Koh Tao: Trial opens for 2 accused of killing British tourists

[bunglebag]

thanks TC

[Sviss Geez]

What numty ever thought of putting the two words Thailand and justice in the same sentence.

Ironically, you did.

[fayou]

Just to throw into the mix: When asked his views Sean MCMystery said words to the effect :

"Check which 3 people did not come to work at the *** bar the next day."

It was at this time there was much speculation about 2 bouncers at this bar, one referred to as 'shark tooth ring.'

Reports stated that they both left the island that day.

Very little has been said about them since.

Just a reminder.

Where are they now I wonder?

Shark tooth man returned after the B2 were arrested, he's also got form, been accused of rape before by a HiSo Thai model, cant post that as its in Thai

Who is shark tooth guy? Chappie who posed with the hoe? or someone else?

Shark tooth man, different to the hoe guy

and this is the hoe guy. Aon Kohtao ( Facebook name )

[ukrules]

I would have thought cellphone tower records would indicate the location of both victims phones in the time leading up to the attack.

[Sviss Geez]

Do you mind stating why you believe b2 are guilty? I can't think of anything other than their proximity to the beach that indicates the young boys are rapists and killers. This attack was a personal attack and it seems it also wasn't the killers first rodeo.

There are no "young boys" involved in this case, there are 2 adult Burmese men though.

[bunglebag]

Who is shark tooth guy? Chappie who posed with the hoe? or someone else?

Shark tooth man, different to the hoe guy

and this is the hoe guy. Aon Kohtao ( Facebook name )Aon-Koh-Tao.jpg

yes, and here also?

http://thumbsnap.com/2CuV8BPp

[Sviss Geez]

I have to agree with you , unfortunately this case has become more unclear thanks to all the posters in here and just too many theories thats been running on social media since day 1 .

It's difficult to separate the real facts from gossip , just look at every thread started on Thaivisa and most of it does not make much sense,

Bear in mind that there are no facts on this subject on Thaivisa because no-one here is involved in the investigation. Everything is unfounded speculation based on rumours, nothing more.

[catsanddogs]

I have to agree with you , unfortunately this case has become more unclear thanks to all the posters in here and just too many theories thats been running on social media since day 1 .

It's difficult to separate the real facts from gossip , just look at every thread started on Thaivisa and most of it does not make much sense,

Bear in mind that there are no facts on this subject on Thaivisa because no-one here is involved in the investigation. Everything is unfounded speculation based on rumours, nothing more.

Similar to the RTP then despite their 'investigation' and 'perfect job'.

[Sviss Geez]

Tempers are fraying and speculation regarding these murders is becoming a little too graphic in description.

Should we not consider that the families of the victims are already trauimatised by viewing the photos in court without TV posters

continually reminding them of the details?

Whether we are willing to admit it or not, there ARE some really good policemen in Thailand who care about policing properly, this case

involves those with more "influence" than the regular policeman.

Thailand is also still a beautiful country and as a long time resident I too can say that I have never had any serious problems here, and I get around a bit.

Its not fair to tar the whole of Thailand for something that happened in a small island run by so called mafia.

"Should we not consider that the families of the victims are already trauimatised by viewing the photos in court without TV posters

continually reminding them of the details?"

There is next to no chance that the families follow the twisted, regurgitated nonsense that is posted here, don't worry about that aspect. Why would they?

[Just1Voice]

Do you mind stating why you believe b2 are guilty? I can't think of anything other than their proximity to the beach that indicates the young boys are rapists and killers. This attack was a personal attack and it seems it also wasn't the killers first rodeo.

There are no "young boys" involved in this case, there are 2 adult Burmese men though.

Ohhhh, I don't know. At my age, anyone under 35 is a "young boy". lol

[smedly]

and just announced by a top cop that high ranking police are above the law, a good indication of the mentality in this very 3rd world country, quite shocking

is there a Thai word for "professional" ? I think not - maybe it's a sentence "do you know who I am"

[sambum]

"The answer is simple - chain of command, the PM lifts the phone and talks with the Chief of Police, he tells him I need this sorted asap as I am being pressured directly by the British PM, the Chief of police reviews the case and sends someone he believes will take over and get a result, neither the PM or the COP will have instructed anyone to look for scape goats but will have been very direct in requiring progress and a resolution as quickly as possible - that is how I see it"

Why would the British PM make such a call when UK investigators have indicated to the victim's family the police nabbed the right people for these crimes and the evidence is strong against them.

I suggest you read the post properly - there was nothing said about the British PM making any phone calls - the reference was to the Thai PM.

