Koh Tao: Trial opens for 2 accused of killing British tourists

[steffi]

Is this latest announcement simply saying there is no more DNA evidence that can be tested and we have to stick to the results from previous tests?

[a99az]

Crucial DNA evidence in the case of the murder of two British backpackers cannot be retested because it no longer exists,

Did it ever exist in the first place?

How can one lose the most key piece of evidence? And without it, what case does the prosecution have?

So now the defence ask for the case to be thrown out due to lack of evidence. Next.

[loonodingle]

Guys and Girls...

Thursday 30 April 2015 11.58 BST

Thailand orders DNA in British backpacker murders to be verified

Court says evidence must be independently examined after claims of tainted crime scene and Burmese suspects being tortured

A court in Thailand has ordered that DNA and other physical evidence allegedly linking Burmese migrant workers to the murder of two British backpackers should be independently checked, a move the suspects’ lawyers said could help ensure a fair trial.

APRIL WAS THE ORDER AND THEY DIDNT HAND IT OVER

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/apr/30/thailand-dna-british-backpacker-murders-burmese-suspects

[a99az]

Crucial DNA evidence in the case of the murder of two British backpackers cannot be retested because it no longer exists,

Did it ever exist in the first place?

How can one lose the most key piece of evidence? And without it, what case does the prosecution have?

None?

[GOLDBUGGY]

Just a thought, if the DNA isn't a match, I wonder who's DNA might have been found in Hannah.

Do you (jdinasia) think it should be retested against those who have already been tested ? Maybe a certain someone could head to Britain and do a test in front of the T.V. cameras.

If you're asking jdinasia or AleG, they would say 'No' ...new testing of DNA should not be done which compares Nomsod's or Mon's DNA (or any other of the Headman's peoples' DNA) against the DNA found in/on Hannah. They would say something like, "No, they're not the defendants, they've already been cleared. Forget about them. Don't even mention their names. They're cleared now and foreever, you got that?!"

Do you mean with also the Alibi of Nomsod, in which he is captured on CCTV in his Bangkok Residence at the University on both the day before and the day of the murders?

Or does your Grand Conspiracy Theory also include the Security at the University Campus, plus all the University Students who say Nomsod was in class at the Bangkok University and writing an exam on the morning of September 15th, and day of the murders?

DNA Testing is expensive and also very time consuming. I am sure they are backlogged in Thailand for other crimes, and just like they are where you live. So you can add me to the list that would say No, as with an Alibi like this, you are just wasting time and tax payers money. Especially when you already have a match from the 2 accused.

My friend you do speak some serious pap, in many posts you make to do with this case it seems. Not sure what your agenda is?

There are reports that Nomsod was on KT that night, along with some of his privileged pals, hanging out in his uncles bar. There were students in his class that said he was missing. The Uni cctv 'snapshot' that shows him on uni property the NEXT day had a lot of doubts about its authenticity, and even if authentic it in no way proves that he was not on KT the previous night. (Out of interest is this cctv snapshot from the next day the 'iron clad alibi' that you refer to? If so can you explain how that is 'iron clad'?)

The confrontation between Hannah / David and some locals in the AC bar seems to be neatly forgotten. No cctv has ever been forthcoming from the AC bar I believe? That's pretty handy if our chum was there. Also jokes (or maybe not jokes?) the next day or two between Nomsod and one or two of his chums about the killings on Facebook (in Thai). One of these people was a girl who, like Nomsod, regularly visits KT (another very privileged offspring) and these 2 in particular chatted and joked about the killings. I must dig up her name. The way they talked made me wonder if she might have been on KT that weekend too. In fact to be honest it made me wonder if they were both involved. I'd also be interested to know more about the AC bar DJs and the large fella who posed with a ho as he cropped up in some facebook friends lists also.

Despite numerous cameras on the wee strip there seemed to be a total lack of cctv available/provided of the night in question apart from a few seconds of edited stuff from a single camera. Surely just a few hours of uninterrupted cctv from a few of the best positioned cameras would have helped this case possibly, rather than the tiny bit released that, surprise surprise, just served to confuse and muddy waters even more. Now who can control all this stuff on the ground?

1. Village headman (or relatives)

2. RTP

3. No-one else

Why was Mon and his dodgy copper pal threatening to pin it on and hang Sean McCanna to tidy up if they had nothing on him?

