Thai opposition urges PM to resign, refuses to back poll

[Mango Bob]

*Deleted post edited out*

There have been a number of members of the cabinet who have already called Abhisit plan unconstitutional. Most are too busy laughing at the plan. So the only fool here is the person calling others fools because they can not see how terrible this plan is.

[rubl]

Eric Loh, on 03 May 2014 - 19:00, said:

Here is a better plan for Ahbishit. Resign from his party, apologize to the people for his undemocratic views and enter monkhood. When he come out, many will forgive him.

Most Thais wouldn't recognise 'democratic' views if it hit them in the face. Furthermore Thailand doesn't really have a democracy, and never had one.

To reason from the starting point of "Thailand democracy" with ideas of how some Western Democracies function is like assuming your car doesn't really need tires or even wheels and simply try to drive off. IMHO

[fab4]

Well it looks like thailand will be going back in years to the year 2010 when there was an APPOINTED PM instead of elected.

Actually most seem to agree that k. Abhisit got to be elected as PM by his fellow MPs in a manner similar to his predecessors, the late Samak and the illustrious Somchai. Even Ms. Yingluck was 'appointed' in a similar fashion.

Technically yes, he got the required number of votes to be nominated PM. If you ignore how that came about you are as naive as the democrat party were when they thought there would be no fallout from it.

[fab4]

Here is a better plan for Ahbishit. Resign from his party, apologize to the people for his undemocratic views and enter monkhood. When he come out, many will forgive him.

Most Thais wouldn't recognise 'democratic' views if it hit them in the face. Furthermore Thailand doesn't really have a democracy, and never had one.

To reason from the starting point of "Thailand democracy" with ideas of how some Western Democracies function is like assuming your car doesn't really need tires or even wheels and simply try to drive off. IMHO

Who's saying the Thais are viewing democracy in a western way (apart from you by saying they wouldn't recognise "democratic" views if it hit them in the face, quite insulting really).

They know what to think of a man who set the army on his fellow thais. That's part of democracy too.

[visionchaser45]

Abhisit and the Democrats are no longer relevant. The reason they don't want an election is because the results show just how little support they have. Bypassing the electoral process is the only way they can get their "good people" in power.

[Mrgk]

So far it has been 10 hours since this became public....

All the rabid terrorist supporting reds on here have already rejected it out of hand.. (nice to know they think they run the country and know what's best for ALL Thai people)....

Yet not a single word by Yingluck, Thaksin, UDD, CAPO or any other party..... That tells me that they are going through it step by step and seeing if there is anything they can negotiate on or even if it seems acceptable and they can too capitalize on it.

However.... the red farang have made up their mind already.... In fact with 3 minutes of this thread being started.

Bunch of fools.

We can read. Hence, it takes even less than 3 minutes to conclude that the Democrats have merely once again decided to go for power without having to earn it at the ballot box.

[Stradavarius37]

Here is a better plan for Ahbishit. Resign from his party, apologize to the people for his undemocratic views and enter monkhood. When he come out, many will forgive him.

Can Thaksin do that too, do you think ?

Sent from my iPhone using ThaiVisa app

[Stradavarius37]

Abhisit and the Democrats are no longer relevant. The reason they don't want an election is because the results show just how little support they have. Bypassing the electoral process is the only way they can get their "good people" in power.

If they are not relevant, then why isn't PTP in power? They did "win" the Feb poll.

Sent from my iPhone using ThaiVisa app

[rubl]

Well it looks like thailand will be going back in years to the year 2010 when there was an APPOINTED PM instead of elected.

Actually most seem to agree that k. Abhisit got to be elected as PM by his fellow MPs in a manner similar to his predecessors, the late Samak and the illustrious Somchai. Even Ms. Yingluck was 'appointed' in a similar fashion.

Technically yes, he got the required number of votes to be nominated PM. If you ignore how that came about you are as naive as the democrat party were when they thought there would be no fallout from it.

A truth conveniently ignored. The most shameful part of Yuppyshit's appointment as PM, was that all involved knew that it would cause deep social division, but didn't care.

Whereas in this true democracy Thailand obviously is, having a criminal fugitive ordering his party MPs who to 'elect' as PM is no problem at all. Almost something we would expect to see and normally see in our Western Democracies back home.

BTW it would be more along forum rules to call k. Abhist by his proper name, as we should for Ms. Yingluck and others involved in this democratic circus.

[Publicus]

Reforms first, then elections. Nothing else is acceptable.

Absolutists proclaiming absolute demands on everyone else = disaster, guaranteed.

Certainly in the present and ongoing context.

Abhisit, the DP, Suthep, PDRC issuing only absolute diktats and demands absolutely create a worse problem than had existed before they came along with their already dictatorial purposes and designs. Absolutists have only absolute contempt and absolute disrespect of others, neither of which is a basis of any balanced resolution or compromise agreement.

