Why are so many foreigners backing Suthep?

[oldsailor35]

Why is Abisit so silent throughout all of this rabble rousing by Suthep.

[A1Str8]

Who cares what they think? Can't vote! Irrelevant!

Not that voting has ever been relevant.

[kingstonkid]

kawaiimomo

Would you support this in your country. Yes actually it has happened only thing is that parties will disolve.

Then again I have a question for you.

Would you support having and escaped felon that robbed and defrauded the country for his own personal gain running your country and trying to come back to make it worse?

The arguments are not against a political party as much as they are against a family that is perceived to wants to run Thailand as their own entity.

These protests are a good thing for this country. Suthep has done something that needed to be done. He has woken up the young people and they are ow getting involved in the country instead of their smartphones.

This coutnry was about to waste billions of baht and if left alone ws going to absolve Thaksin and all his cronies on both sides of any legal responsibilities for life. that can not happen.

Courts have to be respected. Thaksin feels that he is above the law. No one is above it.

[oldsailor35]

Perhaps we would like a government which doesn't treat expats and their Thai families as unreasonably as the current one.

If Suthep gets control, it will be much worse as he has an inferiority complex when it comes to farang.

When he was fronted with the suggestion that they bring in a UN observer group for the elections, his reply was "we Thai will never be told what to do by farang"...............Dumb, ask yourself what this means ?

[jgm005]

I am not.

Move on to next topic.

[cms22]

I'm completely with you. 100%. I'm so glad you've posted this.

Thaksin is corrupt, politically inept and has a horrendous record re human rights. BUT. He was democratically elected, as indeed his sister was. This is the most important point.

Suthep and his followers, however, also have a very dodgy background, corruption-wise, and - and this is the important bit - want to remove a democratically elected government because they believe they are not doing a good job.

Whatever you think about Thaksin, Yingluck and Suthep. The answer in my mind is so clear: if Thailand can live by its imperfect but yet still democratic system then that has to be miles better than an unelected administration.

Why so many farangs cant see this (and I accept that Thaksin is as corrupt as the democrats) is beyond me.

[cms22]

kawaiimomo

Would you support this in your country. Yes actually it has happened only thing is that parties will disolve.

Then again I have a question for you.

Would you support having and escaped felon that robbed and defrauded the country for his own personal gain running your country and trying to come back to make it worse?

The arguments are not against a political party as much as they are against a family that is perceived to wants to run Thailand as their own entity.

These protests are a good thing for this country. Suthep has done something that needed to be done. He has woken up the young people and they are ow getting involved in the country instead of their smartphones.

This coutnry was about to waste billions of baht and if left alone ws going to absolve Thaksin and all his cronies on both sides of any legal responsibilities for life. that can not happen.

Courts have to be respected. Thaksin feels that he is above the law. No one is above it.

Missing the point. Completely. The point about this all is, is not whether Thaksin is good or bad. It is about whether he (or his sister) was democratically elected by the majority of Thai people.

To make it clear, there is only one person who should lead this country: it is the person/party that is elected by the majority of Thais - good or bad.

Understand yet?

[Bernard Flint]

"Why are so many foreigners backing fascist Suthep" Their wife told them to...

Or they have a brain to analyze instead of following some propaganda.

As if one with half a brain, really believes PTP cares about people or country

Sir

Please google and read about Suthep, chequered past,then maybe you will realise that all governments are corrupt

[FLHR]

"I am glad he came into power because something started to change in Thai society"

​What exactly "started to change"?

They are changing back to the traditional corrupt ways instead.of the new fangled ones like trains and water projects.

Agree! Thailand desperately needs those infrastructure projects, 2nd to education though! Keep them stupid and in the dark ages, easier to control & manipulate.

[bifftastic]

Below from OP is my favourite

uneducated people are the ones who understand and respect democracy

We give you 500 baht and you vote for us

We give you Chinese tablet and you vote for us

We buy rice from you for more than its worth and you vote for us

Yes, they most certainly do understand and respect democracy

Could you be more condescending or patronising? Thinking about it, yes, you probably could, but not much.

