Is America at war with radical Islam?

[Berkshire]

Anything to support the notion that Jordan knows how to deal with these people?

They get points for exterminating two Islamic terrorists hours after one on their pilots for burned alive. We will have to wait and see what else they get up to.

The US has taken out a lot more, including Bin Laden. We get any points for that?

[Morch]

Anything to support the notion that Jordan knows how to deal with these people?

They get points for exterminating two Islamic terrorists hours after one on their pilots for burned alive. We will have to wait and see what else they get up to.

Considering how long they had them in custody, it is not very impressive.

Had their pilot not been captured and murdered, nothing would have been done about them.

[Steely Dan]

I've just realized, there is a logical fallacy in the OP, as there so often is. There is no such thing as radical Islam, all Islam is radical. Fundamentalist (original 7th century) Islam is at war with the non-Muslim world, by it's own definitions (house of war, house of submission). What I suspect is intended by the use of the word radical are those who by terrorism, genocide or ethnic cleansing make their fundamentalism visible. Many choose not to do so, at least not yet, their beliefs are still radical to the core and totally incompatible with any liberal democracy.

[Seastallion]

I've just realized, there is a logical fallacy in the OP, as there so often is. There is no such thing as radical Islam, all Islam is radical. Fundamentalist (original 7th century) Islam is at war with the non-Muslim world, by it's own definitions (house of war, house of submission). What I suspect is intended by the use of the word radical are those who by terrorism, genocide or ethnic cleansing make their fundamentalism visible. Many choose not to do so, at least not yet, their beliefs are still radical to the core and totally incompatible with any liberal democracy.

Amazing reading of the minds of 1.6 billion people!

You're sweeping all-encompassing generalisation is a few things unsavoury, but most of all it is hateful scaremongering.

[uptheos]

My personal feeling is that Obama understands the threat of ISIS but as his presidential term is winding down he is hoping to keep the conflict in maintenance mode to kick the problem down the road to the next president. He already has enough problems. There is a case for letting the forces there fight it out themselves ... and that whatever the U.S. does it will likely make things worse regardless of intentions.

I'm sure he does, being the Brotherhood's man in the White House, he probably gets a lot of such information.

[wabothai]

Hey you guys, cut the BS.

Thousands of children, women, old and young are slaughtered in barbaric ways. the ones still alive are screaming for help.

Of course we all are at war with these monsters. We "civilised" people have a moral obligation to make sure these attrocities don't happen.and that the guilty ones are punished. Simple as that.

Do I have to remind you of the barbaric nazis?

[pkspeaker]

That's one way of looking at it, but zionism and israel is more similar to the crusades than isis,-that's the way the arabs see it, isis is what it says it is, this throwback to the islamic caliphate. The crusaders brought their families and settled in jerusalem after killing all of it's muslim and jewish inhabitants.. in that era it was the sephardic middle-eastern jews that took refuge in arab lands from the invading european christians. Today you often hear the term 'Judeo-Christian', 'Judeo-Christian' values etc. There was no such thing back then, back then it was the western european (white) chrstians vs. the darker skinned indigenous muslims and jews.

In the zionist era, it is again, mostly european, american, and now russian (caucasian) ashkanazi jews leading the charge, and this time it's the arab-christians in places like bethlaham, Nazareth, east jerusalem that are on the other side of the fence with the muslims, both physical and political-that is.

And i definitely agree with you that western military industrialists thru political pressure groups encourage policies that enflame islamic militancy.

I think if the west is going to rant about islamic extremism then there needs to be a more honest discourse about the nature of the entire monotheistic ideology. Have you seen this movie on youtube zeitgeist? watch it! In the west we need to admit the truth, both Judaism and Christianity were stolen from the ancient Egyptians .. and Islam is simply a derivative of monotheism.

and basic questions like if 'god' created the universe, then WHAT created 'god'? We got a president whos a 'christian' and every member of congress is either a 'christian' or a 'jew' .. we're over there supporting 'moderate' islamic militants in Syria, we support Islamic States like the 'new' iraq and saudi arabia, we support a Jewish State.. There were 2 secular arab nationalist states in the ME, Baathest Iraq & Syria, we destroyed those and support islamic states.