Yes because reading the post properly would indicate you said, "pressured directly by the British PM"

If you think some meaning or point is lost because I used the word "call" instead of saying, "pressured through unspecified means of direct communication" then it is simply an example of how far your willing to bury your head in the sand to avoid seeing the obvious ... let alone subtle points

Once again you are unwilling to admit when you have made a mistake, and you try to turn things to your advantage by twisting your words to suit. To me, it is obvious that you misread the post, and instead of doing the right thing by admitting it, you make up some nonsense about "pressured through unspecified means of direct communication" The facts are that the UK PM spoke personally to the Thai PM at a conference in Europe, and the PM referred to in the conspiracy theory (Surprised you didn't pick up on that!)about the "chain of command" suggestion above was referring to the Thai PM, and you got it wrong - go on, admit it and apologise, instead of trying to bluster your way out of it. And yet once again, you have got it wrong by showing that you don't read the posts properly. I said nothing at all regarding "pressured directly by the British PM", and I think if you take the trouble to look, that statement was made by Smedley. So do I and Smedley get an apology from you for misquoting us? Or will you just use your usual diversionary tactic, and come out with another of your usual accusations?

[Darkknight666]

Do you mind stating why you believe b2 are guilty? I can't think of anything other than their proximity to the beach that indicates the young boys are rapists and killers. This attack was a personal attack and it seems it also wasn't the killers first rodeo.

There are no "young boys" involved in this case, there are 2 adult Burmese men though.

Yes. young men Thank You for pointing that out.

[fish fingers]

There is next to no chance that the families follow the twisted, regurgitated nonsense that is posted here, don't worry about that aspect. Why would they?

Well if it was my relative and I was spending alot of time stuck in hotels waiting around I'd probably want to dig for as much info as possible regardless. They don't know Thailand and how the system works like we do. So maybe there is a family member reading this thread.

Everyone here is in agreement and would like to see the right people arrested- most here think the family are are being led a merry dance by the authorities. I can't imagine how that would feel, when you'd start to realise whats going on. Who do you trust then??

[metisdead]

A flame post has been removed.

[sangthip]

There is next to no chance that the families follow the twisted, regurgitated nonsense that is posted here, don't worry about that aspect. Why would they?

Well if it was my relative and I was spending alot of time stuck in hotels waiting around I'd probably want to dig for as much info as possible regardless. They don't know Thailand and how the system works like we do. So maybe there is a family member reading this thread.

Everyone here is in agreement and would like to see the right people arrested- most here think the family are are being led a merry dance by the authorities. I can't imagine how that would feel, when you'd start to realise whats going on. Who do you trust then??

Mr Miller's relatives acknowledged the interent 'chit-chat' of the case during a recent report so they are aware of it.

[minikev]

I have to agree with you , unfortunately this case has become more unclear thanks to all the posters in here and just too many theories thats been running on social media since day 1 .

It's difficult to separate the real facts from gossip , just look at every thread started on Thaivisa and most of it does not make much sense,

Bear in mind that there are no facts on this subject on Thaivisa because no-one here is involved in the investigation. Everything is unfounded speculation based on rumours, nothing more.

It has to be said sviss geez unless the police show some evidence of their own theories they are also non fact. So up to now that will be non fact.

[minikev]

JTJ, Balo, Goldbuggy,Sviss Geez. Do you have an opinion on this?

If David was laid with Hannah when he was struck on the head with the blunt end of a Thai garden Hoe would some of his blood splashed onto Hannah's body? If you are in agreement that that is more than possible and very probable. Why was there no DNA from David discovered on Hannah's body.

I apologies to the family for asking in such a graphic way but I feel strongly that if theses murders were carried out in the way they are described by the prosecution there would have to have been DNA evidence and feel sure the prosecution would have shown this.

[Happy Grumpy]

And still some of the trolls half-heartedly appear.

Forget it lads, it's over, there isn't a person on this planet would believe these two raped and murdered Hannah and David.

[Darkknight666]

That pretty much sums it for the realists among us. This case makes me sick, physically.

[BoristheBlade]

Have the RTP ever checked the mobile phone records of "people" of interest at the time of the murders?

It would be a very simple process to check there true location on the night.

It would be very simple. ie if you were in Bangkok at the time of the murders, it would be simpler and far cheaper than a DNA test to prove your whereabouts.

And as the RTP have publicly stated they are under severe budget restrictions...ie the victims crime scene photos are no longer available due to budget restrictions.

Depends on what information phone companies are required to retain and for how long, and whether his their phone(s) were registered.

No, it's very simple, the persons of interest have phones, the accused have phones , the victims have phones......if you have phones you have sim cards.......even Inspector Clueso could trace calls made on the said phones and also more importantly have exact locations of phones and there operators.

[BoristheBlade]

This crime was carried out on a very small island.

A competent police force operating a competent investigation would have quickly solved this case.

I believe for the first week at least, crime scene apart, the police investigation was very sound and was leading to the culprits.

