Visa4UK New Site Questionable

[UbonOz]

I have just spent the past couple of hours attempting to complete a new visa application for my wife.

A banner across the top of the page says:

"BETA: This is the new UK visa application website. We are testing it. It is designed to make the application process simpler and clearer."

Why is this site being "tested"? Surely, I am attempting to make a genuine application, not be a guinea pig for their site tests.

Being simpler and clearer is a matter of opinion.

My wife has made many visits to the UK, and it now appears it is becoming more difficult to apply. Her two year visa expires this month and needs to be renewed for our next visit in April.

The problems I encountered were:

1. Her father has been dead for more than thirty years, nobody knows his date of birth, you have to complete the section. There is nowhere to comment that he is deceased.

2. It appears that you have to collect the passport from the VFS office when it is returned. Previously you could pay a fee and have it mailed to our home address. Living in Ubon makes an additional expense you don't need to return to Bangkok just to pick up a passport.

3. It appears you are allocated an appointment time. Rather difficult when you do not live near Bangkok and have to plan flights, hotel etc to make the visit. Previously you could select an appointment time. I have already booked flight for 18 March, not knowing the application process has changed.

4. There was nowhere to print the application form.

5. Payment by credit card was rejected. No reason to be rejected, tried it twice.

6. Cost for two year visa US$473.00. Why US dollar and not GBP?

7. Note saying if you cannot pay by credit you have to select another location to apply. Guess what, the only location to select in the drop down box is Bangkok.

I assume if the payment had been successful there would have been more information, maybe.

Will telephone them tomorrow and see if we can get further clarification.

All rather frustrating.

[bobrussell]

You can enter 01/01/1900 for the date of birth (or could!) then add in the notes somewhere that his date of birth is unknown. This is not unusual for Thailand. Other information can be entered as unknown where applicable. This will not impact on the application.

Beyond that I would be heading into the unknown!

[Boycie]

Have to agree with you UbonOz, i didnt find the new website simpler and clearer at all when we used it last month. Prefered their old website from 2 years ago when we last applied.

1. I read 2 years ago, some very helpful Q and A notes to each question on the application form that you could put 1/1/1990 as date of birth of parents if unknown. Been looking for the link but cant find it at the moment.

2. You can still pay the 200 baht fee to have it posted EMS to your door. Someone has to sign for it.

3. You can still book a day and appointment time to your liking, but you have to choose what days/times are highlighted as available.

4. I saved the application form and then printed it out at a later date. Think the format was PDF and you need a program like Adobe Reader, as well as a printer

5. Didn't have any problems with my credit card.

6. Why US$, thread running here

7. I'd keep on trying your credit card

Believe they have been having problems with the new website, report here

Frustrating is an understatement

They must also be having problems with their SMS service too, 75 baht (yes seventy five) was paid along with the courier fee at Regents House, but no SMS was received!

Would of complained, but felt so relieved to see the UK visa attached in the passport

Best of luck wishes

[UbonOz]

Have to agree with you UbonOz, i didnt find the new website simpler and clearer at all when we used it last month. Prefered their old website from 2 years ago when we last applied.

1. I read 2 years ago, some very helpful Q and A notes to each question on the application form that you could put 1/1/1990 as date of birth of parents if unknown. Been looking for the link but cant find it at the moment.

2. You can still pay the 200 baht fee to have it posted EMS to your door. Someone has to sign for it.

3. You can still book a day and appointment time to your liking, but you have to choose what days/times are highlighted as available.

4. I saved the application form and then printed it out at a later date. Think the format was PDF and you need a program like Adobe Reader, as well as a printer

5. Didn't have any problems with my credit card.

6. Why US$, thread running here

7. I'd keep on trying your credit card

Believe they have been having problems with the new website, report here

Frustrating is an understatement

They must also be having problems with their SMS service too, 75 baht (yes seventy five) was paid along with the courier fee at Regents House, but no SMS was received!

Would of complained, but felt so relieved to see the UK visa attached in the passport

Best of luck wishes

Unfortunately, you are paying first class prices for a second class service.

[Jip99]

I had no problem submitting one a few days ago.

The question about the applicant's father was on the previous application form -a clear instruction exists to insert 01/01/1900 if not known.

My credit card payment sailed through - ask yourself why yours didn't.

I had no trouble making an appointment. I could not make it for the date I wanted so I will log in again later and reschedule.

A print option appears at the end of the application.

Like it or not the fee is payable in Dollars and ONLY online in Thailand.

I don't believe that you have read/understood the instructions - they really are straight forward. My only gripe is the amount of re-keying of data that could be captured after the first time it input. Thailand and UK should feature at the top of drop down boxes as they are the most likely options for UK visa applications out of Thailand.

