Stay in Chiang Mai or return to your or another western country

[vagabond48]

I have posted this in the CM forum because I have lived in Chiang Mai for over 7 years and I hope there are a lot more like minded 60+ yo people like myself living here.
This thread is primarily for the down to earth people living in Chiang Mai for 5 or more years who are mainly here for a simpler lifestyle, the warm weather, lower cost of living and not because of easy inexpensive sex or cheap booze.
When I first came to CM, I thought this was the place I could spend the rest of my life. I have enjoyed my life here but CM have been changing too fast and too much to suit my needs. The air pollution, that now appears to be extending to a 1/3 of the year as well as the unsustainable growth in CM, are slowly turning me off. I don't think I would want to live in any other part Thailand or rest of South East Asia. I am also married to a non-Thai Asian, so my ties to Thailand are not as strong as some of you that have long term partnerships with Thai Nationals, that is why I thought I would pose this question.
If you could afford to live in a similar lifestyle (excluding sex and booze) within a part of your or another western country that speaks your tongue, has warm pleasant weather, good healthcare, easy and enjoyable lifestyle, less corruption, would you leave Thailand?

[2020]

Yep, probably Malaysia but its hypothetical for me at the moment.

If things aren't going the way you planned then you can either do something about it or do nothing. In my experience, doing nothing is worse than making a mistake if you choose to do something about it.

[eyecatcher]

The over riding concern in your thread is air quality so I assume a move would be due to health reasons.

Certainly the elders amongst us suffer more than others and we are here to enjoy our retirement.

Health becomes priority no 1 so the longer we can protect it the better.

We only get one life and have to make the best of it....and the only regrets in life are the things we didn't do....when we should have done.

[vagabond48]

Yep, probably Malaysia but its hypothetical for me at the moment.

If things aren't going the way you planned then you can either do something about it or do nothing. In my experience, doing nothing is worse than making a mistake if you choose to do something about it.

I wrote that if I left, it would not be to any country in SEA. The last time I looked Malaysia was in SEA.

[vagabond48]

The over riding concern in your thread is air quality so I assume a move would be due to health reasons.

Certainly the elders amongst us suffer more than others and we are here to enjoy our retirement.

Health becomes priority no 1 so the longer we can protect it the better.

We only get one life and have to make the best of it....and the only regrets in life are the things we didn't do....when we should have done.

That is only one of the factors and the move would not be due to health reasons although breathing in CM's air is not on my list of good health practices.

[searcher22]

Yes, but I can't think of another western country that has both a low cost of living and the benefits you describe (same language, warm pleasant weather, good healthcare, easy and enjoyable lifestyle). And then you'd have to meet the visa requirements (which would be more stringent than Thailand's).

Europe's too expensive. Canada's too cold (and Vancouver overpriced). England's too rainy. If you're American, an alternative might be to settle in a warm part of the United States and live frugally in a small university town, where you can get cheap eats, cheap rent and a good amount of cultural and recreational offerings. It might almost be as cheap as living in Thailand. Or you can choose to live in Thailand only six months per year as some do.

[vagabond48]

Again, I am trying to get opinions on, if money was not an issue, would you still want to live in CM or another city in Thailand, or would you choose a warm climate and friendly small city back home or another western country?

Once again, this assumes you are not addicted to cheap sex or booze.

[searcher22]

Again, I am trying to get opinions on, if money was not an issue, would you still want to live in CM or another city in Thailand, or would you choose a warm climate and friendly small city back home or another western country?

Once again, this assumes you are not addicted to cheap sex or booze.

Oh, now money is not an issue? Maybe you shouldn't have left out that "little detail" in your original post. You said earlier that "the lower cost of living" was one of the main reasons you were in Thailand.

If money is not an issue, then I recommend the Cayman Islands (the air is wonderful there!) and southern France (for the exquisite food!).

[CMKiwi]

I still like CM, although I came from the Philippines to be here. If I was tired of CM or in fact Thailand then thats a possible place Id recommend. Sure their food aint great but lifestyle can be. There are many islands and if getting into the marine scene is your thing then its great there. Corruption is pretty much the same so avoid Manila like you may avoid BKK. But as they say....each to their own.

Sent from my GT-I8552B using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[Lancelot]

Hey buddy, how you been?

I've always known that Thailand was temporary for me, despite that I've been here for 10 years The happiest expats that I know personally tend to split their time between their home country and Thailand (or another Asian Country)

Most likely I'll return to the US and set up a home base, maybe a duplex apartment, renting one side and storing my stuff in the other.

I was very impressed with western china, although I have no idea about long term visa requirements. One of the reasons that I've remained in Thailand so long is the relative ease of my annual Retirement extension.

As far as northern Thailand is concerned, check out Phayao; sitting by the lake and eating a nice meal is a fantastic way to spend an evening

Edited January 25, 2014 by Lancelot

[2020]

Yep, probably Malaysia but its hypothetical for me at the moment.

If things aren't going the way you planned then you can either do something about it or do nothing. In my experience, doing nothing is worse than making a mistake if you choose to do something about it.

I wrote that if I left, it would not be to any country in SEA. The last time I looked Malaysia was in SEA.