That's why the world of democracies have lined up against the ammart and are pressuring it. The ammart's response to put Suthep's words on paper in the sweaty hands of Abhisit doesn't cut it either. You people need to break off from the gods of the caves to come down to join the rest of us in civil society.

Edited May 3, 2014 by Publicus

[Scott]

Posts with an aberrant name for a politician have been removed along with replies.

[brewsterbudgen]

Is the 'criminal fugitive' you refer to, by any chance the most successful and popular PM in Thailand's history that was stitched up by a junta appointed witch hunt committee & their pals in the court?

And overthrown by an illegal military coup!

[Scott]

More posts deleted. Let's tone down the rhetoric and the inflammatory terms used to describe those with whom we disagree. Continuing to post in such a manner will result in warnings.

Please exercise care and restraint in your choice of words.

[djjamie]

Well it looks like thailand will be going back in years to the year 2010 when there was an APPOINTED PM instead of elected.

Actually most seem to agree that k. Abhisit got to be elected as PM by his fellow MPs in a manner similar to his predecessors, the late Samak and the illustrious Somchai. Even Ms. Yingluck was 'appointed' in a similar fashion.

Technically yes, he got the required number of votes to be nominated PM. If you ignore how that came about you are as naive as the democrat party were when they thought there would be no fallout from it.

"you are as naive as the democrat party"

Condescension is still your greatest friend I see.

Edited May 3, 2014 by djjamie

[casualbiker]

I assume this referendum on proposed reforms would be like the last one - no campaigning against it and if the ppl say no to it the 'neutral government' stay in place until the ppl say yes?

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Which referendum was without campaigning against it?

If you mean the 2007 constitution: there was campaigning against it.

And if people would have voted against it, they would have got a slight modified 1997 constitution and the reform government would have made elections as well....they told that several times.

And on the 1997 constitution which Thaksin loves because there are less checks and balances there was no referendum at all.....

There were clear restrictions against campaigning to reject the 2007 constitution draft. The information is easy to find if you care to do a simple search. Try "2007 Constitution of Thailand".

The referendum was hardly democratic when martial laws were in place half the country and campaigning to reject the draft was outlawed.

So in the same vein it hardly Democratic if certain political parties cannot canvas in certain areas for fear of violence .....

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[Roadman]

HOAX

3) The National Reform Network and the People's Democratic Reform Committee must draft a master plan of reforms within 30 days.

Well that puts the wolf in the henhouse just fine eh? The good People Suthep's Lot

Fail Abhisit fail... but then that was the intention wasn't it.. Propose something you know will not fly in order to not particip[ate in the elections..

How is this in any way shape or form is this " Launching his well-trailed proposal to ease the crisis..."

Absolute stupidity from Abhisit and again the reason why this needs to be resolved, if Thailand wishes to be recognised as a democracy, by the courts, backed by the Army. Criminals on one side of the political divide and idiots on the other.

[TimCM]

There has been too much debate on this issue, really it is quite clear .

elected government does not fulfill it's obligation to govern fairly as per rule and decree.

it is found over 3 years to go against the law after being warned by so many.

Corruption levels like never before.

Not keeping records of contracts on VIP issues.

Bull dozing through bills in parliament without adequate debate

Election promises that were never kept or paid for.

Because of all that has happened and as I said the government self destructed there HAS to be mega reforms to set Thailand on the straight and narrow.

All the debate about Suthep and democratic elections held quickly is a ploy to overlook the wrongs.

Sorry if this does not fit your agenda pro gov posters.

Which is why if the opposition put up some reasonable policies, they would win an election easily. Instead they just want their turn at the trough.

Besides, if you are so worried about corruption, why would you want the yellows (clearly not democratic) back in as they, including Suthep were corrupt when they were in power and have had no reform since

Who mentioned the yellows--THEY ARE LONG GONE I didn't did I ???

I care who is in--that's why reforms have to be, I do NOT wish for anyone in power if their motives are crooked as of now----understand.

That is why reforms have to come with stringent laws appertaining to corrupt officials, so whoever is elected fairly will have to be transparent of suffer the same fate as Yingluck/PTP. No stupid dissolve to get back in TRIPE.

Sorry, I misread that. You did not say yellows (I can't call them Dems), trying to multitask is no good for me.

I think we both want this corrupt gov out but the issue is there is no alternative at the moment as what Suthep is suggesting would be worse.

We need a council of good expats to take control of government for the good of the country. Courts need independent judged that follow laws for all not just they want to keep in power and then the police cleaned out and the military put in its place.

Pity my footy team here has more chance of beating Geelong than any of this happening

[See the bears]

I assume this referendum on proposed reforms would be like the last one - no campaigning against it and if the ppl say no to it the 'neutral government' stay in place until the ppl say yes?

