My Project - House and Garden

[user343434]

Hi all,

I am since 11 years here, happy married and now my wife and I decided to seddle outside Pattaya. We got via her aunt some nice spots shown. Especially one has caught our eye. It has all criterias that we set to buy.

It is 6 rai land, surrounded by mountains and has a lake that has a permenent water level in all seasons.

Since 3 years we visited this turf at all seasons, even 3 days continously battered by a thunderstorm last year (where we slept in our car.)

So we could be assured, this is what we want.

We start this month with the earth movements, by meaning expanding the pond to 2.6 rai and use the ground to fill up the 1m higher area where the house comes on. In total it will be 2m higher as the garden area.

Gardening is a passion of my wife and myself:

Here I'am looking to get many fruit trees and of cause also some that not everyone has like Avocados or other specialities. If somebody has some cuts spare for a "beer question price" they will be gladfully taken.

Further I will be happy for any info that helps me to succeed with my pond, garden and house, thanks in advance.

-Isolation Q-con walls seem for me the best, but what about the roof?

-The Uncle is builder and has Dredgers and Cats. He and our nephew has good skills about Q-con building.

-Sewage System a good supplier needed

-Rainwater ground tanks like 2x30000 ltr. any supplier where we can see and compare them?

-shading Trees that don't create a mess in the gutter or crack the walls with their roots.

-100m creek design and pump for it, all can be helpful and will be noted. The pond has 60x20x8m steep walls, i'll reduce the angle to 45 degrees and a suitable shallow water area.

I attach some pics and may be some ideas are coming up. btw, in Germany I had a similar spot and size of pond, but the maintenance will be pretty different here in Thailand.

About the Gardening, I'll show my wife some things like raised beets, herb spirals etc.. Most about pruning trees and flowers she is absolute top of the notch.

Cheers

Will

[aircut]

good luck. I suggest that you should

avoid using your wife's relatives as builders. that's if you want to be able to set up your building standards, bargain your price and still remain in good relationship with your Thai family for ever after.....

[user343434]

That is in most cases true. But here the relatives have been working in "modern" construction Projects for Europeans and know about Q-con and can read statics.

I sponsored the nephew the school and 8 years ago, the Uncle has got from me for X-mas a Cat and a Dredger (wich we restored). Now he owns 3 Dredgers (2 oft them under 3 years old) , 2 Planner and some small construction machines. (The Cat is meanwhile hopelessly worn out and gets sold in bits) But proud to say, I gave him a start and he took the chance went right up the road.

The entire family is now making a pretty good living of it and the biggest wish of my uncle is to pay me this back and build my house. If I would take another company I sure would hurt him badly.

[fang37]

See Will

Building in LOS, to me, quality mats essential. Labor - some luck required.

Living in a semi-tropical clmate, insulation is # 1.

Q-Con bricks - bigger the better - we used 15cm x 10cm but you can get bigger. W

e have 2 level so reduced our size.

Roof tiles - CPAC. Light color better.

Foil under that.

A/C - surprisingly we use little.

Termite control - tunnels under the house & refilled annually.

If you have a budget, I would focus on these.

Electrical appliances, furniture, garden - defer.

Get those monks in + fortunetellers - the more the merrier.

Finally, the most important. As all will be in the wife's name, compatibility is paramount.

[AlexRRR]

Did you factor in the cobras swimming in your lake?

Nice looking house on the outside pretty crappy layout n the inside, sorry to be so blunt but I'm in the building industry...its my living, how many people will be using that dressing room at the same time?

All doors to bedrooms enter via the main area....not good, take it as constructive criticism please not looking to spoil your day...some professional help would make the layout so much more appealing....good luck.

[user343434]

Cheers Alex.

There is no critic! It is a necessarity for avoiding mistakes.

I made these sketches on my Job, one of these "do nothing at all Projects" and so I used the Time to build up an idea. Even my uncle was mentioning this and sure this Sketch is not my final.

So you are into this kind of stuff > may be we find together, just name the price for a proper drawing and static.

Well with reptiles, you might see me and my wife somewhere fishing on Snakeheads standing in the lakes surrounded by Snakes as they are definitely a good indication for a fishing hotspot. I have sure more respect for straying dogs.

My dogs, (2 brothers Bang Kaew mix), are also in the Game, unfortunetly they are unstoppable when it comes to snakes and kill them. I really tried all to stop them doing this but they are like switched off. One attracks the attention, the other comes form behind, graps the snake just behind the head and in a split second the life light is blown out.