I think its time we told the truth, we don't believe in any of this medieval ballouny, we don't believe there's a liitle magical man in the sky that controls everything and wants us to talk to him everyday..obama doesn't believe it, and most of the memebers of american and european government don't buy it either.. if we just told the truth and stopped trying to push our 'judeo-christian' values on these people then maybe they would show some respect.

Were the Crusades radical Christian terrorism? If I remember my history lessons correctly, the Christians were doing then, much like what Isis is doing now. There are even MOVIES about it! I hate self-serving political propagandizing.

Well ,,, come to think of it .... the billion dollar in profits weapons manufacturers benefit from it.

[cookee68]

They are radical religious scum, that happen to be Muslim, every one should be against them, Even the good Muslim people, say it as it is, stop covering it in cotton wool, I have Muslim friends and they say it the same way as me.

[Steely Dan]

I've just realized, there is a logical fallacy in the OP, as there so often is. There is no such thing as radical Islam, all Islam is radical. Fundamentalist (original 7th century) Islam is at war with the non-Muslim world, by it's own definitions (house of war, house of submission). What I suspect is intended by the use of the word radical are those who by terrorism, genocide or ethnic cleansing make their fundamentalism visible. Many choose not to do so, at least not yet, their beliefs are still radical to the core and totally incompatible with any liberal democracy.

Amazing reading of the minds of 1.6 billion people!

You're sweeping all-encompassing generalisation is a few things unsavoury, but most of all it is hateful scaremongering.

Ah, the old straw man argument I see. Not all 16 quadrillion Muslims take Islam that seriously, but those who follow all its literal directions are following an extreme ideology. You might as well accuse president Erdogan of Turkey of Islamophobia, for he stated there is no such thing as moderate Islam, the term is offensive and insulting. If you study how sharia law manifests itself you are looking directly at how the Quran and Hadiths are interpreted. Of course we are at war with that, and I would suggest any people born Muslim but wanting nothing to do with such barbarity are quietly cheering the opponents of the 'radicals'.

[Ulysses G.]

That's one way of looking at it, but zionism and israel is more similar to the crusades than isis

Similar how? Israel is one tiny country that is not trying to spread their religion or acquire any more territory than the original Mandatory Palestine - the Jewish national home in Palestine promised in the the Balfour Declaration. There is no sane comparison to the Crusades or the savages of ISIS.

Edited February 6, 2015 by Ulysses G.

[Jingthing]

That's one way of looking at it, but zionism and israel is more similar to the crusades than isis

Similar how? Israel is one tiny country that is not trying to spread their religion or acquire any more territory than the original Mandatory Palestine - the Jewish national home in Palestine promised in the the Balfour Declaration. There is no sane comparison to the Crusades of the savages of ISIS.

It's majorly messed up to suggest an Israel - Crusades equivalency ... but I'm so used to hearing the big lie about Nazi-Israel equivalency that it almost comes across as quaint!

[Morch]

Anything to support the notion that Jordan knows how to deal with these people?

They get points for exterminating two Islamic terrorists hours after one on their pilots for burned alive. We will have to wait and see what else they get up to.

Ah well, can't have everything:

Jordan releases jihadi cleric and Isis critic after group’s murder of pilot

Jordan has released an influential jihadi cleric and fierce critic of Isis in the wake of outrage over the group’s brutal killing of the air force pilot who was captured while bombing targets in Syria.

Security sources in Amman confirmed to Reuters that Abu Muhammad al-Maqdisi had been freed from prison – triggering immediate speculation that the intention is to encourage him to speak out against Isis, which now controls large areas of neighbouring Syria and Iraq.