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Which referendum was without campaigning against it?

If you mean the 2007 constitution: there was campaigning against it.

And if people would have voted against it, they would have got a slight modified 1997 constitution and the reform government would have made elections as well....they told that several times.

And on the 1997 constitution which Thaksin loves because there are less checks and balances there was no referendum at all.....

There were clear restrictions against campaigning to reject the 2007 constitution draft. The information is easy to find if you care to do a simple search. Try "2007 Constitution of Thailand".

The referendum was hardly democratic when martial laws were in place half the country and campaigning to reject the draft was outlawed.

So in the same vein it hardly Democratic if certain political parties cannot canvas in certain areas for fear of violence .....

Sent from my XT1032 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Like PT in Surat Thani

[Mrgk]

Abhisit and the Democrats are no longer relevant. The reason they don't want an election is because the results show just how little support they have. Bypassing the electoral process is the only way they can get their "good people" in power.

If they are not relevant, then why isn't PTP in power? They did "win" the Feb poll.

Sent from my iPhone using ThaiVisa app

Interesting that you pretty much admit that the Democrats and the Constitutional Court are one and the same. Slip-up, or newfound frankness?

[h90]

Considering the amount of anti-Democrat postings by "new" user it seems someone got a big panic.....

[GunterChiangMai]

' i don't know how to spell lose " " my little sister doesn't know how to spell and doesn't do anything without instruction from me ".

RESIGN ? ?

No! Just improve your english skills, dress properly, don't get tattoos and go to the dentist!

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

[Stradavarius37]

Abhisit and the Democrats are no longer relevant. The reason they don't want an election is because the results show just how little support they have. Bypassing the electoral process is the only way they can get their "good people" in power.

If they are not relevant, then why isn't PTP in power? They did "win" the Feb poll.

Sent from my iPhone using ThaiVisa app

Interesting that you pretty much admit that the Democrats and the Constitutional Court are one and the same. Slip-up, or newfound frankness?

Is pretty much admit the same as didn't? Red shirt education on display!

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[Maroon Watcher]

Can anybody tell me if there is a sport where this sort of demand would be allowed...

If we are not allowed to win...

we will take the ball away!

I think I was 5 when it was pointed out to be .. er, wrong!

[rubl]

Here is a better plan for Ahbishit. Resign from his party, apologize to the people for his undemocratic views and enter monkhood. When he come out, many will forgive him.

Most Thais wouldn't recognise 'democratic' views if it hit them in the face. Furthermore Thailand doesn't really have a democracy, and never had one.

To reason from the starting point of "Thailand democracy" with ideas of how some Western Democracies function is like assuming your car doesn't really need tires or even wheels and simply try to drive off. IMHO

Who's saying the Thais are viewing democracy in a western way (apart from you by saying they wouldn't recognise "democratic" views if it hit them in the face, quite insulting really).

They know what to think of a man who set the army on his fellow thais. That's part of democracy too.

Now you're talking and I agree. Most Thai are not viewing democracy in the western way. That's why it's so hilarious to have posters here reasoning from a western vision of democracy and trying to protect it on Thailand.

democracy = elections, things like that.

PS there are more and more Thai who know what to think about a woman who 'protects' anti-government protesters with the police.

[djjamie]

They had an election a couple years ago, and just look at the mess PTP made. It's now time to, as you say, reinvent those parts and make them better.

By mess, you mean all time stock-market peak, booming economy, nearly had the Senate reformed to be elected and democratic again, nearly had the high speed trains in progress that have been promised by the Democrats, very high growth rate and a massive influx of investment...

Good luck with that election and your policies. Whatever they may be.

If you had bothered to check, you would have found Abhisit responsible for Thailand's stock market boom; Yingluck derailed it.

Booming economy? Just ask the starving farmers.

The farmers almost got paid.

The children almost got tablets.

Bangkok almost got washed away in the flood.

And Yingluck almost got away with it!

thailand-stock-market.png

Happy for you, you see the peak? Thats Yingluk, you see the drop at the end? That Suthep & Abhisit.

Starving farmers? If only those farmers had some way of making food! Perhaps you should run for election and see how many farmers you fooled,

Tablets for Children, I look forward to reading your manifesto on what you plan there.

Bangkok floods, yes I'd forgotten how well she did with that. She averted flooding, worked well with the army and navy, yep, another plus.

I look forward to Abhisit 'flood plan', I bet it will be something like: My Plan By Mark Age 9 : appoint a committee to make a plan...

Yep when the PTP HQ set up to fight flooding had to be moved twice, because it was flooded twice says a lot about the PTP's ability to predict where flooding would happen. (notice I stated facts where as you stated a belief the PTP did well.)

If I set up a fire fighting HQ next to a 2 million litre fuel farm aligned with oncoming winds and it was blown up (twice!!!!!!!!!) would you suggest I did a good job too. If I wore a red shirt maybe you would right? If my shirts was yellow you would suggest I didn't. Agenda driven response maybe from you?