But I plan a 2m wall all around our land to keep the most critters out and protect passing by people and other animals, the dogs don't do fun also to people, cats, rats and other dogs.

Fang37

I guess all replies also in other Forums are pointing Towards Q-con.. I reckon a 250K more spent will be the saving, when I can not work offshore anymore and living on Pension.

I am married to my wife for 11 years and togehter 16 in total. (The fact that we are living in Pattaya doesn't say I met her there the first time ;-) beside she hates Patty and loves her garden) And there was not one day of arguments between her and me till now.

Termites, my uncle wants to make a complete European style foundation/fundament around the house and at least 80cm deep, that should keep the critters off to dig under the concrete plate. Beside the Groundwater level will be by 80 cm in the Rain season and 100 cm in the dry season, seen in the last 3 years of observing the test well me made. The trenches are also the same level all time.

best regards

Will

Edited October 19, 2015 by See Will

[fang37]

Home ownership - jest

Q-Con - I had never heard of them. Where I live, some commercial/shopping complexes used Q-Con

THE BEST HOUSING DECISION I MADE!

[AlexRRR]

I'm in Australia now so I can't help you but before u go much further take the time to look at a few books and magazines on home building, imagin yourself walking around the house plan your looking at and try and picture in your mind how it looks and feels,once you have an idea in your mind your going to need to get it drawn up, do some searching ask to see some of there latest projects already built then your on your way.

[fang37]

Re AlexRRR's suggestion, my wife did similar.

Included are many advertisements re products & services available.

[Jonathan Fairfield]

Thanks for sharing this. Please keep us updated on your progress as topics like this are always interesting to follow.

[user343434]

Thanks Jonathan,

It will take 2 years in total, This winter the earth movement is on the plan, that needs to seddle at least one rainseason and the Pond/Garden will be designed.

Sure I'll post step by step all works that have been done.

The house, I love the design but MaxxRRR was bringing up what my guts told me already, I guess the shape makes it difficult to fit the rooms inside without having doors all over the living room.

That will need some good ideas. The idea was to open the front of the living room and have a wide connection or lets say double the size of the terrasse.

Creating enough draft for hot days is the main focus.

here we go....

[Crossy]

Looks like this could be a good one.

Let's try it over in Real Estate where the builders live.

[Rdrokit]

Q-con good. Make sure you insulate in the attic area and have good ventilation in the attic area like BIG vents in the eves (soffit vents). Also if you could find white tiles for the roof use them as they are about 10 degrees cooler than dark tiles. Can't figure why there aren't more white tiles used in Thailand. Use to live in S. Florida and all the roof tiles were white. Good luck.

[kamalabob2]

See Will has an interesting house design and I believe is very wise to use AAC blocks such as Q Con, Diamond Block, TPI Block or Superblock in his home construction in Thailand. CPAC is not the only brand of quality concrete roof tile in my experience, but certainly worth getting a price bid. Trees will certainly help with cooling his attractive home and the color of his roof tile will play a role in my observation and experience. My current home has 12.5 thick exterior AAC blocks made in 2007 by CPAC, but my next home will have 20 cm thick Q Con wall panels or 20cm thick Q Con or Diamond wall blocks for exterior walls. The 7.5 cm thick interior walls have served me well for eight years and I would build a home with that 7.5cm or 10cm interior wall blocks depending on if my wife still likes to sing karaoke. I pass by a beautiful home being built in Lanna style in a Buriram Village. This home has 7.5cm Diamond blocks for the ground floor garage and utility rooms and 20cm thick Diamond AAC autoclaved blocks for the 2nd floor living area. It has a sub roof of Viva board being added this week and a water resistant membrane going onto top of the Viva board. The roof tiles are hand made terracotta roof tiles which made a sub roof and waterproof membrane a serious consideration for the expat. I have mixed experiences with relative builders, but See Will seems to have family builders far more experienced than the Buriram relatives I have used for building a garage with a bedroom and bathroom in a village.

[Stevemercer]

Best wishes for your building project.