I'll grant you one point for your observation about the condom a few pages back, but, if correct, that to me just backs up the fact that there was a very personal motive behind this attack IMO. The B2 just do not fit. Some others fit much better. I'm not saying Mon was the main perp (or even involved in the initial crimes) but his alleged 'dna test' was apparently done and dusted in 8 hours seemingly without anything even leaving the island yet days later the Bangkok lab themselves said it takes an absolute minimum of 24 hours to do the tests. So I call BS on that particular 'test'. Was Mon hiding something, or maybe his dna might have been uncomfortably close to one of the guilty parties?

I think the only thing that is guaranteed is that the real perps will never get done for this. I do think that there is a lot more knowledge on the island than is being shared, so possibly the truth will out in the long run but will never be 'cast iron'. If people living there think that is paradise then so be it. Funny idea of paradise though - being shit scared of your life if you don't toe the killer mafia line. You can keep that thanks.

There is reports that say Elvis Presley is still alive, and some people even reported that they were taken by Aliens, and held for days on their space ship. So what does that really mean when "some people reported" this? Especially when they can't be identified, and won't come forward to make a Sworn Statement. Is it then not just "Gossip?". Or Rumor? Better to start your statement with " Rumor has it", or "The talk of the Town", then by trying to state it as a fact, when it is not, and has not proven.

All I know for sure was that Nomsad was DNA tested in front of a crowd of people and he had document proof he had written an exam on the day in question, and has footage of him at his residence the day before and the day of the murders. That, in my view is enough to let him go. But if you think different, then up to you. .

[GOLDBUGGY]

Great to see that the people are starting to see what some what some posters are really like and ignoring them is the best medicine for them .

Yes, I could have responded, but what's the mileage in having a meaningless debate argument. Now the Brits are helping the defence, and if independent testing of DNA is permitted, I'm hopeful the prosecution's case will founder on the rocks of truthful disclosure.

..........and if it doesn't and it confirms that they were the killers/rapists!!

I notice that it seems to be the junta groupies on here who are rooting for the Myanmar two to be found guilty. Their blinkered views on anything and everything that could reflect badly on the junta really grips me. Big time!

I don't think there is one person here who wants to see 2 innocent men put to their death. I also think there is not one person here who doesn't want to see a fair and transparent trial, and justice served. If you think that way, then it is you who has the Blinkers on.

[ttthailand]

Another few hours and we start again. Will the police find the DNA or more evidence ? Will they declare a mistrial? Will someone come forward with new information ? It is like a Thai soap but this is real and it saddens me that real people are having to suffer through this. God please give these parents the strength to care on.

[catman20]

poor lamps to the slaughter , life can be so cruel if ur in the wrong place at the wrong time

Edited July 9, 2015 by catman20

[loonodingle]

poor lamps to the slaughter , life can be so cruel if ur in the wrong place at the wrong time

Lambs....

And just remember Hannah and Davids Parents are having to sit through this. They know whats been said and had assurances from the UK Gov that alls well.

What are they thinking now after travelling 6000 odd miles to see justice for their children to be confronted by what we all know is a sham.

What on earth are they feeling sat in their hotel rooms... God only knows.

Then there's the 2 accused parents. One has died while his son is in custody. A terrible chain of events... So extremely sad for all concerned let alone us voyeurs.

[JLCrab]

If the local hoodlums want to put a damper on the media reporting, instead of threatening some poor Thai girl translator, why don;t they just arrange for the SKY News reporter to have an unfortunate traffic accident on the way back to his hotel. We all know how dangerous are those roads on Koh Samui.

You are really losing the plot here. Can you dig up some movie examples of people losing the plot?

Yes.

[bunglebag]

If you haven't noticed by now, the Prosecution has strong case against them. It wasn't me who said that first.So lets see how this all unfolds in Court. It has only been 2 days. Two pages doth not makest a Book!

We must be looking at two different cases! The prosecution does not seem to have anything strong

[ttthailand]

I wonder where all the people who were suspects are now ? Wonder what the true killers are thinking ? Are they worried that this will be a mistrial and they might be back in the spotlight ?

[Traveller45]

What a load of BS this is. All these two have done is sign something made up and written by the same human rights lawyer!! This should be dismissed as being 'evidence of their retraction'.

They didn't retract their statements it was done for them.