Maqdisi is to be interviewed on the local TV channel, Roya TV, on Friday, the channel said on Thursday night.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/feb/05/jordan-release-jihadi-cleric-al-maqdisi-isis-killing-pilot-al-kasasbeh

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abu_Muhammad_al-Maqdisi

[Ulysses G.]

What is it that the Arabs say? The enemy of my enemy is my friend...

[transam]

Nazis were dealt with.........Took a lot of doing but it was done........ISIS has nothing to do with Muslim stuff, just to to do with the brain dead and trying to control folk in a heinous way..If folk want to be heinous in a world that is trying to move on......Then go meet your imaginary virgins and let us just live our lives.

[canuckamuck]

I would say it is more accurately described as a war of civilizations rather than a religious war.

Islamic civilization VS western civilization, although eastern civilization is getting a taste too.

If both sides were at war over ideology and one faith was pitted against another, that would be a better example of a religious war.

It may also be described as a world war.

[pkspeaker]

w/o making a direct comparison, like comparing the tactics of IS-to me IS's tactics are reminiscent of the vietcong, remember when the vietcong used to go into villages that were supporting the US occupation, take the village head, gather all the villagers to watch, and they would then sadistically rip his intestines out while he was still alive, making his kin watch this painful torturous death, murder a few other people and take their rice and eggs and chickens-bad shit!

I think the point with that is that when you put alot of pressure on these conservative nationalist groups, they will get increasingly nasty-what do these iraqi& syria sunnis got to lose, their cities and towns are devastated from year of bombing and ground assaults.. i think i would be nuts myself after such a prolonged ordeal.. These people will not give up, not then, not now..

Similar is the racial aspect of it, the zionists came mostly from europe, and they are backed by their fellow westerners, the palestinians get support from arab countries and Turkey, Iran, Pakistan. Does a palestinian christian in Nazareth use the term Judeo-Christian? No way, it's always white caucasian christians using that term. the 2 groups see the other race of people as having barbaric 'values', they constantly argue over who is the 'bad' one because of all this murderous barbarism .

Similar in the respect that the zionists came not thinking 'invasion' like the USM in Iraq, and installing a friendly regime, but rather coming to live there and stay there for good, and to take the country 'back'.. That's exactly what the crusaders did, they came to live there, permanently, 'taking it back' it was supposed to still be there even today, they thought a thousand years from then israel/palestine would still be this anglo-european christian country..they thought t would stick, that t would last forever..

ISIS does have some foreign sympathizers going to fight for them, but ultimetly this is still the American led invasion force battling the people they overthrew, w/o constant expensive us military intervention, baghdad will fall like saigon. i dont see any comparison with the crusades there.

That's one way of looking at it, but zionism and israel is more similar to the crusades than isis

Similar how? Israel is one tiny country that is not trying to spread their religion or acquire any more territory than the original Mandatory Palestine - the Jewish national home in Palestine promised in the the Balfour Declaration. There is no sane comparison to the Crusades or the savages of ISIS.

[neverdie]

The following words by Obama are a good description of radical Islam. An example of Obama's description "those who have embraced a nihilistic, violent, almost medieval interpretation of Islam."

http://edition.cnn.com/2015/02/01/politics/obama-radical-islam-terrorism-war/

I am not a follower of US politics, but calls for the current conflict with ISIS (radical Islam) to be defined as a religious war IMO would be a mistake & agree with the points raised in the article below.

http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2015/02/is-america-at-war-with-radical-islam/385200/

I am unclear why NeverSure claims Australia is unable to address issues with Islamic radicalism. The Oz government is making good progress in updating relevant legislation, funding the programs for recently enacted new anti terrorism laws and border control. In addition Oz government is currently militarily engaged in Iraq working in synch with overall US led coalition efforts. I understand the same progress is being made by the UK.