I live in Isaan and did something similar to you, but on a modest scale. We are on 5 Rai and are now into our second year. The house is a year old. I have about 1 Rai of ponds stocked with about 12 species of fish. The Alligator Gar are nearly 10 kg now and the Pacu (vegetarian piranha) about 2 kg. You can buy many fish from the nearest government fishery at dirt cheap prices. It's worth a visit to the Bangkok pet market where you can pick up all sorts of exotic species at cheap prices to stock in your lake. Alligator Gar are a good stocking species because they grow fast and get big. They are also air breathers so they regularly breach and surface. I'd love to stock Arapima (giant fish from South America), but haven't been able to source any young fish.

I've found it's a lot of work to grow trees on reclaimed land. You need an irrigation system, regular spraying for bugs and stout support poles so they aren't blown away by the wind. If you can afford it, larger trees around the house are the best as you will save a few years in getting some decent shade. I've put in about 250 saplings, but probably only have about 200 alive after 18 months. I made the mistake of putting my wife's son in charge when we were overseas for 3 weeks in March earlier this year. Needless to say he didn't water them and some didn't make it.

[zaZa9]

Will mentions rain water guttering which I would avoid at all costs if I were planting shade trees close to the house.

Im not trying to be critical but I also see the front verandah as having its airflow options restricted by having 3 walls around it whereas one wall would better suit airflow.

[GlutinousMaximus]

Hi OP

Building your own place is great some ways - starting with a clean slate and all that...but in others, you soon learn the meaning of 'set in stone' especially when it comes to layout/design. Definitely worth giving it a lot of consideration so you don't end up thinking 'I wish I'd done this instead of that..'.

It's smart of you to visit the site in all conditions - gives you a good insight into potential problems.

As a previous poster has said, look at some design books etc. There's lots of catalogues available in Thailand with house plans/designs etc. I believe there are also free house plans from the Thai government available for download (just google 'free Thai house plans') - I'm not saying any of them are suitable for you necessarily, but it's free info and you might pick up some pointers or design ideas.

Your plan doesn't show a utility area - useful for sticking all the machines, mops, brooms and so on out of sight. Also, might be worth thinking about including an external kitchen or lean-to for Thai cooking (as well as your main internal kitchen) - especially when you relatives are cooking up plaa-raa and lots of chillies etc. Where it's a bit more rough and ready and they can move about easily with hot oil and the smells ventilate naturally

You might also want somewhere to park your car out of the sun (but you could build a cheapish carport out in your garden I guess)

If I built in Thailand again I'd be looking at:

• Making use of passive cooling as much as possible - e.g. with thermal mass such as very solid foundation concrete slab, double-skinned walls with an air gap etc. There's lots of info from people building in tropical climates (e.g. Australia, Florida) - worth googling for info on building cool tropical houses
  
• Lots of external shading built into the house (plus external tree planting for extra shade and transpiration cooling etc.).If you keep the sun off the walls via deep eaves, external verandas etc., I think it helps with reducing the heat load. These things also help to keep the driving rain out at the height of the monsoon season which can be a pain with leaking windows/doors etc.
  
• Think about construction where wind is funnelled through certain areas by the mass of the buildings around it (e.g. an external seating area which gets a 'wind concentrator' effect). I have an accidentally created one in my current house where the wind is pinched between the house wall and an external wall and it's quite powerful
  
• I know solar panels have their pros and cons cost-wise, but I like the idea of at least a 2-3KW system. If on a hot day, I could drive one 10-15K BTU aircon in a small room completely off the solar, that would be nifty
  
• Build in such a way that it's easy to add stuff later - more rooms, more external areas etc
  
• Build external areas where you can enjoy the air/breezes of an evening but the bugs are designed out - your plan shows what I assume is an external veranda, however the problem with sitting outside is always the mozzies (at least where I am). Netting has it's uses to keep them out, however the birds tend to peck at that, so not really sure what the answer is.
  
• I'd like to be able to sleep semi-outside in any future house (but protected via the house design from bugs/intruders), it's way cooler in the evenings and has gentle breezes, so no need for expensive aircon all the time
  
• Include some really small bedrooms and extra living spaces such as small office, cinema room etc.. The smaller the air volume, the less air-con power you need to cool it over time. I sleep in a 8-9 sq metre bedroom, and it's really cheap to cool at night time. I know we want to spread out and enjoy the space, but I bet you cooling your 40 square metre main living area isn't going to be cheap (electric wise).
  

Best of luck with your project, and keep us posted!

Edited October 20, 2015 by GlutinousMaximus

[user343434]

Thanks GM for the big layout of things that have to be kept in mind. I'll add these sure to my do and not do list.