[Bernard Flint]

I'm completely with you. 100%. I'm so glad you've posted this.

Thaksin is corrupt, politically inept and has a horrendous record re human rights. BUT. He was democratically elected, as indeed his sister was. This is the most important point.

Suthep and his followers, however, also have a very dodgy background, corruption-wise, and - and this is the important bit - want to remove a democratically elected government because they believe they are not doing a good job.

Whatever you think about Thaksin, Yingluck and Suthep. The answer in my mind is so clear: if Thailand can live by its imperfect but yet still democratic system then that has to be miles better than an unelected administration.

Why so many farangs cant see this (and I accept that Thaksin is as corrupt as the democrats) is beyond me.

Sir, i agree with everything u say, But sadly,some dont see this logical point.

Last time i was speaking to another farang,or should i say last time i heard a farang talking nonsense,about thai politics,he actualy suggested that Yingluk got the majority of a 26,000,000 vote,because the Issan people are RETARDS.Karma is a good thing to remember and i am sure he will get his just rewards in the near future,how disgusting can one stoop to say this.

[Bernard Flint]

Below from OP is my favourite

uneducated people are the ones who understand and respect democracy

We give you 500 baht and you vote for us

We give you Chinese tablet and you vote for us

We buy rice from you for more than its worth and you vote for us

Yes, they most certainly do understand and respect democracy

Could you be more condescending or patronising? Thinking about it, yes, you probably could, but not much.

There are demonstrators outside of Bangkok who are getting free bus trips and 1,000 baht a day to blow a whistle,now that is hi-so

[cms22]

Below from OP is my favourite

uneducated people are the ones who understand and respect democracy

We give you 500 baht and you vote for us

We give you Chinese tablet and you vote for us

We buy rice from you for more than its worth and you vote for us

Yes, they most certainly do understand and respect democracy

Could you be more condescending or patronising? Thinking about it, yes, you probably could, but not much.

There are demonstrators outside of Bangkok who are getting free bus trips and 1,000 baht a day to blow a whistle,now that is hi-so

Again. Someone missing the point. Thai democracy is completely imperfect. But it is democracy and it will evolve to something better. This (vote buying or a Chinese tablet) is part of that evolution. Perfect democracry is not possible in any country (look at the US!) but it needs time to evolve, even (and this point is so important) even if that democratic system elects imperfect politicians and PMs. BUT. They are elected.

[MILT]

I see it is time to call Bilbo Baggins and Sting again. Getting over run by trolls a lot these days.

[petertucker48]

I,m certainly NOT backing Suthep.

The man is turning into a megalomaniac and wants to run the country the same way as North Korea/China/Vietnam only with a Royal letterhead.

[DiamondKing]

"Why are so many foreigners backing fascist Suthep" Their wife told them to...

Or they have a brain to analyze instead of following some propaganda.

As if one with half a brain, really believes PTP cares about people or country

Sir

Please google and read about Suthep, chequered past,then maybe you will realise that all governments are corrupt

You might need to post instructions on how to do that for him

[DerringDo]

I have children and therefore an interest in what this country does to itself. I think it incumbent on every parent to point out the faults of all sides in this debacle.

I don't support either side to any extreme. I engage when I'm asked directly by my circle of Thai friends and acquaintances. I don't say it's nothing to do with me. I have a vested interest after all.

As for calling people Fascist, why not call them Communist as that more clearly resembles the setting up of "People's committees". Throwing such labels is misleading anyway as both sides end up being controlled by a small number of people.

[JCauto]

kawaiimomo

Would you support this in your country. Yes actually it has happened only thing is that parties will disolve.

Then again I have a question for you.

Would you support having and escaped felon that robbed and defrauded the country for his own personal gain running your country and trying to come back to make it worse?

The arguments are not against a political party as much as they are against a family that is perceived to wants to run Thailand as their own entity.

These protests are a good thing for this country. Suthep has done something that needed to be done. He has woken up the young people and they are ow getting involved in the country instead of their smartphones.

