TM30 Experience

[Tywais]

Not necessasrily so! I have been explictly informed by the officer (not a new guy) on duty at Immigration Investigations Office that once reported, no further TM30 form is needed until you move your residence. A TM30 receipt should be in your passport; that and your passport are needed upon return from a trip abroad. So go figure...

Which contradicts the whole thing again....but hey, who would be surprised

Based on the TV Visa section on these topics you only have to submit another TM30 if you leave the country and return to your residence or move to a new residence (new address).

[Mapguy]

What the officer (#89 above) said does, actually, make sense.

Frankly, I think the requirement for multiple TM30s for the same residence has been misinterpreted or an explanation sometimes ill-phrased due, perhaps, to lack of very clear English, or maybe questions not being asked clearly. (Actually, what the officer said at the time was confirmed by his supervisor there who reviewed a new TM 30 report with him.

Note, however, if a NEW alien moves into the residence, then, yes, the new person has to be reported by the householder.

Now, here is some speculation. The situation for a hotel or guesthouse is, I believe, actually somewhat different than that of a lessor of a house. A condo "householder" (functioning through the juristic person managing the condo) would be grouped in the law with thethe hotel and the guesthouse.

Maybe things are more sensible than they first appear. Now, that would be different

[Mapguy]

Not necessasrily so! I have been explictly informed by the officer (not a new guy) on duty at Immigration Investigations Office that once reported, no further TM30 form is needed until you move your residence. A TM30 receipt should be in your passport; that and your passport are needed upon return from a trip abroad. So go figure...

Which contradicts the whole thing again....but hey, who would be surprised

Based on the TV Visa section on these topics you only have to submit another TM30 if you leave the country and return to your residence or move to a new residence (new address).

I'll report back on that the next time I do that --- or maybe someone else will before I travel abroad. As I recall, the Chiang Mai Investigations Office did not require this for a simple residential householder.

[MadMac]

I don't push it in the moment, we fly to Europe and come back end of May, then I'll try that and see what ever will be required. Probably all will be new and different again from what they tell us now. One only needs to monitor the 90days discussion last month and how everything was turned upside down in just 2 weeks. No need to open another can of worms, at least for me.

[LivinLOS]

Not necessasrily so! I have been explictly informed by the officer (not a new guy) on duty at Immigration Investigations Office that once reported, no further TM30 form is needed until you move your residence. A TM30 receipt should be in your passport; that and your passport are needed upon return from a trip abroad. So go figure...

Which contradicts the whole thing again....but hey, who would be surprised

Based on the TV Visa section on these topics you only have to submit another TM30 if you leave the country and return to your residence or move to a new residence (new address).

As per the captain in the immigration airport branch.. New one done every time you stay in a hotel or any accomodation for more than 24h..

Stay home non stop.. not needed..

Go to a hotel.. Needed on return (the hotel will do one also)

Go to a friends house for >24h (the friend is liable for doing one).

Rediculious.. But thats firmly what she claims.

[Mapguy]

Well, folks, just stay loose and don't obsess over this! Especially those with "absent" landlords. For example, a TH 30 report by the tenant, not the owner, taken with a copy of the lease (probably with a copy of the ID card) works out just fine. A copy of the chanote would be even better for the hard-nosed! Mai phen rai!

Life is too short!

[Tywais]

http://donslifeinthailand.com/Address_Change.html

With all the different information we received every time we called immigration, we decided to go back down to Promenada. Bob and John met at Immigration with our wives as translators. We kept getting different answers from lots of folks there, that is when the boss noticed and came over. Here are the answers from the boss man himself:

1. We foreigners report just like we always have done.

2. For us, the TM28 is only used when we actually change residences.

3. The owners of a residences NOW have to report on us using TM 30 within 24 hours of our arrival back into Thailand arriving at our residence. Owner can mail it in or walk it into the Promenada Immigration office to the "Re-Entry Permit" desk. No line, just go direct to the desk.

