Penalty for not submitting Thai tax return if no tax to pay

[regedit]

Understand you should submit a tax return if your income in thailand is 50,000 bht or more. If all this 50,000 was from bank interest which was paid from several banks without tax being deducted, after personal allowances and deductions the taxable income can be zero, and no tax to claim back. So what would be the penalty if you didn't submit a tax return ?

[orientalist]

I was told by an accountant 5 years ago that if your income is more than 30,000 baht you are required to submit a tax return. But as I understand it, tax payers have the option to include bank interest or not. If you choose not to include it, perhaps your income is considered to be zero.

[mogo51]

I was told by an accountant 5 years ago that if your income is more than 30,000 baht you are required to submit a tax return. But as I understand it, tax payers have the option to include bank interest or not. If you choose not to include it, perhaps your income is considered to be zero.

\

Are you talking per month here or in total per year?

[scorecard]

I was told by an accountant 5 years ago that if your income is more than 30,000 baht you are required to submit a tax return. But as I understand it, tax payers have the option to include bank interest or not. If you choose not to include it, perhaps your income is considered to be zero.

1. I was told ....

2. I am not a tax expert and happy to be educated.... I'm wondering why Thailand (any country) would say declaring bank interest is up to you?

This would mean folks who are extremely wealthy and gain their large / very income from bank interest don't pay tax? Is that true?

[orientalist]

I was told by an accountant 5 years ago that if your income is more than 30,000 baht you are required to submit a tax return. But as I understand it, tax payers have the option to include bank interest or not. If you choose not to include it, perhaps your income is considered to be zero.

1. I was told ....

2. I am not a tax expert and happy to be educated.... I'm wondering why Thailand (any country) would say declaring bank interest is up to you?

This would mean folks who are extremely wealthy and gain their large / very income from bank interest don't pay tax? Is that true?

There's a limit of 20,000 baht:

3.2 Separate Taxation

There are several types of income that the taxpayer shall not include or may not choose to include such income to the assessable income in calculating the tax liability.

Income from sale of immovable property

Taxpayer shall not include income from sales of immovable property acquired by bequest or by way of gift to the assessable income when calculating PIT. However, if the sale is made for a commercial purpose, it is essential that such income must be included as the assessable income and be subject to PIT.

Interest

The following forms of interest income may, at the taxpayer’s selection, be excluded from the computation of PIT provided that a tax of 15 per cent is withheld at source:

1. interest on bonds or debentures issued by a government organization;
2. interest on saving deposits in commercial banks if the aggregate amount of interest received is not more than 20,000 baht during a taxable year;
3. interest on loans paid by a finance company;
4. interest received from any financial institution organized by a specific law of Thailand for the purpose of lending money to promote agriculture, commerce or industry.

http://www.rd.go.th/publish/6045.0.html

[orientalist]

I was told by an accountant 5 years ago that if your income is more than 30,000 baht you are required to submit a tax return. But as I understand it, tax payers have the option to include bank interest or not. If you choose not to include it, perhaps your income is considered to be zero.

\

Are you talking per month here or in total per year?

30K a year. I assume this is because the personal allowance for any individual is 30K and a lot of farmers earn less than that. Saves a lot of hassle for all concerned. But I don't really know.

[kingstonkid]

This may be off topic but where can I find an english copy of the tax forms

[topt]

OP have you ever submitted a Thai tax return?

If not and you do not want to try and claim back any interest why would you want to - and it is very unlikely that anybody would ask you to do so.

[Satcommlee]

Are you actually "On their Radar"?

Do you actually have a Tax number?

[orientalist]

I was told by an accountant 5 years ago that if your income is more than 30,000 baht you are required to submit a tax return. But as I understand it, tax payers have the option to include bank interest or not. If you choose not to include it, perhaps your income is considered to be zero.

\

Are you talking per month here or in total per year?

30K a year. I assume this is because the personal allowance for any individual is 30K and a lot of farmers earn less than that. Saves a lot of hassle for all concerned. But I don't really know.

