Should children living here have a yearly flu vaccine?

[inbangkok]

Anyone who has seen someone dying of smallpox would know the value of vaccination.

But you know what's great about smallpox? The fact that it no longer exists. Anyone want to guess why? Here's a hint (third from the bottom):

yes great and why is it still vaccinated if it doesn't exist anymore?

See my post above. The vaccinations still exist because brilliant minds like you refuse to vaccinate and ruin it for everyone........

[h90]

The point is, that with flu vaccine we would have pumped maybe dangerous things in our body year for year without having any benefit from it.

How can you possibly know that you've received no benefit from something that is supposed to be preventive (i.e. a thing that makes another thing not happen)? Did you get sick and die from the flu? If no, then one of two things happened: (1) You didn't catch the virus. (2) You caught the virus but were vaccinated, so its impact on your was limited or nonexistent.

Point is 20 times vaccination without value.

How do you objectively measure value in this case? Tell me how a person can know whether or not he has received value from a vaccination.

Not had any vaccinations for 35 years, only had 2 vaccinations in 45 years (Typhoid and cholera for a holiday), haven't died from anything, haven't been seriously ill from anything.

Refused TB vaccination at age 13, haven't caught TB yet.

Had flu a few times, wasn't that bad.

Been all over the world as well.

If vaccinations are vital for everyone, I should have been dead by now.

I think it is good to vaccinate dangerous things: Polio, Hepatitis B, but not flu.

Try to make it worldwide: Once there is no Polio anymore you can drop that vaccination.

If you are farmer you need to vaccinated against things you get from ticks. If you are teacher in downtown and your hobby is playing Chess than you don't need that vaccination.

Common sense.....

[attrayant]

yes great and why is it still vaccinated if it doesn't exist anymore?

From the CDC:

What is the smallpox vaccine, and is it still required?

Routine vaccination of the American public against smallpox stopped in 1972 after the disease was eradicated in the United States. Until recently, the U.S. government provided the smallpox vaccine only to a few hundred scientists and medical professionals who work with smallpox and similar viruses in a research setting. After the events of September and October, 2001, however, the U.S. government took further actions to improve its level of preparedness against terrorism. For smallpox, this included updating a response plan and increasing the amount of smallpox vaccine in the stockpile. We now have enough vaccine in the stockpile to vaccinate every person in the United States in the event of a smallpox emergency. (updated Dec 29, 2004)

Should I get vaccinated against smallpox?

The smallpox vaccine is not available to the public at this time.

[inbangkok]

The point is, that with flu vaccine we would have pumped maybe dangerous things in our body year for year without having any benefit from it.

How can you possibly know that you've received no benefit from something that is supposed to be preventive (i.e. a thing that makes another thing not happen)? Did you get sick and die from the flu? If no, then one of two things happened: (1) You didn't catch the virus. (2) You caught the virus but were vaccinated, so its impact on your was limited or nonexistent.

How do you objectively measure value in this case? Tell me how a person can know whether or not he has received value from a vaccination.

Not had any vaccinations for 35 years, only had 2 vaccinations in 45 years (Typhoid and cholera for a holiday), haven't died from anything, haven't been seriously ill from anything.

Refused TB vaccination at age 13, haven't caught TB yet.

Had flu a few times, wasn't that bad.

Been all over the world as well.

If vaccinations are vital for everyone, I should have been dead by now.

I think it is good to vaccinate dangerous things: Polio, Hepatitis B, but not flu.

Try to make it worldwide: Once there is no Polio anymore you can drop that vaccination.

If you are farmer you need to vaccinated against things you get from ticks. If you are teacher in downtown and your hobby is playing Chess than you don't need that vaccination.

Common sense.....

I am just wondering how many more times you are going to blatantly lie and say the flu is not dangerous? Here....perfectly healthy kid in Texas dies from it....no flu shot.

http://edition.cnn.com/2013/01/10/health/texas-teen-killed-flu/

There is this thing called "google"....try using it.....you will find many cases.

[attrayant]

If you are farmer you need to vaccinated against things you get from ticks. If you are teacher in downtown and your hobby is playing Chess than you don't need that vaccination.

You posted this exact same hypothetical two pages again and I replied to it in post #77. Here it is again.

But the government thought that the small risk of vaccination problem is worth it to prevent the big risk of infection.