I also don't believe that the passport/visa and original documents have to be collected from Bangkok. They never were and this is simply a change in application format not an operational change regarding how visas are issued.

[Bredbury Blue]

I’ve recently been through the completing the application form process and I also had problems.

First problem was that all ‘drop-down’ boxes would only show the first letter…I saved my work and emailed their contact email address for help – 3 times, no answer. I checked their website and it said Windows Internet Explorer 8 was ok for use – I was using Windows Internet Explorer 8.

I then tried using an old version of Firefox which worked.

I also had the problem that we don’t know my father-in-laws date of birth as he died 35 years ago. Unlike earlier online forms there is no where to put a note. I therefore put in the same date as my mother-in-laws date of birth.

The last section allows you in theory to add more information. It wouldn’t input/save so I had to proceed without that very important section.

I also had a few problems with the payment section but I think that was more to do with SCB that UK4visa but I got through it.

I was able to select an appointment time of our choice.

Then the application form wouldn’t print out…it came up with a note stating the system was busy…I persevered and 30 minutes later it printed.

My wife was given an option to collect or have it posted.

The new form in my opinion was much harder to fill in than the one I completed for my wife in 2013 and 2012. I’m reasonably intelligent and computer savvy but I struggled and I got very frustrated, so how does Joe Public cope!

I was so happy when I got through the process – definitely the hardest task I did last week – crap application form!

3/10 could do better!

[7by7]

I haven't used the new form, but would like to add some comments.

Testing the form on real applicants is ridiculous; they should make sure the damn thing works properly before making the public use it. But that is typical of all UK government websites and online forms.

The same online form is used worldwide; no matter where one is applying. So having country specific, e.g. Thailand, aspects would not be possible.

If you do not know someone's date of birth put, as already suggested, 1/1/1900 and explain later, either on the form or in your covering letter.

It is still possible to have passport etc. returned by courier. But this is a VFS service, not a UKVI one. I've never used it myself as my wife's family all live in Bangkok and have collected their passports personally, but I understand applicants arrange, and pay for, it when they attend their appointment at the VAC.

[Stocky]

It's Bht250 for them to mail back to you, you pay on the day. The appointments offer a weeks window, you can't book any further ahead, living in Hat Yai this is a serious pain. As for charging in USD god knows, we got hit USD950 for a five year visa application.

[Bredbury Blue]

Useful topic for others going down this route

[brewsterbudgen]

How much leeway is there to choose your visa application submission date. My GF will only be able to be in Bangkok to submit the form on 11 or 12 September. To secure these dates, when will I need to submit form electronically?

[theoldgit]

I believe that appointments are loaded onto the appointment system a week in advance.

Those with more recent experience will no doubt advise if things have changed.

[sandyf]

I’ve recently been through the completing the application form process and I also had problems.

First problem was that all ‘drop-down’ boxes would only show the first letter…I saved my work and emailed their contact email address for help – 3 times, no answer. I checked their website and it said Windows Internet Explorer 8 was ok for use – I was using Windows Internet Explorer 8.

I then tried using an old version of Firefox which worked.

I also had the problem that we don’t know my father-in-laws date of birth as he died 35 years ago. Unlike earlier online forms there is no where to put a note. I therefore put in the same date as my mother-in-laws date of birth.

The last section allows you in theory to add more information. It wouldn’t input/save so I had to proceed without that very important section.

I also had a few problems with the payment section but I think that was more to do with SCB that UK4visa but I got through it.

I was able to select an appointment time of our choice.

Then the application form wouldn’t print out…it came up with a note stating the system was busy…I persevered and 30 minutes later it printed.

My wife was given an option to collect or have it posted.

The new form in my opinion was much harder to fill in than the one I completed for my wife in 2013 and 2012. I’m reasonably intelligent and computer savvy but I struggled and I got very frustrated, so how does Joe Public cope!

I was so happy when I got through the process – definitely the hardest task I did last week – crap application form!

3/10 could do better!

What a relief, thought old age had taken its toll.

I have done the application 3 times using the previous version without a problem. Have just started a new application and had to take a break after a couple of sections, very tedious.

With the old form you could just cut and paste from a previous application, not so easy with all these drop down 'Add' screens.

Far from being 'simpler and clearer'.

[Tony M]

The current "Beta" application form is pretty poor, especially for a government agency. But, with the changes to the visitor visa requirements from next month, this is the ideal opportunity for UKVI to change from this poor Beta form to a new and improved Beta form. One can but hope........................, but a new form is required for the amended categories of the visitor rules. I'm sure someone in UKVI has thought ahead about this.................... ?

