Reports emerging of police drug testing scam in Bangkok

[johninbkk71]

If stopped tell them you want to go to a hospital to do the test. If they argue have the camera on your phone on and your embassy's emergency number on speed dial (good luck Brits with that one)

[johninbkk71]

If stopped tell them you want to go to a hospital to do the test. If they argue have the camera on your phone on and your embassy's emergency number on speed dial (good luck Brits with that one)

[chrisinth]

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Foreigner comes to Thailand. Takes a walk down Sukumvit Rd. And stops at a street stall. He sees something that he likes and buys it. It's a Hard Rock Cafe shirt. Later that late afternoon he walks past a Beer Bar and is invited into the bar from a few girls standing outside. He goes inside has a couple of drinks and also buys some drinks for the girls. A local comes up to one of the girls and says something in Thai. The girl then turns to the foreigner letting him know that for a couple hundred baht he can buy some pills to have more fun and continue partying. He is excited and having a gret time on his holiday in Thailand.

Upon exiting the Beer Bar he is approached by the police which request a urine sample. They check his pockets and find the pills. He requests to go to the police station. While there he is arrested for drugs and fake brand name clothes. After his fine of 30,000 baht his vacation is ruined. He was lucky because the wasn't thrown in jail but without any money he just sat at the lobby of his hotel until his daparture date. When asked about his experience all he said was that he would never ever come back to Thailand again.

This is sad and I'm sure this is the situation of many visitors that come to Thailand. If one person tells their story to 10 people and they in-turn tell 10 people it doesn't take that long to see how this negative publicity can affect foreigners coming to Thailand.

Locals are the ones that supply the drugs and fake brand name items. So Thailand goes after the foreigners and charges a hefty fine. They do not care that it's the locals that are at the root of the problem. The police position is, if the foreigner didn't come to Thailand then this would not have happened. It's the foreigner's fault.

The flip side to this is that if one person tells their story to ten people, the tenth person will likely hear a completely different story. If however the person telling the story remains consistent, it is guaranteed that the next ten people told the story from the original ten will hear something different.

We used to call it Chinese whispers at school, and even though that was a while ago, human nature doesn't evolve that quickly........................

[goatfarmer]

"...urine samples can test as positive due to the use of a contaminated container, for example."

Would not surprise me whatsoever...

The other problem is that tourists arriving from overseas may not have gone "dry" before arriving and they are arrested for urine content and not on actually taking drugs while in Thailand.

Yeah, fly in from Washington State and Colorado where smoking pot is perfectly legal. Next thing you know you're sitting in a Thai jail for popping on THC. That would thoroughly suck, especially for tourists who are doing nothing illegal in their own counties. Yeah, this issue definitely needs world-wide exposure. Agreed. Clicked 5 Stars.

Interesting point. I recently passed this issue past a friend who is a public prosecutor in Bangkok. For what it's worth, she said the following:

1. There is no extraterritorial jurisdiction for drug offences in Thailand. If you committed a legal act overseas that would be an offence in Thailand, it would not be an offence merely to enter Thailand having committed that act. Thus, if you had , as Condda posits, smoked pot in Colorado and then entered Thailand, you would not be liable in Thailand for the act of smoking in Colorado.

2. Having traces of illegal drugs in your urine is not, of itself, an offence. It is merely presumptive of an illegal act. In other words, there is no law that proscribes traces of illegal substances in urine, as there is a law proscribing levels of alcohol in drivers.

On the question of onus of proof, my prosecutor friend said that the onus would be on the accused to prove that the act occurred outside Thailand. I asked her how one might discharge that onus and she said that:

1. One would need an expert witness to prove that the substance can remain in body tissues for the length of time claimed; and

2. One would have to prove that one was out of Thailand during that window of time, perhaps, by presenting one's passport.

I replied that this is all too complicated. You might get off. But it would sure waste a lot of time and nervous energy in the process.

