American-No Bank Account, No Visa Catch 22. Help please.

[payanak]

NancyL

"I doubt they'd turn away $10,000 US cash for an opening deposit"

Oh that's brilliant, just walk into any bank with a wad of cash. Just for fun, try that stunt at ANY bank in the US now. Just what do you think a key purpose of the FATCA law is?

[bobroper]

Bangkok bank stipulates that in order to open an account with them, you will either need to produce work permit or ED visa with confirmation from the school.

You don't necessarily have to open a Thai bank within a tourist area. I reside in Greater Bangkok and hold a Kasikorn account together with a Krungsri account which I opened some years ago when I resided in Pathumthani at Future Rangsit.

Certainly I would be very surprised if you have problem opening a savings account with Bank of Audhya (Krungsri), anywhere in Thailand.

โชคดี

[overherebc]

I can appreciate that banks are concerned about the costs of compliance but it makes no sense to be forgoing good clients prepared to deposit the equivalent of 30,000USD on a semi-permanent basis. Surely one of the more international K Bank branches would accommodate?

I have an account with K bank and wanted to open a second to hold a small amount of money for ATM use, to minimise problems with skimming etc.

I was refused a second account as I don't have a work permit. Strange reason given was something about scamming !

[Jeffrey346]

Supposely banks in Thailand and in other countries,are turning down Americans ,and also Supposely going to close U.S. citizen bank accounts.Because of that new U.S. Law taking effect.I'm not sure how it's going to play out.

As far as opening an account,just keep on trying.I had A thai go with me.You might want to do the same.

Not supposedly...

Last year I opened an account with Citibank Singapore.

The VERY first question on the application asked if I was an American. If I ticked the yes box the form then led me to a paragraph that read along the lines of "Sorry no accounts for Americans because your government is trying to tell us how to run OUR banking system".

Now that sounds like BS as Citibank is a US Corporation

[NancyL]

NancyL

"I doubt they'd turn away $10,000 US cash for an opening deposit"

Oh that's brilliant, just walk into any bank with a wad of cash. Just for fun, try that stunt at ANY bank in the US now. Just what do you think a key purpose of the FATCA law is?

This is exactly what I did in opening my Bangkok Bank account in Chiang Mai. Got the royal treatment from the staff and manager. Still do. And yes, I do comply with FBAR and the other reporting requirements. It takes longer to do that reporting than to file that actual tax returns these days.

Oh, and as for doing this in the U.S., yes they find it really annoying at the bank. Toward the end of our time in the U.S., I was getting so hacked off with our bank that I would deliberately hold cash receipts from our businesses in our safe until I had more than $10,000 to deposit just to annoy them. What had been a local, small town bank had been bought-sold-merged so many times in seven years that I no longer recognized anyone who worked there and vice versa. It had turned into a branch office of a mean, big business, so I engaged in the passive-aggressive act of deliberately depositing more than $10,000 in cash when possible just to create more paperwork for them. Often the tellers would try to suggest that I should come more frequently to make deposits and I'd loudly raise a fuss about what they were suggesting (making several cash deposits to keep the amount under $10,000) was illegal and where do I report what they were suggesting. It was really great if I could pull this stunt 5 minutes before closing time. Sorry, it was my way of getting back for all the nickle-and-dime (actually $5 and $10) fees they imposed once they'd become big corporate bank.

Edited April 7, 2014 by NancyL

[stuurman]

Bangkok bank stipulates that in order to open an account with them, you will either need to produce work permit or ED visa with confirmation from the school.

โชคดี

On their website they say you can open a savings account and get a debit card to use for shopping and ATM withdrawals without work permit or ED visa.

http://www.bangkokbank.com/BANGKOKBANK/PERSONALBANKING/SPECIALSERVICES/FOREIGNCUSTOMERS/Pages/Openinganaccountnew.aspx

[KayCee]

I agree you should try different branches and also would note different banks are different in their willingness depending on where you are. When we lived in Chiang Mai, Bangkok Bank was unwilling to open an account for us, which we needed in order to apply for the non-immigrant O visa, because we didn't have the visa yet - which we couldn't get until we had the cash deposited - Catch 22. But Siam Commercial Bank was quite helpful and did it with no problem. After a year we moved to Bangkok, and when we tried to have our funds transferred to a local branch of SCB here (across provinces they were charging us fees for every ATM withdrawal or electronic transfer to pay bills, very annoying), but the local SCB refused to open an account for us because we didn't have a work permit - which we couldn't have on retirement visa. But here, Bangkok Bank was completely fine with opening it for us and transferring the funds from SCB in Chiang Mai.