Very true for a farmer.

Very wrong for a kid in down town who never leaves the concrete....And there was a lot promotion. Telling the parents that they risk the life of their kids if they don't get them vaccinated.....Kids who never get in contact with nature.

While that may have been the case 50 years ago, it's no longer a safe assumption today. Nowadays that farmer can get on a plane and be in the big city in less than an hour. It happened less than a month ago:

Ebola claims first victim outside of Africa

Short version: Saudi man flew to Sierra Leone for a quick bite of ebola and flew back home. Thanks to the short incubation period, the man fell ill soon enough that his situation was realized and further infections were prevented. Next time we might not be so lucky.

Note well: This reply is specific to communicable diseases, since that what we are discussing in this thread.

I'm tired of answering the same questions over and over.

[eeeya]

Great thread, now where is my tinfoil hat

Great contribution! Most informative. Would that be the tinfoil hat in the shape of a dunces cap? It's probably in the corner where you left it.

Ha ha, look at you. lashing out at someone who doesnt support your ill informed beliefs.

im a supporter of immunizations. I work on a ship in South east asia teaming with people from all ends of the world, breathing, living, crapping in the same living spaces.. I want all the protection I can get. and I also want to protect those around me. Its not all about yourself.

The problem is now that all the nasty diseases have gone away (for now) people are dropping their guard thinking its all over, the once successful programs have now lost their benefit and the populations defenses slip away, Diseases once thought to be not a problem will spring up again and the cycle will continue.

I'm putting my support for science and statistics. i dont subscribe to conspiracy theories told by internet crack pots

[AnotherOneAmerican]

By the way, why did you get the typhoid and cholera shots?

Trip to Egypt, couldn't enter the country without them.

[h90]

How can you possibly know that you've received no benefit from something that is supposed to be preventive (i.e. a thing that makes another thing not happen)? Did you get sick and die from the flu? If no, then one of two things happened: (1) You didn't catch the virus. (2) You caught the virus but were vaccinated, so its impact on your was limited or nonexistent.

How do you objectively measure value in this case? Tell me how a person can know whether or not he has received value from a vaccination.

Not had any vaccinations for 35 years, only had 2 vaccinations in 45 years (Typhoid and cholera for a holiday), haven't died from anything, haven't been seriously ill from anything.

Refused TB vaccination at age 13, haven't caught TB yet.

Had flu a few times, wasn't that bad.

Been all over the world as well.

If vaccinations are vital for everyone, I should have been dead by now.

I think it is good to vaccinate dangerous things: Polio, Hepatitis B, but not flu.

Try to make it worldwide: Once there is no Polio anymore you can drop that vaccination.

If you are farmer you need to vaccinated against things you get from ticks. If you are teacher in downtown and your hobby is playing Chess than you don't need that vaccination.

Common sense.....

I am just wondering how many more times you are going to blatantly lie and say the flu is not dangerous? Here....perfectly healthy kid in Texas dies from it....no flu shot.

http://edition.cnn.com/2013/01/10/health/texas-teen-killed-flu/

There is this thing called "google"....try using it.....you will find many cases.

Great you found 1 case

[h90]

If you are farmer you need to vaccinated against things you get from ticks. If you are teacher in downtown and your hobby is playing Chess than you don't need that vaccination.

You posted this exact same hypothetical two pages again and I replied to it in post #77. Here it is again.

But the government thought that the small risk of vaccination problem is worth it to prevent the big risk of infection.

Very true for a farmer.

Very wrong for a kid in down town who never leaves the concrete....And there was a lot promotion. Telling the parents that they risk the life of their kids if they don't get them vaccinated.....Kids who never get in contact with nature.

While that may have been the case 50 years ago, it's no longer a safe assumption today. Nowadays that farmer can get on a plane and be in the big city in less than an hour. It happened less than a month ago:

Ebola claims first victim outside of Africa

Short version: Saudi man flew to Sierra Leone for a quick bite of ebola and flew back home. Thanks to the short incubation period, the man fell ill soon enough that his situation was realized and further infections were prevented. Next time we might not be so lucky.

Note well: This reply is specific to communicable diseases, since that what we are discussing in this thread.

I'm tired of answering the same questions over and over.

yes true the farmer could be full with ticks and they jump over to innocent down town kids.

While it is possible I could live with this risk.