They were sought, arrested then.........money calls were exchanged and the investigation became a farce and more importantly...a disgrace to the nation of Thailand

[Whyamiandwhatamidoinghere]

here it is ....., I can show you the DNA samples ....................hang on - here they are in the cup holder of my Toyota Camry, oh wait I think they may have been stuck to that coffee cup I threw out the window, never mind I can assure you the tests were conclusive ......they did it....honest!!! why you not believe me...............I can prove it ..........oh wait ... no I can't - it went out the window

Never mind Sir we can use DNA from those we have accused of similar crimes who are locked up or who have died professing their innocence. Koh Tao you say? Wait.. Sorry we don't have the DNA of any real killers but if you're in dire need we can use the DNA of countless murdered foreigners. That way you can say the case is unsolved and the killer will never be found because the victim was repatriated back to their country. We smart like that here. Huh?

[Rhys]

a sad day for processing the law, a sad day for the respect of the law, a sad day for the scape goats.. a sad day.. Mother Justice Thailand are you proud...

[Whyamiandwhatamidoinghere]

Legally this case is finished and impossible to prosecute. The sickening reality is even if they find someone else to pin it on it will be even harder to get a conviction.

[Happy Grumpy]

This crime was carried out on a very small island.

A competent police force operating a competent investigation would have quickly solved this case.

I believe for the first week at least, crime scene apart, the police investigation was very sound and was leading to the culprits.

They were sought, arrested then.........money calls were exchanged and the investigation became a farce and more importantly...a disgrace to the nation of Thailand

Well said, but I don't know about 'a disgrace to the nation of Thailand'.

Perhaps more, a vulgar public display of Thai culture and society.

Rich Thai families don't go down in Thailand over a couple of farang, and stitching up a pair of Burmese peasants that may well be executed means nothing to them. Disgraceful, yes, but not out of the ordinary for Thailand in anyway other than this case is in the spotlight and involves farangs.

[sambum]

"The answer is simple - chain of command, the PM lifts the phone and talks with the Chief of Police, he tells him I need this sorted asap as I am being pressured directly by the British PM, the Chief of police reviews the case and sends someone he believes will take over and get a result, neither the PM or the COP will have instructed anyone to look for scape goats but will have been very direct in requiring progress and a resolution as quickly as possible - that is how I see it"

Why would the British PM make such a call when UK investigators have indicated to the victim's family the police nabbed the right people for these crimes and the evidence is strong against them.

I suggest you read the post properly - there was nothing said about the British PM making any phone calls - the reference was to the Thai PM.

Yes because reading the post properly would indicate you said, "pressured directly by the British PM"

If you think some meaning or point is lost because I used the word "call" instead of saying, "pressured through unspecified means of direct communication" then it is simply an example of how far your willing to bury your head in the sand to avoid seeing the obvious ... let alone subtle points

Once again you are unwilling to admit when you have made a mistake, and you try to turn things to your advantage by twisting your words to suit. To me, it is obvious that you misread the post, and instead of doing the right thing by admitting it, you make up some nonsense about "pressured through unspecified means of direct communication" The facts are that the UK PM spoke personally to the Thai PM at a conference in Europe, and the PM referred to in the conspiracy theory (Surprised you didn't pick up on that!)about the "chain of command" suggestion above was referring to the Thai PM, and you got it wrong - go on, admit it and apologise, instead of trying to bluster your way out of it. And yet once again, you have got it wrong by showing that you don't read the posts properly. I said nothing at all regarding "pressured directly by the British PM", and I think if you take the trouble to look, that statement was made by Smedley. So do I and Smedley get an apology from you for misquoting us? Or will you just use your usual diversionary tactic, and come out with another of your usual accusations?

FAO JohnThailandJohn:-

Just as I thought, more than 1 day later and no apology! No problem - I've proved my point about what kind of person you are.

[Gweiloman]

Are there any members, absolutely any members that still declare their belief that the 2 on trial are the guilty parties?

It is very strange indeed. In the early days before the trial, pretty much every thread on the KT murders were monopolised by the likes of jdinasia, JTJ, AleG and one or two others. I would not be surprised if more than half the posts on those threads were contributed by these posters.

However, now that the trial has started and certain "facts" are coming to light, they are mysteriously silent and being replaced by another group who are, sad to say, amateurs.

[balo]

JTJ, Balo, Goldbuggy,Sviss Geez. Do you have an opinion on this?

If David was laid with Hannah when he was struck on the head with the blunt end of a Thai garden Hoe would some of his blood splashed onto Hannah's body? If you are in agreement that that is more than possible and very probable. Why was there no DNA from David discovered on Hannah's body.

I apologies to the family for asking in such a graphic way but I feel strongly that if theses murders were carried out in the way they are described by the prosecution there would have to have been DNA evidence and feel sure the prosecution would have shown this.

If he was , its impossible for us to know the facts here. You're guess is as good as mine.

[Zeberdee]

Of course there's none of David's DNA on Hannah.

The RTP only tell you what they want you to hear.

Forget any samples they have, they will be riddled with the b2 dna anyway.

Samples the Brits took is the key to all this.