Beleive it or not hysterical people suggesting spraying Muslims with pigs blood, civilians walking the streets of European cities with weapons, throwing pigs head into the grounds of mosques and so on is counter productive.

He's a couple of Roo's short in the top paddock, that's why.

I think he's referring to the fact that an alleged extremist killed two civilians in Sydney late last year, but he seems to be forgetting the thousands of Americans that died at the hands if extremists since 2000.

[Time Traveller]

This is 100% politics. The GOP cannot provide a reasonable solution to the problem. Because there is no solution. The President wants to get a handle on the radical Muslims without antagonizing the other 1 billion moderate Muslims because frankly, we need them. The Republican party is of no help at the moment in trying to solve this problem.

No such thing as a "moderate muslim". This is your lack of cultural understanding and blinded by western political correct idealism. In Arabic, there is no such word as "moderate". The Quran explains there are only believers and non believers.

And you're worried about upsetting "moderates" muslims? Well, they ain't the true muslims. Only those jihadists who live according to the Quran are true muslims.

So YES it indeed is a War against Islam. Except your CNN, MSNBC, Bloomberg leftist media types will censure the truth.

So you believe there is a war against Islam, not radical Islam. I assume this to mean everyone else against Islam. So we're against the Jordanians, Saudis, Malaysians, etc. And this war can only be won if....what happens?

No, I don't but I believe there should be a war against Islam. The reason I say there is not is because the US is now afraid of upsetting those people who identify as muslim but don't undetake violence, so the West has a different strategy. It's also the same reason America got it's a$$ kicked in Iraq.

In War, civilian casualties - yes women and children - are part of the deal. It's to be expected and it's necessary in order to win the war. Unfortunately, the liberals in America believe they have to "win the hearts and minds". But what that does is ensures America will always lose wars if they are worried all the time about civillian deaths.

If the enemy is hiding in civillian homes/hospitals/schools. Sorry to say that but they become legitimate targets. And if non-violent muslims provide shelter for the jihadists, then the "moderates" are also legitimate targets. Clearly the inspiration for the violent jihad against all non-muslims and against those muslims opposed to violence comes from the Quran itself. That is the cause of the problem

[F430murci]

What is the purpose of this OP other than to stir the pot about the US? As an American I don't give a damn what happens to other countries so a good plan would be to stay home and let others rot.

Brilliant plan. Cause the problem, then run away from it.

"Cause the problem"? Are you from this planet"

Some apparently just have a lot of emotional baggage causing a huge chip on their shoulders. Be really cool to hear what happened to some on a personal level living abroad that caused such resentments.

Obama is a strange. I am not sure anyone can figure him out. I sincerely think he is bothered by all of this crazy ME crap and the Ukraine conflict because it takes him away from his real agenda, taking from the rich and giving to the poor.

Candidly, I wished US profited from these stupid conflicts because we are stuck in them. Fact is, they are breaking us and Obama has actually done everything he could to get us out of them, which I respect.

[phrodan]

Oh, another story about the World's Police. Funny how when the big problems arise everyone looks to the USA.

Why isn't the OP about how the wonderful UK isn't defeating "radical Islam" on its own soil, including doing something about the rapes of 1400 children?

Why isn't the OP about how Australia can't handle them on its own soil?

Why is the topic all about a hand-wringing "what's the US going to do about it"? What's the USA's "plan?"

The US has a plan to keep them from dominating the US, so why don't we just let them move on into Europe and take over?

What is the purpose of this OP other than to stir the pot about the US? As an American I don't give a damn what happens to other countries so a good plan would be to stay home and let others rot.

Let me tell you why - and there are plenty of people around the world that will agree with this.

America cannot keep it's nose out of other countries business.

And it's way too fast to get involved in either military invasions, or funding groups it reckons that it's sympathetic with.

And America has an outstanding record of forking that up.

The defeat in Korea.

The defeat in Vietnam.

