Hiring Is Easy, but how do you make them stay?

[inquisitive lobster]

Hi There,

As the title suggests, hiring people in Thailand is quite easy, but how do you make them stay?

Reason why I am asking is because I would like to know what various methods other employers here use to solve employee problems (as the way business management is done here is completely foreign to me and usual approaches don't quite work.)

For example, how do you handle an employee that has received training the company paid for and is still not happy with their newly increased salary.

I'd like to thank you in advance for taking the time to read this and I do appreciate any helpful advice and lessons you've learned along the way.

IL

[Cloggie]

Have a look at: http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/730337-share-your-problems-of-recruiting-decent-thai-staff/

[ldnguy]

How to make them stay? Pay them well and treat them well.

[innerspace]

Some have no ambition or desire for promotion so spotting that early helps...often the best staff at one level are not the ones for the next job up. Also higher salary doesnt always equal harder work.

Understand the local culture and traditions, find someone who can guide your way.

Find what matters to your staff most and encourage it. Food and family are high on the list, but demographics differ.

Pay ontime and yearly bonus if manageable.

Understand Thai face and what is or isnt acceptable as a result. Age and heirarchy can cause issues, certain things expect certain actions.

Earn their respect, not just fear.

[NOC]

TGF's sister pays her staff day by day. They come in, they get paid. They don't come in, they don't get paid. She feeds them too.

I think with the Thai mindset, 'live for here and now', with too much money in their pocket, you are not the 'here and now'.

If you're hiring college grads or professionals, build a clause into their employment contract that is attendance and performance based.

Hire for personality, train for success, manage by paycheck, terminate through documentation.

Edited September 7, 2015 by NOC

[blackcab]

What's the job, what's the salary and what part of the country are they working in?

Things differ greatly.

[PattayaPhom]

How to make them stay? Pay them well and treat them well.

Wish it was that easy but afraid it dosnt matter how well they are paid or treated still no joy.

[johnh869]

Provide them with a career path if possible and give them different tasks/projects to perform. I was the Thaicom satellite control room manager for many years and I would lose people to other companies because of very little career path options. The satellite training was very extensive (at least one full year) to say the least.The satellite control job would become routine after about three years which led to boredom (95% routine and 5% stark terror!). Also, monetary compensation was lower than other engineering positions which required less knowledge and skills.

[oxo1947]

1/TGF's sister pays her staff day by day. They come in, they get paid. They don't come in, they don't get paid. She feeds them too.

2/Pay ontime and yearly bonus if manageable.

Those 2 suggestions are good---but also throw in some sanuk, maybe a monthly half day trip to the beach in a van, with food paid for----or some monthly get together....if its someone's birthday finish 30 minutes earlier have a cake & some food..it not like it cost a fortune....compared to rehiring

Thais seem to have that Family mentality--even about work, some girls wont leave one bar for another that is paying so much more, & what do they call a customer.....Lūkkĥā.....already family attachment words...............................

[canman]

You don't "make them stay"

You make them want to stay. A good manager will work out what motivates the individual. Not easy with a foreign culture, that's the challenge.

[konying]

There is no secret to it.

Money is not a factor, no matter what Thai visa experts will tell you .

When it's busy, they leave because "tired"

When it's quite , they leave because "boring"

No bonuses or incentives will keep them.

Just keep on hiring.

I have been in business for a few years and only have 1 staff who has worked the longest - 3 years, all the rest do 1-3 months.

[NickJ]

One mistake is to make friends out of those you employ. Sounds a bit harsh however there is a distinct line and when its crossed the situation goes downhill. The circles of Griang Jai are a big deal here. Its how there whole society is structured. I

[RuamRudy]

Showing that you value them and making them feel critical to the business is important up to a point, but I have seen even the most loyal staff (hotel business) cross the road to a competitor for 5 baht more.

One technique I used was to pay my staff on the 5th day of the month for the previous month, meaning that if they were planning to leave without giving proper notice (generally that would happen after receiving their previous month's salary) they would lose 5 days' salary. I know of others who actually had pay day on the 15th of the subsequent month, but that seemed too harsh to me.

[KarenBravo]

The circles of Griang Jai are a big deal here. Its how there whole society is structured. I

In theory, yes.

In practice, No.

They all want to be the recipients of Greng Jai.

[1FinickyOne]

There is virtually no unemployment here - so, other jobs are easily found.

I don't think you are going to be able to sort through this in a rational formulaic manner unless you figure that a certain % will leave for unknown and unpreventable reasons. On the lower, labor levels, they can quit simply because they want to go fishing for the day - if they get fired, they will just work somewhere else next week.

I surely understand the frustrations, but there is no one or easy answer - it is going to be highly individual.