Apparently, 30K is for an unmarried person with income other than a salary. If the income is from a salary the allowance is 50K. If married the allowance is 60K or 100K respectively. (From the Tax Administration section of PWC's Tax booklet)

http://www.pwc.com/th/en/publications/assets/thai-tax-2015-booklet-en.pdf

[scooterboy]

But the OP's question still remains - what would be the penalty if you didn't submit a tax return ?

[Tracyb]

If someone on a retirement visa extension receives rental income from more than one condo one owns, should that be claimed on a Thai tax return?

[chiang mai]

If someone on a retirement visa extension receives rental income from more than one condo one owns, should that be claimed on a Thai tax return?

Yes.

[Tracyb]

If someone on a retirement visa extension receives rental income from more than one condo one owns, should that be claimed on a Thai tax return?

Yes.

What if there is no "work permit"?

[chiang mai]

If someone on a retirement visa extension receives rental income from more than one condo one owns, should that be claimed on a Thai tax return?

Yes.

What if there is no "work permit"?

Perhaps best to read up on taxation in Thailand, the tax tables are a good place to start found here:

http://www.rd.go.th/publish/6045.0.html

I do not believe that a work permit is required in order to receive property rental income, I believe it is regarded as investment income and the deductions, personal allowance and taxation levels are very favorable. If in doubt you should satisfy yourself this is the case, a good way to do that is to go and have a chat with the tax people, they are far less threatening and far more helpful than their Western counterparts.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

I can understand how Thai tax officials could offer advice on how rental property income is regarded/treated in their tax system.

But I'm not sure whether anything they'd have to say would be meaningful as to whether engaging in that activity would or wouldn't require a work permit, or what the actual regulations on that are, since work permits are part of the Labor Ministry.

[buythisdashcam]

Really, someone pays taxes in Thailand ?

:-)

[GanDoonToonPet]

But the OP's question still remains - what would be the penalty if you didn't submit a tax return ?

From the PWC guide:

[chiang mai]

If the OP is really concerned about this issue, one way around it is to put the rental unit into a limited company and use that company for the rental, that's perfectly legal and would leave the OP as a shareholder.

[Farang99]

I was told by an accountant 5 years ago that if your income is more than 30,000 baht you are required to submit a tax return. But as I understand it, tax payers have the option to include bank interest or not. If you choose not to include it, perhaps your income is considered to be zero.

1. I was told ....

2. I am not a tax expert and happy to be educated.... I'm wondering why Thailand (any country) would say declaring bank interest is up to you?

This would mean folks who are extremely wealthy and gain their large / very income from bank interest don't pay tax? Is that true?

There's a limit of 20,000 baht:

3.2 Separate Taxation

There are several types of income that the taxpayer shall not include or may not choose to include such income to the assessable income in calculating the tax liability.

Income from sale of immovable property

Taxpayer shall not include income from sales of immovable property acquired by bequest or by way of gift to the assessable income when calculating PIT. However, if the sale is made for a commercial purpose, it is essential that such income must be included as the assessable income and be subject to PIT.

Interest

The following forms of interest income may, at the taxpayer’s selection, be excluded from the computation of PIT provided that a tax of 15 per cent is withheld at source:

1. interest on bonds or debentures issued by a government organization;
2. interest on saving deposits in commercial banks if the aggregate amount of interest received is not more than 20,000 baht during a taxable year;
3. interest on loans paid by a finance company;
4. interest received from any financial institution organized by a specific law of Thailand for the purpose of lending money to promote agriculture, commerce or industry.

http://www.rd.go.th/publish/6045.0.html

All my income in Thailand is from bank account interest, and 15% tax is deducted before the remainder is credited to the account. I had assumed this means that I do not need to submit a tax return.

[orientalist]

If you don't claim a refund, you should be OK. I claim a refund, but I also have a little income from overseas, so I am careful not to bring this to Thailand until the following calendar year.