This coutnry was about to waste billions of baht and if left alone ws going to absolve Thaksin and all his cronies on both sides of any legal responsibilities for life. that can not happen.

Courts have to be respected. Thaksin feels that he is above the law. No one is above it.

Yes, the Amnesty Bill was ill-conceived, short-sighted, and an attempt to get Thaksin back to Thailand. A lot of people INCLUDING those not aligned with the Democrats demonstrated strong opposition to this bill, and it was dropped. That's what we call "rule of law". This wasn't enough in the protester's eyes so they pushed for more. Now they've gotten it - the government has agreed to dissolution and to hold new elections. That's what we call "rule of law". Yet this too is not enough for the protesters who want some kind of vague solution that they can't even define, and which is not legal in terms of the constitution, and subverts the democratic vote.

So if you feel so strongly that things should be done according to the law, why do you support a protest that demands something that is completely and totally against the constitution and has no basis in law?

[cms22]

I,m certainly NOT backing Suthep.

The man is turning into a megalomaniac and wants to run the country the same way as North Korea/China/Vietnam only with a Royal letterhead. 

Yes. Thailand and North Korea. So many uncomfortable similarities. Don't let the people speak!!!!

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[Baerboxer]

Maybe because the only "side" of the story that many falangs read come from the anti Taksin media...as always there is two sides. Here is an interesting view from the pro Taksin media. I have no idea if the numbers quoted are correct but if so it would seem that there is good reason for so many people to support some of the programs he put into place.

BANGKOK – It has gone quiet in Bangkok, as the people who have been trying to overthrow the government tidy up the debris that litters the city after the last two weeks of demonstrations.

Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra is taking an equally low-key approach. The Thai Army has removed the barbed wire that surrounded government offices, and protesters are wandering through the prime minister’s offices and picnicking on the lawns while she runs the affairs of state from some other location in the capital. But by next week the Civil Movement for Democracy will be back in action, and the final outcome is not clear.

The main thing that distinguishes the Civil Movement for Democracy is its profound dislike for democracy. In the mass demonstrations that have shaken Thailand since Nov. 24, its supporters have been trying to remove a prime minister who was elected only two years ago — and their goal is not another election.

“We don’t want new elections because we will lose anyway,” one protester told Reuters. “We want (the prime minister’s family) to leave the country.”

If they succeeded in driving Yingluck from power, they would skip the whole business of elections and hand the country over to an appointed “People’s Council” made up of “good men.”

These good men would naturally agree with protest leader Suthep Thaugsuban that the majority of the Thai people are too ignorant and flighty to be trusted with the vote. “From a Western point of view, “democracy” is an elected government serving as the people’s representative,” he told The Guardian. “Unfortunately, elections in Thailand do not represent people’s (real) choices because their votes are bought.”

They are “bought” not by bribes but by government spending on free health care and anti-poverty programs. In most democracies this is seen as part of the normal political process, but Suthep and his supporters, who include a high proportion of the country’s professional and middle classes, especially in the capital, regard it as illegitimate.

The current government has destroyed “the virtues and ethics of the people,” Suthep says, but with time and hard work the unelected People’s Council could make them moral again and “put the country on the path to perfect democracy.” We can even imagine that the poor might eventually become enlightened enough to be trusted with the vote again.

There is a conflict between the interests of the rich and the poor in most countries. In democracies it normally plays out in the electoral competition of right- and left-wing parties, and some compromise (always temporary and contentious) is arrived at via the ballot box. But in Thailand, the rich take to the streets.

They do so because they always lose the elections. In five elections since 2001, the winner every time has been Thaksin Shinawatra or somebody chosen by him. Thaksin is a man of humble origins who built the country’s largest mobile phone provider and then went into politics. He proved to be unbeatable.

His record in power has not been above reproach. He was careless of human rights, particularly in his war on drug dealers (he used death squads), and his family fortune benefited to some degree from his influence on government policy. But he wasn’t really in it for the money — he was already mega-rich before he went into politics — and he knew exactly what the poor needed. To the horror of relatively wealthy Bangkok and the south, he gave it to them.

