No Taxis At The New Airport?

[wpcoe]

The following letter was in the August 15 Bangkok Post:

No taxis at new airport

According to the Airports of Thailand Plc, there will be no taxis at the new Suvarnabhumi Airport. Passengers upon arrival (with their luggage) must take a shuttle bus some 3km to the public taxi stand next to the public bus station.

What a welcome to Thailand!

Paul Cheesman

I had been hoping that Mr. Cheesman was misinformed, but then I found the following web page: http://www.bangkokairportonline.com/node/52 , which seems to confirm his appalling news.

It looks like buses to Bangkok and Pattaya are a 3km shuttle bus ride away, too.

They want the facility to be a world class airport, the #1 in Asia, and they intend to inconvenience arriving passengers this way? Oy vey: TiT to the extreme.

[britmaveric]

Prebook a car service prior - lad will be waiting with a sign - problem solved!!!

[jdinasia]

Personally I would like to see NO PRIVATE Vehicles at all allowed close to an airport that have not been screened. Shuttles or slideways etc would be awesome.

I have often thought that paralyzing an airport or the entire industry could be done with drive-up car bombings as easily as hitting planes themselves.

let's hope I am just wrong about that!

[Crossy]

Prebook a car service prior - lad will be waiting with a sign - problem solved!!!

Hmmm, won't you then have to get on the shuttle with your driver? At least he will carry your bags.

This idea of using a shuttle is crazy, going to need 60+ vehicles an hour 24 hours a day, what a waste of energy

I'm all for having the bus terminal remote, but taxis too?? Crazy!!

Every airport I've ever travelled to has taxis right outside the arrivals hall, out of customs, into a cab, easy!

[britmaveric]

Prebook a car service prior - lad will be waiting with a sign - problem solved!!!

Hmmm, won't you then have to get on the shuttle with your driver? At least he will carry your bags.

This idea of using a shuttle is crazy, going to need 60+ vehicles an hour 24 hours a day, what a waste of energy

I'm all for having the bus terminal remote, but taxis too?? Crazy!!

Every airport I've ever travelled to has taxis right outside the arrivals hall, out of customs, into a cab, easy!

Don't think so unless parking for the airport happens to be same place as where the shuttle drops you off.

[Crossy]

Don't think so unless parking for the airport happens to be same place as where the shuttle drops you off.

The maps are very confusing, 'long term' parking is by the transport centre, I see no reference to 'short term' parking.

If everyone calls a pickup car the limited space outside the arrivals hall will become clogged in about 1 minute.

[jdinasia]

with busses etc available to Pattaya and other places .... life will be great for many people with the new set-up

not to mention when the dedicated lightrail to the city is finished!

Edited August 20, 2006 by jdinasia

[wpcoe]

moderator ... please delete. I thought I was editing my post for clarity, and ended up double-posting!

Edited August 21, 2006 by wpcoe

[wpcoe]

with busses etc available to Pattaya and other places .... life will be great for many people with the new set-up

The existence of such buses will be an improvement over Don Muang, but they also will require a 3km shuttle bus ride with luggage...

[lopburi3]

Security - taxis are screened now and expect they would be at new airport so do not view that as a valid reason - especially when private cars are not screened or restricted. The taxi rank would be in the outside lane - thus well away from the building.

Do not believe security can be used as a reason for not allowing taxi pickup at the terminal.

[samran]

Do not believe security can be used as a reason for not allowing taxi pickup at the terminal.

No, the real reason is that a bunch of private limo companies have ensured they have a monopoly the types of transport that first gets seen by a traveller after a long flight.

I'm not going to speculate how this arrangement was ensured however.

One thing I do want to know however, is where the 'puu yai' are going to park. There doesn't seem to be any 'puu yai' parking spots allocated for mercs and BMW's right outside the terminal building in the drop off and pick up areas.

[Soju]

with busses etc available to Pattaya and other places .... life will be great for many people with the new set-up

The existence of such buses will be an improvement over Don Muang, but they also will require a 3km shuttle bus ride with luggage...

It's my understanding that the express buses that go direct to some of the better-known / luxury hotels will be curbside, not requiring a shuttle bus. Certainly I would expect there would be one or more of these buses going to the luxury hotels in Pattaya. For me, the concept is really simple - the premium services for the more demanding passengers get curbside access. The cheaper services for the average, less demanding passenger require a shuttle bus to access. Pay for a premium taxi (private car) or premium bus and you get convenience. Don't pay the premium and you get less convenience. It's a tried and true business model that's woked successfully in many industries all over the world and IMHO it's the right decsion for the new airport.