[johndudorn]

Send it around the world. Till it goes viral! Then maybe T.A.T. will wake up.

At the top of this page is a place you can click on stars to rate the topic. The more stars the topic gets, the higher up this topic is in Google search results. A small thing, but along the lines of what you are talking about.

As they say you learn something new everyday. I have added my vote (5 stars). Hopefully more will do the same!

[SurinScotsman]

Could it be that the rise in these incidents could be due to issues arising between the NCPO and the police ? Perhaps the NCPO are starting to hurt/upset the "income subsidies" of the police who are in turn starting to apply pressure by increasing the number of "incidents" relating to foreign tourists.

[Partigo]

To the person who said 'irrelevant' - length of nose etc? Won't bother to reply - nonsense post. To the question asking me to clarify, I shall. I am not suggesting that tourist harassment has become the norm in NZ or Aust etc. I will add that I am speaking from what I have observed and i hope that Oz is still a great country for visitors AND residents.

I have experienced corruption in this Kingdom and in the Commonwealth. It is immoral and repugnant wherever and to whom ever it occurs.

The issue here is not about drugs, per se, but about how policing is conducted. Police action should not be initiated without 'reasonable cause'. This, it seems to me, is the issue. I am perhaps invoking the hackneyed maxim of 'removing the log before criticizing the speck' etc.

The mayor of New York recently stated that policing must change in the US (reaction to Ferguson etc) and, so it ought change in Australia. So too in Hong Kong and Thailand.

I hope that clarifies my earlier post. Two final obs: our experiences and who we are, is not attached to our posts. We should exchange opinions respectfully, bearing that in mind. Secondly (and personally) i found the response thought provoking - and must say that i am more comfortable with the authority here than in Oz. Again, my experience and obs - but regardless of location, policing should be based on 'probable cause' not 'randomness'!

[EnglishJohn]

Could it be that the rise in these incidents could be due to issues arising between the NCPO and the police ? Perhaps the NCPO are starting to hurt/upset the "income subsidies" of the police who are in turn starting to apply pressure by increasing the number of "incidents" relating to foreign tourists.

lol, exactly what I was just going to post !. I suspect this is a ploy to discredit the government in response to action being taken to stop their supplementary income.

[chrisinth]

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Not that I'm worried about testing positive, but this is enough to make me want to cancel my upcoming trip to Bangkok. Just not worth the hassle.

But that's just it. Anytime you're forced to take a urine test, it's 1 in 10 that you'll be popped on a 'false positive'. So now going to BKK is like Russian Roulette if you get stopped. Not acceptable odd imho.

Is there no properly secured second test at the Station , surely they cant nick and convict you on an uncontrolled street test

You are correct, they can't nick you purely on the evidence of the first test. If you object and demand either a second test or preferably a blood test conducted by a qualified person.

The 'scam' is based on bullying, getting the victim so scared that they will willingly pay to get out of the predicament they are in.

One thing I forgot to mention in my earlier post is what happens if you get fitted up and something is planted on your person. If you suspect that something has been planted on you, under no circumstances either touch it or accept it from any of the officers. No matter what!

Once your prints are on it, you are theirs.

[ColdSingha]

Not that I'm worried about testing positive, but this is enough to make me want to cancel my upcoming trip to Bangkok. Just not worth the hassle.

i'd be worried when 1 out of every 10 negative tests is a false positive, that is scary.

Edited December 8, 2014 by ColdSingha

[Alwyn]

Tourists should be able to understandbthat junkies are not welcome in Thailand. They should be able to figure out before they cross the border. Given that, they should be able to get clean in their home countries. If they prefer a trip on meth to a trip to Thailand, then it's up to them. Is that so difficult to understand?

I think most normal people would understand that. What most normal people don't like is being stopped and made to piss into a jar whilst in the street and then extorted for no reason which is what this post is all about. Is that so difficult to understand?

Sure, no excuses for overreactions, whether by police or not.