For me, Malaysia.

For you, New Zealand.

[zeichen]

You asked us a question where would we live and some have stated that and you object to them. I don't understand do you want us to tell you where to live or are you interested in our personal choices?

[MESmith]

I'd leave Thailand with the family tomorrow if I could get a UK settlement visa for my wife. Rather live on welfare (after buying a nice house for cash) than in this polluted dump. If it's not air pollution, it's noise. This valley is going to get far worse in the near future. Over populated, too many cars, everywhere concreted over. And prices are going to keep going up, up & away (not in a beautiful balloon, but a noisy freaking paramotor). Used to be a nice place.

[iainiain101]

I have lived in CM for over 6 years. Where do you find cheap booze here?

[chiang mai]

Spain might be an option, Malaysia also, as would a return to Blighty although the weather aspect suffers in the latter case.

The OP talks about noise, prices and pollution all being on the increase. My experience is those things are true but can be managed and often offset based on where and how you live in CM. In truth the burning season is only truly bad (potentially) between March and mid-April, not the extended period of time the OP described.

FWIW I've managed to reduce my living costs here year on year for the past five years to the point where I'm now very comfortable that I'm spending at the right level, it's a very satisfying process I can recommend.

[MESmith]

Spain might be an option, Malaysia also, as would a return to Blighty although the weather aspect suffers in the latter case.

The OP talks about noise, prices and pollution all being on the increase. My experience is those things are true but can be managed and often offset based on where and how you live in CM. In truth the burning season is only truly bad (potentially) between March and mid-April, not the extended period of time the OP described.

FWIW I've managed to reduce my living costs here year on year for the past five years to the point where I'm now very comfortable that I'm spending at the right level, it's a very satisfying process I can recommend.

The air has been cr@p since before New Year. Maybe you don't notice in the city. There is a brown haze hanging over the valley. If you go a little higher you will see it. Too many cars, many belching black smoke, temperature inversion with the cold weather. Loverly.

[jackr]

Probably Spain or New Zealand.

[chiang mai]

Spain might be an option, Malaysia also, as would a return to Blighty although the weather aspect suffers in the latter case.

The OP talks about noise, prices and pollution all being on the increase. My experience is those things are true but can be managed and often offset based on where and how you live in CM. In truth the burning season is only truly bad (potentially) between March and mid-April, not the extended period of time the OP described.

FWIW I've managed to reduce my living costs here year on year for the past five years to the point where I'm now very comfortable that I'm spending at the right level, it's a very satisfying process I can recommend.

The air has been cr@p since before New Year. Maybe you don't notice in the city. There is a brown haze hanging over the valley. If you go a little higher you will see it. Too many cars, many belching black smoke, temperature inversion with the cold weather. Loverly.

My primary gauge of the severity of burning season is how much I can see of Doi Suthep and the mountain range to the East, right now they're both in sight plus the smell of burning is very light, when the time comes to close the sliding glass doors and turn on the air con. to cleanse the room air, that's when things get bad, for me.

[MESmith]

Spain might be an option, Malaysia also, as would a return to Blighty although the weather aspect suffers in the latter case.

The OP talks about noise, prices and pollution all being on the increase. My experience is those things are true but can be managed and often offset based on where and how you live in CM. In truth the burning season is only truly bad (potentially) between March and mid-April, not the extended period of time the OP described.

FWIW I've managed to reduce my living costs here year on year for the past five years to the point where I'm now very comfortable that I'm spending at the right level, it's a very satisfying process I can recommend.

The air has been cr@p since before New Year. Maybe you don't notice in the city. There is a brown haze hanging over the valley. If you go a little higher you will see it. Too many cars, many belching black smoke, temperature inversion with the cold weather. Loverly.

My primary gauge of the severity of burning season is how much I can see of Doi Suthep and the mountain range to the East, right now they're both in sight plus the smell of burning is very light, when the time comes to close the sliding glass doors and turn on the air con. to cleanse the room air, that's when things get bad, for me.

Our windows are closed apart from midmorning. No point in opening them after lunch

I do a lot of hiking & cycling away from the valley floor. Returning home, getting out of the truck, I notice the smell of smoke after being a little higher up. It's like living in an ashtray.

Edited January 25, 2014 by MESmith

[sharktooth]

I'd move, but after years of being paid offshore tax free to suddenly have to give the government 40% of my hard earned is a difficult one to take.

[Sparkles]

I think there are many of us,that have been here 5 years plus, feel CM is heading in the wrong direction,fast becoming a mini Bangkok.

However you can only look at your own requirements and lifestyle ,everyone has different values and expectations. In our latter part of life you need to be in reasonable proximity to quality health care ie major hospitals and relevant specialists.That factor can cut down your choices considerably unless you are willing to gamble.

We like the area south of Hua Hin around Bangsaphan and further south on the coast ,that to will be over run in the future but you probably have a 10-15 years window before it happens.

I've lived in the Philiipinnes and Vietnam and they have similar problems to Thailand so it could well be out of the frying pan into the fire.

Australia and NZ ,the cost of living is rocketing up but great places to live if you have the financial capacity to cope with the increased costs which are unavoidable.