People keep knocking the shuttle buses saying no other airport in the world does what's being proposed here, requiring a shuttle bus to taxis. But shuttle buses are used in just about all major airports around the world. Shuttle buses to car parks, car rentals, hotels, etc. All these airports handle passengers with lots of luggage just fine, so I'm sure the shuttle buses at Suvarnabhumi will do the job just fine, with the possible exception of a learning curve at the beginning where certain problems need to be addressed.

[Beavis and Butthead]

Will this airport have enough gates to handle all aircraft? what I hate is taking a shuttle bus from terminal to aircraft

[wpcoe]

People keep knocking the shuttle buses saying no other airport in the world does what's being proposed here, requiring a shuttle bus to taxis. But shuttle buses are used in just about all major airports around the world. Shuttle buses to car parks, car rentals, hotels, etc.

I'd be curious to see the list of airports that require a shuttle bus to take a metered taxi.

Shuttle buses are often required to car parks and car rentals, because the real estate on which those concessions are located is usually not physically close to the arrivals hall. A taxi queue is a horse of another color. (And, of course, non-airport-terminal hotels would require a shuttle bus.)

What is so unacceptable about having a taxi queue outside the arrivals hall? (Other than the quite inconceivable concept that corruption in favor of premium service providers might possibly be a factor?)

[PETERTHEEATER]

Will this airport have enough gates to handle all aircraft? what I hate is taking a shuttle bus from terminal to aircraft

It probably wont matter. There is only one runway (Dong Muang has two) so the limiting factor will be aircraft movements.

[Soju]

People keep knocking the shuttle buses saying no other airport in the world does what's being proposed here, requiring a shuttle bus to taxis. But shuttle buses are used in just about all major airports around the world. Shuttle buses to car parks, car rentals, hotels, etc.

I'd be curious to see the list of airports that require a shuttle bus to take a metered taxi.

Shuttle buses are often required to car parks and car rentals, because the real estate on which those concessions are located is usually not physically close to the arrivals hall. A taxi queue is a horse of another color. (And, of course, non-airport-terminal hotels would require a shuttle bus.)

What is so unacceptable about having a taxi queue outside the arrivals hall? (Other than the quite inconceivable concept that corruption in favor of premium service providers might possibly be a factor?)

I don't know of any airports that require a shuttle bus to a taxi stand, but I do know of one airport where metered taxis are banned completely from the arrivals - Manila, at least that's the way it was last time I was there. If you want a taxi you need to pay for a "coupon taxi" which is like 3x or more the cost of a regular metered taxi and which is in a taxi car park on the opposite side of the arrivals roadway. They don't have any express buses, shuttle buses, or buses of any kind. The arrival area is virtually empty except for private individuals coming to pick up arriving individuals. You have very few options there and is a real pain for budget travelers. But anyways, that's not really important except to note that it's a much worse solution to the taxi mess than what is being proposed for Bangkok.

My point was that people all over the world use shuttle buses with their luggage without problems. I feel that people are moaning about being required to haul their luggage onto shuttle buses just because it's different and they don't want to lose what they consider to be convenient now about Don Muang. They're simply using the luggage issue as an excuse. Every airport shuttle bus I've ever taken has someone to assist you with your luggage if you require it, and places to put the luggage. I'd be totally shocked it the same sort of a situation isn't present at the new BKK airport as well.

What is unacceptable about having the taxi queue outside the arrivals hall in BKK is that is makes the place a madhouse and prevents necessary other means of transportation from effectively using the airport. Most modern airports in Farangland are very well organized and transportation can enter, pick up passengers, and exit swiftly and efficiently. This is far from the case at Don Muang, which IMO is due mainly to one factor - the massive traffic jam created by all the taxis. I will be very pleased to see the taxis gone and gladly use the express hotel buses in their place, or if I really need it pay for a private car. BKK cannot adopt the same strategy as other modern airports in Farangland because of the huge numbers of taxis that are present in BKK compared to a much smaller number in Farangland. It is physically impossible to efficiently accomodate both the huge number of taxis and the express buses plus other transportation in the space provided. Something's got to give, and thankfully they made the right choice in booting the taxis. That's my opinion, but of course I could be very wrong, especially if they implement the plan poorly.

The bottom line is that you can't have it all. Curbside space at airports is very limited and someone has to decide what stays and what goes. The situation presently at Don Muang is certainly nowhere near world-class standards and I think everyone would agree that somethng needed to change. We may disagree on what changes should be made, but ultimately you'll have to wait and see when the new airport opens how convenient or inconvenient it is.