The defeat in Somalia.

The defeat in Iraq.

The defeat in Afghanistan.

All examples of Uncle Sam charging in and leaving an unholy mess behind.

Added to that it's inability to get Israel under control - while funding their expansionism - goes to the core of American political reality.

You guys are clueless, you are dangerous, and in complete denial of how malevolent your foreign policy has been for decades.

[pkspeaker]

..and most of those thousands of americans died in iraq, after they overthrew iraq's secular government that kept christians and minorities safe and that gave women rights.. they overthrew that government because they said Saddam was a 'brutal dictator' who 'had weapons of mass destruction'-that is chemical weapons , something that any poor underdeveloped country may have..

..and between iraq and syria-whos civil war which was a direct result of the american action in iraq, millions of arabs have died and many more have had their lives destroyed and their countries ruined..+ afghans and pakistanis killed in that other war.. meanwhile the entire western worlds death toll when you include the 9/11 attacks, the terror attacks in europe, all the americans that died in iraq and afghanistan, all the israelis that died fighting with hamas and hezbollah.. whats the total there?10,000? i think 15000 at the top end.. think we worry too much about our people who get killed and not enough about the destruction military interventions inflict on these countries where the hot war is being waged on.

i don't blame the sunnis in iraq for being really pissed off, which at the end of the day is what all this ISIS extremism is.

[phrodan]

This is 100% politics. The GOP cannot provide a reasonable solution to the problem. Because there is no solution. The President wants to get a handle on the radical Muslims without antagonizing the other 1 billion moderate Muslims because frankly, we need them. The Republican party is of no help at the moment in trying to solve this problem.

No such thing as a "moderate muslim". This is your lack of cultural understanding and blinded by western political correct idealism. In Arabic, there is no such word as "moderate". The Quran explains there are only believers and non believers.

And you're worried about upsetting "moderates" muslims? Well, they ain't the true muslims. Only those jihadists who live according to the Quran are true muslims.

So YES it indeed is a War against Islam. Except your CNN, MSNBC, Bloomberg leftist media types will censure the truth.

So you believe there is a war against Islam, not radical Islam. I assume this to mean everyone else against Islam. So we're against the Jordanians, Saudis, Malaysians, etc. And this war can only be won if....what happens?

No, I don't but I believe there should be a war against Islam. The reason I say there is not is because the US is now afraid of upsetting those people who identify as muslim but don't undetake violence, so the West has a different strategy. It's also the same reason America got it's <deleted> kicked in Iraq.

In War, civilian casualties - yes women and children - are part of the deal. It's to be expected and it's necessary in order to win the war. Unfortunately, the liberals in America believe they have to "win the hearts and minds". But what that does is ensures America will always lose wars if they are worried all the time about civillian deaths.

If the enemy is hiding in civillian homes/hospitals/schools. Sorry to say that but they become legitimate targets. And if non-violent muslims provide shelter for the jihadists, then the "moderates" are also legitimate targets. Clearly the inspiration for the violent jihad against all non-muslims and against those muslims opposed to violence comes from the Quran itself. That is the cause of the problem

A war against Islam?

Why?

It's not Islam that's the problem - it's terrorists.

And the last time America invaded a Muslim country it ended up a bloodbath that has run out of control.

I'm going to ask you a serious question.

What makes you think that would not happen again?

[BKKBobby]

The US always declare war on something. Good way to shift the public eyes from problems you dont want to get too much attention. If its war on something abroad its to gain/safeguard geopolitical/economical interests.

Edited February 6, 2015 by BKKBobby

[Ulysses G.]

It's not Islam that's the problem - it's terrorists.

It is terrorists that take Islam literally.

[Credo]

I don't know of any wars or military conflicts don't leave a mess. Accusing the US of making a mess is insane.

[BKKBobby]

I don't know of any wars or military conflicts don't leave a mess. Accusing the US of making a mess is insane.