I'm an American, husband is not, we have individual and joint accounts, and made this switch in December, so at least as of then, this particular branch of Bangkok Bank had no problem with a new American accountholder.

[moe666]

Last I knew, Thai immigration only required a certification from the US Embassy that your income is about a certain amount. Mine, fortunately is, and I was not required to have a Thai bank account. During the last week of April, I will be able to post the latest info, as I will be asking for that document again from American Services, and reapplying. I see no benefit in locking up 800,00 baht in a bank here. You never will know the future, especially with the political situation and money owed to rice farmers. Best to be flexible. Thailand, although fine for me at present, The only problem with not having a bank account here is trying to buy a car with a low down payment.. There appears to be some flexibility on that if you make some arrangements with the dealer. I am working on something of that sort...leasing it from somebody who will be guaranteeing the loan. I am not married, so no sense in putting money in the bank here and using a wife to purchase.

If you had read the OPs post he isn't old enough for a pension so doesn't qualify for the monthly income option but has to have the money in the bank option.

[55Jay]

OP,

I presume you are here on a tourist visa, so banks may refuse you (or anyone) based on that alone. But, you knew enough to come on here, say the right buzz words and get the cast and crew of the S.S. Paranoia all riled up. Well done.

As you are old enough and have the money, go home as you've already planned, get an OA, then you can come back and open up all the bank accounts you want at your leisure.

[JSixpack]

OP could be a troll. Suggest we see if other 'Mercuns report the same experience.

[davidst01]

OP, this is first report here of Thai banks refusing to open accounts based on American nationality. Very troubling! Not only to people like the OP but Americans here with existing accounts. Yes, this is the year 2014 where this starts to really hit the fan. I still don't know where it is going and how many Americans are going to be shaken out of Thailand because of it (and many other countries as well). To the OP, I hope you got bad info from these banks and it is still possible for you to get an account here somewhere. Please keep trying.

To the people who have said there isn't going to be any impact from these weird new American laws, I guess it would be crass to say I told you so. Wish this is going to be nothing, but trust me, this isn't nothing. It's starting.

''Yes, this is the year 2014 where this starts to really hit the fan. I still don't know where it is going and how many Americans are going to be shaken out of Thailand because of it ''

of what. What exactly are you talking about?

[davidst01]

i just opened up one at bkk bank and im on a tourist visa. Just pull out 10k or 20k as an initial deposit. Go to the khao san road area and look respectable ie with your clothes. Im surprised if you cant open a bank account here. Its all about money in thailand. UOB bank told me that they can open up one for me if I deposit 50k cash.

[Moo2cm]

I wish you luck, but you might be running into a new country wide policy. I live in another asian country and some Americans are now being asked

to sign some sort of paperwork or their existing accounts can be closed. It has to do with the foriegn bank account notification now required of

all Americans.

It's a lot easier to just tell Americans no I suppose.

[Frank James]

OP, this is first report here of Thai banks refusing to open accounts based on American nationality. Very troubling! Not only to people like the OP but Americans here with existing accounts. Yes, this is the year 2014 where this starts to really hit the fan. I still don't know where it is going and how many Americans are going to be shaken out of Thailand because of it (and many other countries as well). To the OP, I hope you got bad info from these banks and it is still possible for you to get an account here somewhere. Please keep trying.

To the people who have said there isn't going to be any impact from these weird new American laws, I guess it would be crass to say I told you so. Wish this is going to be nothing, but trust me, this isn't nothing. It's starting.

Hey, JT, in general I like your posts on various topics, but here you are rumor-mongering and speculating. There are enough things for Americans in Thailand to be "concerned" about without somebody stirring up pure caca based on no facts. "It's starting." Sheeeiitt!

As others have said, keep going to various branches, and eventually somebody will take the $$.

[SjaakNL2013]

Maybe I may bring under your attention that banks with a main office here and a sub office in a other country that that sub office is a jurisdictional own unit and can, but don't have, to follow the rules from the main office.This is also the other way around. A bank in USA with a sub office here. That sub office is a independent office that use the name/logo and keep close contacts with the main office but is allowed to implement own rules and regulations.Saying this don't expect that a Citi bank in Thailand have the same rules as a Citi bank in New York.