[lopburi3]

Will this airport have enough gates to handle all aircraft? what I hate is taking a shuttle bus from terminal to aircraft

It probably wont matter. There is only one runway (Dong Muang has two) so the limiting factor will be aircraft movements.

Wrong. Don Muang runways can only be used one at a time because they are too close together for simultaneous operation. If you check the new airport it has two usable runways:

The airport has 2 parallel runways (60 m. wide, 4,000 m. and 3700 m. long) and 2 parallel taxiways to accommodate simultaneous departures and arrivals. It has a total of 120 parking bays (51 with contact gates and 69 remote gates) and 5 of these are capable of accommodating the Airbus A380 aircraft.

[Soju]

Will this airport have enough gates to handle all aircraft? what I hate is taking a shuttle bus from terminal to aircraft

It probably wont matter. There is only one runway (Dong Muang has two) so the limiting factor will be aircraft movements.

Where do you get that information from? Everything I've read says Suvarnabhumi has two runways with space to add more in the future if necessary. And everything I've read says that with the same two runways as Don Muang has, but being spaced further apart, that they will be able to handle more flights than Don Muang. If you're saying they can't handle as many flights as Don Muang, I'm sure a lot of people would want to know that because someone's totally hoodwinked the general public into believing otherwise.

[Rinrada]

Will this airport have enough gates to handle all aircraft? what I hate is taking a shuttle bus from terminal to aircraft

It probably wont matter. There is only one runway (Dong Muang has two) so the limiting factor will be aircraft movements.

Where do you get that information from? Everything I've read says Suvarnabhumi has two runways with space to add more in the future if necessary. And everything I've read says that with the same two runways as Don Muang has, but being spaced further apart, that they will be able to handle more flights than Don Muang. If you're saying they can't handle as many flights as Don Muang, I'm sure a lot of people would want to know that because someone's totally hoodwinked the general public into believing otherwise.

Capacity

The airport has 2 parallel runways (60 m. wide, 4,000 m. and 3700 m. long) and 2 parallel taxiways to accommodate simultaneous departures and arrivals.

It has a total of 120 parking bays (51 with contact gates and 69 remote gates) and 5 of these are capable of accommodating the Airbus A380 aircraft.

With a capacity of handling 76 flight operations per hour, both international and domestic flights will share the airport terminal but will be assigned to different parts of the concourse.

In the initial phase of construction, it will be capable of handling 45 million passengers and 3 million tonnes of cargo per year.

Between the airport hotel and the terminal building are the two 5-storey car park buildings with a combined capacity of 5,000 cars.

[sbk]

Will this airport have enough gates to handle all aircraft? what I hate is taking a shuttle bus from terminal to aircraft

It probably wont matter. There is only one runway (Dong Muang has two) so the limiting factor will be aircraft movements.

Where do you get that information from? Everything I've read says Suvarnabhumi has two runways with space to add more in the future if necessary. And everything I've read says that with the same two runways as Don Muang has, but being spaced further apart, that they will be able to handle more flights than Don Muang. If you're saying they can't handle as many flights as Don Muang, I'm sure a lot of people would want to know that because someone's totally hoodwinked the general public into believing otherwise.

Well according to the official website

Capacity

The airport has 2 parallel runways (60 m. wide, 4,000 m. and 3700 m. long) and 2 parallel taxiways to accommodate simultaneous departures and arrivals. It has a total of 120 parking bays (51 with contact gates and 69 remote gates) and 5 of these are capable of accommodating the Airbus A380 aircraft. With a capacity of handling 76 flight operations per hour, both international and domestic flights will share the airport terminal but will be assigned to different parts of the concourse. In the initial phase of construction, it will be capable of handling 45 million passengers and 3 million tonnes of cargo per year. Between the airport hotel and the terminal building are the two 5-storey car park buildings with a combined capacity of 5,000 cars.

Slow internet connection, beat me to it Rinrada

[Jockstar]

The following letter was in the August 15 Bangkok Post:

No taxis at new airport

According to the Airports of Thailand Plc, there will be no taxis at the new Suvarnabhumi Airport. Passengers upon arrival (with their luggage) must take a shuttle bus some 3km to the public taxi stand next to the public bus station.

What a welcome to Thailand!

Paul Cheesman

I had been hoping that Mr. Cheesman was misinformed, but then I found the following web page: http://www.bangkokairportonline.com/node/52 , which seems to confirm his appalling news.

It looks like buses to Bangkok and Pattaya are a 3km shuttle bus ride away, too.

They want the facility to be a world class airport, the #1 in Asia, and they intend to inconvenience arriving passengers this way? Oy vey: TiT to the extreme.