I'm glad the wives went as they asked many questions and then asked for many clarifications of different examples. Simple, the residence owner has to report our arrival when we return to Thailand. That's it!

Fine: 200B per day with a maximum 5,000B.

Bob has written a more detailed explanation which I have included below:

1. The TM-30 is to be filed by the owner of any property that a foreign national stays at within 24 hours of the foreigners’ arrival to that location. This means if you live in a house owned by your wife or girlfriend she needs to file the TM-30 within 24 hours of your arrival. If you live in a rented house, your landlord must file the TM-30 within 24 hours.

2. There are some rare cases where a foreign national lives in a house owned by a person such as an adult Thai child living in America or some other country. In such cases, that person needs to have a limited power of attorney drawn up and notarized in America or whatever country they are in. That limited PoA needs to identify a Thai citizen in Thailand and state that person has limited PoA to file TM-30s with Thai Immigration on their behalf.

3. Once a TM-30 has been filed by the property owner and the foreign national takes a trip out of town but NOT out of Thailand, the property owner need not turn in a new TM-30. However, should the foreign national leave Thailand to visit another country, the property owner must file a new TM-30 within 24 hours of that person’s arrival back on the property.

4. Some of you have questioned if a TM-30 needs to be filed if you have a yellow house-book. The answer is “yes”. The yellow house-book does not excuse the property owner from having to file the TM-30 form.

5. There are no exemptions to this law, all foreign nationals staying at any property in Thailand must be reported to Thai Immigration by the property owner.

[Tywais]

From Samut Prakan immigration website.

Q. Does my Thai wife have to report my address to Immigration?
A. Homeowners must inform Immigration within 24 hours if they have a foreigner staying at their house.This can be done using form TM30. This only needs to be done the first time. Homeowners face a fine of not exceeding 2,000 Baht while hotel managers could be fined 4,000 to 8,000 Baht.

[MadMac]

@Tywais

Got that too, that's a page with personal opinions, particularly wrong. We can only find out ourselves and next day it will likely be different.

[Tywais]

@Tywais

Got that too, that's a page with personal opinions, particularly wrong.

It lines up with all the other information in the TV Visa section and that post was for Promenada so can't say it is particularly wrong at that point in time. Basically it is someone's experience no more or no less then experiences in this topic.

Remember, how many times has an IO at CM said one thing but experience has shown just the opposite? I don't have a lot of faith or trust in what they say at the moment.

[Dante99]

@Tywais

Got that too, that's a page with personal opinions, particularly wrong.

It lines up with all the other information in the TV Visa section and that post was for Promenada so can't say it is particularly wrong at that point in time. Basically it is someone's experience no more or no less then experiences in this topic.

Remember, how many times has an IO at CM said one thing but experience has shown just the opposite? I don't have a lot of faith or trust in what they say at the moment.

Right and I do not have a lot of faith or trust in what people say/write (they think) about what the IOs have said.

[LivinLOS]

Would be fun to take the same wives to Capt Passorn in the Airport branch..

Whose currently saying explicitly and firmly something totally different..

Sections 3 and 4 stating 24 hours and inter provincial travel as printed in the law, which she gave me (to give to the landlord).. I posted this before.

[luke000]

Yet another reason to never - EVER - go to Chiang Mai Immigration. (Yes, it's possible, without breaking any laws/regulations.)

Ive been to CM immigration many times and Ive always found them to be most helpful and fair .

CM immigration do not make the rules, they just follow them, so its quite unfair to criticise them for carrying out their work .

Ive always had an excellent service from them .

No one likes queuing up, filling out forms and waiting, but thats not the fault of CM immigration

[Paul Catton]

I am now wondering if the TM30 would stretch in application to our Thai family members with whom we may possibly have more than an overnight stay in addition to various hotels when visiting under a 30 day Tourist Exemption Visa.

I doubt they would actually be aware of any formality that they would be legally required to undertake.

Edited February 26, 2016 by Paul Catton

[LivinLOS]

Yet another reason to never - EVER - go to Chiang Mai Immigration. (Yes, it's possible, without breaking any laws/regulations.)