As I said before there are no critics there is only a way to avoid mistakes others have already learned from.

It is highly appreciated.

The double wall is for example coming more and more into my mind as yours is not the first recommendation that way. I plan to use Q-con thick blocks but I think its better just to take 2 rows of thinner ones or lets say outside 15cm and the inner wall 10cm..

It is easier when I am at home an have them seen and in my hand in the store, then my common sense will tell me.

As more I think about the my design and listen to the comments I must say, yes it's a nice house by optic but the usability seems getting more and more limited.

I never had a car in my life but a garage for a Bike and Workshop could safe one Wall for an external Garage and isulate the House from one side even more.. ...and so I move on and on.. (Slowly slowly catching the monkey)

Cheers

Will

[GlutinousMaximus]

Hi OP

Glad to hear the feedback is helping - it's one of the best things about Thai Visa, i.e. the voice of experience from 'the crowd'. I'm no expert, but having built one house here, I have a much better idea what I do and don't want to do next time (if there is a next time).

From your avatar, it looks like you might have a dog? That's something else to bear in mind (a place for the canines). If I build again, I'd include a small room, accessed from the outside only (so you don't get ticks crawling into your house) with a netted swing door on a spring (which the dogs can operate) and put in a cool tile floor and a cheap ceiling fan - somewhere they can live outside 24/7 and be comfortable out of the sun and not be eaten alive by the mozzies at night time (but also help to keep an eye on your property).

The other thing I'd recommend is that if you use contractors for certain jobs - ask to see some of their previous work. For example, we chose granito-style tiles for upstairs and I don't think they were laid right with the correct base screed etc. as they have lots of hollow spots and some of them are loose. I had to replace a whole room at one stage because the floor buckled up completely due to expansion/contraction. There's a lot of 'jack of all trades, master of none' type building dudes in Thailand, so definitely worth choosing with care, or asking around and getting recommendations etc. You also can't chase/sue builders here for shoddy work like you might be able to back in Farangland, so it pays to be picky from the first place.

Edited October 20, 2015 by GlutinousMaximus

[user343434]

Yes, this is Thailand and sometimes you need to take a 5 as odd number.

Lucky I can see the house my uncle built at least once a week when we visit them. He is a pretty tight pocket almost a kind of Scottish minded but his house is made 10 years ago, has no cracks and stands solid all weathers beside the mountains.

His wise "requirements" like we calculate for 450 liter of rain per sqm/hr then it's good for 250 ltr/hr that could come in a Thunderstorm of the worst.

Also he can handle Q-con Blocks. They have to be wet glued with special mortar. I guess that is the only one I can rely on. To find a skilled plumber and elecric company worries me more.

The 2 Bang Kaew/German Sheperd Mix nutcases.. One kills all kind of snakes, rats and cats, the other knocks against every glass window incl. camera lenses when its time to enjoy some airco treatment. (see Avatar)

They are staying in our present home only during the midday's heat and a stone table with a fan (and radio) in front makes them sleeping like babys the rest of the time. (If no animal or person that wants to come in has to be sorted).

They attacked already a grown Sheperd as they were 6 weeks old and there was and is no chance to change their behaviour. As long my wife and I are present they are the finest boys but if we are out of sight... real pricks.

Tics and Bugs:

We made very good experiences with a little chemical free Tag called: "Tic Clip". its free of chemicals and works up to 2 years. No fleas and no tics during that time. (well I found 2 tics but dead) but don't ask me what is the trick or black magic.

Well, if it works I don't mind.

Edited October 20, 2015 by See Will

[Naam]

i like you design in principle (we have a U-shaped home) but your doors and windows, size as well as placement, are quite confusing.

[user343434]

Sorry,

Doors and windows are just as I found the Sketch in the internet, the rooms I corrected by my choice with windows paint.

Sure that would be amateur like to set the windows like that.

I am looking for a proper planer when I am coming home from my Job next week. he will create a final drawing with senseful arrangements.

[user343434]

Yes, this is Thailand and sometimes you need to take a 5 as odd number.

Sorry I mean "sometimes you need to see a 4 as an odd number in Thailand" well or "a 5 as an even number"

It's a German thing.

[Naam]

Yes, this is Thailand and sometimes you need to take a 5 as odd number.

