Improving The Water that comes into our house

[engrin]

Hi everyone,

Hope this is the right forum for this topic.

We live in a small house and get our water from the government. When we first moved in, the pressure was very low so we installed a cistern and a pump. The water goes first to the cistern, accumulates, and is then pumped into the house on demand.

I'd like to improve the quality of the water coming in. Sometimes there is a smell, either due to our water heater for the shower or the water itself. I also have a general feeling on my skin that the water is not as clean as it should be.

I'm wondering is there is an additive we can add to the cistern or some sort of filter we can install in the bathroom. I'm also interested to hear of any other suggestions plus cost involved.

Thanks

Edited May 8, 2015 by engrin

[CharlieH]

MOVED to DIY Housing forum

[bankruatsteve]

Assume you have access to the cistern? You should check regularly for critters that may have fallen in and died - and remove with a net if found. If it's just a smell (versus sediment), you could put a capful of bleach for about 500 liters of water used (several caps to start and depending how big the cistern).

[engrin]

We have access to the cistern. There is sediment in there.

[KhunBENQ]

I assume you use the water for showering, washing and flushing only?

The amount of sediment can be reduced siginificantly even with simple cheap filters.

There are tons of threads on the waterfilter topic (also just recently).

I could point to some if that is of interest for you.

How big is the cistern and how much water do you use on avarage?

Or ortherwise: how long does it take for the water to turnover?

What material is the cistern made of?

[engrin]

We use the water for washing, flushing, and showering.

I'm interested in learning about the filters. Where is the filter placed? In the cistern?

I've attached a photo. I am not sure what it's made of or size. I'm also not sure how long it takes for us to go through the water as it automatically starts filling when the water level drops.

[KhunBENQ]

The water filter is simply put before the inlfux to the cistern.

Such a cistern is about 1600 liters.

For us it would take at least 3 days for turnover.

You should consider to control the filling more or less manually and not filling up to the edge.

Most simple filter at the influx.

10 inch housing (2,5 inch diameter), different types/sizes of housing and cartridges are available.

(10 inch, 20 inch, 30 inch, 40 inch, diameters: 2.5, 4.5)

For your application a small 10/2.5 housing is sufficient.

As a starter to the science of sediment filters see this page of a specialized online shop where I buy my stuff.

Much much cheaper than the extortion at local homestores:

Star Water Filter Co. - Sediment Cartrides

Housings:

http://www.duan-daw.com/category/19/%E0%B8%81%E0%B8%A3%E0%B8%B0%E0%B8%9A%E0%B8%AD%E0%B8%81%E0%B8%81%E0%B8%A3%E0%B8%AD%E0%B8%87%E0%B8%99%E0%B9%89%E0%B8%B3-housing

In the picture you see a 5 micron cartridge after about 3 days of use

New cartridges are white

I just changed to washable cartridges (more expensive, not yet sure whether it pays).

Depending on how bad the water is, it might be useful to put two filters in a row.

One with a 20 micron cartridge followed by one with 5 micron.

The black thingy is a handle to open/close the housing.

Edited May 8, 2015 by KhunBENQ

[engrin]

Thanks KhunBENQ! Excellent information. I'm going make an order soon!

[bankruatsteve]

The filters won't help for the sediment already in the jar, so a good cleaning would be in order before you do that. Put a cap of bleach in every day and you should be good.

[Jeffrey346]

I would get rid of the cistern and put a anti bacterial anti mold water tank in. The top of the tank screws shut and no chance of dirt insects etc getting into your water supply.

HomePro has then on sale. You can get a quality tank for less than 5,000B

[NormanW]

I've been using a larger filter pictured for 8 years which is filled with ancient crustations which knock out the large stuff. Your water is basically river water and so needs intervention from you to at the very least give it a basic clean.

If you require drinking quality water then you need to add UV and reverse osmosis after the basic filter which obviously adds cost.

Hope this helps.

[robertson468]

I would get rid of the cistern and put a anti bacterial anti mold water tank in. The top of the tank screws shut and no chance of dirt insects etc getting into your water supply.

HomePro has then on sale. You can get a quality tank for less than 5,000B

Would recommend you get a 2,000 liter tank because if the local authority is unable to supply water (drought) you can get water brought in on a little pick-up with a tank on it. This will fill your tank, but regardless if you have a smaller tank or 2,000 liters, the driver will charge you for 2,000 liters, in my experience.

[peter267]

A filter system needs to be specified specifically for the water it is to treat - so water needs to be analised first and then a effective water treatment method proposed to deal with whatever needs fixing. For basic I go with suggestion above adding bleach/chlorine - could get a swimming pool tester to see you achieve a dosage of say 10ppm (parts per million) This makes water safe to drink. More basically if you can just detect (nose in glass) smell of chlorine in a glass of water its high enough dose.