He set up programs like village-managed micro-credit development funds and low-interest agricultural loans. He created a universal health care system and provided low-cost access to anti-HIV medications.

Yet between 2001 and the coup that overthrew him in 2006, GDP grew by 30 percent, public sector debt fell from 57 per cent of GDP to 41 per cent, and foreign exchange reserves doubled. He even managed to balance the budget.

Income in the northeast, the poorest part of the country, rose by 41 percent. Poverty nationwide dropped from 21 percent to 11 percent, and the prevalence of HIV/AIDS declined. Thaksin even allowed the 2.3 million migrant workers in the country to register and qualify for health coverage.

From the point of view of the opposition Democratic Party, all this was just “buying the people’s votes.” When Thaksin won the 2005 election with an increased majority, it conspired with the military to overthrow him. He was then tried on corruption charges, but fled the country before the inevitable verdict and has since lived in exile, mostly in Dubai. But his party, reformed and renamed, goes on winning every time there is an election.

That’s why his 46-year-old sister is now the prime minister. She probably does do what he says most of the time, but there’s no crime in that: The voters who put her there were really voting for Thaksin. And if the current insurrection in Bangkok overthrows her, they will vote for whoever else represents Thaksin next time there is an election. The right in Thailand should really grow up and get over it.

by Gwynne Dyer

All credibility diminishes when you see "the Guardian".

No mention of Thaksin's human rights issues, the war on drugs, Tai Bak. The last paragraph sums it up nicely. This writer, editor and newspaper see nothing wrong in a Prime Minister and her government doing what a convicted criminal fugitive tells them.

Of course, she implies the conviction was unjust, but offers no evidence to support that, or inquire why he didn't appeal and fight, or that his relation was PM at the time; fails to mention he has many more outstanding charges waiting or that the government have been trying to whitewash him for 2.5 years as their priority.

She doesn't mention the rice scheme and water management fiasco or the 2,2 trillion off budget loan. She doesn't mention vote buying and coercion or the illegal acts of the current government.

If you want pro Thaksin propaganda then The Guardian is a good place to look. They always support corrupt dictators providing the dictators pretend to be a peoples' party.

I don't support Suthep and his extreme ideas. But, the PTP regime lie, cheat, steal, ignore the law and parliamentary rules, and treat the Thai people with utter contempt. I know many Thais who protested not because they support Suthep but because they've seen through this scam of a government. They want them out .......... but the choice of replacement is somewhat limited too.

Edited December 11, 2013 by Baerboxer

[wilcopops]

Thaksin dragged Thai politics into the 21st Centrury - albeit at a cost - he totally outwitted his opposition - which lets face irt wasn't difficult. The opposition still can't get over that they aren't in charge any more and have failed to grasp the basics of democracy. If they had, they could quite possibly stand a good chance of getting elected....DEMOCRATICALLY....something as a party they have repeatedly failed to do.

To invoke Godwin's law - Hitler got voted in by default - and in Thailand so long as neither side of politics grasps the concept of being fairly ELECTED, democracy and a stable government will be a pipe-dream.

Edited December 11, 2013 by wilcopops

[wilcopops]

Maybe because the only "side" of the story that many falangs read come from the anti Taksin media...as always there is two sides. Here is an interesting view from the pro Taksin media. I have no idea if the numbers quoted are correct but if so it would seem that there is good reason for so many people to support some of the programs he put into place.

BANGKOK – It has gone quiet in Bangkok, as the people who have been trying to overthrow the government tidy up the debris that litters the city after the last two weeks of demonstrations.

Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra is taking an equally low-key approach. The Thai Army has removed the barbed wire that surrounded government offices, and protesters are wandering through the prime minister’s offices and picnicking on the lawns while she runs the affairs of state from some other location in the capital. But by next week the Civil Movement for Democracy will be back in action, and the final outcome is not clear.

The main thing that distinguishes the Civil Movement for Democracy is its profound dislike for democracy. In the mass demonstrations that have shaken Thailand since Nov. 24, its supporters have been trying to remove a prime minister who was elected only two years ago — and their goal is not another election.