And of course if there would be a vaccine I would fully agree to vaccinate against Ebola.

From Wikipedia about flu: ""The most common symptoms are chills, fever, runny nose, sore throat, muscle pains, headache (often severe), coughing, weakness/fatigue and general discomfort. "

The last flu pandemic had a fatality rate of 0.03 % that would be 3 out of 10.000 INCLUDING the old, ill, HIV (weak immune system) etc..

So you can imagine how many young healthy died. (that is the swine flu you mentioned earlier).

[fantom]

Prof. Peter Curson writing in this weeks (30th August)Spectator Australia 'Ebola - the next move.' makes the following rather chilling observation:

'Currently ebola seems to be a largely a West African issue. But just think what would happen if ebola and the influenza virus somehow interacted and the resulting infection spread like the common cold. What a frightening scenario that might produce.'

He makes the point that '(In) Australia childhood infections have also reared their heads despite the existence of defensive vaccination programs. Human behavior rules the roost. People simply refuse, for a a variety of reasons, to have their children vaccinated. A good example of this is pertussis or whooping cough in Australia. Despite the fact that there is a vaccine available for children since 2010 there have been more than 113,000 cases of the disease when there should have been very few if any.'

The point here is that there are consequences to the actions of those who refuse vaccination to themselves and try to deny it to others. As I have said in a previous post, microbes simply do not care, they just adapt and infect where they can, sometimes I am sure they even infect the stalwarts on TV who refuse vaccinations and those who seek salvation in quackary.

[inbangkok]

Not had any vaccinations for 35 years, only had 2 vaccinations in 45 years (Typhoid and cholera for a holiday), haven't died from anything, haven't been seriously ill from anything.

Refused TB vaccination at age 13, haven't caught TB yet.

Had flu a few times, wasn't that bad.

Been all over the world as well.

If vaccinations are vital for everyone, I should have been dead by now.

I think it is good to vaccinate dangerous things: Polio, Hepatitis B, but not flu.

Try to make it worldwide: Once there is no Polio anymore you can drop that vaccination.

If you are farmer you need to vaccinated against things you get from ticks. If you are teacher in downtown and your hobby is playing Chess than you don't need that vaccination.

Common sense.....

I am just wondering how many more times you are going to blatantly lie and say the flu is not dangerous? Here....perfectly healthy kid in Texas dies from it....no flu shot.

http://edition.cnn.com/2013/01/10/health/texas-teen-killed-flu/

There is this thing called "google"....try using it.....you will find many cases.

Great you found 1 case

Now you are just acting like an amateur troll.....lol

I know of dozens of cases....but I am not going to link to everyone. Like I said, learn to use google and you will find many as well. There is no reasoning with wing nuts like you, I don't know why I even bother.........

[AnotherOneAmerican]

I am just wondering how many more times you are going to blatantly lie and say the flu is not dangerous? Here....perfectly healthy kid in Texas dies from it....no flu shot.

http://edition.cnn.com/2013/01/10/health/texas-teen-killed-flu/

There is this thing called "google"....try using it.....you will find many cases.

One could argue that allowing those with poor immune systems to live and breed, is decadent.

Bubonic plague died out, because nearly everyone susceptible to it died in the middle ages.

[inbangkok]

I am just wondering how many more times you are going to blatantly lie and say the flu is not dangerous? Here....perfectly healthy kid in Texas dies from it....no flu shot.

http://edition.cnn.com/2013/01/10/health/texas-teen-killed-flu/

There is this thing called "google"....try using it.....you will find many cases.

One could argue that allowing those with poor immune systems to live and breed, is decadent.

Bubonic plague died out, because nearly everyone susceptible to it died in the middle ages.

One could argue anything....but I am not quite sure I understand what the point of this argument is to be completely honest? Unless it is as simple as it sounds......let people die from preventable diseases if their body cannot fight it off naturally? Surely you would not believe something like this in the year 2014.

[attrayant]

One could argue that allowing those with poor immune systems to live and breed, is decadent.

How very Klingon of you.

Bubonic plague died out, because nearly everyone susceptible to it died in the middle ages.

It's statements like these that make me think you're just baiting us for giggles.

So we don't need to vaccinate because we can just throw our weakest hundred million people at the infection as a hopeful sacrifice?