[fred Kubasa]

Looking at Thai businesses for ideas would be a mistake. Some universal ones are :

5 days a week instead of six

Employee of the month gets day off

Coffee or tea and cookies awaiting all each morning

I day a year have party, picnic, restaurant meal,etc. for all

Paid holidays based on longevity - ! year = 1 day or other formula

Lunch catered in once a month

Supplemental pay for higher education that benefits them/you. Paid on completion

Being nice isn't a bad thing, unexpected, contagious and makes for a pleasant work day and space.

Thai employers don't engage these 40 year old ideaa

[IMA_FARANG]

For must people, even if you don't want to believe it, they only work because otherwise they won't have enough money to do what they want to do.

If you pay them, and give them that money they want to go and have fun instead of working and they will quickly quit their job, take what money they have earned. and go and do what they want to do to have fun.

It is human nature.

Only a small percentage of working people actually have work they really enjoy.

That's why, except for a small percentage of employees, such things as incentive bonuses. merit raises, etc. are not enough to keep them on the job.

In fact, the more boring and repetitive a job is, the harder it is to retain qualified people, no matte what the salary incentives are for the employees.

Bet nobody ever told you that in business school..... even if you have an MBA.

Edited September 8, 2015 by IMA_FARANG

[seancbk]

TGF's sister pays her staff day by day. They come in, they get paid. They don't come in, they don't get paid. She feeds them too.

I think with the Thai mindset, 'live for here and now', with too much money in their pocket, you are not the 'here and now'.

If you're hiring college grads or professionals, build a clause into their employment contract that is attendance and performance based.

Hire for personality, train for success, manage by paycheck, terminate through documentation.

These are good points.

I'm in the process of setting up a business and will certainly implement these suggestions.

I am also going to pay monthly (may change to weekly) bonuses, but I think I might make the bonus based not only on sales but also attendance. No point if one of my staff earns a few thousand in bonuses on Monday & Tuesday then doesn't show up on Wed, Thursday because they feel like they made enough that week.

Thanks for the suggestions.

[RuamRudy]

TGF's sister pays her staff day by day. They come in, they get paid. They don't come in, they don't get paid. She feeds them too.

I think with the Thai mindset, 'live for here and now', with too much money in their pocket, you are not the 'here and now'.

If you're hiring college grads or professionals, build a clause into their employment contract that is attendance and performance based.

Hire for personality, train for success, manage by paycheck, terminate through documentation.

These are good points.

I'm in the process of setting up a business and will certainly implement these suggestions.

I am also going to pay monthly (may change to weekly) bonuses, but I think I might make the bonus based not only on sales but also attendance. No point if one of my staff earns a few thousand in bonuses on Monday & Tuesday then doesn't show up on Wed, Thursday because they feel like they made enough that week.

Thanks for the suggestions.

I don't want to teach you how to suck eggs, or suggest that I know much about implementing bonus schemes because I am, like you, trying to devise one for my company, but there seems to be a huge psychological aspect to bonuses and incentives that is maybe worth investigating, if you have not done so already. Google 'how to implement a bonus scheme' and you will see the many, many thoughts on structures and results.

Edited September 8, 2015 by RuamRudy

[NOC]

TGF's sister pays her staff day by day. They come in, they get paid. They don't come in, they don't get paid. She feeds them too.

I think with the Thai mindset, 'live for here and now', with too much money in their pocket, you are not the 'here and now'.

If you're hiring college grads or professionals, build a clause into their employment contract that is attendance and performance based.

Hire for personality, train for success, manage by paycheck, terminate through documentation.

These are good points.

I'm in the process of setting up a business and will certainly implement these suggestions.

I am also going to pay monthly (may change to weekly) bonuses, but I think I might make the bonus based not only on sales but also attendance. No point if one of my staff earns a few thousand in bonuses on Monday & Tuesday then doesn't show up on Wed, Thursday because they feel like they made enough that week.

Thanks for the suggestions.

I don't want to teach you how to suck eggs, or suggest that I know much about implementing bonus schemes because I am, like you, trying to devise one for my company, but there seems to be a huge psychological aspect to bonuses and incentives that is maybe worth investigating, if you have not done so already. Google 'how to implement a bonus scheme' and you will see the many, many thoughts on structures and results.

Salaries should always be performance and longevity based.

The old Jew who taught me based his bonuses upon his daily income. If he hit his number, there was a cash bonus paid that day. If he didn't hit his number, or you pissed him off, go suck eggs.

[NickJ]

When I had my business here. I was the Boss. One of the first things I did was to author my own Company Policy Handbook. Had it translated one page in English.Facing page in Thai.Even when I only had three employees. They each read it signed it. As we grew it really helped. Everyone knew there job describtion and what they were resposible for.......

I still had employee dinners and rewarded bonuses.....Other farangs in tge exact same line of work are long gone.

When I went to help my wife...she ignored everything. befriended her staff. let them use FB In short her small company failed. I couldnt do anything. She was making a decent profit of between 3 to 400k a month with 4 staff........I turned it over and it failed in a year. For no other reason except that she knew better....she was Thai.

Years after tge divorce she was working as an emplyoee......making 15k salary. I asked her if she had any regrets......We had a chance meeting and had a coffee.