“We don’t want new elections because we will lose anyway,” one protester told Reuters. “We want (the prime minister’s family) to leave the country.”

If they succeeded in driving Yingluck from power, they would skip the whole business of elections and hand the country over to an appointed “People’s Council” made up of “good men.”

These good men would naturally agree with protest leader Suthep Thaugsuban that the majority of the Thai people are too ignorant and flighty to be trusted with the vote. “From a Western point of view, “democracy” is an elected government serving as the people’s representative,” he told The Guardian. “Unfortunately, elections in Thailand do not represent people’s (real) choices because their votes are bought.”

They are “bought” not by bribes but by government spending on free health care and anti-poverty programs. In most democracies this is seen as part of the normal political process, but Suthep and his supporters, who include a high proportion of the country’s professional and middle classes, especially in the capital, regard it as illegitimate.

The current government has destroyed “the virtues and ethics of the people,” Suthep says, but with time and hard work the unelected People’s Council could make them moral again and “put the country on the path to perfect democracy.” We can even imagine that the poor might eventually become enlightened enough to be trusted with the vote again.

There is a conflict between the interests of the rich and the poor in most countries. In democracies it normally plays out in the electoral competition of right- and left-wing parties, and some compromise (always temporary and contentious) is arrived at via the ballot box. But in Thailand, the rich take to the streets.

They do so because they always lose the elections. In five elections since 2001, the winner every time has been Thaksin Shinawatra or somebody chosen by him. Thaksin is a man of humble origins who built the country’s largest mobile phone provider and then went into politics. He proved to be unbeatable.

His record in power has not been above reproach. He was careless of human rights, particularly in his war on drug dealers (he used death squads), and his family fortune benefited to some degree from his influence on government policy. But he wasn’t really in it for the money — he was already mega-rich before he went into politics — and he knew exactly what the poor needed. To the horror of relatively wealthy Bangkok and the south, he gave it to them.

He set up programs like village-managed micro-credit development funds and low-interest agricultural loans. He created a universal health care system and provided low-cost access to anti-HIV medications.

Yet between 2001 and the coup that overthrew him in 2006, GDP grew by 30 percent, public sector debt fell from 57 per cent of GDP to 41 per cent, and foreign exchange reserves doubled. He even managed to balance the budget.

Income in the northeast, the poorest part of the country, rose by 41 percent. Poverty nationwide dropped from 21 percent to 11 percent, and the prevalence of HIV/AIDS declined. Thaksin even allowed the 2.3 million migrant workers in the country to register and qualify for health coverage.

From the point of view of the opposition Democratic Party, all this was just “buying the people’s votes.” When Thaksin won the 2005 election with an increased majority, it conspired with the military to overthrow him. He was then tried on corruption charges, but fled the country before the inevitable verdict and has since lived in exile, mostly in Dubai. But his party, reformed and renamed, goes on winning every time there is an election.

That’s why his 46-year-old sister is now the prime minister. She probably does do what he says most of the time, but there’s no crime in that: The voters who put her there were really voting for Thaksin. And if the current insurrection in Bangkok overthrows her, they will vote for whoever else represents Thaksin next time there is an election. The right in Thailand should really grow up and get over it.

by Gwynne Dyer

All credibility diminishes when you see "the Guardian".

No mention of Thaksin's human rights issues, the war on drugs, Tai Bak. The last paragraph sums it up nicely. This writer, editor and newspaper see nothing wrong in a Prime Minister and her government doing what a convicted criminal fugitive tells them.

Of course, she implies the conviction was unjust, but offers no evidence to support that, or inquire why he didn't appeal and fight, or that his relation was PM at the time; fails to mention he has many more outstanding charges waiting or that the government have been trying to whitewash him for 2.5 years as their priority.

She doesn't mention the rice scheme and water management fiasco or the 2,2 trillion off budget loan. She doesn't mention vote buying and coercion or the illegal acts of the current government.

If you want pro Thaksin propaganda then The Guardian is a good place to look. They always support corrupt dictators providing the dictators pretend to be a peoples' party.