This split in rules and responsibilities is common by international operating companies and make that the local office can comply with the local laws.

[Soutpeel]

Supposely banks in Thailand and in other countries,are turning down Americans ,and also Supposely going to close U.S. citizen bank accounts.Because of that new U.S. Law taking effect.I'm not sure how it's going to play out.

As far as opening an account,just keep on trying.I had A thai go with me.You might want to do the same.

Not supposedly...

Last year I opened an account with Citibank Singapore.

The VERY first question on the application asked if I was an American. If I ticked the yes box the form then led me to a paragraph that read along the lines of "Sorry no accounts for Americans because your government is trying to tell us how to run OUR banking system".

Now that sounds like BS as Citibank is a US Corporation

Not BS at all, Citi international personal banking (Singapore) has had this rule in place for a quite a few years already, per "FDAS's" comment I was was asked the same question quite a few years ago, when I opened my account with them.

I referred an American collegue who was working in Thailand to Citi IPB Singapore and he was told the same thing, and my relationship manager with whom I had done the referral with, emailed me up and told me quite candily that thanks for the referral, but Citi IPB dont want the hassles of opening accounts for US citizens because of the reporting requirements, certainly if they are living and working in a country other than Singapore.

My understanding is if one was working in Singapore, paying taxes and getting a salary paid into Citi Singapore then they could open an account for that person.

Further Citi IPB Singapore is not a US Corporation, its a Singapore entity under the Citibank branding, in the same way Citibank Thailand is a separate legal entity from Citibank Singapore

[CIHUAHUA]

Go back to America and apply for your "A-O" visa, you can not do it in Thailand. At that time the consulate will require a notarized police report from your area, notarized proof of income 800,000 B per year and a notarized medical form from a doctor. The medical form can be downloaded. You will also have to have a ticket (oneway is ok). Check with the consulate in America to see what they need for your visa. Not all consulates are consistent with the rules. "Bernard" at the LA Thai consulate speaks perfect English and will be happy to answer questions. If you go to LA, you can walk in and have it done in less that 48 hours. FYI -The consulate honers both Thai and American holidays. Once you get your visa and come to Thailand you will be able to open a Baht account and a dollar account if you like. Many people come here on a tourist visa and can not get a Thai bank account. You can open an account at BKK in NY but it is almost the same as an American bank. The only difference is sending money for very little to your account here in Thailand. If you are married, your wife can come on an "O" visa ridding on your "OA" visa and will not have to leave the country every 90 days. With her tacked on you will not have to show any additional income, only the 800,000 B per year.

[natway09]

U won't be doing it today Lefty, the banks are closed, but tomorrow I bet u can.

[bobroper]

Bangkok bank stipulates that in order to open an account with them, you will either need to produce work permit or ED visa with confirmation from the school.

โชคดี

On their website they say you can open a savings account and get a debit card to use for shopping and ATM withdrawals without work permit or ED visa.

http://www.bangkokbank.com/BANGKOKBANK/PERSONALBANKING/SPECIALSERVICES/FOREIGNCUSTOMERS/Pages/Openinganaccountnew.aspx

True, until you actually apply regardless of where the bank is situated in Thailand.

[CMBob]

As others have mentioned, there's a lot of rumor mongering going on here. If what the OP says is true (and I guess we don't know all the details), then maybe a problem is going to start for Americans.

BUT at the moment no Thai bank has to report anything to any American authorities. The FATCA law (the US law which requires foreign banks to do some rather minimal reporting to the US Treasury about bank accounts held by American citizens) has been implemented by what have been called "intergovernmental agreements" between the foreign country and the US. As of about December, only 5 or 6 nations in the world had signed any such agreements. The Thai newspapers reported about November or December that the Thai government at that point in time began negotiations with the US about such an agreement and the article noted (maybe speculation) that it usually took 6-8 months to reach an agreement. I've read nothing to indicate an agreement with Thailand has been reached, signed, or implemented. I've also read that at least some of the few countries that have signed intergovernmental agreements on this issue then enacted some legislation not only authorizing their banks to release the information to the US Treasury but telling them they must do so.

So...and this is my speculation...I suspect that an intergovernmental agreement will be reached at some point in time and then the Thai legislature will implement the agreement by some law (and/or some other banking entity will issue regulations). If that happens, I'm actually doubtful there will be a long-term problem for Americans opening and maintaining accounts here.