Be very surprised at that!

[sbk]

Not surprised, just wonder how big those shuttle busses are. Do you think they factored in the ability to carry everyones luggage as well?

[britmaveric]

Not surprised, just wonder how big those shuttle busses are. Do you think they factored in the ability to carry everyones luggage as well?

That takes thought SBK - I'd assume the worst.

[lopburi3]

The bus photos I have seen look good and are very low entry with ramp and luggage room; somewhat like the subway cars in seating. One can only guess how many pax will get caught up in the the ramp as it tries to extend as they "queue" to be the first abroad.

[lomatopo]

I've read that Don Muang can handle a maximum of 60 flight operations per hour, compared to the published maximum for Suvarnabhumi of 76.

Based on all my experiences listening to ATC arriving and departing Don Muang, the parallel runways (21R/3L or 21L/3R, reverse direction, for runway numbers add a zero to get the compass direction) are used for simultaneous take-offs and landings (but not simultaneous landings or simultaneous take-offs). That is to say, one plane can land on 21L while another takes off on 21R. One issue at Don Muang is the cross-over required so this reduces the maximum flight operations. At Suvarnabhumi the runways are on either side of the terminal so no need to wait to cross-over an active runway. There are many other factors that govern the max. flight ops. per hour figure.

At Suvarnabhumi I assume they will stick with the one runway for landing, one for take-off scenario? This can be reversed, as it is sometimes done at Don Muang, based on prevailing winds.

A third runway is already being constructed at Suvarnabhumi. I think there were/are plans for a fourth?

[wpcoe]

"Most modern airports in Farangland are very well organized and transportation can enter, pick up passengers, and exit swiftly and efficiently."

This is a brand new airport. Shouldn't it have been designed to be "well organized" so that transportation can enter, pickup passengers, and exit swiftly and efficiently???

"I will be very pleased to see the taxis gone and gladly use the express hotel buses in their place, or if I really need it pay for a private car."

How nice that you can afford the luxury of a private car and/or live near somewhere where the express hotel buses can drop you off. I guess the airport designers realized the majority of local deplaning passengers are like you, and the system will serve the needs of that majority quite well. The rest of us who expect convenient access to a proletariat taxi deserve to have to wait for a shuttle, and then endure enjoy a 3km ride before we can enter the queue.

"BKK cannot adopt the same strategy as other modern airports in Farangland because of the huge numbers of taxis that are present in BKK compared to a much smaller number in Farangland."

Hmmm. Now why do you suppose that there might be more taxis at BKK vs at modern airports in Farangland? Could it be that people use them ... by choice? If that is a fact (that BKK has more taxi usage than western airports), shouldn't that have been a significant factor in designing the arrival area and traffic flow?

"What is unacceptable about having the taxi queue outside the arrivals hall in BKK is that is makes the place a madhouse and prevents necessary other means of transportation from effectively using the airport."

Not to sound like a broken record, but proper planning and design could preclude such a madhouse.

"That's my opinion, but of course I could be very wrong, especially if they implement the plan poorly."

Nice disclaimer. ;-)

[Jack Jones]

Can you not just get a taxi from the departure level, this is what I did before anyway?

I do agree that having the taxi rank 3KM away is not a good idea and just adds an unnecessary leg to an already tiring journey. Did nobody think that the taxi rank could just be organised better rather than putting it into a different location? I fly Heathrow to Frankurt regularly on business, both airports have taxis right outside the terminal, organised in straight lines. Is that such a radical idea???

[mark lamai]

seems the only one who got it right was about influential people taking control of it.

for heavens sake, having done don muang a lot, its not a hellhole, its hot and smelly,

but getting a taxi is very simple and quick.

do a comparison - how long to leave the building and be on your way at DM, about 5 minutes -

compared to how long it will take with this stupid shuttle -

at a guess i reckon you would add 30 more minutes -

which is the last thing a traveler wants after a long flight.

[eddy-ham]

Looking at the plans I would suggest a quick drop down to departures and then grab a taxi that dropping off.

Depositing a 80 plus passengers at a time at a taxi rank 3 km away .........................well thats really going to please everybody.....

see you all in th Q.

[fisherd3]

Arriving at Doan Muang, I have been approached immeadiately outside the terminal building by a Thai taxi man apparently brokering rides to Pattaya for a great rate, by returning taxi drivers.

He is a parked up in the short term car park and drives you to your taxi a couple of kilos away away.

I am sure that the taxi boys will use similar ingenuity to provide a better and cheaper service than that envisaged by the powers that be.