[sandyf]

I believe that appointments are loaded onto the appointment system a week in advance.

Those with more recent experience will no doubt advise if things have changed.

You can go some time in advance. A week ago we could see all of April, opted for April 2nd as we are waiting on a letter from UK.

[sandyf]

Completed my wife's application last week. Happened to be on internet banking this morning and saw the charges, £88.16 + £2.64 Non-sterling transaction fee. Total £90.80.

At 49 to the pound that would be equivalent to 4450 Baht, 15 months ago we paid 3400 Baht at VFS, an increase of 1050 Baht or 30.85 percent.

[Mad Dog]

Just did the wife's online application and it was the first time as we haven't been to the U.K for 5 years now so I can't comment on the old system v the new system.

It was a wee bit frustrating at times, got timed out a couple of times as I didn't know the post code or phone number of the place that we will be renting when we arrive in the U.K. but the vast majority of data entered is automatically saved which was good. The sponsor section confused me rather as I don't think that I sponsor my wife as we live here together and have a jointly-owned business here but I filled it in anyway. Then at the bottom where it asks for the applicant's relationship with the sponsor there is no 'spouse' option so I went for 'other' instead.

Paying in USD was weird but we'll see how that works out when the next statement comes. We paid with K-bank Credit Card, no problems.

We filled in the form yesterday (24/3) and we were give appointment options of (26-27/3) and (30-31/3) so we went for 31/3 to give us time to prepare and get us up to Bkk in good time.

Printing out the form is easy, just click the black button once all other black buttons have turned green.

All in all, pretty straightforward, although repetitious.

[durhamboy]

Regarding payment only being accepted in US Dollars I wonder about the legality of this.

Legal tender in the UK is obviously sterling. British embassies (where the visas are issued) are sovereign British territory. Therefore in effect the product/service (the visa) is being sold in the UK.

Given those facts is it legal for an organisation not to accept sterling? Can anyone think of any examples where companies trading in the UK do not accept sterling? I can't think of any. Some may accept other currencies as well as sterling but none that I know of refuse to accept sterling.

[sandyf]

Just did the wife's online application and it was the first time as we haven't been to the U.K for 5 years now so I can't comment on the old system v the new system.

It was a wee bit frustrating at times, got timed out a couple of times as I didn't know the post code or phone number of the place that we will be renting when we arrive in the U.K. but the vast majority of data entered is automatically saved which was good. The sponsor section confused me rather as I don't think that I sponsor my wife as we live here together and have a jointly-owned business here but I filled it in anyway. Then at the bottom where it asks for the applicant's relationship with the sponsor there is no 'spouse' option so I went for 'other' instead.

Paying in USD was weird but we'll see how that works out when the next statement comes. We paid with K-bank Credit Card, no problems.

We filled in the form yesterday (24/3) and we were give appointment options of (26-27/3) and (30-31/3) so we went for 31/3 to give us time to prepare and get us up to Bkk in good time.

Printing out the form is easy, just click the black button once all other black buttons have turned green.

All in all, pretty straightforward, although repetitious.

Did you do the application as a general visit or family visit. I did it as a family visit and cannot remember that question regarding the sponsor. I also live here and always put myself down as sponsor and responsible for all travel expenses.

I did it on the 18th and went into April for an appointment as we are waiting on a letter from my son.

You are right about it being repetitive, when it came to travel history I had to make about 20 entries, that is where the cut and paste was a real bonus.

I think you will save a couple of hundred baht by using a Thai card as opposed to my UK card.

[sandyf]

Regarding payment only being accepted in US Dollars I wonder about the legality of this.

Legal tender in the UK is obviously sterling. British embassies (where the visas are issued) are sovereign British territory. Therefore in effect the product/service (the visa) is being sold in the UK.

Given those facts is it legal for an organisation not to accept sterling? Can anyone think of any examples where companies trading in the UK do not accept sterling? I can't think of any. Some may accept other currencies as well as sterling but none that I know of refuse to accept sterling.

It is more morality than legality. They have sub contracted the payment processing to Worldpay which I believe is a US organisation and not obliged to accept sterling.

Morally the UK government should have used a UK based payment system.

[7by7]

The sponsor section confused me rather as I don't think that I sponsor my wife as we live here together and have a jointly-owned business here but I filled it in anyway. Then at the bottom where it asks for the applicant's relationship with the sponsor there is no 'spouse' option so I went for 'other' instead.

In a UK visa application the sponsor is the person supporting the application; the reason for the applicant's visit if you will. So yes, you are her sponsor.