They just happen to look for international situations that become messy more than most other countries.

[F430murci]

..and most of those thousands of americans died in iraq, after they overthrew iraq's secular government that kept christians and minorities safe and that gave women rights.. they overthrew that government because they said Saddam was a 'brutal dictator' who 'had weapons of mass destruction'-that is chemical weapons , something that any poor underdeveloped country may have..

..and between iraq and syria-whos civil war which was a direct result of the american action in iraq, millions of arabs have died and many more have had their lives destroyed and their countries ruined..+ afghans and pakistanis killed in that other war.. meanwhile the entire western worlds death toll when you include the 9/11 attacks, the terror attacks in europe, all the americans that died in iraq and afghanistan, all the israelis that died fighting with hamas and hezbollah.. whats the total there?10,000? i think 15000 at the top end.. think we worry too much about our people who get killed and not enough about the destruction military interventions inflict on these countries where the hot war is being waged on.

i don't blame the sunnis in iraq for being really pissed off, which at the end of the day is what all this ISIS extremism is.

Yep, silly to think that people win't savagely and brutally rape, kill, behead and burn others if not kept in check by leaders willing to use chemical weapons on them or willing to commit acts of genocide. They are not evil killing evil Westerners. They are going after their own brothers.

One would hope that, given the opportunity, people would try and better themselves, rebuild their country and try to prosper instead of sinking to a new and inexplicable lows. This is what European countries and Japan did after conflicts, but apparently not Muslims who apparently rather be bearded savages running around in bed sheets when left unchecked.

[BKKBobby]

It's not Islam that's the problem - it's terrorists.

It is terrorists that take Islam literally.

What are your opinion about people that consider practising the Torah or the Bible literally. Stoning isnt something that was added in fairy tales version three (the Koran)?

[F430murci]

It's not Islam that's the problem - it's terrorists.

It is terrorists that take Islam literally.

What are your opinion about people that consider practising the Torah or the Bible literally. Stoning isnt something that was added in fairy tales version three (the Koran)?

I candidly don't get all of the bible is bad rhetoric. I struggle with trying to have some type of belief and I sometimes attend church as my wife who, like a good Russian, has a strong belief.

I honestly see the people at our church as being super nice, do gooders and I feel like a heathen compared to them. What I see is inner peace, happiness and prosperity in people that live by religious norms or values. This I suppose is what keeps me searching because I could use some of those positive attributes I see in others.

I don't see hate, unrest, intolerence, ingratitude or any of the negative effects some of you contribute to the bible or religion in the US.

I just see a bunch of happy do gooders that actually causes me some contempt because I am selfish, intolerant and uptight.

[BKKBobby]

It's not Islam that's the problem - it's terrorists.

It is terrorists that take Islam literally.

What are your opinion about people that consider practising the Torah or the Bible literally. Stoning isnt something that was added in fairy tales version three (the Koran)?

I candidly don't get all of the bible is bad rhetoric. I struggle with trying to have some type of belief and I sometimes attend church as my wife who, like a good Russian, has a strong belief.

I honestly see the people at our church as being super nice, do gooders and I feel like a heathen compared to them. What I see is inner peace, happiness and prosperity in people that live by religious norms or values. This I suppose is what keeps me searching because I could use some of those positive attributes I see in others.

I don't see hate, unrest, intolerence, ingratitude or any of the negative effects some of you contribute to the bible or religion in the US.

I just see a bunch of happy do gooders that actually causes me some contempt because I am selfish, intolerant and uptight.

Theres nothing wrong with jews, christians or muslims cause of their religious belonging.

Interpreting the holy book of choice in a way as to incite resentment and violence is wrong.

Interpreting your holy book of choice as it was written once upon a time (literally) and practice it in that way is wrong.

Taking that one step further is what for example ISIS is doing, that is crusading by violence: religious terrorism.

Edited February 6, 2015 by BKKBobby