No matter the size of any business it has to run like one........I am still in touch with people I hired way back when and they still show me the respect that company built.

Many bought houses cars and raised families on my planning and oversight.

[bearpolar]

So her business failed but she was profiting 400k a month, then you took over a failed business and it failed(can a business that failed, fail again?) because she knew better(she had failed)..

Edited September 8, 2015 by bearpolar

[gandalf12]

Train them so they can leave and treat them so they dont want to.

[timendres]

So her business failed but she was profiting 400k a month, then you took over a failed business and it failed(can a business that failed, fail again?) because she knew better(she had failed)..

What he meant to say was: I had a business that was making 300 to 400K per month. I turned it over to my wife and it failed.

[chrisinth]

One mistake is to make friends out of those you employ. Sounds a bit harsh however there is a distinct line and when its crossed the situation goes downhill. The circles of Griang Jai are a big deal here. Its how there whole society is structured. I

On the flip side of that coin, IMO, it is good to be friendly with those you employ. However, it also depends what your business entails as the goalposts can change dramatically.

The key to where i am is to have someone in middle management who is respected by the staff and that person willing to stand up for them if there is a dispute. Don't even think about putting a foreigner there! The other thing is to have good communications between the workshop and office, a safe passage for any complaints in a controlled manner. This is where the foreigner goes.

Put some effort into making the working environment above all safe, and as 'user friendly' as you can have it for the workers (water dispensers, ventilation, etc)

Everyone has a voice, everybody will be listened to without fear of reprimand. All about teamwork.

Provide all the correct tools, including consumables, for the job.

Ensure everyone has correct PPE (personal protection equipment) for what the job entails.

Families day every year (normally a 2-3 day all paid holiday for all)

The above are just a few things that keep staff together through my experience over the last 10 years at my present job. Still working with staff that were here before me...................

Edited September 8, 2015 by chrisinth

[MobileContent]

There is no secret to it.

Money is not a factor, no matter what Thai visa experts will tell you .

When it's busy, they leave because "tired"

When it's quite , they leave because "boring"

No bonuses or incentives will keep them.

Just keep on hiring.

I have been in business for a few years and only have 1 staff who has worked the longest - 3 years, all the rest do 1-3 months.

I have the opposite experience as most of our Thai staffs in the office have been their at least 5 years with a large number been their over 15 years. We have around 240 Thai staffs and 20 expats.

We offer a very good salary, yearly bonuses, birthday parties and we are very close to our staffs.

[farangmick]

On a very small scale, I can only talk about my experience with gardeners. Struggled for a year since getting serious mobility problems to find someone to look after our modest garden,(only 1/2 rai). Wife found people who would turn up, bugger about doing the little jobs that I can still manage, and disappear. We now have two cracking blokes who work for the amphur. They really graft, to the point that I or my wife tells them to relax and take a break. Only asked for 300B a day, but we stock up with iced water and soft drinks. Mid day they get a good meal with several different dishes. Finish work, Thai whisky or beer. Told them they could bring their kids to play swings, slide, football with ours, which they do. Most of this is down to my wife. If they decide not to work here anymore, I,ll probably get pissed and order a lot of concrete.

[ldnguy]

There is no secret to it.

Money is not a factor, no matter what Thai visa experts will tell you .

When it's busy, they leave because "tired"

When it's quite , they leave because "boring"

No bonuses or incentives will keep them.

Just keep on hiring.

I have been in business for a few years and only have 1 staff who has worked the longest - 3 years, all the rest do 1-3 months.

I have the opposite experience as most of our Thai staffs in the office have been their at least 5 years with a large number been their over 15 years. We have around 240 Thai staffs and 20 expats.

We offer a very good salary, yearly bonuses, birthday parties and we are very close to our staffs.

The fact is that some people know how to hire and retain staff, while others don't. The ones that can't do it assume it's a general problem and don't realize that they are either hiring the wrong staff or not offering the right package and working conditions to retain them.

[farangmick]

If an American reads my last post (if anyone does), please note that in the Queen's English "pissed" means drunk, not annoyed. "Pissed off" means annoyed.

[konying]

There is no secret to it.

Money is not a factor, no matter what Thai visa experts will tell you .

When it's busy, they leave because "tired"

When it's quite , they leave because "boring"

No bonuses or incentives will keep them.

Just keep on hiring.

I have been in business for a few years and only have 1 staff who has worked the longest - 3 years, all the rest do 1-3 months.

I have the opposite experience as most of our Thai staffs in the office have been their at least 5 years with a large number been their over 15 years. We have around 240 Thai staffs and 20 expats.

We offer a very good salary, yearly bonuses, birthday parties and we are very close to our staffs.

I do not know where you based and what your company does , in my circle of friends business owners ranging from doctors to insurance agents, hotels, restaurants and mechanic shops, lucky to have 1 staff who works for over a year.

I am and my friends all based in Pattaya