Agreed, it is ludicrous that spouse is not on the list of sponsors!

Of course, not all visitors will have a sponsor.

As for payment having to be made in USD; this was a Home office decision and has been discussed at length in this topic; which includes the Home Office's feeble, waffling excuse for so doing.

7th March 2014

Thank you for your email correspondence of 244 January to the Immigration Minister, about our online visa fees. Your enquiry has been forwarded to Midlands, East of England and International responder hub, as we have responsibility for entry clearance matters. I am sorry for the delay in replying to your enquiry.

UK Visas and Immigration (UKVI) is embarking on a programme of modernisation, which includes moving to an online application process where almost all customers around the world will apply and pay for their visas online. UKVI has already successfully launched online payment for visas in over 90 countries.

Customers in Thailand already apply for their visa online, and as from 16 December 2013, all applicants applying in Thailand have also been required to pay for their visa application online, using a MasterCard, Visa, Debit or pre-payment card. Additional online methods of payment are expected to become available in due course, such as other payment cards and e-wallets.

Online payment is mandatory for all customers and other methods of payment, including payment at the visa application centre, are no longer accepted. Online payment allows a more streamlined application process and is consistent with a wider global trend to online transactions and payments; it helps to cut costs in the management of the visas operation which in turn helps to keep visa fees down, and it is also a safer system for both customers and staff as it reduces the risk associated with handling large amounts of cash during the visa application process.

Currently in Thailand it is only possible for customers to pay for their visa in US dollars although we expect further currency options to be made available as we progress.

We have considered all options carefully and chosen the most beneficial for all concerned. The currency options are not driven by the UK Government but by global financial services markets, banking regulations and operational requirements within our global visa services network and our online payment service providers. Alternative currency measures may involve high-cost local arrangements with the banks and online payment providers in each country, which when added to the visa application fee would make the process substantially more expensive for all applicants. This would far outweigh the currency conversion fees suffered by applicants who do not own a payment card intended primarily for use in the required currency.

UKVI will not refund currency conversion fees or processing charges levied by card issuers.

Yours sincerely

Cliff Brown

MPs Account Managers Team | Midlands, East of England & International Responder Hub

Whilst I can see that using just one currency worldwide makes sense, there is absolutely no reason why that currency cannot be Sterling. UKVI use WorldPay to process payments, and WorldPay will do so in whatever currency the customer, UKVI, desires.

Indeed, in some countries payments are made via WorldPay, not in USD but in the local currency; China, for example.

Furthermore, passport fee payment in Thailand and elsewhere are also, I believe, processed by WorldPay and paid in Sterling!

[Jip99]

Regarding payment only being accepted in US Dollars I wonder about the legality of this.

Legal tender in the UK is obviously sterling. British embassies (where the visas are issued) are sovereign British territory. Therefore in effect the product/service (the visa) is being sold in the UK.

Given those facts is it legal for an organisation not to accept sterling? Can anyone think of any examples where companies trading in the UK do not accept sterling? I can't think of any. Some may accept other currencies as well as sterling but none that I know of refuse to accept sterling.

They can set whatever terms they like for payment.

One think to consider is that the majority of applicants are likely to be Thais who are NOT married/connected to Farangs - payment in Baht as you are applying in Thailand therefore seems sensible.

Being restricted to ONLY paying in Dollars is inappropriate in my opinion.

[MaprangHolmes]

The payment system is wrong but as that is the way it is as for the form it is easy to complete any information about parents DOB can be added in a letter or left in the notes in the end of the form I can not really see anyone having problems with completing this application form but it is a beta and it is subject to change, but this is what we have now so just get on with it

[bobrussell]

Hopefully a lot will change. I have been starting the paperwork for my wife's best friend to visit. She has Swiss residence and will be travelling with her husband so officially does not really need a visa (as long as they carry the marriage certificate etc) but I have had the devil's own job getting to the right place to do the application on-line.

The paper version which I have downloaded to help put together the right information asks questions that I am not sure are legally required under Eu law. It may be that when I get on the actual site these details are not required. The paper version asks about the EEA spouse's job and income details!

Using the 'check if you need a visa' on the .gov websites does not give information about a non EEA citizen resident in the EU. It just states a visa is required, it needs to be paid for and can take up to 3 months! A visa is not required but a permit will help get her on the plane, it should be free and must be processed without undue delay.

The site is not fit for purpose, gives lousy guidance for those new to the system. At the moment I cannot register for an account, let alone get on with the application!

If I am getting this so wrong then I would appreciate a nudge in the right direction!