I'm certainly not a friend of totalitarian regimes, but I understand fairly well that the western-style parliamentary democracy system is not the real big solution for all countries all over the world.

You're on the wrong page mate, this post is about police scamming tourists

[micmichd]

Can someone enlighten me and tell me what this word "scamming" (in the headline) 's got to do with this?

[smokie36]

Its worse than last year with the protesters.

Amazing Thailand.....perhaps by next Xmas anyone venturing down Asoke from Thonglor will have to negotiate tanks and snipers in the surrounding buildings.

In the meantime the RTP should start handing out badges to those who have "complied" so they are not stopped again.

Gotta love it.

[A1Str8]

It's all part of the 'bring back happiness to the people' project.

[smokie36]

I can see Ploen Chit becoming a popular spot....Thonglor and its wealthy expats must be delighted to be keeping out the riff raff.

[jomcondo]

the Thai tourist empire is gradually crumbling.

[dansan]

Reminds me of the time I was shaken down for about the 3rd time in Ekkamai back around 2005...

Back then the scam was the coppers in borrowed uniforms from Thong Lo police station.

It only came on top when they started to enter the buses looking to shake people down.

That 3rd time they shook my tree they got 10,000 B (I was found holding). Could have been much worse.

Although the bit that was worse was me reading the Bangkok Post the next week and learning to my complete horror that the police were not actually police and the bribe I had paid went wayward...

Would love to say a lesson was learnt but it really wasnt

[The manic]

Tourists should be able to understandbthat junkies are not welcome in Thailand. They should be able to figure out before they cross the border. Given that, they should be able to get clean in their home countries. If they prefer a trip on meth to a trip to Thailand, then it's up to them. Is that so difficult to understand?

No But you are. And who said anything about junkies? The main concerns expressed here are about pot consumed when not even in Thailand

[The manic]

If you have to go to Asoke, Soi 22, or Thong Lor, and you are on foot, just keep your eyes peeled and you stand a good chance of seeing any police before they see you. They are not the most quick or quick witted you'll meet and I would not think it would be too difficult to stay away from them. Cross the street, turnaround and walk quickly in the other direction, whatever it takes to avoid them just as you would avoid crossing paths with someone who looks like they might mug you.

If you get into a position where they can stop you, feign confusion, or pretend you can't see, hear and/or understand them or whatever it is just short of running away and just keep walking, don't stop. They probably will not physically grab you and make you stop. Look at your watch as though you are in a hurry and maybe even break into a jog. The minute you stop and open the interaction then you are totally vulnerable to being cooked in the tom yam tourist pot.

I want a holiday not a bad trip to paranoia park.

[jaywalker]

If you have to go to Asoke, Soi 22, or Thong Lor, and you are on foot, just keep your eyes peeled and you stand a good chance of seeing any police before they see you. They are not the most quick or quick witted you'll meet and I would not think it would be too difficult to stay away from them. Cross the street, turnaround and walk quickly in the other direction, whatever it takes to avoid them just as you would avoid crossing paths with someone who looks like they might mug you.

If you get into a position where they can stop you, feign confusion, or pretend you can't see, hear and/or understand them or whatever it is just short of running away and just keep walking, don't stop. They probably will not physically grab you and make you stop. Look at your watch as though you are in a hurry and maybe even break into a jog. The minute you stop and open the interaction then you are totally vulnerable to being cooked in the tom yam tourist pot.

Maybe start acting mentally retarded, drool & spit a lot when you say something.

Sounds stupid but I bet it would work.

[mrhappyniceguy]

I am a real estate investor. I will no longer be investing in Thailand. I do not consume drugs, but do not want to risk a false positive. In addition, it's not wise to invest in a market that discriminates against tourists as the exit strategies are minimized.

[rgs2001uk]

The OP article talks about racial profiling, are those being stopped mainly young, back-packer types, or are they stopping any Westerner or tourist ?

Not too many KSR types around this area, its anyone they think they can get away with it.