Edited September 5, 2014 by attrayant

[fantom]

I am just wondering how many more times you are going to blatantly lie and say the flu is not dangerous? Here....perfectly healthy kid in Texas dies from it....no flu shot.

http://edition.cnn.com/2013/01/10/health/texas-teen-killed-flu/

There is this thing called "google"....try using it.....you will find many cases.

One could argue that allowing those with poor immune systems to live and breed, is decadent.

Bubonic plague died out, because nearly everyone susceptible to it died in the middle ages.

Complete nonsense I am afraid.

'Bubonic Plague provides a good example. Today the disease is geographically more widespread than at any time in history. Natural reservoirs of plague exist throughout much of the Western USA as well as in Southern Africa, Asia and parts of Latin America. A classic zoonosis or animal disease, plague is permanently maintained in the micro-climate of small ground-living animals where it adapts perfectly to their lifestyle. The disease rarely affects us, but every now and again a virulent strain such as pneumatic plague emerges, spreading rapidly.'

From an article by Prof Peter Curson, 'Ebola - the next move,' Spectator 30th August 2014

The most basic of searches on the internet would tell you this. Wikipedia has an article, as suggested there is a thing called 'Google.'

[heybuz]

the vaccine doesn't protect you against all flu strains,only some deemed by the health professionals to be the worst or where there is more risk to the public. you can still get the flu after having the shot,as all strains are not covered only the most serious.

[Sheryl]

OK finally my computer us repaired and I have proper online access to respond to what has become pages of largely nonsense.

1. All vaccines have side effects. They are known and their incidence is known. Most side effects are minor – pain at the injection site, brief fever etc. But occasionally more serious effects occur. The incidence of that is also known, and is factored into the decisions national public health agencies make when developing recommended vaccine schedules.

2. The diseases vaccines prevent against also have a certain known incidence of complications. With some diseases it is a high percentage (e.g. Japanese B encephalitis, which frequently causes death or permanent brain damage) and in other cases (e.g. measles) it is a low percentage of total cases, but offset by the fact that the incidence of the disease itself in an unimmunized population is very high. The overall risk of serious disability or death for a diseases is the risk of getting the disease times the percentage of people who once they have, develop serious complications or have a fatal outcome. Should note that both factors, but especially the second one, vary with specific population groups. Malnourished children, for example, have a very high mortality rate from measles, well-nourished children much less so (but not nil). The very young and the very old are more likely to die from influenza and young adults usually the least. School-aged children, especially pre-school and primary school age, are especially likely to contract influenza and other infectious diseases. Etc etc.

3. Public health recommendations for vaccines are developed taking all the above into account, usually based on deliberations of an expert panel. Government public health officials do not have any financial link to drug manufacturers and indeed, frequently go up against them. It should be noted that there is no field a health professional can go into that pays as little as public health. Those who opt for it, are not in it for the money. If you or your family are getting your vaccinations through the public sector – be it in Thailand or anywhere else – you can be quite sure you are not getting anything that is not truly needed. You might be failing to get things that would be nice to have (in terms of avoiding unpleasant illnesses) but did not pass government cost benefit analysis or (in the case of Thailand and other less developed/developing countries) which the public health sector does not have the funds to support yet and deems of comparatively lower priority. If you are getting your vaccines from a private doctor/hospital, you should familiarize yourself with government recommendations and carefully research any suggested vaccine that is not part of the government recommended schedule, as it is not impossible that a financial motive (either on the part of the doctor/hospital, or on the part of drug reps who persuaded a doctor too busy to look closely at the data himself) is playing a part. Possible, and sometimes happens, but is by no means as common or standard a practice as some of the posters here apparently believe.

4. The best place to get the details of vaccine side effects, including their incidence is this website: http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/hcp/vis/index.html?s_cid=cs_74 click on the vaccine in question. In addition to listing the side effects and their frequency, this site also lists contraindications, i.e. specific groups of people who should not get the vaccine, or at least carefully consult their physician before getting it because they are at higher than average risk of adverse effects. If you would like to understand in detail the deliberations that led to a specific vaccine being recommended for specific groups of people, you’ll find that here http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/programs/vfc/providers/resolutions.html

