don't understand the concept of more risk for two people, so more security should be required, not less in the event of a disastrous event and therefore you can't validate your ideas.

Are you just acting daft or what? Your second statement is hilarious.

[Hanuman2547]

No, I would not like details. No idea where the 800,000 sharing idea came from. Did you just make that up?

Actually I posted about sharing the 800,000 baht for two farangs back around Post #103.

[Maestro]

Removed a screaming post (large bold font)

[Jay Sata]

Why would two farangs want to retire to Thailand?

There are much better places in the world offering better deals,living conditions/lifestyle and rights to own property.

[ubonjoe]

I plan to bring my Chinese wife next year. She is 32 and I am on Retirement Extension. Does she need to have 800k in the bank? She is not over 50 yet so not eligible for retirement visa. 

I suggest you take a wait and see attitude about this topic.

If they were to eliminate dependent extensions for retirees your wife would not qualify for an extension.

[mca]

Virtually every country on earth gives some sort of immigration concession to family members of their nationals to allow them to be together and it is considered a concession to the local family member is a voting member of their society, not to the foreigner. I am just explaining how they think about this. Sorry, if some one doesn't like that.

Very true. Immigration aren't doing it for my benefit. They're doing it for the benefit of one of their citizens ( my wife) and our half Thai daughter to allow them and the husband and father to stay together as a family unit. They're not sitting there with a calculator figuring out if the foreigner is supporting the extended family or whether the wife works etc. If they were to do that then I shouldn't have to pay a single baht because my wife works for an international company in Bangkok with a high local salary, I work from home online for a company set up for me by my wife's brother ( which is why I can spend so much time chewing the fat on TVF) and I don't have to give my extended family a single bean as they're all entirely financially solvent.

[mgjackson69]

Correct...there is not such thing as a "Retirement Visa" or a "Marriage Visa"

.

Retirement Visa ?

I thought there is no such thing. I learnt here that it is only an extention of stay.

It is an Extension of Stay based on retirement or marriage to a Thai national.

Someone go to Chiang Mai immigration and put them right please.

On my last annual renewal they stamped in red on the top (for some reason) 'Retirement Visa'

I wish these semantics would stop.....extension, renewal, visa......who the heck really cares what it is called, as long as it's for another year and we all know what the person means, so why the need to pick them up?

As I said if it really bothers you, pop along to CMI and give them a mouthful.

Someone must have picked up the wrong stamp!

Just looked at my retirement extensions for the last few years from CM Imm. The stamp mark [just in English] at the top for the last two years states 'Retirement' ------------- no 'visa' and no 'extension' Prior to that it was just in Thai.

Just trying to make the water fractionally less muddy for others

I can only go back to 2004, every year the stamp say's Retirement....... just over 2 years have been in and out on TR Visa's, 6 weeks ago back on Retirement, 1stamp was a conversion, 2 nd stamp 1 year extension, this time say's NON '0' Retirement..

Since my 1st back in May 2004 the stamps have all been in English, no Thai writing of any sort, same as this new one.

For each extension that I have done, the stamp which starts "Application of stay is under consideration...." (the one you get on the first visit), above that stamp is on in red which states "THAI WIFE", sometimes in Thai, sometimes in English

[aguy30]

Hanuman2547, on 07 Dec 2013 - 03:31, said:

aguy30, on 07 Dec 2013 - 00:53, said:

No, I would not like details. No idea where the 800,000 sharing idea came from. Did you just make that up?

Actually I posted about sharing the 800,000 baht for two farangs back around Post #103.

I missed the relevance to a farang married to a Thai and the requirement is only 400,000 baht vs a single farang who is retired with a requirement of 800,000 baht.

[GreenSnapper]

Why would two farangs want to retire to Thailand?

There are much better places in the world offering better deals,living conditions/lifestyle and rights to own property.

Correct. Cannot understand farang couples who stay in Pattaya, pay 500000$ for a crap condo at dirty beach, deal with the yearly immigration issues, 90 day reports and such. When they can have a much safer, cheaper, better life in Malaysia with a proper visa, better cheaper condo/house, locals who can speak English and more friendly.

[IAMSOBAD]

Jay....please tell me some other places like you mentioned!