Pending all that and regardless of what the facts are or might come to be, yes, we'll have to endure the "sky-is-falling" comments by the usual suspects.

[phuketrichard]

This was mentioned last dec (in regards to FBAR) and everyone laughed at me

Thailand is a member country of ASEAN, and ASEAN has agreed to comply with FATCA and Thailand specifically has agreed to comply. While there may be some Thai banks that will reject US citizen/US Green Card holders' accounts, some will still accept them, but probably charge a fee for such accounts as a result of all the reporting the bank will need to do for the IRS.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/686792-us-citizensdo-you-fbar/page-4

All i can tell you is try every bank in the area.

Edited April 7, 2014 by phuketrichard

[lovetotravel]

several years ago, I was turned down by quite a few banks due to having a tourist visa. Bangkok Bank turned me down, but then said if I went to their main branch I would be ok. No problems there.

[philthebook]

I have been turned down at every bank, tried various branches on Samui, keep getting told new regulations were introduced in recently that you must have a WP, ED Visa or own property to be able to open an account.

[Pib]

Maybe the OP left out some key details about his situation and visits to the banks...hopefully he'll add some more posts to this thread beyond his opening post...he was online a few hours ago. I've seen plenty of posts over the years of people on short and long term visas/extensions of stay not being able to open a Thai bank account after visiting multiple branches. And for those folks on long term visas who get turned down multiple times it just may be due to the fact they tried branches that prefer "not" having farang accounts (regardless of your foreign nationality) or how they presented themselves at the bank branch. Banking in Thailand sure can be frustrating some times for farangs.

[yankee99]

Just so happens that I had a friend from the USA came to visit and yesterday we went to open a bank account with a tourist visa.

Kasikorn in central pattaya wanted 2500 for insurance, 800 for ATM and a residency permit or contract to buy a condo. We left as the fees were stupid but it seemed doable.

Went to bkk bank soi bukhao with passport, us drivers license and money. They opened the account on the spot 300 for ATM. You have to wait 2 weeks for internet banking and your ATM is limited to their machines for 30 days.

Basically we went to 2 banks and could have opened two accounts

Edited April 7, 2014 by yankee99

[mahjongguy]

"Kasikorn in central pattaya wanted 2500 for insurance, 800 for ATM ..."

The 2,500 baht is an offer. Just say No Thanks. The 800 baht is for their most expensive ATM card. Just say No, I want the K-My Debit card. It's 200 baht.

[yankee99]

"Kasikorn in central pattaya wanted 2500 for insurance, 800 for ATM ..."The 2,500 baht is an offer. Just say No Thanks. The 800 baht is for their most expensive ATM card. Just say No, I want the K-My Debit card. It's 200 baht.

I asked if the insurance was mandatory and she said yes. Like has been said before YMMV . I did not ask if they had a cheaper ATM but that's good to know.

[Pib]

"Kasikorn in central pattaya wanted 2500 for insurance, 800 for ATM ..." The 2,500 baht is an offer. Just say No Thanks. The 800 baht is for their most expensive ATM card. Just say No, I want the K-My Debit card. It's 200 baht.

Man, I've seen quite a few posts over the last few weeks of people saying K-bank tried hard to push an expensive debit card (ie..,one with insurance) on them versus the basic 200 baht/year card...and one or two of the posters said the account could only be opened if accepting the higher priced card versus the lower priced card. Maybe the K-bank reps are getting a lot of pressure to push their high end products/services (i.e., the high profit products/services).

[Donnievino]

I opened two accounts in February 2014 at Bangkok Bank in Udon Thani. A Baht account with an ATM card and a dollar account. I did not put anything in the dollar account but they gave me 90 days to fund it. I have transferred funds from the US to the baht account with no problem.

[Jingthing]

Kasikorn Bank low level clerk told me something goes into effect starting April 1 and that they will have a letter for all Americans (only Americans, no other nationalities) with existing accounts available saying something, but will not be directly contacting Americans to tell them to pick up this letter. Weird, huh? Just passing this along, can't confirm how credible.

This is a moving target now.

I suspect we'll know so much more by this time next year.

We're in a time of uncertainty now in regard to Americans banking in Thailand.

Edited April 7, 2014 by Jingthing