Perhaps your post is a load of B.S. unless you have proof of what you are saying

I'm no hand writing expert but you don't need to be to see that both letters are written by the same person. Simply look at the dates on both letters and they are identical in every way, as are the loops and style (I used a magnifying glass). I had to laugh when I see the torn out scraps of paper with one sentence scribbled out to make it appear genuine!!.

I don't think it is written in the Myanmar language either and are their signatures for real?

What I would do if I was the prosecutor is ask them to sign a piece of paper - I doubt that they (signatures) would look anything like what's written on the paper.

It is obvious to me that they did it.

Isn't it borderline possible that one of the two knows to read and write better than the other, and did them both, or indeed a third person wrote it for them? What's wrong with that?

[sambum]

Guys and Girls...

Thursday 30 April 2015 11.58 BST

Thailand orders DNA in British backpacker murders to be verified

Court says evidence must be independently examined after claims of tainted crime scene and Burmese suspects being tortured

A court in Thailand has ordered that DNA and other physical evidence allegedly linking Burmese migrant workers to the murder of two British backpackers should be independently checked, a move the suspects lawyers said could help ensure a fair trial.

APRIL WAS THE ORDER AND THEY DIDNT HAND IT OVER

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/apr/30/thailand-dna-british-backpacker-murders-burmese-suspects

Yes, and very shortly afterwards they changed their minds, and said that the "court" would decide on the first day of the trial if the defence team would be able to have the evidence independently checked. Lo and behold, on Day 2 of the trial, it goes "missing",may be "lost", it is "all used up", "it is in Bangkok" etc. etc. Stinks doesn't it?

Edited July 9, 2015 by sambum

[berybert]

Guys and Girls...

Thursday 30 April 2015 11.58 BST

Thailand orders DNA in British backpacker murders to be verified

Court says evidence must be independently examined after claims of tainted crime scene and Burmese suspects being tortured

A court in Thailand has ordered that DNA and other physical evidence allegedly linking Burmese migrant workers to the murder of two British backpackers should be independently checked, a move the suspects lawyers said could help ensure a fair trial.

APRIL WAS THE ORDER AND THEY DIDNT HAND IT OVER

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/apr/30/thailand-dna-british-backpacker-murders-burmese-suspects

Yes, and very shortly afterwards they changed their minds, and said that the "court" would decide on the first day of the trial if the defence team would be able to have the evidence independently checked. Lo and behold, on Day 2 of the trial, it goes "missing",may be "lost", it is "all used up", "it is in Bangkok" etc. etc. Stinks doesn't it?

Are you in any way surprised ? They couldn't let the DNA be retested because it never existed as they claim. Sure there was DNA found it Hannah's body but it has nothing to do with the two on trial.

The serious RTP lovers seems to have taken a distant back seat now and have very little to say for themselves, after 2 days their beloved RTP have fallen apart.

They seem to have left a certain someone in charge who is as inept as the RTP as their spokesman on here.

Now we know why the case was kicked back 3 or 4 times. It must be a lonely life for those that believed the RTP story, that poor little brain cell kicking about on its own all day long. Tho to be far to some I don't believe they believed what they were saying. They just have an agenda that needed to be followed. Forget two people dying if it was going to upset the gravy train. Despicable really, but its the world we live in today.

I wonder if both sets of parents still feel the RTP have a strong case against the accused.

The case has shown not only what a cesspit Thailand can be, but also how so called intelligent people can stoop as low as they have.

Edited July 9, 2015 by berybert

[GOLDBUGGY]

Well this LINK says 20 Billion to 1 chance of DNA being the same, unless it is a twin. So since there isn't 20 Billion People on Earth yet, this would mean no 2 DNA;s are Identical.

https://whereismydata.wordpress.com/2008/07/03/dna-errors/

I don't know who to believe. Do you? But 1 in 7,000 sure seems very small to me. If that were true I don't know how they could even use this as evidence.

How many people would have the same DNA in just New York City alone. My estimate is about 1190 people. I would think it would be pretty difficult getting a conviction base on DNA and other evidence, if 1,200 people in the same city were walking around with the same DNA.

[GOLDBUGGY]

No 2 DNA's Match! Not Now! Not Ever!

Identical twins and Siamese twins match.

Identical Twins are very close. Siamese Twins? I never really thought about that, but in this case I would have to agree. I would also agree that it must be nice to get 2 Pension Checks as a Siamese Twin.