5. Autism is not a side effect of any known vaccine. The idea that it is linked to vaccination dates back to a Dr. Wakefield who in 1998 published an article purporting to show a linkage between autism and the MR (measles/mumps/rubella) vaccine. This article lead to a number of large scale studies, including a case-control one that followed cohorts of vaccinated and unvaccinated children over time. None of these studies found a link; rates of autism were just as high in unvaccinated as in vaccinated children. The 1998 article, meanwhile, was found to contain spurious data. 10 of the 13 authors retracted it and the lead author, Dr. Wakefield, was cited for ethical misconduct. He was also found to have financial conflict of interest in the matter (he received money from lawyers planning vaccine related lawsuits starting 2 years prior to his published article).. Subsequent to this, he was investigated and censured by the British Medical Council for a range of unethical activities including abuse of patients with autism (performance of invasive and unnecessary tests without consent etc.).

Nonetheless, parents of autistic children have continued to at times attribute the onset of their child’s autism to the MMR vaccine. It is generally assumed that this is because the vaccine is given at about the same age that autism first becomes evident. It may also be the case that the vaccine somehow helps trigger the onset in children who due to some combination of genetics and neurochemistry were destined to become autistic anyway. That possibility would explain both the parental perception of a clear temporal association and the clearly established fact that the overall incidence of autism is the same regardless of whether children are vaccinated. (Parents also sometimes attribute the onset to an illness and/or treatment of any illness…and same may apply).

It is, by the way, completely untrue that “autism has increased as immunization rates rose”. The rate of children diagnosed with autism in Western countries has risen steadily ever since the late 1990’s while immunization rates have actually slightly declines in that same period (as a result of scare tactics) and both trends are continuing.

6. Thimerosol: very small amounts of thimerosol was traditionally used as a preservative in vaccine (and other pharmacologic) manufacturing as it has antiseptic and antifungal properties. There is no evidence that it is harmful in the very tiny amounts that are used for such purposes and it was never linked to autism in any way. However in 1999, at a time when there was a lot of concern about mercury in fish etc., the American Academy of Pediatrics recommended it no longer be used in the routine vaccines given to babes/very young children. This was a purely precautionary move and never in any way linked to autism but the popular press seized in it and many people confused the two matters. (Wakefield himself made no mention of thimerosol). Thimerosol is no longer included in the routine pediatric vaccinations but its removal did not, however, stop the rumors or scare tactics and many people are under the incorrect impression that (1) routine childhood vaccines contain it (no longer so) and (2) that it has been proven, or at least that there is strong reason to believe it is, dangerous. Neither is the case.

7. Lastly and most important: this is not a zero sum game wherein one option is total safe. Vaccines save millions of lives each years; there is no question about it. Vaccines also have side effects, and very rarely, these can be serious. Neither option is risk free, but unless someone has specific contraindications/risk factors, vaccines are the safer option. Because vaccination levels are sufficiently high in the Western world (and in Thailand), many people have forgotten – or if young enough, never knew – just how common deaths and major disability from the diseases they protect against were… and still are in some parts of the world. I am old enough to remember the polio epidemic in the US, with hospitals filled with children in iron lungs etc. and parents were terrified to let their children go to school. . And the great joy when the vaccine was introduced. You don’t meet people paralyzed from polio today, but you can if you travel to the Democratic Rep of Congo, and you could just 15 years ago in Cambodia. Measles was one the of the leading causes of death in Cambodian children back then, as well. No more, and thanks to rising levels of immunization infant and child mortality rates in just 15 years dropped in half in that country. As they do in any country where a strong immunization program is introduced. It is tragic that such progress is being undermined in the West by sensationalist misinformation. We are starting to again see outbreaks of measles and whooping cough in the West as a result of people refusing immunization. 10 children died of pertussis (whooping cough) in 210 during an outbreak there that was the largest in 60 years. Another such epidemic is currently in progress. Both are the direct result of anti-vaccine campaigning/scare-mongering.

[attrayant]

OK finally my computer is repaired...

Don't tell me it was a virus...

[Sheryl]

Nope. Power surge fried the motherboard.

[kelly404]

Great thread, now where is my tinfoil hat

Great contribution! Most informative. Would that be the tinfoil hat in the shape of a dunces cap? It's probably in the corner where you left it.

Ha ha, look at you. lashing out at someone who doesnt support your ill informed beliefs.

im a supporter of immunizations. I work on a ship in South east asia teaming with people from all ends of the world, breathing, living, crapping in the same living spaces.. I want all the protection I can get. and I also want to protect those around me. Its not all about yourself.