Sorry I mean "sometimes you need to see a 4 as an odd number in Thailand" well or "a 5 as an even number"

It's a German thing.

man lässt "fünfe gerade sein"

[GlutinousMaximus]

Hi OP

Yes I gathered the 4/5 was a German thing somewhat lost in translation. It's a bit like "a nod's as good as a wink to a blind bat" in English - what does that mean?

I know what you mean about the dogs - mine are the same (killed a few cats/rats in their time). They seem to have more feral genes over here than the sedate European pooches we're used to.

WRT to your concerns over specific things like plumbing, electrics, there's lots of historical threads on TVF about that. You could also start a new topic closer to the time asking for pointers specifically about electrics or whatever. Again it pays to know about these things - you might have to direct/control your contractors to do things a certain way which you've pre-researched. They will be looking to do it 'their way' (i.e. the quick/cheap way). As an example of plumbing horrors, all the plumbing pipes here they tend to sink permanently into the floors/walls - one day I noticed my water meter was spinning all the time, and it turned out there was a cracked pipe or joint under one of our bathroom floors. Fortunately, after a bit of head scratching from the builders, they came up with some kind of pipe re-routing solution which fixed it, but if they'd had to dig up the tiling/concrete in the bathroom, it would have been costly and messy. I don't know what the alternatives are to 'Thai-style plumbing' but I guess they will exist.

On the electric front, there's obviously safety to consider, plus a lot of Thai 'electricians' will just staple the wires to the walls inside the house (rather than chasing them into the walls properly) and it looks ugly. If you've pre-planned for that, you can get the renderers/plasterers to leave space for trunking conduits and such-like. I'm no tradesman, but one trade I'm not bad at is decorating. I was horrified to see the decorators using rollers on the walls above my nice tiled floors with no dust sheets put down so obviously you get a lot of fine spray from the rollers all over your floor. Real basic stuff, but they will cut corners like you won't believe.

Overall, it helps to be aware of what you want before the contractors arrive on site, because due to the communication problems, lack of proper training and standards in the trades etc., it's too late to do anything about it once they start working.

Edited October 20, 2015 by GlutinousMaximus

[Naam]

Sorry,

Doors and windows are just as I found the Sketch in the internet, the rooms I corrected by my choice with windows paint.

Sure that would be amateur like to set the windows like that.

I am looking for a proper planer when I am coming home from my Job next week. he will create a final drawing with senseful arrangements.

not amateur but Thai @rschitecture , e.g. high and narrow windows in one bathroom and master bathroom with floor to ceiling sliding doors.

have you thought of shading your terrace?

[ResandePohm]

Hi Op

I am a Civil Engineer and in the the process of building exactly the same as you. A few things that i have included in my design are:

1. Natural AC which cools the house 24/7 without any energy costs what so ever. With the size of you plot you could very easily do the same.

2. I have positioned my house so that i have a large south facing roof on which i shall place Solar PV Panels.

3. Because of the large amount of water i have concentrated on planting shrubs and plants that actually repel mozzies. I don't expect to get rid of them all but I hope to greatly reduce their numbers

If you would like further details of my design please PM me. Also I would be interested to hear about any ideas you may have.

Edited October 20, 2015 by ResandePohm

[petermik]

Just completed our design house down south............... 2 beds/2 baths 120 sq.mtres 7.5mm QCon blocks Cpac Monier roof tiles (insulated) 1.3 million.

Good luck with your project and be patient

[GlutinousMaximus]

Just completed our design house down south............... 2 beds/2 baths 120 sq.mtres 7.5mm QCon blocks Cpac Monier roof tiles (insulated) 1.3 million.

Good luck with your project and be patient 85.JPG

Nice tidy build at a very reasonable price. I'd challenge anyone to get that built in Europe for 32K Euro!

[GlutinousMaximus]

Hi Op

I am a Civil Engineer and in the the process of building exactly the same as you. A few things that i have included in my design are:

1. Natural AC which cools the house 24/7 without any energy costs what so ever. With the size of you plot you could very easily do the same.

2. I have positioned my house so that i have a large south facing roof on which i shall place Solar PV Panels.

3. Because of the large amount of water i have concentrated on planting shrubs and plants that actually repel mozzies. I don't expect to get rid of them all but I hope to greatly reduce their numbers

If you would like further details of my design please PM me. Also I would be interested to hear about any ideas you may have.

Tell us more about 'Natural AC' - I'm intrigued.