So I will retract my statement and say this instead. "No 2 DNA's match any other person, unless you have 2 heads or more".

[GOLDBUGGY]

I would like to know how the first policeman in the scene was able to say both bodies where almost naked, when it is clear Hannah was almost fully clothed.

These people have no problem telling lies even when the truth is staring them right in the face.

Did he show a picture of Hannah's broken body which was dressed and told people "look she is virtually naked"?

According to all the press reports/photos/videos on Thai television from the crime scene before the trial started, David was totally naked so I find the testimony of this police witness rather odd, to say the least. On the other hand Hannah was found partially clothed, i.e. she was still wearing her top and skirt.

David was found naked. Hannah had her top lowered below her breast line, thus exposing her breast, and her skirt was raise well above her waist, exposing her nude body under that. How would you explain the bodies if you found them and didn't want to give out too much detail?

Have you no shame ?

It is a murder trial, why would you not want to give out to much detail.

You are the biggest lunch box I have yet to come across on TV.

It was already mentioned at the Murder Trial today. Did you not read that here?

There is no shame in talking the truth. The shame lies in the people who did this terrible crime. But if you find it offensive reading about a brutal murder and the evidence, may I then suggest you go someplace else.

[englishoak]

There is no matching DNA other than in falsified police reports, its been lost purely due to the UK police findings of thier own DNA testing differing..... watch

A: Case collapse & minor face loss VS B: debarcle and possibly major media circus time again.............. youd think option A but TIT

Right now id like to see the whole thing exposed and everyone in on it implicated chased around by vicious tabloid media circus.

probably not.............

[GOLDBUGGY]

You could not be my dog. My dog has a much higher IQ then you, is nowhere near as naive but, a little like you, he does obey his master, always and without question!

Does that sound a little like you? RTP shill?

Your naivete was funny at first but now, after many, many unintelligent posts from you, you are simply a dull bore.

Insulting is a waste of everyone's time. Better to ignore.

Can't come up with any proof so now you throw out insults to me.

Well, this does match you personality.

If you haven't noticed by now, the Prosecution has strong case against them. It wasn't me who said that first.So lets see how this all unfolds in Court. It has only been 2 days. Two pages doth not makest a Book!

Seems like you're the last person on this forum that still believes in the RTP. The prosecution (and the RTP) does not have a strong case and never had. That's why it was thrown back so many times.

And if you're trying to exhibit some intelligence, it's maketh, not makest (and I'm not even a native English speaker....).

As I have said many times here, it does not matter what I think. What matters here is what the Judges think. The Defenses will have there chance to bring forth their evidence and witnesses. I will watch and listen closely. But no matter what happens here I am entitled to my own opinion.

What I find so strange here, is that all of these people who are screaming for a Fair Trial, and Justice, are also almost all the same people who are telling me to shut-up, to go away, and keep my opinion to myself. If you don't agree with me fine. I could care less. So don't lose any sleep over me either.

[Tanlic]

Another BS headline from the media to get peoples backs up. There's a huge difference between being used up and being lost.

The guy said it was used up and for that reason it was lost.

The media grab the word LOST and jam it down people throats and get everyone crying frame up again......They have no interest in justice their only interest is selling papers

[IslandLover]

quote: It is absolutely unbelievable, even by the Bib's lowly standards. Everything rests on the DNA evidence which seems to be the only evidence they have (no witnesses to the crime, very circumstantial evidence at best of David's phone found "near" the B2's residence). And now, they don't have this DNA evidence anymore??!!

And yet...... some posters still insist that the police have a rock solid case. I mean, how blind / blinkered / naive / gullible can one be? Even a poor Isaan rice farmer would be able to see it for the farce it is.

I suggest it is more a face savings exercise. They would prefer to be regarded as incompetent than being exposed as providing conflicting/contestable evidence. Which had seemed more and more likely. I would like to hope that at some point the judges would say 'enough is enough' and abandon the trial.

BINGO!!! Incompetent is easier to face than Bold Face Lies. Lose a little face, but if it's kinda like a mistrial,

then it's OVER--- a happy ending for the two boys(after all that time in jail for nothing!), nothing happens to any of the Authorities, the PM will abide in what the Court decides, no more proof of any wrongdoing will come to the surface. The English parents get no resolve or closure-- I'm pissed about that!

LOS is going down-- quickly!