I don't support Suthep and his extreme ideas. But, the PTP regime lie, cheat, steal, ignore the law and parliamentary rules, and treat the Thai people with utter contempt. I know many Thais who protested not because they support Suthep but because they've seen through this scam of a government. They want them out .......... but the choice of replacement is somewhat limited too.

"But, the PTP regime lie, cheat, steal, ignore the law and parliamentary rules, and treat the Thai people with utter contempt." - and you think Suthep doesn't? Check out his behaviour in Phuket land sales in the 90s....

[thaiguzzi]

Once the Big Chair is gone, this country WILL be the next Yugoslavia. 3, possibly 4 separate states. Will be messy for a while. IMO not a bad thing; i'll have to use my passport to go on beach hols once a year, BUT, Suthep, the BKK elites and the rest will have no say on my beloved Isaan and cannot interfere anymore. Amen.

[kamahele]

I don't "support" either side as I see the worst in both, however I do support the idea of a government elected by the people. Rather than try mob rule, the opposition should try to win over the hearts and minds of the people by good deeds in government. Okay, stop laughing at me now.

[GreenSnapper]

Why is it that so many uneducated farangs use the word "fascist" for everybody they don't like?

[slk350]

I am not , he is a Coward.

Remember 2010 when he run away from the Reds, and hardly coulden't get over that little wall.He was scared to death.

Now he is only protecting himself, from justice ( what is not easy to find in this Country.

[mikebell]

And another thing; my wife has Blue Sky TV on all day. I sit at my computer in another room and can hear the ranting and roaring hour after hour. I am reminded of Hitler rallies.

I am not anti Sutthep; I dislike the Shinawatra exploitation of the general Thai ignorance.

Just saying.

[silent]

"I am glad he came into power because something started to change in Thai society"

​What exactly "started to change"?

The making of Ground Hog Days 2 and 3 and to some they all look same same? Final answer.

Edited December 11, 2013 by silent

[Spalpeen]

I agree entirely with the OP. It never ceases to amaze me how many foreigners get up on their hind legs on this forum to support a fascist leader and his mob, currently wanted on charges of murder and treason, and with a long record of corruption. Who in their right mind would want this clown and his "peoples council" to run Thailand?

I'm equally amazed that the Thai army sees itself as an "honest broker" between the democratically elected government of Thailand and a gang of street fascists. This is all part of a bigger sort-out that will be coming one of these days.

[Baerboxer]

kawaiimomo

Would you support this in your country. Yes actually it has happened only thing is that parties will disolve.

Then again I have a question for you.

Would you support having and escaped felon that robbed and defrauded the country for his own personal gain running your country and trying to come back to make it worse?

The arguments are not against a political party as much as they are against a family that is perceived to wants to run Thailand as their own entity.

These protests are a good thing for this country. Suthep has done something that needed to be done. He has woken up the young people and they are ow getting involved in the country instead of their smartphones.

This coutnry was about to waste billions of baht and if left alone ws going to absolve Thaksin and all his cronies on both sides of any legal responsibilities for life. that can not happen.

Courts have to be respected. Thaksin feels that he is above the law. No one is above it.

Missing the point. Completely. The point about this all is, is not whether Thaksin is good or bad. It is about whether he (or his sister) was democratically elected by the majority of Thai people.

To make it clear, there is only one person who should lead this country: it is the person/party that is elected by the majority of Thais - good or bad.

Understand yet?

Nonsense. A government that is elected by a majority, or in this case a large minority, still has to govern in accordance with the law and constitution of the country.

This government has tried to act above the law and change laws for its own benefit. It has been caught lying, which it admits, acting illegally, which it refuses to comment on, and cheating by ignoring correct parliamentary procedure. Not one single apology - simply: we're the government and we can do what we want. Well, no actually they can't as they are now finding out.

Democracies must have the power to remove corrupt regimes that are acting illegally and/or purely for self-benefit. In mature democracies, a government that has been caught out so many times as this lot would have been forced to resign.