This shyt has been going on for at least the last 15-20 years I can remember.

[The manic]

I think these stories are appalling. I read another similiar tale yesterday. A tourist on his 2 week trip to Thailand. Second day in the mid- afternoon.

I don't know Bangkok very well, but tell me are Thonglor and Asoke 'red light districts'?

No, not at all. But what if they were? Thonglor is a Thai yuppie area,Korean businessmen steakhouses and a big Tesco. Also a few hugs and tugs places.

[The manic]

It is because of this nonsense I decided to skip on heading down to the Golden Bar for a beer and a chat with a mate I have not seen in 2 years. Just cannot be bothered to deal with this crap.

Any time I need to go downtown, I make sure I stay on the BTS and go straight down the stairs to the MRT.

Contaminated cups. Jumping Jesus.

But the Golden bar is miles from Thonglor and in a different precinct...isn't it?

[rgs2001uk]

I can see Ploen Chit becoming a popular spot....Thonglor and its wealthy expats must be delighted to be keeping out the riff raff.

Smokes, its got to the point now, if I am ever in that part of town, I get on the BTS to Prakhanong and get a taxi home from there.

Have been stopped a few times, NEVER been asked for a passport.

Last time I was stopped, they pulled the taxi over, I had been stopped a few weeks previous and knew the drill, took off my shirt, opened the door and handed it to the policeman, sat in the taxi with my feet hanging out and started to take off my shoes and socks, even the taxi driver was pissing himself.

The whole area is a complete fecken joke, even the Thais tell me, dont go to the police station unless accompanied by a lawyer.

You go there by yourself as a witness, you are held as an accessory.

Isnt that the same area where Red Bull man pulled off his stunt, still on the sick in Singapore is he?

As has been mentioned by previous posters, Ekamai bus station is another favourite area.

It must piss them off that they cant make it down to Lumpini district and get in on the action on the lower Suk ghetto.

[The manic]

I am a real estate investor. I will no longer be investing in Thailand. I do not consume drugs, but do not want to risk a false positive. In addition, it's not wise to invest in a market that discriminates against tourists as the exit strategies are minimized.

And if you have a normal cross section demographic of wealthy European customers they will be, or have been, or might in the future be recreational drug users. It is so common. Or their kids will be. That is why it is an easy scam for the police. It is shooting fish in a barrel. Which combined with the third world prison and justice system makes Thailand about a popular as Midnight Express Turkey in the 70s.

Edited December 8, 2014 by The manic

[rgs2001uk]

It is because of this nonsense I decided to skip on heading down to the Golden Bar for a beer and a chat with a mate I have not seen in 2 years. Just cannot be bothered to deal with this crap.

Any time I need to go downtown, I make sure I stay on the BTS and go straight down the stairs to the MRT.

Contaminated cups. Jumping Jesus.

But the Golden bar is miles from Thonglor and in a different precinct...isn't it?

The Golden Bar is Lumpini district.

[kurnell]

Interesting that I have worked in the Thonglor area for 7 years and have never been harassed or seen any cops scamming tourists. I usually walk the streets there 5 times a week. I know it has happened to my friend once, but he has lived in thonglor for 10 years.

[sambum]

Can someone enlighten me and tell me what this word "scamming" (in the headline) 's got to do with this?

I would have thought that 4 words give it away:-

"police drug testing scam"

[The manic]

It is because of this nonsense I decided to skip on heading down to the Golden Bar for a beer and a chat with a mate I have not seen in 2 years. Just cannot be bothered to deal with this crap.

Any time I need to go downtown, I make sure I stay on the BTS and go straight down the stairs to the MRT.

Contaminated cups. Jumping Jesus.

But the Golden bar is miles from Thonglor and in a different precinct...isn't it?

The Golden Bar is Lumpini district.

Oh sorry I thought it was in Soi 4 in Klong Toey precinct. It's all so confusing sometimes.