The problem is now that all the nasty diseases have gone away (for now) people are dropping their guard thinking its all over, the once successful programs have now lost their benefit and the populations defenses slip away, Diseases once thought to be not a problem will spring up again and the cycle will continue.

I'm putting my support for science and statistics. i dont subscribe to conspiracy theories told by internet crack pots

welll that's hardly 'lashing out', is it, many dunces are just late developers, so don't feel insulted.

I do tire though of seeing the same old phrases over and over again when reading forums, it tends to make them boring to say the least, I mean, why bother?

I want to see the statistics from the study of vaccinated against unvaccinated, that would clear a lot up, there must be one surely, perhaps you could give me a link?

[eeeya]

Sorry, dunces don't know how to use google

[FlipSide]

Here's an interesting report just came out.

Moms of autistic, vaccine-damaged children mount wave of online protest against CDC research fraud

http://www.naturalnews.com/046750_autistic_children_vaccines_CDC.html

So please do your own research, but I wouldn't vaccinate if I were you. Colloidal Silver and a healthy raw, fresh diet. All my friends kids who haven't vaccinated, vs the other kids who are , and all have given me personal testimonials to support staying healthy naturally, where possible.

[harrry]

Nope. Power surge fried the motherboard.

Should have given the computer the protection of a surge protector.

A nice new computer so you can type twice as fast.

[fantom]

Nope. Power surge fried the motherboard.

Sure it wasn't a thunderbolt?

[attrayant]

Here's an interesting report just came out. Moms of autistic, vaccine-damaged children mount wave of online protest against CDC research fraud

http://www.naturalnews.com/046750_autistic_children_vaccines_CDC.html

So please do your own research.

You should take your own advice and do your own research. You've got advanced degrees in virology, biochemistry and medicine, don't you? Right! Then it should be easy.

I checked your link (knowing full well where it leads) and found the whole brouhaha stems from a CNN iReport. For those of you who don't know, iReport is CNN's user-generated content. Essentially an open-access site that anyone can post content to and make it look like news.

Nice "research", Flipside.

Now let ME do some research on Mike Adams, founder of Natural News dot com:

Mike Adams is a self-described "Health Ranger" and the nut behind the Internet's most embarrassing collection of paranoia and misinformation, the Natural News website. At first glance, he appears to be just another run of the mill alt-med blogger. He promotes the tired old ideas that everything related to science based medicine is corrupt and poisonous, and that everything "natural" is the key to all health. Yawn.

What's interesting about Mike, and the reason I honor him as a wacko, is the way he illustrates how people who believe one crazy thing are very likely to believe many crazy things. Completely aside from his usual alt-med stuff, look at this list of other things he promotes:

• Jesse Ventura and his conspiracy theories
• Plastic water bottles will kill you
• Alkaline water is a miracle drug
• The breast cancer "industry" is a giant profit-driven deception
• Cancer is your body's natural healing system
• Well-funded covert operatives are trying to suppress him (this is a sign of true mental delusion)

In short, name the conspiracy theory or paranoid delusion of your choice, and chances are you'll find the Health Ranger promoting it somewhere.

UPDATE 2014-07-27: Mike Adams has gone from being a typical wacko to a dangerous one by calling for the murder of all those who don't accept his misinformed world view.

From the Wackos Gallery.

[inbangkok]

Here's an interesting report just came out.

Moms of autistic, vaccine-damaged children mount wave of online protest against CDC research fraud

http://www.naturalnews.com/046750_autistic_children_vaccines_CDC.html

So please do your own research, but I wouldn't vaccinate if I were you. Colloidal Silver and a healthy raw, fresh diet. All my friends kids who haven't vaccinated, vs the other kids who are , and all have given me personal testimonials to support staying healthy naturally, where possible.

..."a healthy raw, fresh diet."

[fantom]

Here's an interesting report just came out.

Moms of autistic, vaccine-damaged children mount wave of online protest against CDC research fraud

http://www.naturalnews.com/046750_autistic_children_vaccines_CDC.html

So please do your own research, but I wouldn't vaccinate if I were you. Colloidal Silver and a healthy raw, fresh diet. All my friends kids who haven't vaccinated, vs the other kids who are , and all have given me personal testimonials to support staying healthy naturally, where possible.