Ive been to CM immigration many times and Ive always found them to be most helpful and fair .

CM immigration do not make the rules, they just follow them, so its quite unfair to criticise them for carrying out their work .

Ive always had an excellent service from them .

No one likes queuing up, filling out forms and waiting, but thats not the fault of CM immigration

Its painfully obvious that they are operating a go slow, just watch them in action, while the student helpers do 5x the work in half the time.

Why would they do that ?? Given it helps connected agencies operate a for profit queue jumping system ?? I guess that doesnt need explaining.

[fleur3]

I own the house through usufruct. That is in CNX. Meaning I'm the legal owner for lifetime and my name is in the chanot. That makes me the "housemaster". Farang can always own the house, just not the land (for more than a year). US citizens had some special laws applying, I am not.

I can not use that online site, as I don't run a business and don't have a business registration. I can not do the reporting, as I am the farang. So, it's that typical Thai messed up situation.

sorry but i have to correct you. The wordt usufruct means you can USE the FRUITS of somthing. In the case of a house it means you can use the house. But that is not ownership it is a USE of it !!

[MadMac]

That's the old roman definition from a couple of thousands years ago where it originated. As usufructary aka owner of the usage rights, you are the legal owner of the property and you are responsible for whatever happens with it. Thus you are the "housemaster" (which is a strange thing by itself).

Edited February 28, 2016 by MadMac

[HullyGully]

Usufruct is the right to use the land.

You can be the owner of the house, therefore you are the housemaster

In my yellow book, it names myself as owner

[MadMac]

I actually meant the title "housemaster". In german we have a "Hausmeister" which is exactly the same but means janitor . So perhaps it's a translation thing, but I find it funny .

[Lordfoul]

Today my wife contacted the investigation division of Chiang Mai Immigration to ask about fees for late reporting of the T.M. 30. The person who answered the phone would only say 'Maybe, just come down' . She tried to get a more specific answer, but that is all he would say. She then called the Immigration office at Promenada and was told that there would be no fee and then the person added (unsolicited)if you go to the main immigration office near the airport you may be charged a fee.

So we went down the immigration office at Promenada around 2:30PM, waited at the unmanned desk for 10 minutes until some showed up. 5 minutes later everything was finished. They handed back a small piece of paper showing that the report had been made and said I should keep it in my passport.

[connda]

That's the old roman definition from a couple of thousands years ago where it originated. As usufructary aka owner of the usage rights, you are the legal owner of the property and you are responsible for whatever happens with it. Thus you are the "housemaster" (which is a strange thing by itself).

Is that correct? Really? Have you run that by a Thai lawyer. I have a Usufract, so I'm quiet curious.

[HullyGully]

Usufract are entered onto the Chanote and can be for the rest of your life OR a fixed period of time

Its the right to use the land

[SooKee]

Went to Promenada today to file a new TM30 on behalf of the owner seeing as I've just returned to Thailand from a short trip away. Not sure I've missed this anywhere as I rarely read up the threads until it's time to go do something but I was told that Promenada is no longer doing TM28/TM30s and that you can now only do them at the airport office. I asked if that was only for people in my predicament (trying to help the owner who is a friend but who is in the USA for 3 months so can't do it herself) but both the girl outside and one of the guys at the desks inside said nope, EVERYONE. Changed now. No more Programmes for TM30/TM28.

So back on the bike and off too the airport office. Actually I arrived a bit late, closed for lunch, but the folks in the office (Investigations - Building 3) said no problem, take a seat and we'll do it. Found them very helpful. Not sure whether speaking Thai to them helped but having explained it all in Thai they just did the update. Very pleasant and friendly even sat chatting about how bored they were with the incessant heat-wave.