[maewang99]

Something to always bring up, many Thai small and mid cap companies pay very good dividends and, quite unbelievably do not change in market price when they go XD, so you can get in and out easily and still get the dividend. what's this got to do with Thai tax returns? if you live in Thailand 180 days or more in any one year, you get a refudn of the corporate tax paid ahead of the dividend. So a 7% yield becomes 8.75%, notwithstanding the lower corporate rate nowadays. and Thai Revenue will do all the paperwork for you, all you need are the orange mailers from the TSD (the dividend notifciation).

a very nice benefit especailly since pension income is not taxable.

the whole deal is wonderful, and quite fair actually. we pay the VAT, and the stock market is important not just for finance reasons so government support of it for retail stockholders is an excellent public policy. and being a "foreigner" means nothing under the Thai Revenue code, it's all based on days resident on Thai soil. no prejudice, no discrimination or room for misunderstandings... a slong as you use a Thai bank or broker to hold securities and not an overseas broker because the orange mailer must be in your name, not in a nominee.

Schwab (USA) is always talking about fixing that, so that it's in the customers name instead of Gerlach (their Thai registration nominee fort US customers). So the only bad deal is you must use a Thai broker. Everything else is way cool.

Edited March 3, 2016 by maewang99

[topt]

But the OP's question still remains - what would be the penalty if you didn't submit a tax return ?

From the PWC guide:

Penalties & Surcharge.png

So if you owe no money and you do not file a return 200% of nothing is still.........nothing?......................................

[topt]

If you don't claim a refund, you should be OK. I claim a refund, but I also have a little income from overseas, so I am careful not to bring this to Thailand until the following calendar year.

Interestingly (to me anyhow) I claimed my refund in January but yesterday I received (what appears to be) a Thai Tax return in the post. I did not receive one last year or the year before when I first reclaimed tax on interest.

I have to go to my local Immigration office in Jomtien this month so will visit the Revenue office around the corner at the same time to see what they want to do with it. The only bit I can read is the year on top, my name, part of my address and the number 90 in the top right hand corner but it comes with 15 pages of Thai notes to help you fill it in................

[orientalist]

I worked in Thailand for many years and they always sent me a return form at the beginning of each year, initially a Form 91 and later 90. This year it was very late, around the end of February. Since I had already submitted the PND90, I ignored the one they sent. I don't think you need to worry about it if you have already submitted a return, but they will send you one every year anyway.

It's very much in your interest to apply for the refund early in January so you can get the cheque quickly. When I have filed my return in March it took several months to get the refund.

[scoutman360]

I was told by an accountant 5 years ago that if your income is more than 30,000 baht you are required to submit a tax return. But as I understand it, tax payers have the option to include bank interest or not. If you choose not to include it, perhaps your income is considered to be zero.

1. I was told ....

2. I am not a tax expert and happy to be educated.... I'm wondering why Thailand (any country) would say declaring bank interest is up to you?

This would mean folks who are extremely wealthy and gain their large / very income from bank interest don't pay tax? Is that true?

There's a limit of 20,000 baht:

3.2 Separate Taxation

There are several types of income that the taxpayer shall not include or may not choose to include such income to the assessable income in calculating the tax liability.

Income from sale of immovable property

Taxpayer shall not include income from sales of immovable property acquired by bequest or by way of gift to the assessable income when calculating PIT. However, if the sale is made for a commercial purpose, it is essential that such income must be included as the assessable income and be subject to PIT.

Interest

The following forms of interest income may, at the taxpayer’s selection, be excluded from the computation of PIT provided that a tax of 15 per cent is withheld at source:

1. interest on bonds or debentures issued by a government organization;
2. interest on saving deposits in commercial banks if the aggregate amount of interest received is not more than 20,000 baht during a taxable year;
3. interest on loans paid by a finance company;
4. interest received from any financial institution organized by a specific law of Thailand for the purpose of lending money to promote agriculture, commerce or industry.

http://www.rd.go.th/publish/6045.0.html

If I am reading this correctly, it means that ALL bank interested is taxable. Some banks don't deduct taxes on your interest. They keep saying none is owed if less than 20,000bht. Don't know where they got that rule. According to what I have read so far, if your annual Thailand income is over 150kbht, then that small 1,000bht interest you made last year must be taxed also.

Anyone understand differently?

[topt]

It's very much in your interest to apply for the refund early in January so you can get the cheque quickly. When I have filed my return in March it took several months to get the refund.

That has been my experience as well