[Jip99]

The payment system is wrong but as that is the way it is as for the form it is easy to complete any information about parents DOB can be added in a letter or left in the notes in the end of the form I can not really see anyone having problems with completing this application form but it is a beta and it is subject to change, but this is what we have now so just get on with it

I agree but in feedback on a recent application I complained about the amount of 're-keying' of information, where 'smarter' systems ill give default values from initial data submitted.

[sandyf]

The payment system is wrong but as that is the way it is as for the form it is easy to complete any information about parents DOB can be added in a letter or left in the notes in the end of the form I can not really see anyone having problems with completing this application form but it is a beta and it is subject to change, but this is what we have now so just get on with it

Obviously we have little choice, but looking at the objective, looks like they have failed.

It is designed to make the application process simpler and clearer."

It would also appear that they are not interested in feedback. In the travel history section, Korea is missing from the dropdown list of countries but I couldn't find any way of reporting the fact.

Change for the worse is not really the best way forward, but each to his own.

[fbf]

It is more morality than legality. They have sub contracted the payment processing to Worldpay which I believe is a US organisation and not obliged to accept sterling.

Morally the UK government should have used a UK based payment system.

Worldpay (formerly RBS Worldpay) is a British company. They can accept payments in almost any currency. Regardless of where they are based, the company is only acting as a payment gateway on behalf of their client (UKVI) and accepting the currency that they are instructed to accept.

I hope that makes sense, and not meaning to detract from your point at all.

[fbf]

Whilst I can see that using just one currency worldwide makes sense, there is absolutely no reason why that currency cannot be Sterling. UKVI use WorldPay to process payments, and WorldPay will do so in whatever currency the customer, UKVI, desires.

Indeed, in some countries payments are made via WorldPay, not in USD but in the local currency; China, for example.

Furthermore, passport fee payment in Thailand and elsewhere are also, I believe, processed by WorldPay and paid in Sterling!

Ah sorry, should have read this before making my reply above.

I can see a reason to use USD (not saying I'd agree with it): they probably process many visa applications from that country. I imagine US visitors would be surprised and confused if they had to pay in GBP, but maybe that's being a bit unfair. Still, there could be a regulatory obstacle.

Using one currency might make sense as the currency fluctuations can be a nightmare... however, where does all that money go? If a significant amount goes back into the UK, then taking money in USD makes no sense, as the money will suffer those fluctuations when being repatriated. If most of the visa fee goes to local processing costs, they'd be justified in only accepting THB.

So, as many others seem to suggest, all their reasons seem to make no sense!

When looking for an explanation though, I'd favour incompetence over malice. They probably just haven't got around to sorting it out.

[sandyf]

It is more morality than legality. They have sub contracted the payment processing to Worldpay which I believe is a US organisation and not obliged to accept sterling.

Morally the UK government should have used a UK based payment system.

Worldpay (formerly RBS Worldpay) is a British company. They can accept payments in almost any currency. Regardless of where they are based, the company is only acting as a payment gateway on behalf of their client (UKVI) and accepting the currency that they are instructed to accept.

I hope that makes sense, and not meaning to detract from your point at all.

You are quite right. I got them mixed up with WorldLink Payment Services which is run by Citibank. Was going to post a correction but you beat me to it.

Worldpay being British is even less of an excuse for payment in USD.

[7by7]

fbf, the money from visa fees goes directly to UKVI.

The actual fees are set, in Sterling, by Parliament and UKVI already make a large profit on most visa and LTR fees; though, to be fair, not on 6 month visit applications.

After deducting the costs of running UKVI, which includes not just ECOs in post but immigration officers at UK ports of entry, in UK enforcement teams etc., any surplus goes to the exchequer

As the government have chosen USD as the currency in which fees must, in most countries, be paid and use an exchange rate very advantageous to themselves, applicants are actually paying a fee of around 8% above the amount set by Parliament in Sterling; even more profit for the exchequer.

Personally I see this as a cynical ploy by the government to secretly tax UK visa applications.

[sandyf]

Whilst I can see that using just one currency worldwide makes sense, there is absolutely no reason why that currency cannot be Sterling. UKVI use WorldPay to process payments, and WorldPay will do so in whatever currency the customer, UKVI, desires.

Indeed, in some countries payments are made via WorldPay, not in USD but in the local currency; China, for example.

Furthermore, passport fee payment in Thailand and elsewhere are also, I believe, processed by WorldPay and paid in Sterling!

I have just submitted an application for my wife for a visitors visa to Canada, the fee for that was 100 CAD also had to be paid online.

That is a full online application, rather than just an online application form. The application form and all supporting documents are uploaded to the Canadian Immigration.