Good luck but no where is perfect

[true blue]

I have lived in CM for over 6 years. Where do you find cheap booze here?

drink in the thai bars,far cheaper than the rip of prices you pay in tourists places,average price 65 baht large bootle of chang,leo or tiger,lot on draught too.

[DogNo1]

Well, if you're American, you have never been living here tax-free. Americans must pay the USA income tax no matter where

they live. I'm presently splitting my retirement years between living here in Bangkok during the winter months and living in Tokyo during the rest of the year except for August, which I spend in Southern California. I plan to move back to Southern

California in a couple of years. Whether or not I continue to spend part of the year in Thailand will depend on my health

and energy level. I will have to pay state tax in California but I prefer living there to other warm parts of America. I

don't care much for Florida because of its high humidity. So I would recommend Southern California. You won't miss Asian people if you live there!

[beau thai]

I would not suggest Spain. Had a nice place on the beach overlooking North Africa but way too cold, wet and windy for 3-4 months of the year.

I cant think of anywhere in the west with tolerable winters where I would be as happy as in Chiang mai..

[FiftyTwo]

Again, I am trying to get opinions on, if money was not an issue, would you still want to live in CM or another city in Thailand, or would you choose a warm climate and friendly small city back home or another western country?

Once again, this assumes you are not addicted to cheap sex or booze.

If money (and a VISA for me and the family) was not an issue, I would be living in San Francisco.

My primary gauge of the severity of burning season is how much I can see of Doi Suthep and the mountain range to the East, right now they're both in sight plus the smell of burning is very light, when the time comes to close the sliding glass doors and turn on the air con. to cleanse the room air, that's when things get bad, for me.

For the past 5 years I have been walking to Wat Doi Suthep every week.

Most days you got a really good view across the city to the mountains at Doi Saket until last year.

I've only seen that view once in the last six months, despite doing the trip 3x a week in the last year.

Something is going seriously wrong with the air in Chiang mai this past year.

Edited January 25, 2014 by FiftyTwo

[FiftyTwo]

I have lived in CM for over 6 years. Where do you find cheap booze here?

drink in the thai bars,far cheaper than the rip of prices you pay in tourists places,average price 65 baht large bootle of chang,leo or tiger,lot on draught too.

The rather posh Thai restaurant "Huan Huay Keow" near the Buddha, top of Huay Keow road only charges 65bht for a large Chang Classic. Tourist bars in the center are charging scary prices these days. Many Thai bars are still selling 3 large bottles for 140bht.

Edited January 25, 2014 by FiftyTwo

[Microwave]

New Zealand, Ecuador & Mexico are my suggestions.

[skills32]

I have been looking for my next home for the last 6 months after 13 years in CM.

Cm is no longer the idyllic little back water that I used to know.

Traffic and air pollution which is getting worse each year, and now starting earlier, have persuaded me to call it quits.

But to where? That is the question. Because money is a consideration, well for me it is, and I can't see myself dreaming about Utopia because there are places I can afford and places I can't.

If money was not a problem than I would to back to OZ.

[northernjohn]

Again, I am trying to get opinions on, if money was not an issue, would you still want to live in CM or another city in Thailand, or would you choose a warm climate and friendly small city back home or another western country?

Once again, this assumes you are not addicted to cheap sex or booze.

That is not what your original post asked.

If you could afford to live in a similar lifestyle (excluding sex and booze) within a part of your or another western country that speaks your tongue, has warm pleasant weather, good healthcare, easy and enjoyable lifestyle, less corruption, would you leave Thailand?

Name us the country that has the lack of corruption and weather you describe. Remember you are posting on an English speaking forum. That really limits the number of countries. Then the health care well you have really narrowed it down now. The life style. I walk a lot as I have no vehicle. How ever I just stick out my hand and even if I do get over charged it is still cheaper than what I would have to pay in this fictional country of yours.

Your whole question is hypothetical. So my answer is a hypothetical yes. Provided I could take my Thai wife which should be no problem as it is the perfect country to live in. If I couldn't that would take away my life style.

You are over looking the fact that the weather is changing all over the world. Your hypothetical city might have snow next year. We might have a rainy season wiping out the smog season here as we did two years ago.

[northernjohn]

Again, I am trying to get opinions on, if money was not an issue, would you still want to live in CM or another city in Thailand, or would you choose a warm climate and friendly small city back home or another western country?

Once again, this assumes you are not addicted to cheap sex or booze.

If money (and a VISA for me and the family) was not an issue, I would be living in San Francisco.

I don't think you would find the life style or the weather there. Being as you would have to be very well off financially the health care and tax's would not bother you.

How ever it is a good choice for a completely different life style. Not sure if I could handle the cold. By the way I am partial to the city as I was born there. Raised in Seattle so you can see the choice for me was hard on the 49er Seahawk game. I was neutral.

New Zealand, Ecuador & Mexico are my suggestions.

New Zealand speaks English the other two Spanish.

Never been to New Zealand on my to do list. How is the weather compared to Chiang Mai and what is the medical like.

Edited January 25, 2014 by northernjohn