If you can, as others suggest above, control tank fill manually - let it fill from near empty/ half full - then treat with a bleach hit. Left to stand the bleach/chlorine will evaporate off taking smell away still leaving water disinfected. A fish tank bubbler would oxygenate and accelerate chlorine evaporation

[callaway]

Get rid of that clay pot and put in a poly tank. Put in an inline filter to remove sediment then water should be ok. As stated before, you need to buy the tank with the screw cap to seal. I have installed a float valve shut off on the inlet side so when the tank is full it shuts off the main water feen to the tank. Works great. And pressure pump attached to the outlet side pumping to the house.

[khunPer]

If you use the filter-house showed in post #7 by khunBENQ, you can choose a ceramic filter instead, which is 0.3 micron and will also remove small sediments, even some color, and larger bacteria. The ceramic filter is easy to clean with a soft sponge and water – you can see when it’s dirty – and can with good care last for a year or longer. A ceramic filter costs around 450-500 baht, and may be cheaper in long term than using 5-micron fiber filters. When you clean the filter you add a little hydrogen peroxide to kill any build-up of bacteria, and that also oxidize the water – use 35 percent food-grade hydrogen peroxide, which you can bay in many pharmacies for around 225 baht a liter; but be aware that undiluted it’s very corrosive, so don’t get it on your skin. Hydrogen peroxide is harmless, natural, and recently a demand in many Western water plants, where it’s added to tap water in a light dilution – it’s also hydrogen peroxide cleaning the water in the Space Station.

You can use a second filter after your pressure pump, before the water is distributed into your house, to remove any particles coming from storage tank.

To keep the water fresh and removing smell in the storage tank you can use a small aquarium pump (costs about 200 baht), pumping air into the water to oxidize it – if you don’t want it to run all the time, you can control it with a simple mechanical timer – that’s the principle with the so-called water-steps in a water plant, some use air pumps, and newer water plants simply add little hydrogen peroxide instead, saving the power for pumps.

Another possibility is a small circulation pump in the storage tank, circulating the water through a 0.3-micron ceramic filter, to remove any build-up of dirt in the stored water; also that can be timer-controlled, so it’s not running all time.

Seems like you have a stoneware or ceramic (clay) water tank, which is good for keeping water cool in a natural way. I’m no expert, but you may check on using a fiberglass or steel tank instead, as that might be easier to keep clean from dirt and build-up of algae and fungus that can stick to the ceramic surface.

I myself use inlet filter(s) – have water coming from a well, so I also have a sand filter and a second ceramic – air pump and circulation pump with filter and UV-light in a fiberglass storage tank. Normally I need to clean inlet filter once a week – but you can see when filter(s) get dirty, using the clear housing – and I add around 10 centiliter (about a small cup) of food-grade hydrogen peroxide, when cleaning filters.

Edited May 8, 2015 by khunPer

[dotpoom]

My Government (Pa-Pa) water pipe is connected to my pump that pumps the water directly into the house, no cistern. We do have a pipe coming off the pump that can fill two storage tanks whenever we need to...... for back up

[jacko45k]

A filter on the incoming line before the tank will keep the water cleaner.

My water isn't too bad so I have one only at the washing machine.

Obviously change/clean the filters as required.

Check inside the tank for cleanliness...... it should be drained and cleaned once a year or as required.

Fit a proper top to it, you have to stop geckos/ cockroaches getting in.

Consider adding a small amount of chlorine ....obtained from swimming pool suppliers.

If you really get into it, you could buy a testing kit and maintain about 1ppm of free chlorine.

If you plan on drinking the same water, install proper filters/UV in the kitchen... personally I prefer to buy large bottles and never use mains water in food preparation.

Edited May 8, 2015 by jacko45k

[mike324]

Install a RO water filer, good water quality and no more water residue, easy to clean up too!

[Crossy]

My Government (Pa-Pa) water pipe is connected to my pump that pumps the water directly into the house, no cistern. We do have a pipe coming off the pump that can fill two storage tanks whenever we need to...... for back up

You do realise this is illegal do you not??

Also, there is a danger of you sucking the contents of your neighbour's fish pond into the mains supply if he's left the hose under the water surface whilst filling.

[Sheryl]

Are you also getting discolored stains (reddish brown) in sinks, toilets etc? As if so would suggest iron and/or manganese in the water, which a sediment filter alone will not take care of (though it will help).

If not, agree with recs to (1) get a proper water tank with tight lid and (2) add an inline sediment or ceramic filter.