..."a healthy raw, fresh diet."

Colloidal silver?

''Colloidal silver is a mineral. Despite promoters’ claims, silver has no known function in the body and is not an essential mineral supplement. Colloidal silver products were once available as over-the-counter products, but in 1997, the U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA) ruled that colloidal silver drug products were not considered safe or effective. Colloidal silver products marketed for medical purposes or promoted for unproven uses are now considered “misbranded” under the law.' from http://www.webmd.com

And you still feel free to advise people to avoid vaccinations?

[fantom]

Here's an interesting report just came out.

Moms of autistic, vaccine-damaged children mount wave of online protest against CDC research fraud

http://www.naturalnews.com/046750_autistic_children_vaccines_CDC.html

So please do your own research, but I wouldn't vaccinate if I were you. Colloidal Silver and a healthy raw, fresh diet. All my friends kids who haven't vaccinated, vs the other kids who are , and all have given me personal testimonials to support staying healthy naturally, where possible.

Colloidal silver

I do hope you are not making your kids ingest this stuff, I really think you should take your own advise and do some basic research on the side effects (see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argyria) . You may not mind, but your kids will not thank you if they end up looking like rejects for the cast of Avatar.

[h90]

Here's an interesting report just came out.

Moms of autistic, vaccine-damaged children mount wave of online protest against CDC research fraud

http://www.naturalnews.com/046750_autistic_children_vaccines_CDC.html

So please do your own research, but I wouldn't vaccinate if I were you. Colloidal Silver and a healthy raw, fresh diet. All my friends kids who haven't vaccinated, vs the other kids who are , and all have given me personal testimonials to support staying healthy naturally, where possible.

..."a healthy raw, fresh diet."

Colloidal silver?

''Colloidal silver is a mineral. Despite promoters’ claims, silver has no known function in the body and is not an essential mineral supplement. Colloidal silver products were once available as over-the-counter products, but in 1997, the U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA) ruled that colloidal silver drug products were not considered safe or effective. Colloidal silver products marketed for medical purposes or promoted for unproven uses are now considered “misbranded” under the law.' from http://www.webmd.com

And you still feel free to advise people to avoid vaccinations?

Silver kills bacteria and still used for this purpose in water.

But I have no idea if it kills some unwanted bacteria if you eat it.

[h90]

Here's an interesting report just came out. Moms of autistic, vaccine-damaged children mount wave of online protest against CDC research fraud

http://www.naturalnews.com/046750_autistic_children_vaccines_CDC.html

So please do your own research.

You should take your own advice and do your own research. You've got advanced degrees in virology, biochemistry and medicine, don't you? Right! Then it should be easy.

I checked your link (knowing full well where it leads) and found the whole brouhaha stems from a CNN iReport. For those of you who don't know, iReport is CNN's user-generated content. Essentially an open-access site that anyone can post content to and make it look like news.

Nice "research", Flipside.

Now let ME do some research on Mike Adams, founder of Natural News dot com:

Mike Adams is a self-described "Health Ranger" and the nut behind the Internet's most embarrassing collection of paranoia and misinformation, the Natural News website. At first glance, he appears to be just another run of the mill alt-med blogger. He promotes the tired old ideas that everything related to science based medicine is corrupt and poisonous, and that everything "natural" is the key to all health. Yawn.

What's interesting about Mike, and the reason I honor him as a wacko, is the way he illustrates how people who believe one crazy thing are very likely to believe many crazy things. Completely aside from his usual alt-med stuff, look at this list of other things he promotes:

• Jesse Ventura and his conspiracy theories
• Plastic water bottles will kill you
• Alkaline water is a miracle drug
• The breast cancer "industry" is a giant profit-driven deception
• Cancer is your body's natural healing system
• Well-funded covert operatives are trying to suppress him (this is a sign of true mental delusion)

In short, name the conspiracy theory or paranoid delusion of your choice, and chances are you'll find the Health Ranger promoting it somewhere.

UPDATE 2014-07-27: Mike Adams has gone from being a typical wacko to a dangerous one by calling for the murder of all those who don't accept his misinformed world view.

From the Wackos Gallery.

For such research no "advanced degrees in virology, biochemistry and medicine" is necessary. And it is statistics....