Staff at the airport and at Promenada confirmed that if you leave Thailand a new TM30 has to be done each time you come back. Whether or not you change address. Before I'd been told I could bring the TM30 on behalf of the owner but at the airport office they said cannot. They said they'd update my TM30 status and re-stamp the forms I already had in my passport but only because I'd not changed address and all the other details were the same. I was technically late making the TM30 on behalf of the owner but they weren't bothered, maybe because it wasn't technically my responsibility and/or because I was trying to help out a Thai owner who was overseas. In all honesty, I didn't push them for any reasons in case they changed their mind.

Sent using Tapatalk

Edited May 13, 2016 by SooKee

[NancyL]

I'm so glad our condo building office is set up to file TM30s on-line just like a hotel does for their guests. They do this for everyone who lives here, renters and owners. Just love 'em for it. They print out a nifty screen shot of their filing from the Imm. website that we can staple in our passports for "proof" that a TM30 has been filed.

[HullyGully]

The same happened to me, arrived back from overseas 11/05, went to IMM PROM 12/05 to file my TM30

Told to go to AIRPORT IMM building 3

As the reporting was within 24 hrs, no issues, in and out within 20 minutes

In the past IMM PROM did not issue fines, going forward people who have not completed TM30 maybe fined

AIRPORT IMM previously was issuing fines, I think max is 2000B

We'll see

[jonesthepost]

I'm so glad our condo building office is set up to file TM30s on-line just like a hotel does for their guests. They do this for everyone who lives here, renters and owners. Just love 'em for it. They print out a nifty screen shot of their filing from the Imm. website that we can staple in our passports for "proof" that a TM30 has been filed.

A TM 30 is the duty of the owner of the house or condo it is a duty of the renter so if the house master does not submit one it is no problem for the farang living there The only time it concerns a farang is if his wife or partner is the house master and she is fined and expects you to pay. I have never been ask to show a TM.30 for an extension or 90 day report but my my wife has filed one

[HullyGully]

In my case I am the Housemaster, I took along my yellow book along with copies of documents

[NancyL]

I'm so glad our condo building office is set up to file TM30s on-line just like a hotel does for their guests. They do this for everyone who lives here, renters and owners. Just love 'em for it. They print out a nifty screen shot of their filing from the Imm. website that we can staple in our passports for "proof" that a TM30 has been filed.

A TM 30 is the duty of the owner of the house or condo it is a duty of the renter so if the house master does not submit one it is no problem for the farang living there The only time it concerns a farang is if his wife or partner is the house master and she is fined and expects you to pay. I have never been ask to show a TM.30 for an extension or 90 day report but my my wife has filed one

Well, this it's all very well and good to say this, but ever since our condo office starting doing TM30s on-line, I've been able to do my 90-day reports on line. Have you ever considered that one reason people can't file 90 day reports on-line is because they don't have a current TM30 in the immigration data base? That arrival card number counts for something.

[HullyGully]

Nancy,

You maybe right

When I left CNX the IMM officer a young girls was friendly, and no people around, so I asked about the IMM database and what could she see.

So question, is my TM30 in the system...yes along with the retirement extension and 90 day reporting

Now the 1000dollar question is "Does this enable you to report on line'

I know I complete a TM30 in Jan 16, and I tried 90 day reporting online, and IT WORKED for the first time

So I'll know more in Aug 16, when my 90 day is due

[manfredtillmann]

I'm so glad our condo building office is set up to file TM30s on-line just like a hotel does for their guests. They do this for everyone who lives here, renters and owners. Just love 'em for it. They print out a nifty screen shot of their filing from the Imm. website that we can staple in our passports for "proof" that a TM30 has been filed.

A TM 30 is the duty of the owner of the house or condo it is a duty of the renter so if the house master does not submit one it is no problem for the farang living there The only time it concerns a farang is if his wife or partner is the house master and she is fined and expects you to pay. I have never been ask to show a TM.30 for an extension or 90 day report but my my wife has filed one

just got asked again for it yesterday doing a 30 day extension to my single entry tourist visa at nakhon phanom immigration. they issued it 7 weeks ago (gf got fined back than for having lodged it at our local police station instead), it was not on record in their system and we would have been fined again if we did not have the actual document with us to present.