The water tank you have is not tightly covered, and easy for insects, snails, snail sludge etc to make its way in, all of which will give a bad smell.

[sappersrest]

My Government (Pa-Pa) water pipe is connected to my pump that pumps the water directly into the house, no cistern. We do have a pipe coming off the pump that can fill two storage tanks whenever we need to...... for back up

You do realise this is illegal do you not??

Also, there is a danger of you sucking the contents of your neighbour's fish pond into the mains supply if he's left the hose under the water surface whilst filling.

Not only this is illegal it is downright un neighbourly, you are basically increasing your own water pressure to the detriment of others especially at times of high demand ok if you have good pressure sod the neighbours, and as Crossy says it is not very good health wise as you can in some events contaminate the water pipes down stream of your self and also put your neighbours health at risk.

[sappersrest]

A filter system needs to be specified specifically for the water it is to treat - so water needs to be analised first and then a effective water treatment method proposed to deal with whatever needs fixing. For basic I go with suggestion above adding bleach/chlorine - could get a swimming pool tester to see you achieve a dosage of say 10ppm (parts per million) This makes water safe to drink. More basically if you can just detect (nose in glass) smell of chlorine in a glass of water its high enough dose.

If you can, as others suggest above, control tank fill manually - let it fill from near empty/ half full - then treat with a bleach hit. Left to stand the bleach/chlorine will evaporate off taking smell away still leaving water disinfected. A fish tank bubbler would oxygenate and accelerate chlorine evaporation

Would you swim in a pool that had 10ppm of chlorine? So why drink it 10pppm is fine for disinfecting the tank but you should then bring it back down to max 1ppm, either by dilution or adding the appropriate amount of sodium thiosulphate .

[sandyf]

Seems like you have a stoneware or ceramic (clay) water tank, which is good for keeping water cool in a natural way. I’m no expert, but you may check on using a fiberglass or steel tank instead, as that might be easier to keep clean from dirt and build-up of algae and fungus that can stick to the ceramic surface.

You do not get algae in that type of tank. We have 15 of those tanks around the property and some are at least 10 years old and there has never been any sign of algae. Wish I could say the same for the poly tank.

We do not have mains water so I always keep about 8K litres on hand, I have a 4K poly tank and 3 concrete tanks as the OP.

The main problem with the concrete tank is sealing, but this can be done with a length of the clear plastic tubing made into an 'O' ring and put your lid on that.

The other problem with the older concrete tanks is that they may only have a 1/2 inch outlet. The ones we have on the house were bought as a batch from the factory and we had 1 inch outlets fitted.

[engrin]

So we bought a housing (with filter) similar to the one mentioned KHUNBENQ and it worked a treat. I decided to replace it after a couple of weeks and now there is sediment in the bathroom and it is getting worse not better. I've either installed the new filter wrong or I bought the wrong one comepletely because when I opened it, the outside of the filter was covered in grimy dark sludge. In addition, there is a plastic piece that came with the housing that looks like a small cylinder with holes in it which I have no idea where it should be place?

So my questions are

1. Where does the plastic cylinder with holds go ?

2. What micron number is best ? a low number or high?

Thanks

[Crossy]

Compare the new element with the one you took out, they should be the same length and diameter.

I have no idea where the cylinder with holes goes, because ours doesn't have one. Perhaps a photo of the mysterious cylinder will help us determine where it goes.

Put the old element back in and see if the sediment improves.

The smaller micron number, the smaller the holes in the filter, so it's a better filter but it will clog more rapidly.

[engrin]

Here is a photo of the plastic piece

[Crossy]

Lord knows, perhaps a trip to the place you got the filter is indicated

Does the filter element itself fit well in the housing?

Gunge getting past it suggests there's a water path bypassing the filter, maybe that plastic bit blanks it off, but to be honest I have no idea

Anyone?

[Isan Farang]

Here is a photo of the plastic piece

That item shown looks a inlet strainer, never seen that part when obtaining a replacement element.

On my system for the drinking water I have two of these filters prior to the water going to my RO Unit, you also need to keep these filters out of direct sunlight.

These replacement elements are a standard size so very difficult to get them mixed up. If not sure just bring the old one to the filter shop or measure and order online.

[engrin]

The plastic piece was left over after the guys installed the tank and filter housing so I guess it is possible that it belongs to the tank.

Unfortunately I tossed the old filter. I had a closer look and it appears the water is supposed to go from the outside of the filter to the inside, and then out to the tank. Is that correct?

[Crossy]

Yes, water goes in through the outside of the filter, where all the goop ends up.

There's a flow direction arrow on the housing to show the correct direction.