Even with police buffoonery like this on the stand and no credible or verifiable evidence the Samui court is quite likely to convict. The police forensic colonel will testify he saw DNA matches before disposing of the samples and judge can say he sees no reason why the police should lie, so an independent analysis would have made no difference.

I sincerely hope you're wrong ....

[GOLDBUGGY]

If you haven't noticed by now, the Prosecution has strong case against them. It wasn't me who said that first.So lets see how this all unfolds in Court. It has only been 2 days. Two pages doth not makest a Book!

We must be looking at two different cases! The prosecution does not seem to have anything strong

Ha!Ha!Ha!

[berybert]

Can't come up with any proof so now you throw out insults to me.

Well, this does match you personality.

If you haven't noticed by now, the Prosecution has strong case against them. It wasn't me who said that first.So lets see how this all unfolds in Court. It has only been 2 days. Two pages doth not makest a Book!

Seems like you're the last person on this forum that still believes in the RTP. The prosecution (and the RTP) does not have a strong case and never had. That's why it was thrown back so many times.

And if you're trying to exhibit some intelligence, it's maketh, not makest (and I'm not even a native English speaker....).

As I have said many times here, it does not matter what I think. What matters here is what the Judges think. The Defenses will have there chance to bring forth their evidence and witnesses. I will watch and listen closely. But no matter what happens here I am entitled to my own opinion.

What I find so strange here, is that all of these people who are screaming for a Fair Trial, and Justice, are also almost all the same people who are telling me to shut-up, to go away, and keep my opinion to myself. If you don't agree with me fine. I could care less. So don't lose any sleep over me either.

And your reply to me just a few minutes ago was ?????????????? Oh yes .......................

*********************It was already mentioned at the Murder Trial today. Did you not read that here?

There is no shame in talking the truth. The shame lies in the people who did this terrible crime. But if you find it offensive reading about a brutal murder and the evidence, may I then suggest you go someplace else.*********

Who would have thought you could contradict yourself so quickly.

[cdnvic]

Those of you who keep trying to make this a personal argument between you are going to get removed from the forum soon. We're getting tired of removing your juvenile pot shots at each other. If you can't discuss the story without insulting each other please go somewhere else.

[GOLDBUGGY]

Can't come up with any proof so now you throw out insults to me.

Well, this does match you personality.

If you haven't noticed by now, the Prosecution has strong case against them. It wasn't me who said that first.So lets see how this all unfolds in Court. It has only been 2 days. Two pages doth not makest a Book!

Seems like you're the last person on this forum that still believes in the RTP. The prosecution (and the RTP) does not have a strong case and never had. That's why it was thrown back so many times.

And if you're trying to exhibit some intelligence, it's maketh, not makest (and I'm not even a native English speaker....).

As I have said many times here, it does not matter what I think. What matters here is what the Judges think. The Defenses will have there chance to bring forth their evidence and witnesses. I will watch and listen closely. But no matter what happens here I am entitled to my own opinion.

What I find so strange here, is that all of these people who are screaming for a Fair Trial, and Justice, are also almost all the same people who are telling me to shut-up, to go away, and keep my opinion to myself. If you don't agree with me fine. I could care less. So don't lose any sleep over me either.

And your reply to me just a few minutes ago was ?????????????? Oh yes .......................

*********************It was already mentioned at the Murder Trial today. Did you not read that here?

There is no shame in talking the truth. The shame lies in the people who did this terrible crime. But if you find it offensive reading about a brutal murder and the evidence, may I then suggest you go someplace else.*********

Who would have thought you could contradict yourself so quickly.

It has been posted in another media page. If you do not have the intelligence to look for it and find it, then that is your problem. As I said, I don't give a Rat's...whether you believe me or not.

[Luang]

If you think the opinion of a Thai judge is more important than the truth then .......

[alfalfa19]

I don't believe that any crucial evidence, including dna, was lost. I believe that any evidence which contradicts the case of the powers that be was simply thrown away. I feel that it's kind of kind of missing the point to criticize the authorities for their carelessness, when the real problem is much worse.

[Fireyfish]

Crucial DNA evidence in the case of the murder of two British backpackers cannot be retested because it no longer exists,

Did it ever exist in the first place?

How can one lose the most key piece of evidence? And without it, what case does the prosecution have?

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

[lvr181]

Some "face saving" going on?