Tablets for children. I see from your response you agree the PTP failed there.

Starving farmers. Yep. When you throw all your money into the last harvest and still need to be paid to plant your next harvest then you have no rice to eat. Farmers are not committing suicide because the PTP only adhere to 1 principle of democracy. Try being a farmer and if you can't imagine that then intimidate them and call them fake to suit the PTP agenda.

What I love most about TVF is the broad spectrum of views and opinions I read.

Yours, my dear friend, scares me.

Farmers are dying and have no money. Children don't have tablets and 815 people lost their lives in the 2011 floods and you state YOUR belief that the PTP are great when facts have stated otherwise.

Facts save lives when lessons are learnt. Beliefs kill and destroy lives.

Shame on you my friend. Shame on you.

You, my friend deserve the pigeon award. See below.

I pity you.

<edit> I nearly forgot who I was talking to...“if you reply, don't demonize me, don't be condescending, don't quote me out of context, don't change the subject and don't cherry pick”

Edited May 3, 2014 by djjamie

[rubl]

Can anybody tell me if there is a sport where this sort of demand would be allowed...

If we are not allowed to win...

we will take the ball away!

I think I was 5 when it was pointed out to be .. er, wrong!

Answer: politics

Politics is one of the more dangerous and certainly all round sports what with the elbow activities, the double talk with forked tongue, the sneaky movements, the seemingly withdrawal with sudden return. The obfuscation and the ability to please people with 'election only' promises.

Luckily I learned a normal profession

[rubl]

HOAX

3) The National Reform Network and the People's Democratic Reform Committee must draft a master plan of reforms within 30 days.

Well that puts the wolf in the henhouse just fine eh? The good People Suthep's Lot

Fail Abhisit fail... but then that was the intention wasn't it.. Propose something you know will not fly in order to not particip[ate in the elections..

How is this in any way shape or form is this " Launching his well-trailed proposal to ease the crisis..."

Absolute stupidity from Abhisit and again the reason why this needs to be resolved, if Thailand wishes to be recognised as a democracy, by the courts, backed by the Army. Criminals on one side of the political divide and idiots on the other.

You forgot the honorable mention of TV Forum posters who know all about democracy ( at least I assume they were not included with those on the other side ).

[3NUMBAS]

she should urge them to shut their filthy mouths and find a job instead of loafing around on the streets creating chaos and damaging the economy .

[geriatrickid]

Which referendum was without campaigning against it?

If you mean the 2007 constitution: there was campaigning against it.

And if people would have voted against it, they would have got a slight modified 1997 constitution and the reform government would have made elections as well....they told that several times.

And on the 1997 constitution which Thaksin loves because there are less checks and balances there was no referendum at all.....

You are incorrect. It was ILLEGAL to campaign against the referendum.

The military dictatorship passed a law and enforced it arresting people who sought to campaign against the forced constitution.

You are posting false information.

The military dictatorship said that there would be no elections until the new constitution was selected. The military dictatorship also stated that unless its constitution was selected it would take one of the prior constitutions and amend it and implement it as it saw fit. Those were the choices. The 57% vote in favour was made up in large part by people who wanted elections due to the forced conditions appointed by the military dictatorship.

All of the above is established fact.

[Smokemachine]

Seriously, the people are willing to give the same group of the current "govt" a 2nd chance?

By voting for them and got elected again,the people are taking a big risk.

Currently YL govt has indeed screwed up in their administration, what if they fail again?

By then, voters regretted for their choice is too late then.

Thing is done and nation collapses. Nothing is cured.

Are the people really want to take such a gamble?

Since YL govt is not up to the job. Why not let others to have a chance to build up the nation effectively?

Let the capable ones have a chance to save their homeland. Does the people really to see their homeland fall into hands of the evil syndicate?

But again, we know the red supporters very well.

"We the red supporters, we are the democracy!, We vote and we win the election. We are the majority!

You indict our dear leaders, we send you M79 presents.

We couldn't care less about the mistakes, graft charges, rejected the CC rulings, corrupted policies schemes. We are the democracy! We are the majority, we voted. You can't use a "judicial coup" on our elected leader. To us, remember we won the elections.

So what ever mistakes,charges you want to fault our leaders, set a election. let's the people have their votes.

Election, election, election,election,election, election............."

So the red democracy voters purely interested to have elections. Vote and the majority win. That it! This is the democracy.

So we need to understood in Thailand, democracy is to have election, votes and get the most votes. Nothing else, after elected, what ever laws they break is not under their red democracy process.

If people try to fault them, again ELECTION.

Election, votes and the majority win. Full stop. Democracy ends here.

Edited May 3, 2014 by Tywais
Changed to standard color font